From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN A Collection of Books for the Ages: Deseret Book Press Release 24Nov01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 30 Nov 2001 16:43:51 -0500 [MOD: I believe Elder Maxwell received an award from AML at one point. Can someone confirm?] A Collection of Books for the Ages SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Long known for his literary excellence, Elder Neal A. Maxwell of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has written more than two dozen full-length books spanning his career as an apostle, administrator, and educator, only eight of which are still in print individually. Now this monumental body of work from one of the most beloved and well known authors in the Church has been compiled in "The Complete Works of Neal A. Maxwell" (Eagle Gate, $189.95), a six-volume set, hansomely bound, with a comprehensive index. From his first book, "A More Excellent Way," originally published in 1967, to his most recent volume, "The Power of Discipleship," published earlier this year, Elder Maxwell's style and breadth of experience have become legendary. Each work appears as it was originally published--well-written, instructive, uplifting, and inspiring. Beautifully foil-stamped covers, decoracted endsheets, gilt-edged pages,and attached ribbon bookmarks make this limited-edition set a true collector's item. About the Author Elder Neal A. Maxwell was called as an assistant to the Council of the Twelve in 1974. From 1976 to 1981 he served as a member of the Presidency of the First Quorum of the Seventy, and in 1981 was called to his present position as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. Source: A Collection of Books for the Ages Deseret Book 24Nov01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] Reading Aloud (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 30 Nov 2001 14:46:36 -0700 Jacob Proffitt has defended the Harry Potter books eloquently enough that = I'll have to be satisfied with cheering from the sidelines, shouting = 'yeah, what he said!" I would like to point out three other things about = the magic of Harry: 1) In one of the books, a Quidditch match is won by the other side than = the ones who catch the Snitch. Team A gets the snitch and Team B wins, in = other words, due to racking up enough ten pointers. I'm a complete sports = kook, and originally thought Quidditch a poorly thought-through sport, but = I'm more taken with it now. 2) The Harry Potter books are wonderful to read aloud. My daughter just = turned eight, which means, in our house, Watership Down. That's the = special treat our kids get when they turn eight; I get to read Watership = Down to them. (Lengthy aside; is Watership Down the best kid's book ever, = and a wonderful Mormon book? Follow the prophet, right? Fiver's the = prophet and he's getting revelation and he's right! And Hazel gets in = trouble whenever he ignores prophetic counsel. And Bigwig is brave and = strong and also humble enough to listen, to accept direction and to listen = to Fiver. Absolutely the best kid's book I know.) Anyway, hardly the = night goes by when I don't read something to my kids. One of the greatest = pleasures of parenthood, if not the greatest, is the pleasure of reading = favorite books aloud to your kids. And the Harry Potter books are a = wonderful read. Jacob mentioned how good they are visually. Maybe that's = why they're so good to read aloud. (I do an awesome Hagrid, I'm told, and = my Gilderoy Lockhart isn't far behind, if I have to say so myself.) Say = what you like about Scholastic's marketing, but I live in a neighborhood = of Harry Potter fans, every one of which learned of the books from a = friend, and most of which turn up their noses at the marketing campaign. = And most of those kids gather in our living room to hear me read. How = many parents read to their kids? Not enough, I suppose, but also, a lot, = I suspect. 3) Which leads to my next quasi-rhetorical question, and my Mormon lit = connection: Is there a link between liking literature and family scripture = study? I mean, in our house, we've been reading scriptures together for = years, and our eight year old takes her turns. They're used to difficult = concepts expressed in difficult language, and so are our neighborhood = kids. And we are used to reading aloud together. Makes it easy to gather = the kidlings for an evening with Harry, Ron and Hermione. Which in turn, = makes it easier to gather them to read about Nephi, L & L, and Sam. = Speaking of good v. evil. . . . Eric Samuelsen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Literary Standards (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 30 Nov 2001 16:23:40 -0600 Fair warning: What I plan to do here is respond briefly to D. Michael Martindale's post, then use that as a jumping-off point for discussing a much broader issue... It's interesting how different people, even among those who are widely read in a particular genre, will respond differently to specific pieces of literary work. I have so far quite enjoyed the Harry Potter books, and the movie too. But then, I rather like Tom Bombadil, too... (And I'm highly skeptical about the ability of any movie to do justice to _The Lord of the Rings_, but I'll be out there watching it anyway.) Of course, I recognize that my reaction to the Harry Potter movie is mediated by a different experience than Michael's: that is, I read and enjoyed the books. I rather think that may make a difference, in this case. Even before I read Michael's post--even before I saw the movie--I was speculating with various family members that unlike most movies, I suspect that this one was not intended to reach new audiences so much as to reach the same audience as had already read the book, with a product which would enhance their appreciation of the story. So perhaps--unlike most movies--this one is not intended to stand alone; and perhaps that's okay, in this case. Which brings me to the main point of my post. Over the course of thirty years of reading, writing, editing, and sometimes teaching about writing, I've come to disbelieve in the notion of universal standards or rules of good writing, that apply across all genres, for all authors, in all categories. I've become an esthetic relativist. I've come to distrust any critique of a particular piece of writing, or plot device, or anything else, that doesn't eventually refer back to the author's particular audience and purpose, and show why either (a) that purpose is not worth accomplishing or (b) the author's choices in composition undermine the successful carrying out of that purpose. The first of these criteria generally brings one into the realm of moral/ethical criticism; the second, into the realm of esthetic criticism. As is usually the case with me, I can already see a number of ways that what I have said could be misinterpreted. Let me address some of these. First, I *do* believe that it's possible to state some universal principles of good writing, most of them boiling down to variations on the statement that vocabulary/style/structure/etc. should reinforce, rather than undercut, the author's purpose in writing the story for his or her intended audience. But such a statement is so general as to provide no specific guidance to an author on specific questions, such as (to take a recent example from the List) whether a particular point of view is better or worse for storytelling purposes. It generates no rule, but only a broad framework within which the question can be posed: e.g., does point of view in this work carry out or undermine the work's apparent literary purpose? We get a little closer to rules once we start focusing on specific genres and audiences of writing, where it *is* possible to say what the conventions are in any particular field. I take it as a given that all readers will come to any particular reading experience with a specific set of expectations based largely on the literary category to which they assume a particular work belongs. But what happens when an author chooses to violate one of those conventions? We can't say whether that is an error or a good artistic move until we look at the author's choice in light of the apparent purposes of the literary work. Maybe a violation of that particular rule makes possible some greater artistic triumph. Maybe, instead, it throws the reader out of the story entirely (usually not one of the author's goals, though there are some posmodern exceptions). No hard and fast rule can be stated--only the observation that when you violate one of your audience's expectations, there's a tradeoff involved. The particulars of that tradeoff, and whether it's worth it, require an analysis of the specific case. It's interesting, by the way, how many discussions of the literary quality of a particular work end up hinging on questions of classification: this work says it is x, but actually it isn't, because it doesn't do y. On the surface, such discussions seem faintly ridiculous. After all, is it really necessary to categorize a work of literature in order to appreciate it? My answer would be: yes, it is. The vast bulk of available evidence suggests that we see specific literary works through the lens of our expectations; those expectations are largely shaped by our beliefs about its category. You can change a reader's opinion of a particular work by getting him or her to think of it as something different. Even within specific genres, however, and those who love them, opinions will frequently differ about specific authors and their artistic decisions. Say, readers of modern fantasy, among whom some (e.g., Michael Martindale) will find Harry Potter books a bore, while others (e.g., Jonathan Langford) will find them enjoyable. Actually, Tom Bombadil is perhaps a better case in point, since children's fantasy is in many ways a different genre from adult fantasy, and it's unclear to me whether Michael is as much a fan of that category as he undoubtedly is of adult fantasy. As someone who has studied Tolkien criticism, I can tell you that many readers have agreed with Michael that Tom Bombadil is a mistake. But by no means all readers. And both sets of readers include articulate, competent individuals who are able to make a good argument for their view, based on principles of good storytelling as applied to Tolkien's genre. So was it a mistake for Tolkien to include Tom? Aside from running some kind of vast statistical analysis, attempting to judge on a purely quantitative basis whether more readers were thrown out of the story or drawn into the story by Tom (suspect anyway--do we really want to reduce discussions of literary quality to a pure matter of numbers?), all we can really do, in my opinion, is attempt to accurately describe Michael's reaction, and Jonathan's reaction, and anyone else's reaction that may be out there. And we can agree that all those reactions are real, and leave it up to the would-be Tolkiens among us to judge which reaction they would rather court, when they receive similar responses to specific elements in their own storytelling. But I don't think we can privilege any particular response as more valid than anyone else's, unless we can show (a) general consensus, either of the general body of readers or of the body of trained readers (a point I'll get to below); (b) superior understanding of the work as it was meant to be read; or (c) superior logic in tying a particular response to a generally accepted set of external ideas (e.g., gospel teachings, or a specific definition of "true" literature). In other words, appeal to the authority of a community of readers, or of the work's own context, or of an external framework. I'm going to digress again (is anyone still reading at this point?) to share the Langford Rules of Giving and Accepting Critiques. They are: 1. The author is absolutely, unchallengably right in describing his or her intent in writing a work. It is therefore never appropriate for a reader to argue with the author about his or her intent. 2. The reader is absolutely, unchallengably right in describing his or her reaction to the work. It is therefore never appropriate for the author to argue with a reader about his or her response. 3. The reader may or may not be correct in analyzing the reasons for his or her reaction. In other words, all the reader really knows is that he or she has had a bumpy ride; whether the reader is correct in speculating that the axle is broken is a different matter entirely. 4. Different readers have different reactions. It is therefore critical to get a range of reactions, particularly among those whom you wish to reach in your writing. It is also important, in receiving critiques, to identify those individuals who are not part of your audience, so that you don't give equal weight to their opinions. It is this last point, in particular, that brings me back to the topic at hand. Sometimes critiques are offered by those who are not part of the natural audience for a particular piece of writing, on the grounds that their comments relate to general "rules of good writing." I've offered comments like that myself. But any such critiques have to be taken with the caveat that the rules do, in fact, change across different genres. If as a writer your internal response to my criticism is, that's not the way they do it in the kind of writing I'm attempting, you may be right. You'd certainly be wise to seek multiple opinions, particularly from experienced readers of the type of literature you're trying to write, and look closely at those published authors whose work is most similar to what you're trying to accomplish to see how they did it. It's been interesting to me, in watching the List discussions about point of view,to see the different assumptions List members make about how good writing is defined. Someone--I forget whom--like a particular way of doing point of view, because it was more cinematic. Someone else responded, if you're just duplicating what a movie does, why write a book instead of creating a movie? It's easy to see how two vastly different esthetics could be developed from these two starting-places. Personally, I think it's fruitless to decide which of these is the "true" way of writing fiction, because I think there are many different types of fiction developed to achieve many different kinds of goals. Different means will necessarily be best suited for different goals. It's interesting to see how artists themselves define the essence of their art from generation to generation. Thus, the Romantics had a credo, different from the Neoclassicists, and the Victorians differed yet again. (Actually, this makes each period sound more monolithic than it truly was; but still there are discernible movements and schools at different periods of time.) All of these philosophies of art--literature, in particular--seemed to serve a useful purpose as goalposts for a particular group of literary artists. But to take one of these as "the truth" and its dicta as therefore applicable to every period seems to me shortsighted--like trying to decide which is the "true" football team, when the real point is that you have to have many different teams in order to have good games. (So are you saying, Jonathan, that it's the Romantics versus the Neoclassicists, with Dryden coaching one team and Coleridge the other? What a great idea for a Monty Python sketch...) I promised earlier that I would get back to the idea of a "trained" reader as the court of final authority for laying down the literary law. I have some inherent problems with this notion--because, after all, such training tends to bring its own slant: not an objective point of view, but simply the privileging of one particular standard among many. But in practice I find that professors argue as much as anyone else, among each other, about the qualities of particular works. And even among those who, say, will acknowledge Shakespeare's greatness, the reasons given for that greatness are myriad, and seem to say more about the speaker's own literary theories than about the bard himself. There's a bunch of specific examples we could get into--when, for example, ambiguity is a virtue, and when it may be a vice; whether brevity is always good in a literary work; etc. But my main point as I've explored it here seems to be that I don't think, in our discussion of specific literary works and their strengths and weaknesses, we can meaningfully appeal to any theoretical high ground of rules describing what good literature is and isn't, and what traits it does and doesn't include. At best, we can use those theoretical tools to describe what we find in a specific work, and attempt to explain why we think the work does or doesn't succeed; but it's a descriptive, not a prescriptive, exercise. Which is probably more obscure than what I started with...but I've spent too long on this already; I'll send it off, and out of my hair. (And into yours...) Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeffrey Savage" Subject: Re: [AML] Cornerstone as Publisher (was: Covenant as Publisher) Date: 30 Nov 2001 16:15:23 -0700 Richard, You are exactly right, which just strengthens the point I was trying to make. Just because your story is not the typical LDS fare, does NOT mean that it is not sellable by the current LDS publishers. The opportunities have expanded dramatically over the last few years. -Jeff -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 30 Nov 2001 17:28:53 -0700 We are currently enjoying the Harry Potter books together in our family, and I wanted to say that I appreciate Jacob's assessment of them. I feel that the vivid imagery and the magical details, as well as the use of humor, are all strong points. However, I will back up D. Michael on his opinion of the first few chapters. I agree that the first book starts slowly, and would argue that the first chapter is almost completely unnecessary. After we read the first chapter together, my husband and I wondered what all the fuss over these books was about, because we sure weren't as "hooked" as we'd expected to be. And I wondered how people who hadn't read the book would perceive the movie. While I felt that it kept to the story quite well, many details had to be left out in the interest of time. I'm not sure that watching this movie first would have made me want to go read the book. Anyway, sometimes ya gotta read past the first few chapters to get to the good stuff. On the other hand, good writers should be ready and willing to rewrite and rewrite until they get it right. (LDS writers included. There's my LDS literature tie-in ;) Fortunately, I don't think Rowling had much that really needed to be rewritten, besides (IMO) axing the first chapter. --------- Katie Parker Salt Lake City, UT -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: [AML] Utah Dialect Project Date: 30 Nov 2001 17:31:31 -0700 Interesting article in the "Deseret News" about BYU lingustics professor David Bowie's attempt to map a unique "Utah dialect." (It includes such classics as "fetch", "flip", and "Spanish Fark.") It can be found at: http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,355009121,00.html? (A personal note: at choir practice, whenever we are told to not sing sing "like we're from Heber"--with hard r's, broad a's, and the like--I always bridle inwardly. I understand the need for the instruction, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it.) R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Major Productions Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 30 Nov 2001 19:41:07 -0600 > As you can probably tell, I like the Harry Potter books. I don't think > they are great literature. But they just might be great YA literature > and there is plenty there for adults to appreciate. I have to surface here--though I am usually a major list-lurker... I have to take exception to the above. I am a writer of and reader of (and, as a former children's librarian, pusher of) children's lit and it is my very strong opinion that great is great. If it's great, it's great, without adding that YA qualifier. And if it's not, it's not. And whether or not it is, the fact that Harry Potter speaks to so many people of all ages is a truly remarkable thing. Shortly after the first Harry Potter book came out, I sent it to an honorary nephew of mine for his 11th birthday--a calculated risk as he is ADHD and has the attention-span of a gnat. He had never heard of Harry Potter. But he sat down and devoured it, tackling the 300+ pages, eschewing video games and Pokemon, reading under the covers with a flashlight until he'd finished the whole thing. In the years since (until this year) J.K. Rowling obliged me by producing regular installments so that I could send them to my young friend for his birthday or Christmas, each of which he has inhaled with that degree of enthusiasm usually reserved for things chocolate. Say what you will about Rowling's adverbs. What she has done is phenomenal. She has crafted something so magical that even reluctant readers are drawn in. And what she's written is NOTHING like the proliferating horror series of yesteryear. It is also nothing like the Babysitter's Club. Or the American Girls books. Or Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys. She draws subtly on classical literature. She uses humor--not just of the "booger" variety, but truly witty stuff, some of which sails right over the heads of her younger readers. (And that's okay because, to paraphrase Shrek, it's like an onion.) Decades ago, when I was but a young lass at BYU, there were condescending references made to "kiddie lit". But it is not a bastardized (Can I use that word here?) sub-genre. It's the real thing. So back to the Harry Potter books. They are either great, or they aren't. They just can't be not great in general, but maybe great as YA. That's not giving enough credit to the world of literature for young people--which has come along way since the days of Little Golden Books. Robbin Major. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Christmas At Studio B Features an All-Star Musical Lineup: Excel Entertainment Press Release 30Nov01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 30 Nov 2001 23:58:25 -0500 Christmas At Studio B Features an All-Star Musical Lineup SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- KJZZ-TV14 will air an hour-long musical Christmas special with an intimate and uniquely intermountain flavor three times in December. Featuring an all-star lineup of musicians and singers from the Intermountain West, Christmas at Studio B will first be broadcast on Sunday, December 2 at 5 p.m. Taking the Studio B stage are popular singer-songwriter Peter Breinholt, acoustic trio Colors and folk ensemble Enoch Train. Bluegrass boys Ryan Shupe & the Rubberband, and folk guru Shane Jackman will each get into the holiday spirit by putting Christmas spins on their individual and unique styles. Songstress Julie de Azevedo, whose music has recently been featured on the Olympic Commemorative CD, will also make an appearance. Pianist Jon Schmidt will take his turn on the Studio B stage, as will songwriter Cherie Call, pianist David Tolk and rocker Greg Simpson. Rounding out the list is rising star Maren Ord, whose radio-friendly song "Perfect" recently was featured on the Welcome to Brigham soundtrack album. The special will feature intimate performances from each of these popular artists, as well as backstage footage and interviews. KJZZ-TV14 plans to air the special twice more-December 7 at 9 p.m. and December 16 at midnight. ON THE AIR -- KJZZ-TV14; December 2, 5pm; December 7, 9pm; December 16, midnight Featuring Julie de Azevedo, Peter Breinholt, Cherie Call, Colors, Enoch Train, Shane Jackman, Maren Ord, Jon Schmidt, Ryan Shupe & the Rubberband, Greg Simpson and David Tolk Source: Christmas At Studio B Features an All-Star Musical Lineup Excel Entertainment Press Release 30Nov01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Point of View Date: 01 Dec 2001 08:18:47 -0700 On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 13:02:04 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" writes: > Point is: we've got some great stuff our people have written. But > where's the Mormon David Foster Wallace or Dave Eggers? Because > there's a market for it. That's my next project after the God's Army novel I am currently working on. I think it'll be fun to do. scott -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Character Preferences Date: 01 Dec 2001 08:16:57 -0700 On Thu, 22 Nov 2001 11:20:21 -0700 "K.D. Enos" writes: > I realized, not long ago that all the stories I am currently working > on have a petite beautiful young woman with very long hair. > two of them have green eyes ( haven't figured out the third one's > eye color). I don't believe I have ever described any of my characters' physical attributes unless it has a direct emotional connection to the story through that -- or some other -- character's POV. scott -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Bestsellers: Evans' New Book Looks At His Own Experiences: Kent Larsen 30Nov01 US NY NYC A4 Date: 01 Dec 2001 00:21:56 -0500 Bestsellers: Evans' New Book Looks At His Own Experiences NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- Richard Paul Evans, author of the runaway bestseller "The Christmas Box," has a new book on the best seller lists -- but one that addresses the previous bestseller. In "The Christmas Box Miracle" Evans looks at his own experiences as "The Christmas Box" went from a modest self-published book to become a runaway bestseller. The other books on national bestseller lists are also familiar. Stephen R. Covey's "Seven Habits" is still there, and Stephen Ambrose's "Nothing Like It In The World," which is back in paperback. Evans, an LDS Church member, tells his own story, from his youth in a Mormon household, through his mother's loss of a stillborn daughter, severe depression and suicidal tendencies. Evans shows how these and other experiences led him to write a novel that brings healing and hope to life. Mormon News is experiencing logistical problems with the LDS bestseller lists, but we expect that they will return shortly also. The current titles on US National bestseller lists are: The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, by Stephen R. Covey This ten-year-old personal management classic is still selling strongly. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 20 - Amazon.com (November 30) Non-Fiction Paperback 67 - Barnes & Noble Top (November 30) Top 100 20 - Wall Street Journal (November 23) Business Nothing Like It In The World, by Stephen E. Ambrose A history of the building of the transcontinental railroad in the US. Ambrose, a highly regarded historian, details the involvement of Mormons in building crucial portions of the road, including the driving of the "golden spike" in the heart of Mormon territory. Now in paperback. Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 12 - BooksAMillion (November 30) Non-Fiction Paperback 10 - Booksense (November 30) Non-Fiction Trade Paperback 7 - New York Times (November 30) Non-Fiction Paperback 128 164 USA Today (November 30) Bestsellers 13 - Wordsworth (November 27) Non-Fiction Paperback The Christmas Box Miracle by Richard Paul Evans Evans tells about his own spiritual journey of "destiny, healing and hope." Currently on the following bestseller lists: This Last List 19 - New York Times (November 30) Non-Fiction Hardcover >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Bad Personal News Date: 03 Dec 2001 05:50:17 -0700 I will be participating less frequently for a while. My wife has had some bleeding into her brain that has put her in the hospital. Technically it's not a stroke, but it has the same effect as one. They're still trying to decide between two possibilities what the cause was. It's important to decide, because treatment for one is nasty and for the other pretty effortless. At first she was conscious and would follow movement with her eyes, but otherwise completely unresponsive. I despaired that I may have an invalid wife for the rest of my (or her) life. Since then, she has made great progress, to the point where I am confident she'll recover most if not all of her funcionality. She pretty much understands everything going on around her and what you say to her, but has the usual stroke-like problems controlling the right side of her body. The biggest challenge is communication. She is hard to understand with her slurred speech, and she often can't pick the right word to use. That's displaying the slowest progress in improving--no surprise, considering how complex a behavior speech is. But every time I see her again, I can see definite improvement. The doctors and nurses keep using words like "amazing" to describe the progress she's making. She's on a regular diet already, feed, herself, sits in a regular chair, and has walked a couple of times with the help of a walker and someone keeping her balanced. It's only been three days. We're all okay here, and are just determined to do what it takes to get her back to normalcy. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Konnie Enos Virus? Date: 01 Dec 2001 23:05:53 -0600 Now THIS is embarrassing. Sorry, Scott, I don't like you THAT much (or should I say, hate you that much, to send out something that potentially frightening). I sent out a previous email warning that I did get a virus this week. Please, everyone, don't open any weird attachments from me. Hold that sick curiosity in check!! My story is, my SIL got it first; she uses Outlook and the thing can open itself in Outlook, which it did. Her computer sent it to me. I use Eudora, so it wasn't automatic. She sends us photos of her kids all the time. The message and attachment looked almost normal (not this "me_nude" stuff), so I opened the thing. Bingo. OOPS. I had the PE_Magistr.B virus which CAN do damage to your hard drive. Please invest in antivirus software if you don't already have it installed, and scan your machine ASAP. ...on further thought, this attachment description fits more with the Badtrans virus which Jana had this week. But my antivirus software hasn't come up with anything saying I had that one. Linda >I got an infected message from Linda Adams with an attachment called >"me_nude.scr." While Linda may well be an exhibitionist (aren't all >writers?), I thought this was a pretty good sign that she'd gotten an email >replication virus and I would be best to delete without viewing. > >Not that I wasn't curious, but it just didn't seem like her style. At least >not in response to an AML-List post. > >Scott Parkin Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Writer's Lament Date: 01 Dec 2001 18:00:12 -0700 On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 17:42:39 -0700 "Scott Parkin" writes: > 1995-2001: Foundering/The Wall, Part II (1997-2001) > > Then a series of things happened and my whole approach to writing > was transformed. I'm still not sure whether it was for the better. > > * Event 1 -- Scott Bronson * > After a writing group meeting one night, Scott Bronson commented > that his goal with writing was to "build the kingdom of God" and that > he saw all his fiction as serving that larger goal. I remember this conversation. We were standing in the parking lot outside of Barnes & Noble in Orem. By the way, I still believe this. Regardless of what others may think about art and its purpose, and how it is created, and why it is created, it still all boils down to this: The artist has a view of the world and wants to share it. I believe if every artist is honest with themselves they will find that their purpose in sharing their view is to show the world a better way to think. They want to change the world. Well, there are only two ways to go. Change for the better, or change for the worse. And now let me stress something here -- The Spirit of God will make that distinction. AND IT MAY BE DIFFERENT FROM ONE PERSON TO THE NEXT. Almost certainly will be. A work that offends one may help another. As Eric Sam. often says ... we don't get to make that call, except for our own selves. While I may believe that I am building the kingdom of God (effecting change for the better) with my play, Stones," I am perfectly aware that there may be some who will believe that I am tearing down the kingdom. I already know of at least a couple of people who hated the show. And I observed another guy the other night who appeared to be bored completely out of his gourd. Whatever. > It seemed like a relatively innocuous comment, but it stuck with > me, and began to infect the way I thought about fiction. I had > been looking for an overarching purpose for my writing, and > this seemed as good as any. In many ways, this was a sort of turning > point in terms of how I thought about my religion--being a Mormon > became a more active sort of thing for me at about this point, part > of my direct philosophical exploration. Thank you, Brother Bronson. Well, you're welcome. I hope it turns out to be a positive all ways around. [snip] > Why do I spend all these words to tell you how I feel about my own > writing? For two reasons. First, so anyone else struggling with similar > questions knows that they're not alone ... Second, I write it so that > I can understand it. This is the perfect forum for this kind of essay. It truly helps to define and strengthen our community I think. I think that it's terribly important for us to make offerings like this so that we can all begin to understand each other a little better. I appreciate knowing what goes into the work that someone else does. I like hearing about their processes. I should know why a critic does what she does. I should know what the film director is thinking about his reasoning. I have given myself a strict edict against "answering" the critics when my work has been examined in a public way, but here, I think it may be worth the time to explain myself in some instances. When "Stones" has closed (after tonight) I think I will do just that. It may be interesting ... or not. But it will at least let people know what one playwright is thinking when he works. J. Scott Bronson -- Member of Playwrights Circle "The sun, with all those planets revolving around it and dependent upon it, can still ripen a bunch of grapes as if it had nothing else in the universe to do." Galileo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] LDS Film Festival (Deseret News) Date: 03 Dec 2001 03:28:53 +0000 Deseret News Friday, November 30, 2001 LDS filmmakers showcased By Jesse Hyde Deseret News staff writer PROVO =97 In the documentary "There's No Place Like Home," a junkie stretches a piece of surgical tubing tight around her arm and fills a syringe full of heroin. As she prepares to stick the needle in a pulsing vein, several members of the audience turn away, unable to watch. It was an uncomfortable moment for those who arrived Thursday at a film festival expecting film versions of The Book of Mormon. The Young LDS Film festival, which runs through Saturday at the Provo Theatre, 105 E. 100 North, is a forum for a growing group of aspiring LDS filmmakers to showcase their work. Besides screenings of short films, the festival also includes workshops and presentations by established filmmakers. Richard Dutcher, director of "God's Army" and one of the more successful LDS filmmakers, was scheduled to appear at the event. "People have told me that it is long overdue," said film- fest organizer Christian Vuissa. "I think there's a need for a community for LDS filmmakers, a way to network." Vuissa, an Austrian film student who is taking classes at Brigham Young University, hopes similar festivals happen all over the world. He says people have contacted him through his Web site =97 www.ldsbox.com =97 asking him how to set up similar events for LDS Church members in Spain, Germany and New Zealand. Like most who attended Thursday's screening, Daniel Drysdale dreams of becoming a filmmaker. The English major at BYU came to Thursday's program to watch a documentary he made about footwear. He says he is in pre-production for a television series set in Egypt. "Film is the closest thing to seeing dreams come true," says Brian Sullivan, one of Thursday's judges. "The good news is there is talented youth year in and year out. They are dedicated, hopeful and inspired," Sullivan said. "The bad news is there really isn't any funding or awareness." Sullivan, a former film student and professor at BYU, says it is more difficult to make movies than to become a brain surgeon. Without support from the community, especially those with money, LDS filmmakers will never make it, he says. "We have talent; all we need is funding," said another judge, Anne Sward-Hansen, an acting instructor at BYU. "A lot of these films are really impressive, especially considering the lack of resources they have to work with." The festival continues today with presentations by LDS filmmakers and concludes Saturday at 7:30 p.m. with a screening of short films. =A9 2001 Deseret News Publishing Company _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _House on the Sound_ (BYU Newsnet) Date: 03 Dec 2001 07:07:27 +0000 Acclaimed author acheives aspirations By Charity Brunson NewsNet Staff Writer 11/30/2001 After wading through a pile of accolades accumulated over 16 years, author Marilyn Brown is finally achieving her dream of publication. The BYU graduate recorded her family's World War II experience in 1986 in a memoir entitled "House on the Sound." The book is available at the BYU Bookstore. The work won an honorable mention in the 30th Annual Utah Fine Arts Contest in 1988; four years later its sequel won first place. But despite the critical praise of Brown's work, which also earned her the first Mayhew prize ever given at BYU and the Association for Mormon Letters award for novels, she said she was unable to find a publisher because of the book's literary nature. "What sells in Mormon writing is easier to read," Brown said. "But I wanted to write things that were not quite as accessible." She said she's wanted to have a career in writing for about 40 years, ever since reading the work of George Elliot when she was 10 years old. "I wanted to write something that good that was Mormon," Brown said. She said she knew "House on the Sound" had the quality she sought, but was frustrated by the ambivalence of publishers. Finally, she decided to make her dream happen - she went to Springville publisher Cedar Fort and arranged to work for the company in exchange for the publication of her work, an arrangement she said is mutually beneficial. "I love being involved in publishing, and lo and behold, the book is selling," she said. Apparently, the book was worth the wait. "I've been waiting for 'House on the Sound' a long time - since I read the early pages of it a decade or more ago," said Bruce Jorgensen, a BYU English professor in a review. "It's a good read - funny, scary, sometimes lyrical." The book explores Pearl Harbor from the perspective of a child whose father works in the Navy shipyard. It incorporates the story of her family's conversion to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter- day Saints. "My dad was working at night in the dark hull of a ship, and he'd read by the single light bulb the Book of Mormon," Brown said. Both of her parents were eventually baptized in the Puget Sound in the Seattle area and shortly after, her father sent the family to Provo to keep them out of danger. Brown said the story is one of hope and inspiration. "It's a memoir of how my father was trying to build a sound house while the war was going on - he gravitated towards religion and peace," she said. She said she enjoyed writing from her own experience. "You don't have to look things up - you can concentrate more on the story and characters, what they're saying and doing," Brown said. The account of family endurance in a time of war is particularly relevant in light of today's conflict, she said. "I hope the readers put themselves in a different world and realize how war effects the characters and how incredibly important it is to try to build a sound house for their kids," Brown said. Copyright =A92001 BYU NewsNet Home | Campus | Lifestyles | Opinion | Sports | Religion | Features | World= =20 | Utah | Text Only LEGEND Live Audio Video Photos Advertising | Classifieds | Web Cam | Email Briefs | Palm Version Copyright =A92001 BYU NewsNet _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: [AML] Cheri CRANE, _Kate's Turn_ (Review) Date: 02 Dec 2001 21:19:26 -0700 Crane, Cheri J. _Kate's Turn_. Covenant, 1994. Paperback, 355 pp.,=20 $10.95. Reviewed by Katie Parker Sixteen-year-old Kate Erickson is on the wrong path. She's experimented=20 with drinking and smoking, hangs out with the wrong crowd, and she's=20 been leaving her job at Burger King early and meeting her loser boyfriend= . =20 Furthermore, she's a grouch around her family and determined to ruin any=20 family bonding activities. And she doesn't have a testimony. Her parent= s,=20 particularly her mother, are upset about it and have tried talking to her= as=20 well as yelling at her. The plot heats up a little when her mother catch= es=20 her in what appears to be a compromising position with a boy. During the= =20 ensuing spat, Kate tells her mom what she seems to be suspecting: that=20 she's "been with more boys than you can count on both hands" (68). This=20 is actually a lie, and once the heated moment passes, Kate can see how=20 hurt her mother is over this "confession" and she tries to tell her the t= ruth. =20 Her mother, however, is so upset that she refuses to listen to anything K= ate=20 has to say. This alienates Kate further; it really hurts her to know tha= t her=20 mother would actually believe these things about her. Something strange happens when Kate storms off after another=20 confrontation and is hit by a car. She ends up in a coma in the hospital= ,=20 but she also somehow ends up in the year 1848 with some of her ancestors=20 in a wagon train headed to the Salt Lake Valley. After disposing of the=20 provocative clothing she's wearing, they accept her as one of their own,=20 believing her to be a niece rather than the great-great-great-great=20 granddaughter that she really is. They have to get after her occasionall= y=20 for her language, and Kate sorely misses modern-day conveniences, but=20 she learns to cope with pioneer life and to love the people she's with. = Her=20 4th-great grandmother, Colleen, shows true pioneer strength as she leads=20 her family on the daily trek and eventually buries yet another of her you= ng=20 children. She also helps Kate on her quest for a testimony. Colleen's=20 daughter Molly, who would be a distant great aunt of Kate's, is another=20 story. Molly is actually very much like Kate, and the two quarrel for=20 much of the book. Molly is engaged to David, a fine priesthood holder,=20 but hasn't agreed to a wedding date because of her weak testimony. =20 Meanwhile, Jedediah, a greasy but charming nonmember who is traveling=20 with them is also pursuing her. Everyone can tell that this man is only=20 trouble, except, of course, for Molly. She runs off with him and leaves=20 David high and dry. Kate, however, gains a testimony of her own. When Kate finally awakens from her coma, her family is overjoyed and=20 she plans to make a fresh start in life. The story doesn't end there, th= ough. =20 When she was with her ancestors, she learned about a secret compartment=20 in Colleen's trunk. Her aunt now has this trunk, and Kate opens the=20 compartment and finds Molly's journal. Eagerly, Kate reads Molly's=20 tragic account of her marriage to Jedediah, and how he abuses her and=20 keeps her locked up in his mountain cabin. Eventually Molly makes it to=20 Salt Lake and finally marries David. Kate renews her promise to herself=20 to be careful about who she dates, and starts dating a guy who's about to= =20 leave on a mission. On the plus side, I thought Molly's journal was a good touch, as were=20 Kate's stories of Superman that she tells to the pioneer children. =20 Unfortunately, a large portion of the book didn't work for me at all. Mu= ch=20 of the first part of the book is told in Kate's mother's point of view. = While=20 it does show her mother's concerns and frustrations over Kate's behavior,= =20 it also portrays Kate in a negative light, through her frustrated mother'= s=20 eyes. Seeing the mom's point of view may be educational for young=20 readers, and the book in fact is billed as one that mothers and daughters= =20 can read together. But this shouldn't be done at Kate's expense; after a= ll,=20 she's the star of the book. I wanted to sympathize with Kate, not with h= er=20 mom. Perhaps this is a deliberate technique used to prevent young reader= s=20 from feeling comfortable with Kate's poor choices. Or perhaps the author= =20 just didn't feel much sympathy for Kate, either. Point of view on the whole is handled sloppily. Most of the story is tol= d=20 from either Kate's or her mother's point of view, but occasionally Crane=20 cuts in with another voice: her dad's, or Molly's, or Colleen's, or=20 Jedediah's, or the guy Kate is currently kissing. This happens repeatedl= y=20 in the same scene without warning. Many times I got confused as I read,=20 only to realize too late that I was now in someone else's head. I soon=20 found that the only consistency is within a single paragraph. =20 The back of the book proclaims, "You'll want to take sides with Kate one=20 minute and punish her for her outrageous behavior the next." I didn't fi= nd=20 her behavior too outrageous, or interesting for that matter. Yes, the gi= rl=20 has problems, but I found them to be rather two-dimensional. Her antics=20 at home include general grouchiness and insults, banging her fist on a=20 wood fence and getting splinters, and getting stung by a bee and falling = in=20 the lake. Not until her "confession" to her mother about her promiscuity= =20 did I have much interest in the story, although even this situation was=20 milked a bit too long. But I thought that it added some much-needed=20 depth to Kate and to the story. Although we are assured that Kate's reading the scriptures and trying to=20 gain a testimony happens over a period of time, her repentance is too eas= y=20 and complete to be real. This especially bothers me at the end of the bo= ok=20 (pages 344-345), when Kate's mom gives her a letter that her loser=20 boyfriend Jace had sent her while she was comatose: <<<<<< Hey babe, If your mama, the hag-woman, ever gives this to you, I'll be in total sho= ck. =20 I called the other day and thought she was gonna hang up on me! When ya gonna haul that firm little tush of yours outta bed? (Can you=20 believe I said that, knowin' what my goal for the past two years has been= ?) =20 Our little get-togethers just aren't the same without ya. Linda got so h= igh=20 the other night, we thought she'd never come down. I guess she's worried= =20 about ya. We all are. Some vacation. I told ya to stay here with me. = I=20 would've shown ya a better time than your family did! Guess it'll have t= o=20 wait until ya come home. Hurry up, sweet cheeks. A guy like me can't=20 wait forever! Jace >>>>>> Kate lets her mother read this, and then says, "Mom, I want you to know I= =20 will never have anything to do with Jace again. I don't ever want to end= =20 up with a Jedediah!" Then she adds, "The Church is true, Mom! I feel it= =20 inside, all of those things you used to tell me about. It all makes sens= e=20 now. I've still got some changes to make, and there are some things I'll= =20 have to take care of=85but I can do it. Especially if you'll help me" (3= 45). This is about as two-dimensional as it gets. Where is Jace's concern ove= r=20 Kate's comatose condition? His profession of love? Even guys with low=20 moral standards have feelings, or at least pretend to. And where are=20 Kate's feelings? She's only been dating the guy for the last two years. = =20 Doesn't she feel any sorrow at letting him go? Any confusion? The blurb on the back of the next book in the series, _Kate's Return_,=20 promises that in this next book Kate will now have to deal with her old=20 friends and prove to them and to everyone else that she really has change= d. =20 Hopefully it will address some of the feelings that are missing in _Kate'= s=20 Turn._ =20 My overall opinion: The story about Molly was a lot more interesting. =20 The book should've been about her. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 03 Dec 2001 04:01:04 +0000 What's the point of reading all those novels all the time? Don't you have anything better to do? This is the question for this month's Andrew's Poll (well, bi-monthly maybe). It is inspired by Richard H. Cracroft's article in the recent issue of BYU Studies (40:2, 2001): "'Cows to Milk Instead of Novels to Read': Brigham Young, Novel Reading, and Kingdom Building". Cracroft goes over the development of Brother Brigham's attitudes towards reading novels, from disinterest to public denunciation. You theater people like to quote Brigham Young because of his support for and participation in plays. The novelists out there don't have that luxury. Although he thought many novels were immoral, the thrust of Young's arguments was that they were a waste of time for a community with so many important jobs to be done, particularly building up the kingdom of God on earth. He did not condemn reading in general. He lauded the benefits of reading doctrinal works, histories, and other non-fiction of a practical nature. Although he usually used dime-store romances and westerns as examples of frivolous fiction, his criticism covered the entire genre of novels. In his last letter to his son Brigham Young Jr. he advised him to throw away his set of works by Charles Dickens. (It has been a few months since I read the article, and I don't have it with me, if anyone would like to correct or add to my summary, please do so.) Now, of course Young's comments did not become doctrine, or even remain a well-remembered aspect of his legacy. Many leaders of the Church after Young have publicly lauded works of fiction, if in no way else than by quoting them in their talks. The Relief Society used those "Out of the Best Books" series in their cultural enrichment meetings for a time. AML-list writers sometimes quote Orson Whitney and Spencer Kimball on the uplifting nature of great literature. Still, Brigham is not a man to be ignored. If you had the chance to talk to him, what would be your justification for time spent reading fiction? I'm not talking about writing, that is a different question. Andrew Hall Fukuoka, Japan _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Neal A. Maxwell's AML awards Date: 03 Dec 2001 09:53:46 -0700 On Fri, Nov 30, 2001 at 04:43:51PM -0500, Debra Brown wrote: > [MOD: I believe Elder Maxwell received an award from AML at one point. Can > someone confirm?] >From the AML-Awards Archive (http://www.aml-online.org/awards/r/Maxwell_Neal_A.html): 1983: Sermon: Special Commendation for Sustained Excellence 1999: Devotional Literature: _One More Strain of Praise_ -- Terry L Jeffress | If a book is not worth re-reading, it is not South Jordan, UT | worth reading. -- Samuel Johnson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: [AML] Good Mormon Writers (was: Point of View) Date: 03 Dec 2001 10:09:03 -0700 I think Brady Udall rivals David Foster Wallace. I think Phyllis Barber, at her best, is outstanding. "J. Scott Bronson" wrote: > On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 13:02:04 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" > writes: > > > Point is: we've got some great stuff our people have written. But > > where's the Mormon David Foster Wallace or Dave Eggers? Because > > there's a market for it. > > That's my next project after the God's Army novel I am currently working > on. I think it'll be fun to do. > > scott > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] Bad Personal News Date: 03 Dec 2001 10:48:57 -0700 Michael, many of us will want to include you and your wife in our prayers and put both your names on temple prayer rolls. We know your name, but we need hers. What is it? -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] Konnie Enos Virus? Date: 03 Dec 2001 11:40:39 -0700 Linda Adams wrote: > ...on further thought, this attachment description fits more with the > Badtrans virus which Jana had this week. But my antivirus software hasn't > come up with anything saying I had that one. My bad. I did get it (the post, not the virus) from Jana, and realized that after I had sent the previous note. But this raises an excellent point--if you're using a mail program that automatically saves and opens attached files, consider turning that option off and manually saving your attachments so you can look at them. That's how I stopped Jana's allegedly nude picture from infecting my computer (interesting metaphor there that I won't get into at this point). Of course I also have the latest version of Norton Antivirus running (an absolute necessity if you're Internet active). Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 03 Dec 2001 11:52:44 -0700 Just a brief response to part of Jonathan's post. I'm not so sure that Harry Potter's audience is primarily those who have already read the books. That might be part of it, meaning that the people fronting the 125 million plus 2.5 million for the series rights surely want to tap a ready-made audience. However, I think that another big purpose for the movie (from the studio's point of view) is to hook the next generation of Harry Potter readers. The news during the opening was sporting all kind of 4-7 year old kis who couldn't really read through that kind of stuff, and these kids were "Harry Potter Harry Potter Harry Potter," through the roof. Still, I'm not arguing if these books are good are not. I've never read them, and probably won't for a while, given that I have lots of other things in line to read. In any case, this thing is a marketing machine gone amuck. It doesn't matter if the product is good. Kids couldn't refuse the books anymore even if they wanted to. There are a lot of people who are reading these books so they won't get left out of conversations. It's become a social phenomenon--and no one wants to be the outcast who hasn't read THE BOOKS OF THE CENTURY. One last thing, once Led Zeppelin starts writing songs with Harry Potter characters in them, maybe I'll close Tolkein and push Rowling a little closet to the top of my list. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 03 Dec 2001 11:58:31 -0700 <<>> I've only made it to about first base with Harry Potter, so I'm still nearly a virgin. (I've read just the first few chapters of the first book--until somewhere in Diagon Alley--to my 6-year-old, but he hasn't quite latched on yet, so we've stopped. As with Disneyland, I refuse to experience something aimed primarily at kids without a kid actually in tow to help me appreciate it vicariously.) However, we did go see the movie, and I agree with Katie's statement above. As an old Dungeons & Dragons and fantasy fan, this movie came across to me as throwing all kinds of familiar fantasy elements together into a stew. It had some interesting visuals and moments, but mostly it was about as compelling to me as stew. I wasn't impressed with the forced storytelling--for instance, Snape was a standard-issue red herring, and what I've seen of Voldemort so far is less convincing than Darth Vader. The movie really fell apart for me when they went down the trapdoor. That chess thing was dumb--why did the red-headed kid have to stay on the playing piece? If everyone knew about the magic mirror's properties and it was insignificant enough to gather dust in a storeroom, why was it considered an effective guard for the stone, and why would Quirrell have let himself be trapped by it? I agree that the way Harry beat Quirrell by touching him with the power of his mother's love was gag-eriffic. Maybe these things are handled better in the book. The movie wasn't unwatchable or anything. I'd give it a C+. Essentially the movie lays bare the skeleton of Rowling's story without the flesh of her reportedly magical prose. While her elephant may have had some remarkable new color or texture on the outside, the skeleton revealed by the movie is decidedly unremarkable. I hope the book pulls it off better, when we eventually get around to reading it. (I ordered the audio version of book one for Christmas, so maybe we'll just listen to it together instead of me reading it.) From what I've read so far of Rowling, however, she's not as fresh and original as Roald Dahl. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 03 Dec 2001 13:14:49 -0600 At 07:41 PM 11/30/01, you wrote: >Say what you will about Rowling's adverbs. What she has done is phenomenal. >She has crafted something so magical that even reluctant readers are drawn >in. And what she's written is NOTHING like the proliferating horror series >of yesteryear. It is also nothing like the Babysitter's Club. Or the >American Girls books. Or Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys. AMEN. Thank you for saying what I couldn't quite articulate after reading D. Michael's post. I love the Harry Potter books for their own merit, and frankly haven't read any better writing in this genre since the Chronicles of Narnia. To each his own. However, *especially* compared against the other popular children's series of the day: Goosebumps, Babysitters' Club, et al., the quality of J.K. Rowling's writing blows them away. I have suffered through reads of all the series listed above and then some, so that I am aware of what my children are reading. And believe me: it *has* been suffering... I find nothing inherently wrong with these series, and have allowed my children to read them after I preview them (and they like them), but give me more Harry Potter any day. Rowling raises the bar of literary expectation in her field. Trust me. ...With older series, such as Nancy Drew and the Boxcar Children, the originals are decently crafted. But the current "modernized" incarnations of these series are NOT, often written by someone else. It's the quality difference between the original Scooby Doo cartoon and all the following Scrappy Doo Mysteries garbage. (And you could not force me to read all 100+ Babysitters' Club books. I'd rather pluck every hair off my body individually with tweezers.) Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: [AML] "Great" Books (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 03 Dec 2001 10:33:45 -0700 It's finals week for me, and I probably should be writing my papers. But I thought I'd just make one comment here, since I see a potentially interesting thread developing. Robbin writes, >So back to the Harry Potter books. They are either great, or they aren't. >They just can't be not great in general, but maybe great as YA. That's not >giving enough credit to the world of literature for young people--which has >come along way since the days of Little Golden Books. I also loved the Harry Potter books, and I look forward to reading them to my son when he gets a little older. But I think the term "great" is really what is in question here. What makes a book "great"? If anyone out there has a really good definition, I'm interested in hearing it. Last year at Utah State, I taught an Introduction to Literature class, and we tried to come up with a list of specific things that define "greatness" in literature. After establishing our criteria, I brought out the Yellow Pages, and, much to our chagrin, we all noticed that it too fit our description of "great" literature. I only ask because I'm interested in hearing what a group of "great" writers has to say on the subject :) I must admit up front though, that I'm convinced any definition of bookish greatness will be hazy at best, more the product of what Stanley Fish calls "interpretive communities" than any real objective classification. If you are familiar with Stanley Fish, you can stop reading here, but if you've never heard his arguments, they might be interesting. In attempting to classify "greatness" in literature, one is quite often confronted with claims of "objectivity," as well as accusations of "subjectivity." On the one hand, readers often claim that the "greatness" of the text is based on methodical, precise, even mathematical procedures--and therefore reveals the real value in the text, plainly and unequivocally. Or, on the other hand, readers sometimes argue vociferously that any "greatness" in a text emerges from one's own personal experiences, biases, and, prejudices--an argument that allows every reader to have "their own" equally valid interpretation of the text. The resulting paradigm introduces several problems, particularly when one considers the shakiness of claims toward objectivity and the uselessness of accusations of subjectivity. The evidence against the "definitive" greatness is quite often compelling, even obvious, making the supposed value of the text nearly impossible to substantiate. And, on the flip-side, the basic premise of the subjective interpretation insinuates a kind of anti-social proclivity, as if to say "Fine, you have your definition of greatness, and I have mine, so just go home and stop wasting my time"--an argument that effectively eliminates any attempt toward validating literary criticism and, I would argue, plunges readers headlong into a kind of useless solipsism. Readers frustrated by these arguments will often conclude that the entire debate is a damned nuisance, literally a DAMNED nuisance, since neither side effectively answers the problems of textual interpretation. There is, however, a third option, introduced by Stanley Fish in _Is There a Text in This Class?_ (1980). Fish's argument implies the presence of "interpretive communities" that embody certain preconceived cultural ideas in formulating meaning and value in a text. He asserts that "the opposition between objectivity and subjectivity is a false one because neither exists in the pure form that would give the opposition its point," implying that the entire "objective vs. subjective" paradigm is faulty to begin with. And further that =93we do not have free-standing readers in a relationship of perceptual adequacy or inadequacy to an equally free-standing text. Rather we have readers whose consciousnesses are constituted by a set of conventional notions which when put into operation constitute in turn a conventional, and conventionally seen, object=94 (332). Viewed this way there is really no such thing as a completely objective or subjective stance. Instead, readers ineluctably act as members of a "literary community," participating in a collective construct concerning which meaning is considered valid. As Fish puts it: if the understandings of the people in question are informed by the same notions of what counts as a fact, of what is central, peripheral, and worthy of being noticed--in short, by the same interpretive principles--then agreement between them will be assured, and its source will not be a text that enforces its own perception but a way of perceiving that results in the emergence of those who share it (or those whom it shares) of the same text. (337) Like I said, I think this argument is practically unassailable. So what, then, makes the Harry Potter books (or any other books for that matter) "great?" [John Williams] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Enoch Train Sets Sail for 50 Young Passengers: Excel Entertainment Press Release 30Nov01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 03 Dec 2001 14:26:27 -0500 Enoch Train Sets Sail for 50 Young Passengers Acclaimed Folk Ensemble to Perform in Benefit Concert for Young Skyline High Musicians SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Eight master musicians, 90 exotic instruments and hundreds of years of folk heritage-that is the formula for Enoch Train, the instrumental Americana folk ensemble whose modern interpretations of folk and hymn tunes were the musical backbone of Sea Trek 2001. Now the ensemble will put their music to work in a benefit concert on December 3 for the Skyline High School Orchestra. Skyline High School's orchestra has been invited to play at the International Band and Orchestra Convention on December 19 in Chicago. They are the first Utah orchestra to be invited to play at that convention. The coveted invitation to that convention comes with a price tag-the students themselves must pay for the trip! Enoch Train will dedicate the proceeds of their December 3 concert to these young musicians who have distinguished themselves by their dedication. The December 3 benefit concert will be held at the Skyline High School auditorium. Music begins at 7:30 p.m. A dinner will begin at 6 p.m. Tickets are $5 for the concert and an additional $3 to attend the 6 p.m. dinner. Tickets are available at the door, or by calling Skyline High at 801-273-2080. Enoch Train will play one number with the Skyline Orchestra and then present a full evening of their trademark folk fusion hymn arrangements which were so popular this summer in Copenhagen, Esbjerg, Gothenburg, Oslo, Glasgow, Liverpool, Hull and Portsmouth. They played with the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra, on board the Staatsraad Lehmkuhl (the Norwegian tall ship), and in concerts across Northern Europe. Enoch Train's founder, Clive Romney, is an alumnus of Skyline High. In his days there (last century!), Clive was orchestra president, folk club president, and a class officer. Clive is also a long-time friend of Richard Chatelain, the orchestra's conductor. "I couldn't turn down Rich's invitation after all Skyline did to foster my love for and abilities in music," Clive says. "Larry Bird and Donald Ripplinger (previous orchestra and choir leaders) were huge influences in my life and I owe them more than I can ever pay back. So I'll pay it forward." The concert will include tunes from their debut self-titled album and from their recently-released second album, Set Sail. Set Sail features several hymn tunes that were sung at the embarkation of the ships from Albert Dock in Liverpool, ships which carried many of Enoch Train's own ancestors to America. Enoch Train will also perform "We Three Kings", which was honored at the 2001 Pearl Awards as "Holiday Recording of the Year". Enoch Train features Janice Andersen on fiddle and guitar, Daron Bradford on woodwinds, Dave Compton on harmonica, keyboards and guitar, Rich Dixon on guitars, Tom Hewitson on mandolin, guitar and percussion, Rob Honey on bass, Jay Lawrence on drums and percussion, and Clive Romney on mandolin, guitar, accordion, and percussion. To hear samples of Enoch Train's music, go to http://www.enochtrain.com . ### Source: Enoch Train Sets Sail for 50 Young Passengers Excel Entertainment Press Release 30Nov01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Elder Groberg devotional broadcast Dec. 4 Features Film: BYU Press Release 1Dec01 US UT Prov D3 Date: 03 Dec 2001 14:27:14 -0500 Elder John H. Groberg devotional broadcast Dec. 4 PROVO, UTAH -- The Brigham Young University devotional by Elder John H. Groberg of the First Quorum of the Seventy of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints scheduled for Tuesday (Dec. 4) will be broadcast live at 11:05 on KBYU-TV (Channel 11) and the BYU-Television satellite network. The BYU-TV satellite network will also show a live Webcast of the devotional on the Internet at www.byutv.org. The devotional will be rebroadcast Sunday, Dec. 9, on Channel 11 at 6 and 11 a.m. and on BYU-Television at 8 a.m. and 4 p.m. Elder Groberg will speak about his missionary experiences in Polynesia. He will also share highlights from the soon-to-be-released autobiographical film based on his book, "In the Eye of the Storm." Elder Groberg has been a member of the First Quorum of the Seventy since 1976. He now serves in the presidency of the Utah South Area. Previously he was the executive administrator for several areas of the Church including Hawaii, Tonga, Tahiti, Fiji, Samoa, Micronesia, Nevada, Arizona, the U.S North Central and Northern California Areas. Elder Groberg has served as a Regional Representative for seven years, as president of the Tonga Mission where he also served earlier as a missionary and as a bishop in Idaho Falls, Idaho. After graduating from BYU, he received his Master of Business Administration degree from Indiana University where he also taught. -###- Sources: Elder John H. Groberg devotional broadcast Dec. 4 BYU Press Release 29Nov 01 D3 Elder John H. Groberg at BYU devotional Dec. 4 BYU Press Release 26Nov01 D3 http://www.byu.edu/news/releases/Nov/groberg.htm See also: More about John H. Groberg's "Other Side of Heaven" at Amazon.com "The Other Side of Heaven" is the title of the paperback version of "In the Eye of the Storm" and of the film, which will be released December 14th. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN The Other Side of Heaven: From Book to Movie to Paperback: Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 03 Dec 2001 14:25:26 -0500 The Other Side of Heaven: From Book to Movie to Paperback SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- The missionary memoirs of Elder John H. Groberg, found in his popular book "In the Eye of the Storm," can now be enjoyed in paperback as "The Other Side of Heaven." "In the Eye of the Storm" has been re-titled "The Other Side of Heaven" for its paperback version available December 10th th coincide with the theatrical release, December 14 locally and December 21 nationally, of the major motion picture based on Elder Groberg's book. The cover art of the paperback release will match the promotional movie poster. This first-person account tells such stories as: The emergency night voyage on a turbulent sea, and the anxious search for the only guiding light into the destination harbor. The boy whose apparently lifeless body was handed to the missionaries with the words, "Here, make him well again -- you have the power." The storm that overturned the boat, throwing the missionaries into the raging sea. The hurricae that hit the little island. The hunger when the usual supply boat failed to show up. And so much more. This account tells the fascinating story of the three years he spent on the islands in the South Pacific amidst a kindly people who had a deep faith in God, a faith that provides a backdrop for Elder Groberg's accounts of miraculous healings, protective warnings, and perilous voyages. This remarkable book paints a vivid picture of missionary life in a society geared to "a different way of thinking." But it is far from being solely a collection of stories. To the experiences it recounts, the author has added observations on the scenes and circumstances that in an inspiring way bring out the gospel principles involved. Given this combination, the total effect of the book is that from the time reader's are introduced to this young missionary through his journey to Tonga they will be engrossed in his story until the end. ### Source: The Other Side of Heaven: From Book to Movie to Paperback Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 A2 See also: More about John H. Groberg's "Other Side of Heaven" at Amazon.com "The Other Side of Heaven" is the title of the paperback version of "In the Eye of the Storm" and of the film, which will be released December 14th. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: [AML] RE: "Great" Books (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 03 Dec 2001 14:57:31 -0700 ---Original Message From: Major Productions > > As you can probably tell, I like the Harry Potter books. I don't > > think they are great literature. But they just might be great YA > > literature and there is plenty there for adults to appreciate. > > I have to surface here--though I am usually a major list-lurker... Thank you for surfacing! I'm glad you brought this up. > I have to take exception to the above. I am a writer of and > reader of (and, as a former children's librarian, pusher of) > children's lit and it is my very strong opinion that great is great. I used to believe that, too (that great is great). Melissa (who I had the great good fortune to marry) has convinced me otherwise. And I don't mean that as a dabbler in children's lit, either. Some of the best fantasy and science fiction on the market is marketed as Young Adult. Robin McKinley (The Blue Sword and Hero and the Crown), Dianna Wynne Jones, Diane Duane, among others, write some of the best books out there. Some of it very challenging and insightful. One of the best things about J. K. Rowling is that it has sparked an interest in long dormant books by Dianna Wynne Jones (and I'm sure others as well). That said, the problem is that there is no universal definition for great. Does frequent use of -ly words automatically disqualify you from great? Or does that merely represent an adjustment for audience? As an adult, the -ly words interfere with my reading--pulling me out of the story. But for my children, they don't notice all the -lys and might find them necessary to how much they enjoy the books. Maybe I'll experiment a little and start leaving out the -lys as I read to them--see what happens. Hmmm. > And whether or not it is, the fact that Harry Potter speaks > to so many people of all ages is a truly remarkable thing. I absolutely agree. And it is something that I think we need to take a serious look at as people invested in the reading habits of, well, everyone really. It would be very well for us to try to discover *why* these books are so engaging to their target audience. Rip on it all you like, but it does something fundamentally right that we should try very hard to identify and, where possible, emulate. > Decades ago, when I was but a young lass at BYU, there were > condescending references made to "kiddie lit". But it is not > a bastardized (Can I use that word here?) sub-genre. It's the > real thing. I absolutely agree. Melissa had the same experience at BYU. She is very involved in "kiddie lit" and has infected me somewhat as well. There is some great stuff there and one of the joys of raising children is being able to share the great stuff with them. > So back to the Harry Potter books. They are either great, or > they aren't. They just can't be not great in general, but > maybe great as YA. That's not giving enough credit to the > world of literature for young people--which has come along > way since the days of Little Golden Books. I understand what you say, but I want to point out that at the base of your statement is the assumption that there is some hierarchy of genres. When I say something is great YA literature but not great 'literature', I'm not saying that it is not great. As Dave Wolverton likes to point out, literature is itself a genre with specific rules and structures, and doesn't have any more intrinsic value than any other genre. For me, the Harry Potter books could use some editing to take out the heavy handed adverbs and such. So it isn't great for me (very good, and a lovely read and I couldn't put them down, but only with the effort of mentally editing certain elements). To me, Dianna Wynne Jones is infinitely better. But I want to recognize that the very things that bother me, might be a part of what is so right about the books in how they engage young people--i.e. make it great for 'kiddies'. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: [AML] Quotation Marks Date: 03 Dec 2001 14:52:31 -0700 I just started reading _Red Water_ by Judith Freeman, in which she never uses quotation marks around her characters' speech. I don't get this style choice at all. Reasons to use quotation marks -- Readers of English literature have come to expect the author to set off dialogue with some sort of special punctuation. To me, quotation marks make the most sense. We get a visual cue about which words came out of the characters' mouths. I can also accept em-dashes (i.e., James Joyce). -- Leaving out the quotation marks works contrary to the reader's expectations and creates a negative reading experience. -- Quotation marks leave no ambiguity. If I want to put a character's unspoken thoughts in the center of a paragraph of dialogue, quotation marks clearly set apart the spoken from the unspoken word. Reasons not to use quotation marks -- I have read one work where I think I understand the author's decision not to use quotation marks: _Angela's Ashes_ by Frank McCourt. I believe that McCourt did not want people to confuse his reconstructed memories of situations with factual situations. If he had used quotation marks, it would appear that four-year-old McCourt had photographically remembered his parent's conversations. By not using quotation marks, he expresses the content of the conversations without committing to word-for-word accuracy. I still had to spend time getting used to this narrative style, which still presented certain ambiguities about whether the main character really spoke aloud or just to himself. -- You want to create an air of superiority over the reader. You believe that you, as an artist, cannot bother with silly conventions and reader expectations. You want your final pages to look like long blocks of exposition that the reader will have to slog through. You believe that you create Literature with every sentence, and that the lowly reader should just accept your artistic decisions without complaint. In other words, an affectation. Choosing not to use quotation marks creates immediate distance between author and reader. Freeman could argue along the same lines as McCourt -- that she does not want to create the idea that she can produce exact quotes about the real-life characters in her historical novel. But _Red Water_ addresses events in the late 1800s, so I don't think that anyone would really believe that she had somehow found exact transcriptions of John D. Lee's pillow-talk with his wives. Besides, I have read numerous historical novels that use quotation marks without ever inferring that I could find documentary evidence of the conversations -- that's history, not fiction. So why would any author make this style choice? -- Terry L Jeffress | The man who does not read good books has no South Jordan, UT | advantage over the man who can't read them. | -- Mark Twain -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: [AML] Review Archive Update Date: 03 Dec 2001 16:26:40 -0700 New Titles Review in November 2001 ================================== 505 The Whipping Boy by J. Scott Bronson reviewed by Andrew R Hall 506 J. Golden by James Arrington reviewed by D. Michael Martindale 507 If I Forget, You Remember by Carol Lynch Williams reviewed by Tracie Laulusa 508 The Shadow Taker by Blaine M. Yorgason reviewed by Jeff Needle 509 Beneath the Surface by Jeni Grossman reviewed by Julia H. Todd 510 I'll Find You by Clair M. Poulson reviewed by Terry L Jeffress 511 One More River to Cross by Margaret Blair Young reviewed by Roy Schmidt 512 Stones by J. Scott Bronson reviewed by Darlene Young 513 Love, Sin and Survival: Three Women in 1930's Utah by LaVon B. Carroll reviewed by Jana Bouck Remy AML-List Review Archive Statistics ================================== Build date: Tuesday, 3 December 2001, 15:59:12 Total reviews: 513 Total reviews this year: 104 Most Prolific Reviewers Needle, Jeff 70 (13.6%) Rasband, R. W. 32 ( 6.2%) Martindale, D. Michael 29 ( 5.7%) Clark, Harlow S. 28 ( 5.5%) Hall, Andrew R 19 ( 3.7%) Parker, Katie 17 ( 3.3%) Parkin, Scott 11 ( 2.1%) Samuelsen, Eric R. 11 ( 2.1%) Parkinson, Benson 11 ( 2.1%) Most Reviewed Authors Card, Orson Scott 33 ( 6.4%) Young, Margaret Blair 12 ( 2.3%) Dutcher, Richard 9 ( 1.8%) Hughes, Dean 9 ( 1.8%) Lund, Gerald N. 9 ( 1.8%) Parkinson, Benson Y. 9 ( 1.8%) Arrington, James 7 ( 1.4%) Most Reviewed Titles Brigham City 7 ( 1.4%) Latter-day Daughters 7 ( 1.4%) MTC, The: Set Apart 7 ( 1.4%) Children of the Promise 6 ( 1.2%) Work and the Glory, The 6 ( 1.2%) Testaments, The 6 ( 1.2%) Most Reviewed Publishers Deseret Book 108 (21.1%) Signature Books 53 (10.3%) Bookcraft 44 ( 8.6%) Covenant Communications 35 ( 6.8%) Aspen Books 22 ( 4.3%) Shadow Mountain 17 ( 3.3%) Tor 16 ( 3.1%) -- Terry L Jeffress | It is a good rule, after reading a new book, South Jordan, UT | never to allow yourself another new one till you | have read an old one in between. -- C. S. Lewis -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: Re: [AML] Bad Personal News Date: 03 Dec 2001 15:09:38 -0800 This is terrible. Please know our prayers and good thoughts will be with you all. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Scott BRONSON, _Stones_ Date: 03 Dec 2001 18:17:56 -0700 At 06:00 PM 12/1/01, you wrote: >While I may believe that I am building the kingdom of God (effecting >change for the better) with my play, Stones," I am perfectly aware that >there may be some who will believe that I am tearing down the kingdom. I >already know of at least a couple of people who hated the show. And I >observed another guy the other night who appeared to be bored completely >out of his gourd. Whatever. I loved the show, Scott. The acting and the script were marvelous, and I was completely involved in every moment. My 13-year-old grandson just sat there after it was over, saying, "Incredible!" and he thanked me several times for taking him to see it. He also said that it was the first time he understood the connection between Abraham's sacrifice of his son and Heavenly Father's sacrifice. When I was at church on Sunday, I was thinking that I wished everyone in the ward could have seen the play--I was still filled with thoughts of it. I tried telling my Sunday School class about it, but almost every line I tried to quote made me choke up. I think that Eric Snider was off in saying that the first part needed closure. To me, it was about those two men coming to a complete willingness to make the sacrifice. One they were ready, the play was over. (But it's a good thing we did know what happened next!) Where did you find that young man? He was amazing! Well, you all were! But the words that you gave them were stunning. When I got home, I had to take five pounds of soggy kleenex out of my purse. What higher tribute do you need? barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Barbara R. Hume" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _House on the Sound_ (BYU Newsnet) Date: 03 Dec 2001 18:21:06 -0700 At 12:07 AM 12/3/01, you wrote: >"What sells in Mormon writing is easier to read," Brown said. >"But I wanted to write things that were not quite as >accessible." I would love for Marilyn to expand on this comment. Perhaps I can finally come to understand what literary writers are thinking. . . . . barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN A Christmas Message of Love, Hope and Healing: Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 03 Dec 2001 21:25:58 -0500 A Christmas Message of Love, Hope and Healing SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- When Robert's father suffers a near-fatal injury from an accident on Christmas Eve, the twelve-year-old boy must not only take over the operation of the extensive family orchard, but he also must wrestle to maintain his courage in the face of mounting troubles. This is the setting for "Christmas of the Cherry Snow" (Eagle Gate, $15.95), bestselling author Richard M. Siddoway's newest novel of a family keeping hope in the face of tragedy, and a mother's determination never to give up. Set in the 1950s, "Christmas of the Cherry Snow" takes a nostalgic look back at an innocent time -- when kids were free to be kids, when television was still a novelty, and when Christmas was filled with magic. As Robert and his family struggle to overcome the burdens created by his father's injuries, they take comfort in the spirit of the Christmas season. The tree, with its colorful ornaments and gifts, becomes a symbol of hope. Bu the tree begins loosing its needles and becomes barely more than a stick, causing the family to struggle with its faith. Will those values they've embraced for generations endure even in the face of adversity? "Christmas of the Cherry Snow" is appealing to readers young and old alike. About the Author Richard M. Siddoway has been a professional educator for more than 30 years, and currently serves as a member of the Utah State Legislature. His previous books include "The Christmas Wish," the bestselling novel that later became a made-for-television movie staring Debbie Reynolds and Neal Patrick Harris. He and his wife Janice, the parents of eight children and grandparents of nine, live in Bountiful, Utah. Source: A Christmas Message of Love, Hope and Healing Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 US UT SLC A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: [AML] YOUNG & GRAY, _Standing on the Promises_ Date: 03 Dec 2001 22:08:33 -0800 (PST) I'm pleased to report that in my ward's gospel doctrine class yesterday _Standing on the Promises_ was used as one of the main sources for a lesson on the June 1978 revelation on the priesthood. Granted this is a fairly liberal ward, but it was still cool to see. And it was also nice to be involved in a lesson where much of the discussion and presentation wasn't 'here's how we answer the question of why the blacks didn't get the priesthood until 1978' but instead was focused on the experiences of African Americans and black Africans in the Church. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. http://shopping.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] _Irreantum_ Proofers Needed Date: 04 Dec 2001 10:05:36 -0700 The autumn issue of Irreantum is almost ready for proofing (yes, we are still a couple of months behind--we are working to catch up). This issue is completely devoted to Eugene England. We are looking for some volunteers to read through it for typos and errors (but not stylistic preferences, at this point). We can provide you a PDF, or you can pick up and drop off a hard copy at approximately 8th North and I-15 in Orem, Utah. If you proof a PDF, you can either e-mail us your changes (which requires some orientation typing, such as "On page 3, second column, 7th line from bottom, there is an extra period"). Or you can fax or drop off just the pages you've marked. We anticipate having the proofs ready by December 16. Your turnaround time will be 72 hours. Please let us know ASAP if you can help and how you want the proofs (paper or PDF). The more eyeballs the better. Thanks in advance! Chris Bigelow chris.bigelow@unicitynetwork.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: [AML] RE: (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 04 Dec 2001 16:49:17 -0700 Um. I've always been comforted by the quote by Brigham Young when he was asked point blank about dime novels. His response was (and I paraphrase), "It's better to read dime novels than to read nothing at all." Which isn't precisely an endorsement, but certainly qualifies as a decent excuse... Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 04 Dec 2001 16:53:51 -0700 To be fair, Andrew should have mentioned that most of the English-speaking world was anti-novel during the mid- to late-1800's. Brother Brigham was simply following the current fashion. My answer to the question of why read all these novels is this: fiction helps me empathize. Also, as art critic Dave Hickey once argued, difficult art makes people better able to deal with difficult personal, political, and social problems. It's a kind of exercise for the brain. I do think it's a waste of time to be sucking up entertainment all the time. It's good some of the time, very good. For me it's a balancing act; writing, reading, charity. I can only do each of them for so long, and then I must clean the kitchen. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: Re: [AML] Quotation Marks Date: 04 Dec 2001 16:59:27 -0700 Cormac McCarthy seems to think that all punctiation marks except for [. , ?] are unneeded extravagances, and I must admit that in his writing, I've never missed them because his rhythms more than make up for the lasck of punctuation. James Joyce employed the French model where dialogue looks like --Yes, Gabriel said. We should go to the party. --Why? She looked about the room, thinking of a suitable answer. --Because that Austen woman will be there, she said, curtly. And so forth. Some people don't want to separate the dialogue from the description. I don't always think that's a wise choice. But that's part of an answer anyway. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: [AML] Adverbs (was: "Great" Books) Date: 04 Dec 2001 17:02:37 -0700 This whole leaving out the ly adverbs is important only if writers use them to create more interesting verb structures. For example, to eat quickly is to "wolf" to run quickly is to "dash" or "dart." In most cases these are metaphorical uses of verbs which indicate to me a much greater control of the language, which is something good writers (with few exceptions Dos Passos, for exapmle) always demonstrate. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: Re: [AML] Scott BRONSON, _Stones_ Date: 04 Dec 2001 17:14:35 -0700 Barbara Hume: >I think that Eric Snider was off in saying that the first part >needed closure. To me, it was about those two men coming to a >complete willingness to make the sacrifice. One they were ready, the >play was over. (But it's a good thing we did know what happened >next!) I agree it was about two men coming to a complete willingness to make the sacrifice. Had it ended with that willingness established, I'd have been fine with it. It was the fact that Abraham actually raised the knife and made to go stabby, in a quick, jerky motion, that was off-putting. If the play's going to go THAT far with their "willingness," I think it needs to let us breathe again by showing us that he didn't have to go through with it after all. Still a great play, though. Eric D. Snider -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 04 Dec 2001 18:03:47 -0700 on 12/3/01 11:58 AM, Christopher Bigelow at Chris.Bigelow@UnicityNetwork.com wrote: > From what I've read so far of Rowling, however, she's not as > fresh and original as Roald Dahl. Hmmm. Whimsical and fetching as Dahl can be, I came away from both the Harry Potter books and the Harry Potter movie thinking, "J. K. Rowling is what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of bitterness and hatred." Steve -- skperry@mac.com http://stevenkappperry.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Preston" Subject: [AML] AML "Best Film" Award Date: 04 Dec 2001 19:15:23 -0600 The AML recognized "God's Army" both for its artistic merit as well as its historic importance. Because of its trend-setting nature, such far-reaching praise may not be repeated any time soon. But clearly the Association for Mormon Letters would like to grant awards in this category in the future. Some might point out that "Gods' Army" was an easy choice because it was the only "Mormon film" released commercially in 2000. But, unlike with the Academy Awards, there are no rules specifying commercial release as a requirement. Perhaps the AML "Best Film" Award could have gone to Kieth Merrill's extraordinary large screen epic "The Testaments of One Fold and One Shepherd," which was also released in 2000, although it was shown only in the Joseph Smith Building in Salt Lake City. But "Testaments" is a work commissioned by the Church. Perhaps it was not even have been considered by the AML. But the AML does not seem to exhibit anti-institutional bias. Deseret Book publications have been honored in the past, and in 2000 the AML Award for Personal Essay went to Pres. Gordon B. Hinckley for his book Standing for Something. Could another contender for "Best Film" have been Neil LaBute's Showtime special "Bash: Latter-day Plays"? It, too, features Latter-day Saint characters. But perhaps this would only have been considered in the Drama category, because it was essentially a taping of the off-Broadway play. And there is the question of films without Latter-day Saint characters. What about other year 2000 feature films such as LaBute's "Nurse Betty" or Bluth's "Titan A.E."? These were probably not considered. Should they be? While most AML Award recipients have featured overt LDS themes and characters, not all have. Anne Perry's Victorian mystery The Sins of the Wolf and Slover's "A Joyful Noise" are set before 1830 and certainly feature no Latter-day Saint characters, yet both won the AML Award. Card's AML-winning Xenocide features an Ender Wiggins who identifies himself as Catholic, forgetting his half-Mormon parentage (the philosophy and metaphysics of the novel, not the religious affiliation of the characters, are what caught the AML's attention). Martine Bates' The Dragon's Tapestry and The Prism Moon are outright sword-and-sorcery fantasies. Naturally all of these works exhibit Latter-day Saint ideas and motifs. But could not the same be said of "Titan A.E.," with its space-faring re-creation of the Pioneer Trek, Christological symbolism and planet-forming conclusion? Perhap these questions are purely academic. Regardless of whether or not these other films were considered, the truth is that "God's Army" was more deserving of the "Best Film" distinction than these other possibilities. Without even considering where it was shown, or whether or not it features Latter-day Saint characters, it is a better film than "Testaments", "Bash" or "Titan A.E." And "God's Army" is a better film than a number of year 2000 movies made by Latter-day Saints and released on video with little or no exposure in theaters, such as Kels Goodman's "Y2K, A Comedy", Treu's "The Brainiacs.com", Dayton's "Where the Red Fern Grows", Hendershot's "Message in a Cell Phone", Featherstone's "Return to the Secret Garden", Kemp's "Fedora", etc. What will happen with the AML Best Film Award in the future? In the year 2001 there were two feature films made by and about Latter-day Saints: Richard Dutcher's "Brigham City" and Mitch Davis' "The Other Side of Heaven." It seems almost certain, and appropriate, that one of these will be singled out by the AML as the "Best Film" of 2001 in the realm of "Mormon Letters." "Brigham City" was an excellent film, even better than "God's Army," and if it had no competition I would see nothing wrong with awarding Dutcher a second "Best Film" award in a row. But "The Other Side of Heaven" offers serious competition, and I believe the AML will intensely consider the merits of both. With a budget 7 times higher than "Brigham City," and the guidance of Hollywood veterens such as Jerry Molen and John Garbett, I'm sure there are people who predict "Other Side" will be hard to beat. But I haven't seen it yet. And I'm not a judge. "The Mountain Meadows Massacre", a documentary, was released on video this year, but it is doubtful that it will be considered a competitor in the "Best Film" competition, although it has been shown at the Eclipse and Young LDS film festivals. Perhaps a "Best Documentary" category will be implemented to consider the merits of films such as this one, as well as Triffo's "Men of Valour: Heroes of the Victoria Cross" and "Disasters of the Century", Swofford and Smoot's "Shackleton's Antarctic Adventure", Van Wagenen's "The Haunted Desert: Archaelogy and the Dead Sea Scrolls", Chamberlain's "There's No Place Like Home," Brandon Arnold's "Loie", Durham's "Woodwork", and Mikita's "Sea Voyage of the Saints." The question of whether or not to consider feature films without LDS characters may be a moot point this year. The release of LaBute's "Possession" was postponed until early 2002. Richard Rich's animated "Trumpet of the Swan" was the only other theatrically released non-documentary film of 2001 that was directed by a Latter-day Saint. "Trumpet of the Swan" is a lot of fun (my kids love the DVD), but it, along with family-friendly direct-to-video releases such as T.C. Christensen's "The Penny Promise" and "Bug Off!" are unlikely to be compared directly to "Brigham City" and "The Other Side of Heaven." 2002 will be the first year with serious, perhaps unpredictable competition, and some interesting questions to resolve. At least four feature films by and about Latter-day Saints are expected to be released to theaters in 2002: Kurt Hale's "The Singles Ward", Adam Anderegg's "Charly", Cary Derbidge and Ryan Little's "Out of Step" and Kels Goodman's "Handcart." From what I know about these productions, all of these will be excellent, artistically accomplished films with wide viewership. Perhaps these four films alone will be the field of nominees for AML's "Best Film" of 2002. But each of these films was helmed by a director who has never before had anything shown in commercial theaters. Judged purely on artistic merit, it is unlikely that any of these four films will surpass LaBute's much anticipated "Possession." On top of the fact that this is LaBute's 4th major film, he also had studio backing, and a much larger budget. And the talent: The four "LDS Market" films feature incredible talent: Will Swenson, Jeremy Elliott, Michael Buster, Heather Beers, Connie Young, Kim Wares, Daryn Tufts, Alison Akin Clark. But can they compete with LaBute's direction of Gwyneth Paltrow, Aaron Eckhart, and Jeremy Northam? Realistically, it may be necessary for the AML to officially restrict the field to films with overt LDS themes and characters, and leave "Possessed" to the Academy Awards voters. There are two distinct possibilities for what will happen after 2002: If "The Singles Ward", "Out of Step", "Charly" and "Handcart" (or at least some of these) are good movies, and they are commercially successful, the following years will see the advent of yet more LDS-themed films, of increasing quality. But if these are mediocre or embarrassing films, and if they fail to attact audiences (and returns on investments), the AML "Best Film" Award may be retired because there will be nobody to give it to. Preston Hunter www.adherents.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Internet: Personal and Small Business, Literature Websites: Kent Larsen 3Dec01 US NY NYC I4 Date: 04 Dec 2001 22:24:43 -0500 Personal and Small Business, Literature Websites NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- The number of personal and small business websites run by members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints seems to be growing rapidly, and this week's new websites demonstrate their prevalence. The new websites include a massage and doula business, a wedding invitation business, a filtering software business and a floral business, in addition to a few personal web pages. Also new this week are a couple of literature resources, including one that specifically focuses on Mormon literature. Among the businesses, the nicest design comes from LDSfilter.com, which sells filtering software meant to screen pornography websites while using the Internet. Also nice is Rebecca's Sunnybrook Flowers, which includes floral arrangements for weddings and other occasions. However, the site doesn't have photos of its arrangements catalog available yet. The literature sites include Suite101.com's Mormon (LDS) Literature page, which includes a few articles on Mormon literature in addition to discussion boards and links. However, the site misses much of the Mormon literature material available elsewhere. While it doesn't specifically aim at Mormons, Katharsis.org provides more detailed links and resources for writers. Newly Listed Mormon Websites: Amber's Natural Health and Healing Website http://www.geocities.com/alglmt/ Website covering LDS Church member's massage and doula business. Gives basic information on natural health and healing, including doula services, massage, complimentary health care and energy work, natural family planning, healthy eating and living, polycystic ovarian syndrome, and more. Celebrations Invitations and More http://www.celebrationsinvitations.com/ Midlothian, Virginia LDS Church-member's 20-year-old business selling wedding invitations. Includes links to wedding invitation catalogs, and some favorite sites. Doug Noble.com http://www.dougnoble.com/ Attractive personal page for Mesa, Arizona-based LDS Church member. Includes pages about children, Moab, Utah, Alpine, a picture gallery, ancestry and links to other sites. Katharsis http://www.katharsis.org/ Writer's support website run by LDS Church member Rachel Anne Lister. Includes submitted fiction and poetry, as well as sections on journaling, writing aids, workshops and critique circles. Includes a long list of links to useful writing sites. An attractive and nicely-organized site. LDSfilter.com http://www.LDSfilter.com/ Website for filtering software meant to filter Internet webpages for pornography. LDS-MassageTherapyGroup http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LDS-MassageTherapyGroup Yahoo!Groups discussion list for Latter-day Saint (Mormon) Massage Therapists. Covers professional discussion of massage therapy from a LDS perspective and of other natural therapies, natural healing, body work, or energy work. Nomrom.com: Another Backwards Mormon... http://www.nomrom.com/ Umbrela site that includes site for LDS Pocket PC resources. Also includes personal sites for Andrew Lewis, Curtis Gibb and a wedding album for Heidi J. Fisher and Michael G. Gehmlich. The Pocket PC resource page includes software for syncing the LDS Church's MIS data to MS Outlook, and links to sources for LDS palm resources. Rebecca's Sunnybrook Flowers & More http://www.sunnybrookflowers.com/ Attractive site for Tuscon-based LDS Church-member's floral business. In Search of Ancient Cumorah http://www.ancientcumorah.com/ Website for video produced by LDS Church members Dave Asay and Randy Mellor that attempts to describe the locations of Book of Mormon geographical locations. The video places the Hill Cumorah at the Hill Vigia, near Santiago Tuxtla in Veracruz state, Mexico. It includes interviews with LDS archaeologist Dr. Bruce Warren and LDS Scholar Dr. Joseph L. Allen. Suite 101: Mormon (LDS) Literature http://www.suite101.com/welcome.cfm/mormon_lds_literature Site about Mormon Literature using about.com-like Suite101.com. Includes links to Internet sites on Mormon Literature and general Mormon sites, articles about Mormon Literature and discussion boards. While not as heavily promoted as about.com, suite101.com is nicer, not as heavily coded and its subjects are better organized. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] AML "Best Film" Award Date: 05 Dec 2001 14:56:09 -0700 On Tue, Dec 04, 2001 at 07:15:23PM -0600, Preston wrote: > What will happen with the AML Best Film Award in the future? First, lets make some adjustments in vocabulary. AML did award Richard Dutcher the 2000 AML Award for Film for his work on "God's Army." The word "best" does not appear in the title of this or any other the award category. The AML Awards recognize an individual for their contribution to the field of Mormon letters. In practice, the year's "best" novel does not necessarily make the greatest contribution to Mormon letters. Also, the AML board does not necessarily grant an award in every category every year. So far, Richard received the first and only award for film. The board might choose not to consdier the film category for the 2001 awards. For example, the board did not grant an award for the novel in 1997 and had no award for drama in 1998. Many award categories come and go. The board has not used the Biography award category since the 1996 awards. Sometimes the board even creates a category (1993 Service to Mormon Letters award to Neila Seshachari) or uses the category "Special Award" to recognize the contributions of an individual that do not easily fall into other more common categories. I certainly do not want to deter the discussion of films worthy of notice and how those films contribute to the field of Mormon letters, but I have seen a general misunderstanding about how the board chooses its awards in this and other posts in the past. If you would like to review the know history of the AML Awards, you can always visit the AML Website and browse the Awards database: http://www.aml-online.org/awards/index.html -- Terry L Jeffress | Advice to young writers who want to get ahead South Jordan, UT | without any annoying delays: don't write about | Man, write about a man. -- E. B. White -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: lajackson@juno.com Subject: [AML] re: Beards Date: 04 Dec 2001 20:51:13 -0600 Barbara Hume: > "Now Brother Johnson" sayeth he. "What can I do > to get you to shave off your beard?" He didn't say why he wanted you to do that? ... It seems so much more a cultural issue than a religious one. ... a book about the intermingling of LDS culture and LDS dogma (which someone ought to do, if no one has). _______________ Some day I'm going to write a book (<-- list connection, it worked for Barbara). And in it, I'm going to include the story of the stake president who called a new bishop, telling him that the beard had to go. The good brother told the stake president that, although he had no desire to serve as bishop, he was certainly willing to do so if called, but that the beard came with the face. This brother said it was completely up to the stake president, and he would not be offended either way the decision went. He was sustained with the big red bushy beard. And I'm going to tell about the bishop who also happened to be a senior officer at the nearby Air Force Base. He encouraged the members to live the gospel, but they didn't respond to the bishop's requests as the more junior military responded to him at work. The bishop became very frustrated. One day another good brother in the ward put his arm around the bishop and said, "Bishop, do you know what your problem is? At work you are a senior officer, and the airmen respond quickly to your instructions. I'm really sorry, but here at Church, you're just the bishop!" Then I'll tell why the first bishop shaved off his beard (it had nothing to do with Church), how the second bishop succeeded in getting his members to follow, and what motivates members to serve and build the Kingdom. And then I'll find a good editor to tell me why I shouldn't be telling all these things and help me make it into an internationally famous best selling book. (I could even intermingle a little LDS culture and dogma in there, too, which I "ought to do, if no one has.") But, how would I make it interesting enough to read? Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] "Great" Books Date: 05 Dec 2001 08:00:50 -0700 On Mon, 3 Dec 2001 14:57:31 -0700 "Jacob Proffitt" writes: > ---Original Message From: Major Productions: > > Decades ago, when I was but a young lass at BYU, there were > > condescending references made to "kiddie lit". > Melissa had the same experience at BYU. So did I. My play, "Dial Tones," was in the PDA (Playwright, Director, Actor) Workshop. One of my characters confessed to another that her favorite book was Scott O'Dell's _Island Of the Blue Dolphin_. One of the professors in the workshop wrote in this comment on the script: "Her favorite book is a children's book? This brings her mind down a notch in my estimation." So, I rewrote the scene. It now goes like this: HAZEL I make all my students read it, so every year I get to read it again. It's pretty much my favorite book. KELLY What grade do you teach again? HAZEL Fifth. KELLY Fifth graders read this book? HAZEL Yeah, well, it's kind of --, it's children's literature. KELLY I'm not into kid's lit. HAZEL Why? KELLY ‘Cause when I was ten I started to read Stuart Little, and I thought it was totally absurd for this guy -- the author -- HAZEL E.B. White. KELLY Whatever. But there's no way he's gonna get me to believe that two human beings gave birth to a little white mouse. I'm sorry, but even at ten years old, I knew more about -- I knew enough to know where little white mice came from. HAZEL Really. A man of the world at such a young age. KELLY Yep. HAZEL Well, that was only one book, and it was a long time ago. Give it another try. KELLY I don't want to read a book about a little white mouse with human parents. HAZEL You don't have to read that one, there's all kinds of good "kids lit" you could read. KELLY No thank you. HAZEL You like science fiction, what about A Wrinkle in Time? KELLY Not interested. HAZEL Why? What are you afraid of? KELLY Not afraid of anything. Just don't wanna waste my time with it. HAZEL Oh, so it's beneath you, is it? KELLY I didn't say that. TELEPHONE But you meant it. HAZEL "Children's literature does not enlarge one's intellect." KELLY Hazel-- HAZEL So, I suppose, since Island of the Blue Dolphins is my favorite book -- one of my favorite books anyway -- it takes my mind down a notch, in your estimation. KELLY No. TELEPHONE Liar! HAZEL Tell the truth, Kelly. KELLY I a --. TELEPHONE Go ahead. Try to lie to her. KELLY Well, it's not what I expected. HAZEL Okay, now you listen to me Mister Snobby Pseudo-Intellectual -- KELLY Whoa. HAZEL I mean it. This type of thing really pisses me off -- KELLY Hey, relax. HAZEL No! I will not relax! TELEPHONE That's it! HAZEL Okay, I'll relax. TELEPHONE Wimp. HAZEL Maybe "kid's lit" isn't the most "scholarly" type of reading there is, but that doesn't mean it has no value. Maybe a lot of it doesn't speak to your mind, but, if it's well done, it certainly speaks to your heart. KELLY That was very eloquent. HAZEL Oh, don't patronize me you jerk. KELLY Hey, I'm sorry. HAZEL The hell you are. KELLY Good grief. HAZEL You're just like every other self-proclaimed intellectual I know. Believing all the books they read in college, and adopting all the elitist opinions of their professors and then actually believing it was something they thought up themselves. The "offending" professor recognized himself in this scene and to this day we are still ... well, I wouldn't say friends (we don't hang out together) ... on very friendly terms. I don't think, however, that my little tirade in the play had any effect on his views of kid-lit. Too bad. J. Scott Bronson -- Member of Playwrights Circle "The sun, with all those planets revolving around it and dependent upon it, can still ripen a bunch of grapes as if it had nothing else in the universe to do." Galileo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG & GRAY, _Standing on the Promises_ Date: 05 Dec 2001 09:38:02 -0700 I can't tell you how thrilling it is for me to hear this. I was asked to talk for a few minutes on the subject (same lesson) in my ward. To be honest, I was a little chagrined that the manuel spoke about the Church in Africa--where there is so much miraculous success--but said little about the Church and African Americans. There is considerably less success with missionary work among African Americans, and much difficulty retaining them after baptism. We are yet haunted by words of past leaders, which new converts inevitably (it seems) come across and are troubled by. Many new converts don't know about the former priesthood restriction, and when they learn are troubled again. When I discuss the book with returned missionaries, I often ask if they were confronted with the race question on their missions. The answer is almost always YES. And when I ask how they answered, they usually say they didn't really feel like they had a good answer. It's tough stuff. Perhaps the most troubling thing I've heard lately--and this from three returned missionaries who served in different missions--is that some false doctrine is circulating again (a discourse by Alvin Dyer which talks about valiency in the pre-existence). These missionaries received it ON their missions. Can we call that discourse Mormon literature and hence tie it in with the list's objectives? Here's my question: How on earth can we get that talk out of circulation? Is it possible? Or how can we train missionaries to recognize that its teachings are contrary to the scriptures? Do we need a special class at the MTC for this? [Margaret Young] William Morris wrote: > I'm pleased to report that in my ward's gospel doctrine class yesterday > _Standing on the Promises_ was used as one of the main sources for a > lesson on the June 1978 revelation on the priesthood. Granted this is a > fairly liberal ward, but it was still cool to see. And it was also nice > to be involved in a lesson where much of the discussion and presentation > wasn't 'here's how we answer the question of why the blacks didn't get the > priesthood until 1978' but instead was focused on the experiences of > African Americans and black Africans in the Church. > > ~~William Morris > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Buy the perfect holiday gifts at Yahoo! Shopping. > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] Fw: MN The Other Side of Heaven: From Book to Movie Date: 05 Dec 2001 10:15:06 -0700 May I just invite everyone to support the movie? Remember that the first week of a movie's release is of vital importance to its success. Please come, if possible, during that first week. The actual premier is December 12 in Salt Lake City. Dec. 14 is the opening in Utah theaters (the Scera here in Utah Valley). Yesterday's BYU devotional featured Elder Groberg, his wife (Jean) and Mitch Davis, the film's maker. President Bateman scheduled it--it was an extra devotional--and told Elder Groberg that he wanted every BYU student to see that movie. Though some administrators were nervous that the devotional would appear to be a commercial, it was all done in good taste. [Margaret Young] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 05 Dec 2001 13:18:54 -0600 I'm going to skim around the edges of the "Great" Books thread here, then talk specifically about the Harry Potter books and where I think they fit in that regard. I agree with those who argue that "great" is a relative term that has a lot more meaning when attached to a specific genre or type of literature. But then, that follows from my arguments about esthetic standards. I think that the qualities of a good children's book are not necessarily those of a good book for adults, though I know some excellent books that can be enjoyed by children and adults both. But I don't think that breadth of audience necessarily makes these books better than those that may appeal more narrowly, but just as deeply, to an audience specifically of children, or specifically of adults. In the field of children's fantasy... I find Rowling's books very good, but not (at least, not yet) "great." I certainly agree with Chris Bigelow that they lack Roald Dahl's originality, but then originality is Dahl's strong suit. It would be just as accurate (in my view) to say that Dahl lacks Rowling's ability to create engaging, realistic characters. But then, I'm not a great Dahl fan. In any event, I don't think Dahl and Rowling are really similar enough to make meaningful comparison possible. So who and what are the "greats" in children's fantasy? Top of the list, in my view, has to be Lloyd Alexander's Prydain chronicles. Exceptionally well written--and they do the best job of any children's fantasy I know in realistically "aging" the main character from book to book. And there's a lot of thematic depth there, too. (Harry does some aging in Rowling's books, but so far, his growth has been on a more superficial level, in my view.) Other candidates? Probably Susan Cooper's Dark Is Rising sequence, much though I dislike the way the series ends and some of its ethical undertones. (I dislike books that suggest humans are so frail that the truth needs to be concealed from them.) But these books, particularly _The Dark Is Rising_ and _Greenwitch_, do very well at evoking a "spirit of England" that I think is also part of what appeals to readers of Rowling's books. Another series of children's books that evokes a spirit of "England past" particularly well is Hugh Lofting's Dr. Dolittle's books. These are not read as widely as they deserve, in my opinion. _The Story of Dr. Dolittle_ and _The Voyages of Dr. Dolittle_, which are perhaps the most widely read, are nowhere near the best of these. Arguably the most American of all fantasy authors is Lyman Frank Baum, who wrote the 14 original Oz books. (After his death, other authors took up the series, but none so well as he.) In sheer inventiveness, these books surpass any other fantasy novels I have ever read, whether for children or for adults. Again, the first is by no means the best (my personal favorites are _The Emerald City of Oz_ and _Glinda of Oz_). The first three books in Joan Aiken's Alternate England series (_Wolves of Willoughby Chase_, _Black Hearts in Battersea_, and _Night Birds on Nantucket_) are exceptional as well. No library should be without these, though too many are. (Aiken has also written some other stories that almost rival Dahl in their zaniness...) I'm sure there are many others. My point is that, taking these as my baseline, I don't think Rowling quite makes the "great" category--at least, not yet. It may be that by the time the series has ended, I'll revise that opinion. (For example, I think the Prydain series needs the last two books in order to make it into the category of "great.") Rather, for me they fall, so far, into the category of "very good," together with authors such as John Bellairs--an uneven, but sometimes very good author, now sadly rather neglected. All of which is only my reaction. Other readers' responses clearly will vary. But in cataloging this list of great children's fantasies, I'm realizing once again that I do think there is a discernible difference in what constitutes greatness in children's fantasy and greatness in adult fantasy. For one thing, none of the worlds of these novels are developed with the level of internal consistency, attention to detail, and depth that I expect from a Tolkien, a McKillip, or a Moorcock. Indeed, to develop their worlds at such depth would risk losing the books' narrative threads. But even "very good" in the distinguished world of children's fantasy is, in my view, high praise indeed. Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself jlangfor@pressenter.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: [AML] Re: Harry Potter Books Date: 05 Dec 2001 11:30:16 -0800 Glad to see mine and D. Michael's verbal jousting has started so many Harry Potter postings. As an aside, I wish his wife continued speedy recovery with many good thoughts and prayers for their whole family. Jacob mentioned Scholastic's big marketing push of the books and I wasn't so sure that was the case with my daughter's school. I asked her and she discovered the first book through a classmate whose grandma bought it for him. (He had a waiting list of borrowers for it). It wasn't available from the book club flyers that get sent home, nor was it in our school library. The teachers weren't didn't have the books and put them on their wish list for their personal class libraries and the parents bought the set for them. We didn't see the books until the bookfair late in my daughter's sixth grade year. So for us, it was a fellow classmate and the display at Sam's Club that brought Harry Potter to our house. But even with whatever marketing has been done, I agree the books have gone beyond what they imagined. As big a literary fault as it is to use 'ly' adverbs (A big fault of my own), I believe it works for the Harry Potter books. Remember, these are the same preteens who bought Savage Garden's "Truly, Madly, Deeply" CD by the carload. They like 'ly' words, that's how they talk! J.K. Rowling's 'ly' adverbs are fun anyway-stuff like abysmally incurably,apprensively,carefully,and gradually to name a few. Jacob also mentioned he thought the character's physical descriptions were minimal or lightly sketched, I tend to disagree with that. The first and second chapters of the first book have good, visual descriptions of the Dursleys, (such a wonderful last name for them), and of Harry with more details in the rest of the books. I think the few illustrations match the wording of the books and I think the movie did a good job with casting and costuming the actors. Nevertheless, I have to say "right on" to most of what Jacob and others have had to say about Harry and his world, and the related genres. Although these books will always be classed with YA/Fantasy fiction there is indeed much that adults can enjoy and identify with. Her use of character names is phenomenal. For one that likes clever use of names and semantics I just love that about these books. The Dursleys, Sirius Black, Hagrid, Dumbledore, Voldemort, Dementors, Ludo Bagman, Snape, Gilderoy Lockhart, I could go on and on...BTW, Hugh Grant has our vote to be Gilderoy Lockhart in the second movie. We think he would be perfect with the toothy grin and pretty boy looks to play perhaps the most irritating character in the books. Trying to describe what it is about these books that makes them so special is like trying to describe good comedy. You can talk about things like timing, expressions and other things, but you can almost lose it if you over analyze it. There is a good essay by Alan Jacobs about Harry Potter's Magic from his book, " A Visit To Vanity Fair". ( I read it yesterday on WorldNet Daily, but I don't know if the link is still there). Finally, the link to Mormon Lit: To answer Eric's question-yes I think there is a connection between liking literature and family scripture study. For me, it worked the other way; I grew up in a family that didn't read the Bible much, it wasn't encouraged in the Catholic Church at that time. But my family did and still does love reading books. My Dad was one of the most well read men I ever knew. The dictionary, the size of a concrete block, lay waiting to look up any word that wasn't understood. When I became interested in the LDS Church I soaked the scriptures up like a sponge, I just loved the language and visual pictures they spoke of, especially in the Parables of Jesus. For me, it was easy to understand because I had been read to as a child and time for reading was always encouraged and rewarded as a break from homework or after chores were done. With our children I think reading the scriptures aloud allows them to appreciate books like Harry Potter, Tolkein, and the works of classic literature. I believe it helped place our son in the advanced placement English Lit class he had in high school. Children grounded in the language of the scriptures have a better chance of grasping the wording of good books, they have a better, larger, richer vocabulary in my opinion, and that is a good thing for the enriching of their whole life. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Jack WEYLAND, _Megan_ (Fw from MN) Date: 05 Dec 2001 10:46:20 -0500 Dealing with Your Weaknesses Can Help You Find Your Strengths SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- On the outside, Megan seems liek a typical LDS girl. She participates in all the Church programs and always seems to have the right answers. But when she falls in love with Kurt, a young boy who is not a member of the Church and is a couple of years older than she, the standards she can recite by heart just don't feel all that important. In "Megan" (Bookcraft, $16.95), popular LDS youth writer Jack Weyland tells the story of a young girl willing to take risks for the boy she loves. At first the risks seem small -- staying out too late, dressing more provocativesly to please her boyfriend, even the friction developing between Megan and her mother. But those risks lead to an unexpected pregnancy, abandonment by the baby's father, and the challenge of facing a difficult situation on her own. Is repentance possible? Should she keep the baby? or should she give it up to be adopted by a childless couple whose greatest wish is to have a family? In his usual insightful way, Jack Weyland explores the problem that is all too common in today's world. The author of more than 20 novels and short stories specificially designed for LDS teens, Weyland is best known for titles such as "Ashley and Jen," "Michelle and Debra," "Night on Wolf Mountain," "The Krystle Promise," and "Charly." He and his wife Sheryl are parents of five and live in Rexburg, Idaho. Source: Dealing with Your Weaknesses Can Help You Find Your Strengths Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Russ Asplund Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 05 Dec 2001 12:30:34 -0700 >However, we did go see the movie, and I agree with Katie's statement above. >As an old Dungeons & Dragons and fantasy fan, this movie came across to me >as throwing all kinds of familiar fantasy elements together into a stew. It >had some interesting visuals and moments, but mostly it was about as >compelling to me as stew. Here to me is the crux of the "greatness" debate. I will agree that Harry Potter is a stew of things that came before--I just happen to think it is great stew. Just the right sprinkling of humor for sweetness, but with a spike of danger for that perfect tang in the aftertaste. It also helps that I love stew. I don't think there is just one type of Great Book, just as I don't think there is one kind of Great Meal. There are a lot of meals I like to eat, including some--like macaroni and cheese--that I know aren't gourmet class, but I enjoy anyway. I like the notion Robin brings up about "interpretive communities," I'd just add that I think we can often be in several of these communities depending on our mood and reasons for reading. Harry Potter, the book, was a great book by my definition. It left my children and me wanting more. The movie merely okay, but I loved it because it didn't undermine the book. Russell Asplund russa@candesa.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 05 Dec 2001 13:26:44 -0700 I don't read nearly as much as I should and would like to, but I really, really think reading and writing are the best ways to understand. I don't know if it's head-injury or just stupidity, but if I see things or hear or experience--I'll forget after a while. But if I read it two or three times or write it down I can remember. It's good to read or have things to re-read because I forget (and get so confused--damn, I'm only forty-one). Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: cgileadi@emerytelcom.net Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 05 Dec 2001 21:34:53 GMT I read because my mind seems hungry all the time--for stories, new things to think about, fresh ideas, images. . . A good read fills in all those empty spaces :). Then, after a while, I get hungry again and have to find another book. Cathy Wilson This message was sent using Endymion MailMan. http://www.endymion.com/products/mailman/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 05 Dec 2001 14:41:34 -0700 Steve writes: "J. K. Rowling is >what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of >bitterness and hatred." I think you should explain yourself a bit here. How does someone as delightful as Roald Dahl have an "unquenchable inner core of bitterness and hatred"? How is Rowling's totally one-dimensional characterization of the Dursley's as fat brainless people (and Harry's somewhat unreasonable revenge on them), any less "bitter" than Dahl's characterization of, say, Matilda's parents or James's Aunties? I think if Rowling had any storytelling mentor at all, it was Dahl. Isn't it obvious? Harry Potter is a virtual amalgam of every Roald Dahl hero: the painfully abused/deprived child discovers some magical power (in him/herself or in a chocolate bar or in a peach), and embarks on a magical journey to some utopian, fantastic, dream-like place where "good" finally prevails. (Only Dahl pulls it off with a bit more charm--and a LOT more variety). --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 05 Dec 2001 15:41:04 -0700 Quoting Andrew Hall : > What's the point of reading all those novels all the time? Don't you have > anything better to do? > My own conclusion has been that art, in whatever form, touches the soul in a way that straight lectures or numbers or other left-brain activities don't. I need my soul touched. Also, I think that reading improves my writing skills. Someday I hope to be really good at writing and to publish novels of my own. So it has a temporally useful purpose for me as well. (And I write because...) But I agree that reading novels for pleasure should be the icing on the cake in one's life, rather than the main course. --Katie Parker Salt Lake City, UT -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Picht Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 05 Dec 2001 18:29:14 -0600 Steve wrote: > Hmmm. Whimsical and fetching as Dahl can be, I came away from both the > Harry Potter books and the Harry Potter movie thinking, "J. K. Rowling is > what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of > bitterness and hatred." I've always enjoyed Dahl, bitterness and all, but it's a taste I don't care to indulge too often. If you think Rowling is Dahl without the bitterness, I suppose I'll have to break down and buy one of her books. Dahl really is an excellent writer, a nastier version of Nabokov who pretends to write for children. I'd no sooner let my child read one of his stories unattended than let him play with razor blades. I have some idea in my head about why Dahl and Nabokov are good writers. Could anyone be a little more direct about Rowling's literary virtues? I don't recall seeing a post regarding just what it is that many of you like about her. Jim Picht -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Bad Personal News Date: 06 Dec 2001 08:43:02 -0700 margaret young wrote: > > Michael, many of us will want to include you and your wife in our prayers > and put both your names on temple prayer rolls. We know your name, but we > need hers. What is it? Naomi Hoki Martindale. She is making remarkable progress. She is on a regular diet, has been moved out of ICU into a regular hospital room and is scheduled to be moved to rehab in a day or two. She is feeding herself with a regular diet and can walk by herself with the aid of a walker. Everything functions--she just has weakness and lack of coordination on her right side. She is very difficult to understand when she speaks--both because of slurring of words and problems with choosing the right word--but I can see definite improvement in everything each day I come to visit. She is boggling the minds of all the medical personnel. Her physical therapist said, "Do you realize how fast you're making progress? Normally patients like you take months to accomplish what you've done in days. Thanks to all of you who have expressed words of comfort and for your prayers. I'm not answering them all personally since I have hundreds of e-mail to get through, but rest assured I am noticing them. The prayers are working. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] AML "Best Film" Award Date: 06 Dec 2001 09:33:02 -0700 Terry L Jeffress wrote > First, lets make some adjustments in vocabulary. AML did award > Richard Dutcher the 2000 AML Award for Film for his work on "God's > Army." The word "best" does not appear in the title of this or any > other the award category. The AML Awards recognize an individual for > their contribution to the field of Mormon letters. In practice, the > year's "best" novel does not necessarily make the greatest > contribution to Mormon letters. Thank you, Terry, for this clarification on the AML Awards. To reiterate Terry's point: the AML Awards are *not* a contest--we don't claim to annoint a best work in a category, but rather seek to recognize excellent work in the broad field of Mormon letters. Often that means recognizing a work widely regarded as the best in its class, but selecting a "best" work is not the intent of the award and is not a specific criterion for judging. This is clearly illustrated in the award in the Novel for 1999, when we awarded Anne Perry's novel _Tathea._ The judge felt that it was not necessarily the best written or best plotted Mormon novel of the year, but that it was the most important and influential novel in terms of exposing Mormon ideas to a wider international audience. The judge felt that Perry's risk in writing an explicitly Mormon novel when she's known for her mysteries was an extraordinary thing and one that should be recognized. I personally felt that several other novels were "better" that year, but I also agree fully that _Tathea_ deserved to be awarded, as did the AML board. In the specific case of Dutcher, the Film category, and this year's crop of films, let me offer some comments. By rule, one person can't win an award in the same category on consecutive years, meaning that Dutcher is inelligible to receive a 2001 award in film for _Brigham City,_ which I feel is a bit unfortunate. I agree that BC was a better film, and I wish we *could* recognize _Brigham City_ with an award this year. But that's not how the rules are written. I can tell you that the AML is actively looking at films this year, and that an award in film may well become more regular as more and more quality films are produced by Mormon artists. I can't tell you whether we will award in film this year; that's a matter for the judges to decide. But we are explicitly considering film as a category. A note on awards and non-awards in a category. Sometimes we fail to award in a category because we don't feel that any work rose above to be worthy of special recognition. Just as often we choose not to award in a category because we have a limited budget for awards and a reasonably short time alotted for an awards ceremony, so we alternate years. Sometimes the awards coordinator just messes up and fails to solicit judges for a worthy category--as has happened under my watch with Children's and Young Adult fiction. There have been excellent works in both of those fields that weren't recognized over the past several years because I flaked out, not because the AML has made a judgement of unworthiness on the field. An AML Award indicates that a particular work is excellent, not that it's the only worthy work--or even the most worthy work--produced in a given year. The goal is to raise awareness and appreciation, not to annoint winners or losers, or to be a comprehensive judge of the field of Mormon letters. Scott Parkin AML Awards coordinator -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] Broken Back Date: 06 Dec 2001 11:49:36 -0700 Mr. Jonathan Langford, My name is Kai Samuelsen, Eric's Samuelsen's son. He wanted me to let you = and everyone else on the list know that he injured himself this weeekend = and has broken his back and wrist. There's no spinal cord injury, and he = will be fine, but out of comission for a while. Please contact Chris Bigelow and tell him that Eric will not be able to = conduct the Neil Labute interview until January. He probably also won't = be able to pick up e-mail messages for at least a couple weeks. Many Thanks, Kai Samuelsen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: [AML] John BENNION, _Falling toward Heaven_ (Review) Date: 04 Dec 2001 21:19:59 -0700 Bennion, John. _Falling toward Heaven._ Salt Lake City: Signature Books. 2000. 312 pages; Trade paperback; $19.95. ISBN 1-56085-140-6. Reviewed by Scott R. Parkin * Capsule: "Worthy Questions Well Asked" * For better or worse the current Mormon literary landscape is a sparse one, like a central Utah desert dotted here and there with life, but still largely empty. Because of that sparsity, each new work stands starkly against a largely empty background, and as such draws more of our scrutiny than it would against a more lushly populated one. Especially when one book is so clearly different than the majority of those around it. John Bennion's _Falling toward Heaven_ is one such book. In a small market dominated by thrillers, historicals, and teen morality plays, Bennion has written a literary-academic novel whose primary purpose is neither to illuminate historical fact nor explore Mormon solutions to moral/ethical problems. Rather, _Falling toward Heaven_ focuses on asking questions of its Mormon readers--questions that are sometimes difficult and often uncomfortable; questions that each of us should be thinking about as we work out our own salvation and try to make sense of both our lives and our religion. This is the essence of the literary-academic genre: to ask questions of the reader. As Mary Clyde said of Bennion in her back cover blurb, "his are worthy questions well asked." This is a worthy book, well written and well presented, depicting a faith that may not be orthodox but that is considered and well-earned. I think this book succeeds on its own terms quite well, painting a picture that is too often too true of our reliance on others peoples' answers to deal with the struggles of our own lives and faith. It is a book that invites you to agree, disagree, or defer; but it will force you to think about many of your assumptions and perhaps rethink a few of them. For some readers that aggressiveness may be disconcerting, but I would caution people from rushing to judgement about whether this book is "faithful" or "critical" of Mormon thought or practice; to my mind it is both, offering a faithful but critical look at attitudes and assumptions whose time may have passed. While _Falling toward Heaven_ certainly offers an often condemning social critique of how Mormon patriarchy can smother some good people and their expressions of faith as unorthodox (aka "untraditional"), it is no less critical of the all-or-nothing resistance that often comes in response. Bennion isn't trying to provide answers, he's trying to ask the questions well and explore attitudes on both sides of the fence, leaving answers to each reader to decide on their own. This book is not for every Mormon reader, but for those who enjoy well written literary-academic fiction that asks hard--and sometimes unflattering--questions about what it means to be a Mormon and a human, this is well worth reading. I don't think _Falling toward Heaven_ is a perfect book, but I think it is a good one and worth your time and money to read. * Plot Synopsis * The story revolves around Howard and Allison, and begins when Howard meets Allison while on his mission in Houston. He's counting days until he goes home and is struggling with a loss of faith--not a problem with the organization of the Church, per se, but a cognitive dissonance with the traditional Mormon definitions of God as a stern, angry, vengeful deity who hates sin and sinners alike. Those definitions don't make sense to him, though he sees them reinforced by the attitudes and behaviors of the other Mormons around him, including his companion, his parents, and to a lesser degree his mission president. When Howard meets Allison and her lover while street contacting, Howard is instantly entranced by her direct, intelligent, no-nonsense manner. She's an aggressive atheist, a computer programmer, and a fully independent woman--a kind of woman he's not sure he's ever known before, a woman who seems freed of the hedges that surround the Mormon women he's grown up with in Rockwood, Utah. He's also attracted to her sexually and that deepens the dissonance he already feels about the definitions of God. How can his attraction to her--both physically and emotionally--be wrong? It's clear that she has little patience with religion of any kind, especially Mormonism, and yet her vivid spirit attracts him anyway. Howard finds himself obsessed by her and creates opportunities to see her, to the consternation of his companion who wants to drop her as an unproductive--and potentially dangerous--contact. Allison is also charmed by this odd representative of a religion she finds not just silly (she finds all religions at least a little bit silly), but actively offensive in its institutional suppression of women. She has every reason to simply dismiss him as a kook, yet she finds his intelligence and his honest faith both intriguing and troubling. She's as much amused by him as anything else, but she finds herself thinking about him a great deal. When the time comes to end his mission and return to Rockwood, Howard finds that he just can't leave Allison behind, so he steps off the plane and goes to find her before she leaves for Alaska to start a new job. He does find her and they decide that they need to explore what their relationship is, to find out whether they belong together. Allison gives Howard a ride back to Rockwood, and during their travels they have sex--each doing so in order to bind the other. This, of course, radically alters the future that Howard had planned for himself to return to Rockwood and marry his teen sweetheart, to manage his father's cattle ranch, and to take his place as a returning hero in his Utah Mormon community. The remainder of the novel explores how Howard and Allison deal with their different concepts of how life should be lived and the role of Howard's religion in it. She wants to save him from a traditional lifestyle that has locked four generations of his family into a pattern of slow self-destruction, as well as the religion that facilitated it. He wants to bring her into the life that he has imagined for hiself, where he manages a ranch and builds his own little kingdom on earth--a life so thoroughly informed by his Mormonness that he can't easily separate himself from his religion. As they come into conflict over each others' assumptions, dreams, and desires, they find that while there seem to be few reasons to stay together, they also each find something in the other that fills a space in their own soul that they never imagined needed filling. Each is forced to reconsider long-held assumptions about what is good and right as they try to build a life compatible for both of them in Alaska and as they deal with the challenges that Howard's family face back in Rockwood. * Comment: An Author's Craft * Bennion is a very good writer, which is to say that each sentence is well written and a pleasure to read. He writes visually and with style, yet keeps that style under control so that you rarely feel that the author is trying to show off. His characters are interesting and vivid, and Bennion does a good job of showing how odd Mormon assumptions can be to someone whose own philosophical heritage is quite different. This led to times throughout the book where I wondered why these two characters tried to stay together. The strong emphasis on their incompatibility seemed to overwhelm their search for compatibility. I understand the reasons for this and even agree that there needed to be a nearly frantic sense of that incompatibility in order to force the characters into decision points, but I might still have liked a little more powerful success in the relationship to offset the powerful reasons each has to leave the other. Perhaps my only strong criticism of Bennion's craft as a storyteller was a somewhat languid pace that seemed to go over the same functional ground again and again. As I said before, I understand the reasons for it, but that didn't change the fact that I had a hard time working through the middle third of this novel. At about the time that I wanted to skip to the end to see what happens, the character Allison voiced very much the same frustration: ----- She grabbed him by the throat. "What am I going to do with you?" Time like a spiral bringing her back to the same dilemma. "I'm becoming more a pagan, but it isn't three old women, it's a bunch of hag-like old men weaving my life. They've decided to force me through the same experience again and again until I'm broken." (216-17) ----- While there was good reason for that repetition, it still slowed the pace to point where I had begun to lose interest in the story. Oddly, I would have preferred not a reduced page count, but an expanded one that added some elements of success to their relationship to offset the recurring call for Howard to return to his old life in Rockwood and leave his new life with Allison behind. Otherwise, I think this is a well-constructed, well-told, and well-written story. It does not resolve the characters or their relationship completely, but that was never its intention. This book is as much about illuminating a situation, about stating questions clearly, as it is about anything else. * Comment: Male Mormon Feminism * I suspect that women will tend to enjoy this book more than men, because Bennion shamelessly inverts the positions of men and women and their relative power in a culture. Howard is an object of nearly constant condescension from the two strong women in his life--Allison and his mother, Emily. In fact, Emily sums it up nicely when she says, "Howard's a good boy...a simple soul" (274). This inversion made me angry as a male reader. Howard's feelings and desires and motivations mattered, too. He showed himself to be willing to compromise, as trying to understand and integrate all hopes and plans. I found it intolerable that neither Emily nor Allison seemed to recognize it as they made decisions that plunged his own hopes into doubt and removed his options and choices. They protested their concern for him but rarely if ever allowed him to create the conditions of his own happiness. He was marginalized. Then I realized that Bennion was showing me what it's like for many women--to be viewed as simple or sweet or innocent but not treated with the same sort of ordinary respect and dignity that men routinely show for each other. Even the closet feminists among us are forced to rethink some of our own behaviors when Allison proclaims of Utah (and by extension, patriarchal Mormon culture), "It's worse than Texas for--ah--a kind of deference toward women that is really contempt. They're diseased with it" (240). Bennion doesn't invert every situation--in Rockwood, the male power structure remains fully intact and is illustrated in the strong differences in how Howard's Church court is presented (for his fornication with Allison) versus how the bishop deals with Emily's so-called apostasy (for giving other women blessings by the power of her husband's priesthood). Part of the difference is certainly related to the clear nature of Howard's sin versus the somewhat less clear nature of Emily's, but in addition to that ambiguity there's an issue of trust and respect that is evidently different in the two cases--and clearly gender linked. This feminist commentary is the core issue of the book and is evident in pretty much every scene or situation--from the mission president plotting the marriage of his daughter to an RM, to the male gossips of Rockwood, to the Alaskan software company's structure with a woman as the driving force and a man as the secretary. Bennion plays with our assumptions about traditional roles on every page. At times, though, that commentary seemed overstated and a little forced. Allison spoke a few too many pronouncements for my tastes and acted too much the emasculating man-eater for most of the novel for me to really like her all that much. In choosing to invert expectations, I think Bennion sometimes undercut the righteousness of his womens' causes and made them seem more like caricatures of the dominating patriarchs they claimed to hate. Again, that's an issue of taste. I admit that I wanted his women to be morally and ethically superior to his men, perhaps illustrating my own guilt at showing "a kind of deference toward women that is really contempt." Or maybe I just wanted to see the focal characters being better than real, regardless of gender. * Comment: Central Utah, "The Backslider," and Cultural Criticism * About seventy-five pages into _Falling toward Heaven_ I thought this review would be as much a critique of Levi Peterson's _The Backslider_ as it would be of John Bennion's book. The two books are eerily similar in many ways--a good-hearted but oddly naive central Utah boy runs into trouble when his sexual urges exceed his limited resistance and he's forced to reconcile the noble parts of his soul against the harsh judgment he feels for having sinned against his religion. I thought this review would discuss the unfortunate stasis that I think much of Mormon literary-academic literature has fallen into as other authors tried to retell that powerful and important story. I thought I would accuse Bennion of doing little more than writing an updated version of _The Backslider_ that relied on the same scary, heartless institution of the Church that Peterson depicted, set against the same ineffectual Utah culture that had taught people to despise themselves along with their sins. But I won't do that, because it turns out that Bennion didn't do that. I've had a difficult relationship with _The Backslider_ over the years because I feel that the book was essentially unfair in never showing the institutional Church as providing useful spiritual support or guidance. In Peterson's book the institution fails at every turn, and peace comes only by looking outside it. While I don't disagree with the premise that grace is something we need to seek individually and in our own way, I have a hard time seeing the Church and its institutions as failing in all times and in all places. By failing to acknowledge that some do find peace within the institution, I think Peterson makes a broad criticism of cultural Mormonism that too easily dismisses the good bits as irrelevant and that defines the culture only by its failures. While Bennion took plenty of opportunity to show some of the failures of Mormon patriarchal culture, he also showed a success or two, and that makes all the difference for me in how well I can accept the totality of the world presented to me in the pages of the novel. By allowing the institution to sometimes work, by showing some agents of the institution as both able and willing to show individual compassion and discernment, Bennion shows a world where I hope and believe that change is possible. Still, I also look forward to a literature that doesn't attempt to criticize the entire culture, the entire institution of the Church. _Falling toward Heaven_ makes a grand critique, criticizing Mormon culture on a large scale, and does so as evenly and fairly as I've seen in my limited reading in the Mormon market. But it still makes the Church a character, and it still takes on the institution as a whole more than the individuals within it. Not a criticism of Bennion's book so much as a desire to see another kind of literature, one that leaves the institutional critique alone. We've let the institution define too much of ourselves already, as both Peterson and Bennion so aptly point out. * Conclusion: It's Worth Reading * I understand sales of this book have been quite poor. That's a shame, because this is a good book and a worthy member of the canon of Mormon literature. It jousts with big issues, but does so in a story that is engaging while still being intelligent and fair. This book will challenge you, but it does so in a way that leads to further introspection rather than easy judgment. That's all we can ask of a literature of our culture. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Point of View Date: 05 Dec 2001 23:22:52 -0800 Point of View came up in May of last year, after a comment I posted about my unwritten novel _Purple Twinkies_. I didn't get involved in that discussion, but now that POV has come up again, I'll say that in this whole discussion I haven't seen Point of View considered as a matter of control. _Purple Twinkies_ ("I bet if our moms found out about this they'd sh_t purple Twinkies.") is about two teenagers who live on the streets of Spokane together, get pregnant, get married. Husband joins the military to bring some kind of stability to his life and get professional training. Wife has two more children before she's 20--in a hurry because she's afraid she may have health problems later that will preclude having children. Her testimony and spiritual desires overcome her alienation from the Church and she goes through the temple. Husband is something between a pagan and an atheist and doesn't oppose her going through the temple, but doesn't particularly support or love her. One of his military buddies is an inactive LDS who comes to live with them. Through the wife's influence and testimony he becomes active in the Church again and seeks the Melchizedek priesthood. Through all this the wife has become increasingly alienated from her husband, has been separating herself emotionally from him, and finally thinks of their marriage as over. Then she hops in bed with his army buddy. The two eventually understand what they've done, and at first try to repent on their own, but finally go to their bishops. She's excommunicated, he's not. Eventually they marry. It's unwritten partly because I've been trying to define the story's narrative voice, and partly because of language. It would have the fiercest language this side of That Championship Season (or, Glengarry Glenn Ross, from what Eric Samuelsen has said about David Mamet). There's a lot of abuse in the story. Not much physical abuse, but a lot of sexual exploitation, a lot of head games and emotional battering, and both husband and wife engaging in fierce verbal assaults on each other. That phrase, "engaging in fierce verbal assaults on each other," suggests the complexity of the situation. We think of _engaged_ as a love term, and _engaging_ is a synonym for _charming_, and while I hope the story would be engaging, the language wouldn't be. I have considered different ways of approaching the story, for example, telling it from a parent's pov and not quoting the exchanges, but that only tells us what it's like from the outside. Shortly before reading Thom's piece I recalled the narrator's comment in Thomas Berger's _Little Big Man_ about how he is bowdlerizing the old old man's words, then lets off with a string of profanity, and says, something to the effect of, "That was nothing compared to what he really said." (Can't quote it, loaned my copy years ago before I had read anymore than that forward.) It occurred to me, why not tell the story from the wife's pov, then I started thinking about opening lines: >>>>> I'm not going to tell you what we said to each other all those hours on the phone. You already know the words anyway, and if I tell you we were yelling and talking about physically impossible things you'll know exactly what we said, and you've probably said them yourself, and if you haven't, get down on your knees and thank the Lord. So if you want to hear dirty words stop reading right now, and go listen to "Me So Horny." <<<<< That defines a rhetorical stance, separates the adult who is writing a story her children will probably read someday from the child she was, and allows the story to be told in frank detail without being overwhelmed by the ugliness of the life she was living. Now I just have to decide if I really want to enter into that world enough to write the story. After I posted this synopsis, Eric Eliason wrote, Wed, 31 May 2000: > Harlow, > > I read your synopsis of Purple Twinkies and think it is brilliant. I > hope you write it. I think the perfect irony would be for both > characters to emerge from there sordid past fully spiritually > converted and mainstream LDS from this and be faced with the > question of "So how did you meet?" from cheerful innocent > Mormons in their ward. > > Cheers, > > Eric Eliason Very nice idea. Would make a great tag line. All through the novel there would be references both to doing your home teaching and to allowing yourself to be home taught, so at the end of this narrative the (new) home teachers finally show up, and their first question is, "So, how did you two meet?" On Thu, 1 Jun 2000 15:08:52 Valerie Holladay picked up on my comment about trying to find a POV to tell the story from. > With the various personalities and viewpoints > involved, I'd love to see each person tell it the way > he/she sees it. Is that an option, Harlow? I've > enjoyed quite a few books where the author allows each > character to tell what happened from his/her POV. I > like first person but third person works well also. > Though for your story, I think first person would be a > better vehicle for the intensity of the issues. > > I think it would be fascinating to hear the wife, the > ex-, the new husband, the parents, everyone seeing (or > choosing to see) things a certain way, painfully > honest or stubbornly self-deceptive, trying to earn > the readers' sympathy and convince them to see their > side of the story. This is the underlying ethical issue of the story. Who has the right to speak, and what do they have the right to say? There's a lot of verbal violence in the story, both reflecting and shaping the obscenity these two teenagers live in. I don't particularly want to use that kind of language in the story--partly because I want people within my culture to be able to read it. If I limit the story to one POV, the young wife, I can create a character who knows obscene language and has uttered lots of it, but has decided not to allow it into her story. In other words, she's using her position as narrator to control how the story is being told, and part of the story being told is that she's a controlling person who manipulates people around her. She can get away with not using the profanity because she has an engaging voice. By letting her control the narrative I'm being true to the kind of person she is. If I split the narrative and let the ex-husband speak from his POV, honesty requires that I let him use the kind of language he would use, or find a reason why he can't use that language. Now here a technique from the _Road_ movies might work, where Bob Hope and Bing Crosby occasionally turn to the camera and crack jokes about each other to the audience. I could have the ex-husband argue with the Editor about why he (she?) keeps erasing his profanities, or substituting the word _blue_. We have the convention in novels that the first person narrator isn't necessarily writing the story, simply telling it. In this case the narrator is writing and understands that between him and his audience sits an editor. So, to go back to what I was saying in the first paragraph, POV is not simply a matter of having a consistent voice and following rules for making sure the audience doesn't get lost, it's a tool for telling stories. Authors choose a POV because it allows them to tell the story in a particular way. It may be difficult to change POV effectively, but if the story requires it why think of it as a violation, or an exception to the rules? Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Readers Respond with Nominations for Mormon Of The Year: Kent Larsen 5Dec01 US NY NYC P2 Date: 06 Dec 2001 02:00:34 -0500 Readers Respond with Nominations for Mormon Of The Year NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- Mormon News' readers have responded with three additional nominations for Mormon of the Year as we prepare for a vote starting December 15th. In addition to the 10 nominations provided in the announcement, Mormon News' readers have nominated: Cary Stayner, Jon M. Huntsman Sr. and Darius Gray. Mormon News is launching the Mormon of the Year vote to determine who our readers believe, other than LDS Church president Gordon B. Hinckley, has been the most influential Mormon in the past year. As previously announced, nominations may be for any Mormon who has been in the news during the past year, and who was alive at some point during the year. President Hinckley is excluded because it is likely that he, or whoever he LDS Church's president is, would be selected by readers each year, making the process of selecting a "Mormon of the Year" pointless. Instead, we are determining who, other than the prophet, has had the most influence. Until December 15th, Mormon News will be accepting nominations for the award. To nominate someone, please send the nomination to: MOTY-nominations@MormonsToday.com In your message, please include the person's name, a link to a news article about his or her accomplishments during the year, and a sentence or two describing why you think this person should be considered. Mormon News' website should help you find an appropriate article, but links to other websites are also acceptable. We will keep an updated list of those nominated on the MormonsToday website at the URL: http://www.mormonstoday.com/subjects/MormonOfTheYear.shtml . On December 15th we will close nominations and open voting at that same web page. Voting will consist of ranking nominated people in a 'top ten' list. Each place on the list will be given a number of points, and the person with the most overall points will win. Note: One subscriber suggested that other women should be nominated. If you know of someone appropriate, please let us know. The following list includes all nominees to date: Gary Crowton (Nominated by Kent Larsen) As the replacement for famed BYU Coach LaVell Edwards, who retired last year, Crowton only had to do as well or a little better than Edwards had last year to be accepted as adequate. Instead Crowton has led the Cougars to their first undefeated (so far) season since their National Championship in 1984. See: Crowton Will Be Named BYU Coach Today Mormon News 7Dec00 S2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/001208/S2GCrowton02.shtml Eugene England (Nominated by Kent Larsen) Known for his untiring attempts to bridge the gap between liberal and conservative LDS Church members, W. Eugene England died August 17th of brain cancer. His example made a lasting impression for Church members of how to live in a community with conflicting views. See: Remembering England Mormon News 25Aug01 A2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010824/A2EEngland02.shtml Darius Gray (Nominated by Allen Johnson) Along with Marie Taylor, Darius Gray was instrumental in getting the Freedman's Bank Records on CD. Darius also published the first of three books "One More River To Cross" during the year and is President of the LDS Church's Genesis Group. As a result there is much activity among the African American community and the Church as been perceived in a very positive light. "I believe that thousands of names have been added to the Church's ancestral files as a result and these souls will now have an opportunity to have their work done for them," says subscriber Allen Johnson. Mormon News 7Nov01 P2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/011102/N4Genesis01.shtml Tom Green (Nominated by Kent Larsen) While not now an LDS Church member, Tom Green has been in the news this past year as much as any other Mormon. The Utah polygamist, once an LDS Church member, appeared in newspapers worldwide during his trial on bigamy charges. Although Green wouldn't see it this way, he gave the LDS Church more opportunity to disavow itself of polygamy than it would otherwise have had. See: Polygamist Green Given Five Years, $78,000 Judgement Mormon News 27Aug01 N5 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010831/N5TGreen01.shtml Orrin Hatch (Nominated by Kent Larsen) Hatch continues to have a major impact on U.S. policies, including his groundbreaking decision to support the use of federal funds for stem-cell research. With Hatch leading the way, all five Mormon senators eventually supported stem-cell research, and the views of many conservatives were moderated on this issue because of his decision. See: Hatch Favors Stem Cell Funding, Draws Pro-Life Ire Mormon News 6Jul01 T2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010706/T2OHatch01.shtml Paula Houston (Nominated by Kent Larsen) Lawyer Houston was named Utah's Porn Czar to handle citizen complaints about pornography and help Utah's local governments draft laws that meet constitutional muster. The unique nature of her new job led to national attention. LDS Church Member, Utah's 'Porn Czarina,' Gets National Attention Mormon News 9Mar01 T2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010309/T2PHouston01.shtml Jon M. Huntsman Sr. (Nominated by Lyle Leavitt) While most wealthy men tend to loss their faith, Huntsman continues to demonstrate an unyielding ability to exercise his religion in his business, community and personal affairs. This is a very powerful example to member and non-member alike. "There are a million bad things he could be doing with that influence but I haven't heard of one." says Mormon News subscriber, and nominator Lyle Leavitt. Mormon News 21Sep01 P2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010921/D4AllianceUnity01.shtml Elbert Peck (Nominated by Kent Larsen) For fifteen years Elbert Peck led Sunstone magazine, despite criticism from conservatives and continuing struggles to keep the magazine growing. In spite of the criticism, Peck has maintained his belief that Sunstone provides a needed and enduring role in the Mormon community. See: Long-time Sunstone Publisher Elbert Peck Resigns Mormon News 14Jun01 N4 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010615/N4EPeck01.shtml Naomi Randall (Nominated by Kent Larsen) A longtime leader of the LDS Church's Primary organization, Randall was best known for authoring the favorite LDS hymn, "I am a Child of God," in 1957. Randall died May 17th at age 92. See: 'I am a Child of God' Author Naomi Randall Dies Mormon News 21May01 P2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010525/P2NRandall01.shtml Mitt Romney (Nominated by Kent Larsen) When Romney took over the Salt Lake Organizing Committee in January, 1999, he became one of the most visible Mormons in the world, known for rescuing the 2002 Winter Olympics from a bribery scandal that could have put it in the red. And since the 2002 Games he is preparing for is in the Mormon heartland, he has also become visible to many Mormons. See: Deseret News Profiles Mitt Romney Mormon News 7Jul00 S2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/000709/N2Romney01.shtml William Sadleir (Nominated by Kent Larsen) Sadleir pulled off one of the biggest Mormon commemorative events in history, focusing the attention of news media on two continents as well as hundreds of thousands of Mormons on a small group of ships commemorating the immigration of more than 80,000 Mormon pioneers from Europe to America. SeaTrek2001 was simply the biggest Mormon event since the 1997 Mormon Trek re-enactment. See: SeaTrek Sails; Commemoration Gets International Attention Mormon News 8Aug01 N6 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010810/N6SeaTrek01.shtml Cary Stayner (Nominated by D. Jack Haycock) Stayner murdered three people in Yosemite park and then plead guilty to a federal homicide charge, getting life imprisonment. He is now awaiting trial for the Sunn-Peloso murders and expected to get the death penalty. His widely-publicised trial brought disgrace to the church and his family. Mormon News 7Aug99 P2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/990801/L8Stayner01.shtml Mark Wattles (Nominated by Kent Larsen) CEO of Hollywood Entertainment has managed to turn around his company and raise its stock price during the year from under $1 a share to a high of $12 a share. See: Hollywood Entertainment Fighting Investor Fears Mormon News 19Sep01 B4 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010921/B4HollywoodEnt01.shtml >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Bigfoot and Mormons?: Shane Lester Press Release 3Dec01 A2 Date: 06 Dec 2001 02:03:01 -0500 Bigfoot and Mormons? New Theory About the Origins of Bigfoot linked to early history of Mormonism. EVANSTON, WYOMING -- Clan of Cain: The Genesis of Bigfoot is a newly published book that offers a different dimension to the Bigfoot mystery. A recently uncovered document reveals a possible connection between the origins of the Mormon Church (Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints) and Bigfoot. Searching through the archives of historical church documents the author; Shane Lester uncovered an extraordinary story that becomes the foundation of a new theory about the origins of Bigfoot. "I uncovered an obscure historical document that sheds new light on the Bigfoot mystery. I used this encounter as the basis for a fictional story that links the mystical, legend of Bigfoot to the origins of Mormonism." says author, Shane Lester. Deep in the woods of Tennessee in 1835, an unparalleled encounter occurs. David Patten, an early Mormon Church leader, unwittingly opens a new facet of the future mystery of Sasquatch. His story will lend new credence to the existence of Bigfoot. "What does Clan of Cain mean? David Patten described an encounter with a person that represented himself as Cain, the brother of Abel found in the Holy Bible. My first chapter is a representation of the actual dialogue that was reportedly exchanged during this encounter. The book asserts the theory that Cain is in reality the legendary Sasquatch. The rest of the book is a fictional extrapolation based upon the validity of that account," explains Lester. >From the legendary tale the story then propels the reader to the last remnants of undiscovered wilderness of the Pacific Northwest where a young man takes a journey of a lifetime. Spencer James joins a group of scientists in their quest to find the legendary Bigfoot in the Pacific Northwest. Egos, deception, and conflicting agendas are brought into a singular effort by a millionaire consumed with revenge and hate. Spencer becomes the moral compass, standing alone in a forest of scientific amorality. Despite their technology the truth becomes more allusive, challenging their intent and ethics, questioning the morality of their methods and the very reason for the hunt. Recent creditable sightings, such as the one by Psychologist Dr. Matthew Johnson on July 1 2000, have reinvigorated the interest in Sasquatch. ( http://www.sasquatchsite.com/ ). The Skookum Cast discovered in September 22 2000 ( http://www.bfro.net/NEWS/BODYCAST/index.html ) mentioned in the book is also an important find as we continuethe search for Bigfoot in the new millennium. A man, a myth and the obsession to know the truth will reveal a story that will forever change the way you think about Bigfoot. To read the first chapter log on to http://www.clanofcain.com . Source: Bigfoot and Mormons? Shane Lester Press Release 3Dec01 A2 New Theory About the Origins of Bigfoot linked to early history of Mormonism. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 06 Dec 2001 08:32:14 -0700 katie@aros.net wrote: > > I will back up D. Michael on his opinion of the first > few chapters. I agree that the first book starts slowly, and would argue that > the first chapter is almost completely unnecessary. After we read the first > chapter together, my husband and I wondered what all the fuss over these books > was about, because we sure weren't as "hooked" as we'd expected to be. > Anyway, sometimes ya gotta read past the first few chapters to get to the good > stuff. I believe there is no good excuse for starting a book out this way. Why any author would think the reader should be willing to slog through a lackluster beginning is beyond me. If it doesn't grab in the first few pages--one way or another--I don't think the most exquisite writing on earth in the following pages can justify a poor opening. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 06 Dec 2001 08:35:31 -0700 Major Productions wrote: > If it's great, it's great, without adding that YA qualifier. And if it's > not, it's not. > > And whether or not it is, the fact that Harry Potter speaks to so many > people of all ages is a truly remarkable thing. Whatever I may say about my personal reaction to the book or film, I still consider the Harry Potter series to be great. Anything that can get so many millions of young people to read in this day and age--especially those who never cared for reading before (I know one such kid personally)--and is a cut above the usual spook fare, deserves the appelation "great," no matter how many writing errors I personally think Rowling may have committed. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Beards Date: 06 Dec 2001 08:49:05 -0700 At 07:51 PM 12/4/01, you wrote: >But, how would I make it interesting enough to read? Looks like you already know how! Tell a lot of stories to illustrate your points! Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] re: Beards Date: 06 Dec 2001 08:42:11 -0800 Larry, If you wrote a book with these elements I would find it fascinating. I have never been a bishop (and heaven forbid they ever ask me to be - I've seen the bosses job and I don't want it). But I am a Stake Scouting Leader and find motivating people to do all the parts of their calling in scouting very hard and frustrating. Any book on how a bishop motivated a ward would do everyone good. Jerry Tyner -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: BJ Rowley Subject: Re: [AML] Beards Date: 06 Dec 2001 10:19:25 -0700 lajackson@juno.com wrote: >Some day I'm going to write a book . . . to include >the story of the stake president who called a new bishop, >telling him that the beard had to go. . . . > >And . . . about the bishop who also happened >to be a senior officer at the nearby Air Force Base. . . . > > >But, how would I make it interesting enough to read? > Simple. Turn it into an action-packed murder mystery, a la "Brigham City," but with a little more than just a mustache mention. -BJ Rowley Orem, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: Re: [AML] Book of Mormon as African Date: 06 Dec 2001 14:42:41 -0500 Gideon, I looked up the book and was most intrigued. Did anyone on the list respond? Are you at liberty to share any of Melekin's email? Gideon Burton wrote: > I received an interesting email from Embaye Melekin, who has authored a > book called Manifestations Mysteries Revealed in which "proves that the > Book of Mormon is an African book and the exclusive property of the > black race" Details are on a page at Amazon. BYU doesn't have this > book. Has anyone seen or read it? > > http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/books/0968156916/re > views/103-8399387-4739855 > > Gideon Burton > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN New Products: Trio of Historial Novels, Romney's Latest Primary CD: Kent Larsen 5Dec01 US NY NYC A4 Date: 06 Dec 2001 21:46:52 -0500 Trio of Historial Novels, Romney's Latest Primary CD NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- New on publisher's lists this fall are three historical novels, two of which launch new series. In addition, Clive Romney has released his latest CD of songs to fit the 2002 Primary theme. Dean Hughes' new series, "Hearts of the Children" really covers recent territory. It follows the children of the family in his previous series, "Children of the Promise" as they move through the turbulent 1960s. In contrast, N.C. Allen explores well-traveled territory with a new series of novels set during the U.S. Civil War -- but with an LDS connection. And for fans of popular author Lee Nelson, a new collector's edition of the first five volumes in his popular Storm Testament series is now available. New and recent products: The Writing on the Wall (Hearts of the Children, Volume 1) by Dean Hughes Bookcraft Book; LDS Publisher; Fiction; Mormon Author and Subject $22.95 Dean Hughes' new series of books looks at the grandchildren of Al and Bea Thomas, the babies born at the end of his "Children of the Promise" series. These characters experience the turbulent world of the 1960s. The Storm Testament Vol. 1-5 Leather-bound Collector's Edition by Lee Nelson Cedar Fort Book; LDS Publisher; Fiction; Mormon Author and Subject $49.95 A leather-bound collector's edition of Nelson's popular Storm Testament series. The first 500 copies are signed and numbered and available for $79.95. The series follows Mormon pioneer Dan Storm from the persecutions of Mormons in Missouri to life in the Rocky Mountains. Faith of Our Fathers, Vol. 1: A House Divided by N. C. Allen Covenant Communications Book; LDS Publisher; Fiction; Mormon Author and Subject $22.95 The first novel in a historical series that looks at a family caught in the middle of the U.S. Civil War. The saga looks at brothers on both sides of the war and their families as the war irrevocably changes their lives. The Temple-I Am Going There Someday by Clive Romney Excel Entertainment Music CD; LDS Publisher; Mormon Performer and Subject $15.98 Romney's latest children's CD fits the theme of the 2002 Primary Sacrament program, and helps children prepare to one day be married in the Temple. Includes six original songs written by Romney. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN The Other Side of Heaven Theatrical Release December 14: Excel Entertainment Press Release 5Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 06 Dec 2001 21:47:37 -0500 The Other Side of Heaven Theatrical Release December 14 SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Excel Entertainment Group proudly announces the theatrical release of "The Other Side of Heaven." From the Academy Award-winning producer of "Schindler's List" and "Jurassic Park," comes "The Other Side of Heaven" -- a movie that captures the essence of a beautiful time and a beautiful people in a true adventure story that explores the heart of what makes life worth living. See the movie based on the real-life experiences of Elder John H. Groberg as chronicled in his book, "In the Eye of the Storm." John Groberg (played by Christopher Gorham of "A Life Less Ordinary"), a farm kid from Idaho, crosses an ocean as a missionary to the remote and exotic Kingdom of Tonga during the 1950's. He leaves behind a loving family and the true love of his life, Jean Sabin (played by Anne Hathaway of "The Princess Diaries"). John must struggle to overcome language barriers, physical hardship and deep-rooted suspicion to earn the trust and love of the Tongan people he has come to serve. John Groberg's Tongan odyssey will change his life forever. Be one of the first to see the film that made Larry King say, "This movie is just what America needs. I loved it!" Michael Medved raves that "The Other Side of Heaven" is "skillfully crafted, heart-felt and all-together refreshing." Stop by http://www.othersideofheaven.com today to view the theatrical trailer and read the early reviews! The adventure comes to theaters in Utah on December 14. Coming soon to a theater near you. "The Other Side of Heaven" is rated PG by the MPAA. Source: A Major Motion Picture Event Excel Entertainment Press Release 5Dec01 US UT SLC A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: [AML] Pete EARLEY, _Prophet of Death_ (Review) Date: 06 Dec 2001 20:17:33 -0800 Review ====== Pete Earley, "Prophet of Death -- The Mormon Blood-Atonement Killings" 1991, William Morrow and Company Hardback, 448 pgs., price not known Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle Prior to writing this review, I spent some time going back in my memory, trying to remember when I had last been traumatized by a book. I've read my share of "scary" books -- from time to time, I enjoy a good horror tale. Sometimes I have to put the book down because I'm just plain frightened. Other times I put it down because it's just plain boring. But this book, "Prophet of Death," well, it's a whole other story. Earley's book documents the rise and fall of Jeffrey Lundgren. Lundgren, a layperson in the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (now Community of Christ), found himself in strong opposition to the "liberalization" of his church. The decision to ordain women was the last straw for him. He, and a handful of his friends, formed a small group that separated from the RLDS community to pursue what they considered pure religion. So far, so good. But Lundgren, an unstable, egomaniacal extrovert, began to consider his own role as leader, elevating himself first to prophet, and finally to "God of the whole world." His followers were transfixed by his dynamic personality, ultimately abandoning their own wills to his. Lundgren turned deadly when he perceived one of the families in his group, the Avery's, as enemies. He hatched an elaborate plot to entice the family, one by one (parents and three children), into a barn where a special pit had been dug. There Jeffrey executed the entire family. Jeffrey's sexual habits are a strong theme in this book. His wife, Alice, was forced to endure the most humiliating and degrading practices I'd ever read. And it didn't end there. Jeffrey determined to take a second wife. He admitted to homosexual attraction to at least one of the men in his group. And at one point, he forced all the women to perform a strip-tease in front of him and his wife, in search of the one who would be his next wife. Crucial to Jeffrey's credibility was his command of the Scriptures. Early on he was taught the idea of chiasmus, that ordering of scriptural thoughts in a variably symmetrical pattern. He learned to use this technique to find the central thought in a section of Scripture. But he soon learned to twist and turn the Scriptures to his own advantage, "proving" the correctness of his murderous, licentious lifestyle. The extent to which his followers were willing to obey him was disconcerting. I had a particular interest in this book because Lundgren was finally apprehended just a few miles north of my home, in National City, California. I remember reading the news coverage. I did not, at the time, understand the depth of the sickness of this individual. Earley does a fair job of documenting the Lundgren story. From time to time he reveals his lack of acquaintance with Mormonism. His use of the term "testimonial meeting" for "testimony meeting," for example. And his statement that the Doctrine and Covenants contains "all" the revelations to the Prophet Joseph Smith adds to the impression that Earley isn't intimate with Mormonism. He does take great pains at the beginning of the book to point out the distinction between the Independence RLDS Church and the Utah LDS Church. But this distinction is blurred as the reader progresses through the book. I found myself wondering if readers will understand that Lundgren's concept of blood atonement, and his practice of polygamy, had no basis in RLDS history. It certainly didn't help matters by subtitling the book, "The Mormon Blood-Atonement Killings." It is unlikely that non-Mormon readers will make the distinction between Lundgren's roots and the Utah church. Several times I wanted to close the book and never open it again. The crime scenes are described in gory detail. Lundgren's megalomania sent chills through me. That such evil really does exist in this world is something I don't like to think about very often. In the end, of course, Lundgren is apprehended. Justice has had the last word. With this I should be satisfied. But I'm not. My great fear is that another Jeffrey Lundgren is out there, just waiting for the vulnerable and the weak to come to his side. "Prophet of Death" is a grim reminder of the evil that can so easily beset us. We need to be vigilant. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "althlevip" Subject: Re: [AML] Lavon CARROLL, _Love, Sin and Survival_ (Review) Date: 06 Dec 2001 20:37:43 -0800 I am glad that Jana Remy read and enjoyed Lavon Carroll's novel. I have a copy of the book too, given to me by the author, who was my colleague in the English Department at Weber State University. The background of the novel is drawn from her own girlhood in Alpine, Utah, which is at the extreme north end of Utah County. I am quite certain that Ellen is modeled on Lavon herself, not from her ever having declared that as a fact but from the many details of her early life that she shared with me over many years of association. The modeling would be approximate and not exact, of course. Levi Peterson althlevip@msn.com AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Kumiko" Subject: [AML] Re: AML "Best Film" Award Date: 06 Dec 2001 23:53:40 -0600 I appreciate the comments that Terry L. Jeffress and Scott Parkin have made clarifying how the AML awards process has worked. If I keep my comments about the "AML Best Film Award" online I will modify the page extensively, perhaps omitting reference to AML, or perhaps removing the page. Fortunately (for those worried about misperceptions being propagated), my missives have only been seen by the AML email list. Preston Hunter www.adherents.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: [AML] Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 06 Dec 2001 22:41:13 -0700 rwilliams wrote: > Steve writes: > > "J. K. Rowling is > >> what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of >> bitterness and hatred." > > > I think you should explain yourself a bit here. How does someone as > delightful as Roald Dahl have an "unquenchable inner core of bitterness and > hatred"? Apparently you've never read his short story collection, _Royal Jelly_ (Or maybe that's just the name of one of the stories in the collection.) Creepy stuff. I first learned of Roald Dahl by seeing some of his stories on TV (I seem to recall that it was Twilight Zone). Thom -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Film: Feature Films by LDS/Mormon Filmmakers and Actors: Mormon News Film Editor 5Dec01 A2 Date: 07 Dec 2001 00:32:04 -0500 Feature Films by LDS/Mormon Filmmakers and Actors [Mormon News plans to make this a regular weekly feature, giving our readers an overview of Mormons in film and the films that they are in. Please let us know what you think!] DALLAS, TEXAS -- The big news in film this week was once again "Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone", in 1st place at the box office in its second week of release. The opening weekend for "Harry Potter" set a new box office record, breaking the old single-weekend box office record previously held by LDS producer Jerry Molen's "Lost World: The Jurassic Park." The relatively low-budget "Out Cold," with Canadian-born LDS actress A. J. Cook as female lead, opened in sixth place nationwide. Cook, who now lives in Utah, is actively seeking a more serious, dramatic role for her next film. Also notable in the Top 10 this weekend was Pixar's "Monsters, Inc" in 2nd place and Mark Andrus' "Life as a House" in 9th place nationwide. The big news in the next weekend report is "Behind Enemy Lines." Co-written by Mormon writer David Veloz, the early reports show that this war pic set in the former Yugoslavia opened in 2nd place, behind Harry Potter. In addition to Veloz as writer, it's worth noting that this film was inspired by the real-life experiences of Utah pilot Scott O'Grady, who was shot down in Bosnia. December 7th brings "Oceans Eleven," with no major LDS filmmakers or actors, but with two major Mormon characters (played by Scott Caan and Casey Affleck). And December 14th is, of course, when the long-awaited John H. Groberg/Mitch Davis/Jerry Molen film "The Other Side of Heaven" premieres. New on DVD this week: The acclaimed Criterion Collection version of Alfred Hitchcock's "Notorious" (1946). Starring with Cary Grant and Ingrid Bergman is Mormon film star Moroni Olsen, playing Walter Beardsley. Along with "The Long, Long Trailer" (1954) and "Father of the Bride" (1950), Hitchcock's "Notorious" is one of Olsen's best remembered films. Also arriving in stores this week is a new video release of "Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs," whose Magic Mirror was voiced by none other than Moroni Olsen. But LDS film fans remember "Snow White" best for its Academy Award-nominated musical score by Utah native Leigh Harline. The recipient of 2 Academy Awards (for "Pinocchio") and a total of 8 nominations, Harline is considered one of the greatest composers in Mormon history. Weekend Box Office Report (U.S. Domestic Box Office Gross) Weekend of November 23, 2001 [If table below doesn't line up properly, try looking at them with a mono-spaced font, such as courier - Ed.] Natl Film Title Weekend Gross Rank LDS/Mormon Filmmaker or Actor Total Gross Screens Days ---- ------------------------------ ------- ----- ---- 6 Out Cold (NEW) $4,531,665 2,011 5 A. J. Cook (2nd billed star) 6,700,687 22 Shackleton's Antarctic Adventure 238,790 18 290 Scott Swofford (producer) 5,405,381 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 28 Mulholland Drive 176,695 95 49 Joyce Eliason (producer/writer) 4,980,763 43 Joy Ride 60,847 122 52 Paul Walker (2nd billed star) 21,760,992 47 China: The Panda Adventure 39,991 21 122 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 1,523,396 58 Galapagos 24,049 10 759 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 11,882,077 68 Cirque du Soleil: Journey of Man 16,271 9 570 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 12,876,333 73 All Access 11,772 4 234 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 947,789 78 Island of the Sharks 9,206 6 941 Alan Williams (composer) 10,514,823 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 07 Dec 2001 00:31:14 -0800 On Tue, 27 Nov 2001 16:35:37 -0700 Thom Duncan writes: > A person who "has" to write "will" write, critics and naysayers be > damned. You must have confidence in your vision. Criticism will do > one of two things: it will cause you to stop writing, in which case > you're vision was never all that clear in the first place -- or it will > cause you to try even harder with an "I'll-Show-You" attitude. I'm not sure about that. One of the haunting comments from Tillie Olsen's _Silences_ is her comment on Thomas Hardy's "thirty year ceasing from novels after the Victorian vileness to his _Jude the Obscure_" (p 24 of the paperback). Hardy continued writing poetry, but I wonder what else he would have produced if he had written some fiction in his last 30 years. I've sometimes thought of doing a paper called "Mormon Silences," about writers like Maurine Whipple and Bela Petsco. A writer's connection to the muse can be tenuous, and negative reactions can damage that connection, by damaging a writer's connection to community. It's important to give accurate critiques of a work, weaknesses as well as strengths, but it can be difficult to separate a person's work from the person. Next time you ask someone what they do for a living note how they answer: I'm a professor, I'm an engineer, I'm a truckdriver, I'm a contractor, I'm a writer. We tend to answer the question "What do you do?" with the verb "to be." That's why layoffs can be so emotionally devastating, ripping away part of who we are. Artists identify themselves with their work no less than anyone else, and negative critique of a work can can damage their sense of connection to the community they create for. Lois Hudson, my thesis director at the UW, taught me by example that if you want someone to change something in a work you have to give enough detail to convince the person you understand what he or she is doing in the story. Showing someone that you've read a story carefully and sympathetically builds up trusts, increasing the likelihood they'll listen to suggestions. I've been waiting for over a year for this thread to come up again, and thinking about how devastating an ill-conceived remark can be. When we were talking about influential teachers in Aug 2000, Scott Parkin (Mon, 14 Aug 2000 Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) Influential Teacher) told the following story: >>>>> The teacher (teaching assistant, actually) who nearly knocked me out of writing altogether is (I think) our own Harlow Clark. Or at least the memory I have is populated by someone who looks suspiciously like Harlow (as much of the memory as I haven't blotted out). If it wasn't Harlow, I apologize for taking his name in vain. It may have been Harlow's evil twin. Back in the Spring of 1983, I took a fantasy short story into the writing lab at the BYU library, got some perfunctory comments from the TA on duty (who thought the story a bit juvenile for his tastes), and suggested that I would be willing to "write down" to a younger audience. He immediately responded that I didn't need to write down to reach that audience; I was already there. This drove me into a deep depression that followed me into the mission field and haunted my thoughts for the next two years. I didn't consider myself a trivial person, yet that TA certainly considered my story to be trivial. I went back and read it, and discovered that he was right. And that made me completely rethink my reasons for writing, and what I wanted from it. <<<<< I didn't think at first that this was really me because it would have been uncharacteristic to say something like, "You don't have to write down, you're already there." (Though I might have said, "No, you don't have to write down to a level, you're there already," meaning, "That's not the problem I'm seeing here, you're fine with your intended audience--don't try and dilute what you're doing," not intending the remark as a criticism, just a badly expressed and incomplete observation.) However, on Aug 17, 2000 Scott followed up with, "I remember the TA telling me that I needed to do more descriptive writing (mine was heavily plot-oriented, with little or no description). He then told me about his own story that featured several pages just describing how the rain dripped off a (barn? apartment?) roof, and how that set up the POV's entire mindset." This sounds familiar, like a passage from Bela Petsco's "The Mustard Seed" (in Twenty Two Young Mormon Writers). Bela mentioned it in class one day. Well-wrought description of a woman looking out her window at a rain storm. But he realized after the story was published that she wouldn't have been seeing any of it because her son had just died and she would be paying attention to her grief, not to anything outside her window. I remember mentioning that to someone in the writing lab, but my point was that sometimes even very good passages don't serve a purpose in the story. So I almost drove Scott Parkin into silence. That would have been a shame. Harlow Clark -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: [AML] Re: Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 07 Dec 2001 01:05:58 -0800 I think Steve was spot on when he wrote: "J.K. Rowling is what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of bitterness and hatred." John wants an explanation of some of this. Well, for one thing Jo Rowling seems to actually like people, especially children. Roald Dahl seemed to have the same loathing of the human race Mark Twain possessed. Rowling's Dursleys are not just "fat, brainless people". They are people that like things their way in their own little world and are rotten to anyone that gets in the way of that happening. They are deliberate and calculating in beating down Harry's spirit throughout most of his childhood and enjoy doing so. It's just that far livelier minds and methods frustrate them when he reaches the magic age of 11. As far as Harry getting any kind of revenge on the Dursleys, I don't know what you are talking about. Where does that happen in the books? The glass in the zoo disappears after Dudley hurts Harry by pushing him to the ground, Hagrid explains that this kind of magic can happen unconsciously when a witch or wizard is angry, hurt or scared. That's part of the idea of the wizarding school, so they can learn to control magic and use it wisely. Harry still has to live with these people during summer break, they know he's not allowed to use magic then, so whence the unreasonable revenge? About the only thing that comes close is his teasing Dudley before they found out about the "no magic rule out of school" or that he has told his uncle his godfather is a murderer who wants to know if Harry is happy or not. Harry only does this to get these people off his back. He doesn't demand they wait on him hand and foot or any other demand for that matter, he just wants them to leave him alone. Remember these are people that made him sleep in a cupboard under the stairs and would put him there whenever he displeased them. They also barely fed and properly clothed him. Add to that the constant verbal and emotional cruelty and I'd say he'd been abused. And yes, a lot of Dahl's heroes were kids abused in some fashion. One major difference is Rowling seems to balance the nasty adults with decent, caring and sometimes strict ones. Very few adults in Dahl's stories are decent to children or anyone else. The only two I can think of are Willy Wonka and the father in "Danny, Champion of the World". Yes, he did have a good variety of stories, but it can be pointed out that many of his child heroes had much in common that you point out in Harry Potter. Often, circumstances other than the child hero deal with the antagonists in Dahl's books. Harry has to face Voldemort or his agents with his own wits and abilities before help seems to arrive. As to Roald Dahl himself, he was a brilliant, gifted writer who was not a very nice human being. And yes, I know history is replete with such artists, but is that not part of the fullness of the gospel-to be a gifted and a kind, decent person? Besides his fiction for children he could write clever, macabre stories for adults and even hosted a TV show in the early sixties that rivaled Hitchcock's in telling tales of the strange and creepy. Much of his bitterness probably stemmed from a string of personal tragedies-his oldest daughter died of measles because the doctors and the english government were doling vaccine sparingly and refused their pleas before she got sick. They vaccinated their other children after the daughter died. His only son had a severe brain injury while a small infant in a pram accident with his nanny. He nursed his wife through a stroke that took place while she was pregnant with their youngest child. He is said to have gotten through these things by sheer stubborn will, but they made an already brittle and difficult personality even more so. His family members have said he could turn on you on a dime. That is confirmed by at least one reporter who considered him a friend. Much of this is documented in his former wife's book, "As I Am" by the actress Patricia Neal. Granted books by ex-spouses can questionable in their facts and viewpoints, but she's brutal on herself as well. His daughter Tessa Dahl also wrote a fictional book that was a thinly veiled novel of their family life. She concurs with her mother on a lot of the same things told from a child, then adult's point of view. To his credit, Roald Dahl called his daughter's book brilliant and supported the public buying it. Rowling despite an unsuccessful marriage seems to have a good relationship with her daughter and other family members and seems to think well of her many readers. One other thing, since Dahl generally didn't do sequels, (except the follow-up to "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory") Rowling has Harry still under the thumb of the Dursleys and having to deal with an even more powerful Voldemort with each new book. That while dealing with the onset of adolescence, its accompanying hormones and teenage angst. That,to my knowledge is not something Dahl ever dealt with in his books. And yes, I would like to see Rowling expand the variety of her work, she's said so herself-just give her time. I repeat, Dahl was a brilliant writer who did have a good variety of work. I think Rowling is quite clever as well. As for Dahl books being charming, that's a bit of a stretch...maybe a couple of them, no more. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] Jack WEYLAND, _Megan_ (Fw from MN) Date: 07 Dec 2001 07:45:37 -0700 > Weyland is > best known for titles such as "Ashley and Jen," "Michelle and Debra," > "Night on Wolf Mountain," "The Krystle Promise," and "Charly." He and > his wife Sheryl are parents of five and live in Rexburg, Idaho. > Actually _The Krystal Promise_ is by Blaine and Brenton Yorgason. --Katie Parker Salt Lake City, UT -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: [AML] Re: Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 07 Dec 2001 09:01:17 -0700 > Steve wrote: "J. K. Rowling is what Roald Dahl could have been without his unquenchable inner core of bitterness and hatred." > James wrote: > I've always enjoyed Dahl, bitterness and all, but it's a taste I don't care to indulge too often. If you think Rowling is Dahl without the bitterness, I suppose I'll have to break down and buy one of her books. Dahl really is an excellent writer, a nastier version of Nabokov who pretends to write for children. I'd no sooner let my child read one of his stories unattended than let him play with razor blades. > > I have some idea in my head about why Dahl and Nabokov are good writers. This line is very interesting to me . . . I fancy myself the most wonderful and enlightened children's writer ever--with the possible exception of Roald Dahl and Hans Christian Andersen (not the Danny Kaye version). It's very interesting that the words "bitterness" and "hatred" are used to describe Dahl's work. It seems terrifically inappropriate to me. A person cannot write a good story from a position of hatred--bitterness, maybe. The sinister element in Dahl's work, to me, seems to come from a threatening experience he had early in life. Perhaps, he got fixed on that feeling and now (or then, I don't know when he wrote), as an adult he find an innocent and harmless threat to be titillating. (That's very, very familiar to me. I read an interview of Gary Larson, of The Far Side fame, where he said the origin for the "sick" element in his humor came from his cruel older brother who often locked him in a pitch black basement.) I think it's unfair to think Roald Dahl is hateful. That just doesn't fit. He may be bitter, but not hateful. Maybe J.K. Rowling never had a threatening experience as a child, or at least didn't get fixed on it. The tense moments in her books certainly are not as wonderful as Dahl's. Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Picht Subject: [AML] Re: Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 07 Dec 2001 10:30:12 -0600 rwilliams wrote: > How does someone as delightful as Roald Dahl have an "unquenchable inner core of > bitterness and hatred"? ... Harry Potter is a virtual amalgam of every Roald > Dahl hero... Hmm, how about the protagonists of his short stories in the collection _Switch Bitch_? I love _Charlie and the Chocolate Factory_, and I really enjoy stories like "Pig," but in the stories Dahl displays a nasty streak that's much more subtle in the books, an inky misanthropy of splendid proportions. Dahl strikes me as the sort of man I'd like to have over for dinner, but not living next door to me or dating my sister - a dazzling aquaintance, never a friend. And he'd always be making fun of me in ways I couldn't quite put my finger on. Harry Potter may include elements of Charlie and James, but that's Dahl pretending to be nice. If Rowling were really like Dahl, I doubt her books would be terribly popular with children. Jim Picht -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN LDS Film Festival continues: LDS Box Press Release 6Dec01 A2 Date: 07 Dec 2001 11:22:27 -0500 LDS Film Festival continues PROVO, UTAH -- With over 15 events and 750 visitors, the First Young LDS Film Festival was a great success. Filmmakers, theoreticians, film critics and an enthusiastic audience shared a weekend of great films, presentations and discussions. The Festival will continue on Saturday in Salt Lake City. The "Best of Competition" program will be shown in SLC on Saturday, December 8, at 7.30 p.m. at the U's Fine Art Auditorium. Come and see the best films made by young LDS filmmakers in 2001. It can also appear next year in your city, ward or stake. If you are interested in bringing the "Best of Competition" program to your city, stake or ward, contact us at feedback@ldsbox.com The Salt Lake City presentation is available at: Fine Art Auditorium, University of Utah Saturday, December 8, 7.30 p.m. Admissions: $ 4 at the door To check out the "Best of Competition" program, go to: http://www.ldsbox.com/cgi-bin/bestof.php To find out who won what at the festival, go to: http://www.ldsbox.com/cgi-bin/winners.php Source: LDS Film Festival continues LDS Box Press Release 6Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike South Subject: [AML] Re: Harry Potter Books Date: 07 Dec 2001 10:12:16 -0700 Kathy Tyner wrote: > BTW, Hugh Grant has our vote to be Gilderoy Lockhart in the second movie. I understand that spot's already been taken by Kenneth Branagh. --Mike South -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 07 Dec 2001 10:19:35 -0700 I read fiction (and fiction-like narrative nonfiction such as memoirs) because I like to let someone else take over the steering wheel of my brain and see where they take me. It's an escape from boredom and from myself, and it's a much more effective way to learn about other places and cultures and personalities than traveling, which I actually don't care for much. Fiction allows me to experience difficult things vicariously, which helps me either avoid pitfalls or better deal with challenges when they arise in my own life. When I was a teen I used to seek out psychedelic substances to transport me, and now fiction fills that same role for me as an adult. I can't stand TV at all and I like only about 1 out of 4 movies I see, but the fiction I'm drawn to is the most satisfying cultural fare I partake of (followed by music and then drama, with movies bringing up the rear and TV not even registering). However, most of my reading time and energy go into periodicals because I'm addicted to trolling for up-to-date information and insights about the world that I can put to immediate, direct use as a consumer, citizen, writer, parent, hipster, editor, etc. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Even After Sept. 11th, LaBute's Work Doesn't Change: Rosemary Pollock 6Dec01 A2 Date: 07 Dec 2001 11:30:53 -0500 Even After Sept. 11th, LaBute's Work Doesn't Change WASHINGTON, DC -- "The Shape of Things," suffered an ill-timed debut in New York off-Broadway at the Promenade Theater just weeks after the World Trade Center attack. Controversial playwright and director, Neil LaBute, had received critical acclaim when the play opened in London at the beginning of the year, but the tragic story of personal cruelties by LaBute's characters was more than the public could bear after the horrors of Sept.ll. "It didn't even occur to us that it wouldn't be well received. It had already been well received [in London]. And yet I think we kind of ran into something that I had heard whispers of and seen in other productions, which is that difficult trans-Atlantic move, where critics say, hold on a second, we'll tell you if something is good," LaBute said. Despite the New York reception for "The Shape of Things," LaBute told Salon.com in a recent interview that his work hasn't changed since September 11th. "Since [Sept. 11] I've been thinking of possibly doing a film of 'The Shape of Things,' " he told interviewer Kerry Lauerman. "But the things I have been working on -- I have been working on a musical." But he then added that the musical isn't what you might expect, "The musical is as severe as anything that I've ever written. Because I thought, you know, I've never seen a musical where people were generally pretty heinous, and they would just burst into song." But, he also told Lauerman, that he just might have sweeter material in him somewhere, "probably deep inside I have one of those soft gooey centers like, you know, a Tootsie Roll Pop had and I just don't know how many licks it will take to get to, nobody's bothered to lick down that far." Raised in Liberty Lake, Washington, LaBute later attended Brigham Young University where he joined The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. "I was inundated with all the trappings of the religion and I found it quite comforting. Sometimes I wonder how much my conversion had to do with me being away from home for the first time and was maybe tied to the security I needed at the time. I grapple with that occasionally, but the big stuff I have no real trouble with. There's nothing I like more than the idea of faith. People can study and discuss the nature of it all they like but it just comes down to making that leap. Also, I figure what's the worst case scenario if I'm wrong - that I've lived a relatively good life," LaBute said. London Observer critic, Sean O'Hagan, called LaBute "a nice human being who specializes in depicting the often despicable nature of everyday lives. His words are to be savored, even as you choke in disbelief on them." LaBute's credits include the film "In the Company of Men," "Friends and Neighbors," "Bash," and last fall's popular film "Nurse Betty." LaBute claims that the script went against his instincts. "I liked working within the constraints of that genre and the studio system. But, that said, my instinct was to have her plane explode at the end. I suppose the fact that she ended up alone and disillusioned with the American dream was enough. I just couldn't have done the pat Hollywood happy ending. It's not in my nature to go along with that big lie that they tell us over and over and that has no correlation in reality," LaBute explained. Source: The misanthrope speaks Salon.com 26Nov01 A2 http://www.salon.com/ent/movies/int/2001/11/26/labute/index.html?x By Kerry Lauerman Neil LaBute, our leading spokesperson for the beast within, talks about art, letter bombs and critics in the wake of Sept. 11. See also: Labute in London: Controversial Mormon Playwright & Director Has New Play Mormon News 18May01 A2 http://www.mormonstoday.com/010518/A2NLaBute01.shtml >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rich Hammett Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Pete EARLEY, _Prophet of Death_ (Review) Date: 07 Dec 2001 12:06:09 -0600 (CST) On Thu, 6 Dec 2001, Jeff Needle wrote: > Review > ====== > > Pete Earley, "Prophet of Death -- The Mormon Blood-Atonement > Killings" > 1991, William Morrow and Company > Hardback, 448 pgs., price not known > > > Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle [snip] > In the end, of course, Lundgren is apprehended. Justice has had > the last word. With this I should be satisfied. But I'm not. > My great fear is that another Jeffrey Lundgren is out there, just > waiting for the vulnerable and the weak to come to his side. > "Prophet of Death" is a grim reminder of the evil that can so > easily beset us. We need to be vigilant. On my returned missionary e-mail list, we recently had a discussion about this same topic, sparked, of course by the religiously-motivated events of 9/11/01. At least half the people participating in the discussion said that they would kill anyone if told to by their prophet or priesthood leader. They somehow thought this differentiated them from the terrorists, because the returned missionaries were _right_. I didn't read this list much in the last two months, so I apologize if this has been discussed already. Tying it back to mormon lit, does Deseret, for example, publish books that examine when the "right" time to disobey a leader is? Is that too subversive? I don't remember seeing the issue treated in _Ensign_, but I don't read it very thouroughly. rich -- \ Rich Hammett http://home.hiwaay.net/~rhammett / rhammett@HiWAAY.net \ They that can give up essential / liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve \ neither liberty nor safety. -- Benjamin Franklin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 07 Dec 2001 12:28:41 -0700 Jim asks what it is about the Harry Potter books that everybody likes. It's been months since I read the books, but as I recall, you get true British flavor in a children's book--similar to what CS Lewis did in his Narnia books. Then again, the action trots right along so it's a pleasant narrative. The characters are drawn just a little past real life but just a little short of fantastic, so you can experience that pleasant world inbetween reality and fantasy life. Most of all, though, Rowling fills the books with original and fascinating detail. She's wonderful at creating this fantasy world without being cutesy or derivative. If you're familiar with boarding-school stories, this can be read as a funny takeoff on that genre. Her prose is consistent but not brilliant--but that didn't stop me from really enjoying the novels. And, as everyone else has said, the children adore these books. Even the younger kids who hadn't to that point tackled longer novels just took up these books and read. :) Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 07 Dec 2001 12:59:37 -0700 ---Original Message From: D. Michael Martindale > > Anyway, sometimes ya gotta read past the first few chapters > to get to > > the good stuff. > > I believe there is no good excuse for starting a book out > this way. Why any author would think the reader should be > willing to slog through a lackluster beginning is beyond me. > If it doesn't grab in the first few pages--one way or > another--I don't think the most exquisite writing on earth in > the following pages can justify a poor opening. I think this is a matter of audience again. Just because those first few chapters don't pull you in, doesn't mean that they are poorly written or should be changed. I say that because those first few chapters pull the intended audience in right from the start and the book doesn't let them go until they've finished. How many times have you heard that Harry Potter hooked a reluctant (or even non) reader and expanded their horizons? I can give you two personal examples from my own family (but then, I have a large family). It may be a poor opening for you, but there is a *lot* of solid evidence that it is exactly right for who it was written for. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 07 Dec 2001 11:37:46 -0700 On Wed, Dec 05, 2001 at 06:29:14PM -0600, James Picht wrote: > I have some idea in my head about why Dahl and Nabokov are good > writers. Could anyone be a little more direct about Rowling's > literary virtues? I don't recall seeing a post regarding just what > it is that many of you like about her. I'll throw my hat into the fray. I like to read Nabokov for the sheer elegance of the language. You don't even really have to look to deeply. His writing has such an innate rhythm and flow that you literally glide through his texts as if on ice-skates. Rowling does not have Nabokov's ability with words. She uses very basic language with a lot of made-up words thrown in for flavor. Her strength comes in worldbuilding. She has taken her model from the British boarding school genre an set hers in a magical world parallel to the mundane, "muggle" world we inhabit. The occupants of this world have all the same problems: boy/girl, bullies, school, politics, terrorists, and sports. Sentence for sentence, you really can't find much to praise in Rowling's texts, but with those plain sentences, she evokes a world filled with people that consider magic as an everyday element of life. What kids, and many of us adults, don't wish for a more interesting existence, where wondrous things happen with the flick of a wand. I do like that it takes seven years of schooling to earn even a fundamental understanding of the magical arts. Although wonders do come at the flick of a wand, the characters do have to study and go through numerous mistakes before they can confidently wave their wands. I think you can draw many parallels between Harry Potter and Joseph Campbell's heros. Harry comes from an obscure, but royal, background, must go through many trials, and eventually -- so Rowling has led us to believe -- in volume seven must face the ultimate live-or-die challenge. And while reading Rowling, you have a good time. You hope for the best. You get some interesting surprises. You laugh a little. You never cry. The nurse can mend almost any broken bones in a matter of hours. And the good guy always wins. -- Terry L Jeffress | Perhaps in time the so-called Dark Ages will be South Jordan, UT | thought of as including our own. | -- G. C. Lichtenberg -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 07 Dec 2001 13:07:06 -0700 ---Original Message From: D. Michael Martindale > Whatever I may say about my personal reaction to the book or > film, I still consider the Harry Potter series to be great. > Anything that can get so many millions of young people to > read in this day and age--especially those who never cared > for reading before (I know one such kid personally)--and is a > cut above the usual spook fare, deserves the appelation > "great," no matter how many writing errors I personally think > Rowling may have committed. But that's what I am talking about. You keep talking about writing errors, and I'm still not convinced Rowling made any. True, I think that Dianna Wynne Jones is an order of magnitude better in the same genre, but that doesn't mean that my perception of error is an accurate one. We may *think* that we know good writing when we see it, but do we really? Particularly in this specific genre? And if we know so much better than she does, why aren't we on track to be the first author *ever* to earn a *billion* dollars from our writing? Given the success of J. K. Rowling we would be *much* better served if we could figure out how to write *just* *like* *her* than we are if we try to find out how to "improve" on her writing. Improve if you can, and if you find a way to engage children better than she does, then more power to you. But I'm betting that some of the very things that we consider writing errors might actually be a part of what makes her so successful. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 07 Dec 2001 13:18:31 -0700 Hi. I'd say that more than anything else a novel gives me an in-depth experience of standing in someone else's shoes, broadening my experience. Putting me in touch with another world. So that I can understand people better and learn to love them more. (Marilyn) -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _House on the Sound_ (BYU Newsnet) Date: 07 Dec 2001 13:44:17 -0700 I give, Barbara. I'm not sure that's what I said over the phone. People say my writing is not as accessible. I guess that's what I was saying. Although I make perfect sense out of it, myself. I think some writers are more difficult to read. Faulkner? Cheers! Marilyn > At 12:07 AM 12/3/01, you wrote: > >"What sells in Mormon writing is easier to read," Brown said. > >"But I wanted to write things that were not quite as > >accessible." > > > I would love for Marilyn to expand on this comment. Perhaps I can finally > come to understand what literary writers are thinking. . . . . > > barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Quotation Marks Date: 07 Dec 2001 13:49:58 -0700 I'm anxious to know what you think of the book, Terry. As far as I'm concerned you are right on with your points as to why an author would use no quotes. It is "stylistically" more literary. Makes it "better." Marilyn -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Picht Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 07 Dec 2001 15:38:22 -0600 > What's the point of reading all those novels all the time? Don't you have > anything better to do? One could ask the same thing of people in church - why spend time in Sunday School unless you have nothing better to do? Then again, you shouldn't be doing whatever it is you're doing, no matter what it is, unless you have nothing better to do. But doing constant cost-benefit analysis with my time gives me a headache, so "better" in this case isn't going to be better according to some eternal measure of opportunity cost, but of what seems to _me_ better. I read novels because I enjoy it, and happiness is an end in itself. Everyone understands the human rights to life and liberty, but people are awfully intolerant of the pursuit of happiness. That's probably because so many of us confuse happiness with fun, entertainment, and indolence, and in that we're completely mistaken. The pursuit of happiness can be hard work, and it isn't always entertaining or fun. The novels I choose to read sometimes entertain me, sometimes don't, and reading them is sometimes fun, sometimes not. I read them for the same reason I practice the piano - it changes me in ways that I like; it makes me happy. Now will somebody tell me, please, what's the point of doing accounting? Does the activity really make accountants happy? Does it make _anyone_ happy or wise, or does it simply make them rich? Does it have any greater significance to God and the cosmos than playing with your dog? That one really is a mystery to me. Jim Picht -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Mary Jane Jones" Subject: [AML] OSOH Cast Members at UVSC Date: 07 Dec 2001 15:15:35 -0700 FYI.... MEDIA ADVISORY December 6, 2001 Contact: Mary Jane Jones Excel Entertainment Group 801-358-7020, mjjones@xelent.com=20 HOLLYWOOD CELEBRITIES TO PRESENT=20 FREE Q&A AT UVSC Orem, UT=AFThree stars of the upcoming motion picture THE OTHER SIDE OF = HEAVEN will be in Orem Tuesday night to present a free Q&A session about = their experiences during the making of the movie. Christopher Gorham, Joe Folau and Miriama Smith will also be joined by = writer / director Mitch Davis and producer John Garbett. The Q&A will = take place on Tuesday, December 11 at 7 p.m. UVSC=A2s TRIO Student = Support Services is sponsoring the event, which will be held at the UVSC = Institute (adjacent to the Student Services building on campus). The = Institute houses the largest room available on campus that evening. The actors will be welcomed with a Tongan traditional dance from the UVSC = Polynesian Legacy Promo Team, a talented group of Polynesian dancers. The = team will also perform a Tahitian dance to close the event, and will = present traditional leis to the panel. THE OTHER SIDE OF HEAVEN is a major motion picture chronicling the true = story of a young boy=A2s adventures in the Kingdom of Tonga in the = 1950=A2s. The movie opens in Wasatch Front theaters on Dec 14. Christopher Gorham stars in the film as John Groberg, a young Idaho farm = boy sent as a missionary to Tonga. Gorham is well known to television = audiences for his role as Harrison on the hit series "Popular." He has = also made memorable guest appearances on shows like "Party of Five" and = "Buffy the Vampire Slayer." Gorham made his feature film debut in the = movie A Life Less Ordinary. =20 Joe Folau, a native Tongan, is making his American film debut in THE OTHER = SIDE OF HEAVEN. He plays Feki, Groberg=A2s cheerful and resourceful guide = and friend. He is a regular on several popular television shows in New = Zealand, and made his feature film debut in the highly acclaimed NZ film = The Whole of the Moon. Miriama Smith, who plays Lavania, has been making regular appearances on = New Zealand television since 1991. In the past few years she has become a = familiar face as a core cast member of programs like "Mercy Peak" and = "Atlantis High." She has also made notable guest appearances on such = shows as "Xena: Warrior Princess" and "Young Hercules: The Series."=20 Mitch Davis and John Garbett first met at Disney Studios while Davis was = an intern. Garbett was an LA-based producer for Shrek, and spent eight = years as an executive for the Walt Disney Company supervising the = production of pictures such as Father of the Bride, Oscar, Three Men and A = Little Lady, and Alive. This is Davis=A2 first major feature film. He = has a Masters Degree in film from USC. ### -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: OmahaMom@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] Beards Date: 07 Dec 2001 17:40:13 EST The most motivating Bishops I've ever had presented the ward with a goal and a dream--the ward leaders honed in on it and it caught fire. It was a college ward--and I suspect that the age group is a bit easier to fire up than those who have staid, stick-in-the-mud "done it this way for generations" ward members. It was an interesting experience in that there were always returnees each fall coming back to be part of the ward experience, and some new ones. By second semester, those new ones who had caught the vision were excited to be there. Those content to remain lukewarm were looking for other places to move to. Made it easier to envision how Enoch got his city put together. That's not saying there was a "Holier than thou" attitude, they were just more focused on becoming like the Savior. Sacrament meeting attendance was frequently in the triple digits, because ward members brought their dates, rather than go to someone else's ward. I've often said the speed of the boss is the speed of the crew & if the boss wants the crew to be in there pushing, he'd better be in the trenches with them...that would include a bishopric, RS pres or otherwise. Delegating is one thing, but being willing to get down and dirty with the common man makes a big difference when the going gets touch--and isn't that what the Savior did? There's always room for good books on working with people--sometimes fiction is easier to use when trying to teach people. They don't always recognize that they're being taught--but the principles rub off and get absorbed as they read. And then there's the less good books, that the author climbs on his pulpit and preaches through his characters. Karen Tippets -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Young LDS Woman Fills Internet Niche for Young Women: Kent Larsen 7Dec01 I2 Date: 07 Dec 2001 23:06:35 -0500 Young LDS Woman Fills Internet Niche for Young Women JACKSONVILLE, FLORIDA -- Stacie Skinner, a young LDS woman in Northern California, couldn't find an LDS young women's e-zine on the Internet, so she decided to create one herself, says a report last week on the web site Mahonri.org. The result is the now two-year-old 'Daughters of Zion' e-zine, a twice-monthly email list that reaches some 150 young women, including some as far away as Russia and England. Skinner says she tried hard to find an LDS e-zine elsewhere, "I subscribed to around 50 e-zines run by girls of all ages, but couldn't find one organized by a member of the church focusing on our religion. So I came up with this idea and Daughters of Zion took off." The e-zine started in August 1999, providing advice, ideas, interviews, dating tips and more. Skinner says she believes her magazine serves as a missionary tool, an informative guide, a social outlet, and as a safe place for young women with high standards. The e-zine includes columns titled Advice4Life, Pen Pals, Choose the Right, Ideas for Devotionals, FHE Recipes, Guy Interviews, Dating Tips, Poetry, Personal Progress, My Favorite, You Speak, Freebies, Make It Yourself, and Birthdays. Source: 19 Year Old Runs LDS Daughters of Zion Ezine Mahonri.org 1Dec01 I2 http://www.mahonri.org/story/2001/12/1/1481/13060 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 07 Dec 2001 22:21:09 -0700 > What's the point of reading all those novels all the time? Don't you have > anything better to do? I read for a number of reasons. * I want to see if anyone else perceives the world the way I do. * I want to see how others perceive the world, how they relate to it, and how they make sense of it. * I want to understand why others perceive the world as they do. * Vicarious experience--to know more than my own senses can teach me, to experience more than my own limited time allows. * Admiration of the well-wrought--be it beautiful prose, elegant style, vividly presented, cunningly constructed, symbolically expressive, metaphorically multi-faceted, stunningly insightful, uniquely amusing, or just nicely balanced in all its elements. I admire expression when it's expressed well. * I want to be entertained with imagination that's not my own, with stories I have not conceived. I want to discover both the familiar and the new. * I want to learn both new facts and new ways of thinking. * I want to understand how good fiction is made so I can try to make it myself and share the joy with another generation of readers while discovering what it is that I really believe. ----- Do I have better things to do? Maybe. But I don't perceive the search for truth and understanding as a waste of time or a fruitless pursuit. If the purpose of this life is to work out our salvation with fear and trembling, then to pursue understanding of human thought and mind and spirit is not just a valid hobby, but a primary purpose of our whole existence. For me literature is the tool that has spoken most directly to my soul (film second--a special case of literature, IMO--and music third, fourth, and fifth) about those things that seem important to me--understanding myself and others. It's indicative of my hubris (and a fundamental tenet of Scott's Private Heresy Number 1b) to believe that one can in fact come to understand another person, to mourn not just near them, but *with* them; to revel not j ust for them, but *with* them in equal power and honesty. In so doing--in so caring about another that you literally become as they are, perceive as they perceive--I believe you start to become as God. With sufficient triangulation, I believe you define what it is be God. Sort of a pointillist theory of life--to know a truth about yourself is to place a dot on a conceptual canvas. To know another truth about yourself places a second dot. To know the same truths as perceived by someone else adds hue to those dots. With enough dots in enough hues, eventually a pattern begins to form. When the pattern is sufficiently formed, the mind leaps forward and unifies dots and hues into a grander meaning, a coherent picture. That is the moment of epiphany, of grand understanding. That is to become as God. Literature--both the reading and the writing of it--is a tool of my selfish desire to know and to understand. Because if I can understand enough, I hope to transcend my own selfishness and discover something wonderful, something marvellous. And if I'm lucky, maybe I can become a part of it. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 07 Dec 2001 23:39:49 -0700 Jim writes: >I really enjoy stories >like "Pig," but in the stories Dahl displays a nasty streak that's much more >subtle in the books, an inky misanthropy of splendid proportions. >Harry Potter may include elements of Charlie and James, but that's Dahl >pretending to be nice. If Rowling were really like Dahl, I doubt her books >would be terribly popular with children. I'm sorry, perhaps I'm just not following your argument. How do you know that in Dahl's portrayal of Charlie and James that he is _pretending_ to be nice, but in "Pig" he is _sincerely_ "nasty"? (The argument implying that Dahl is basically incapable of any human warmth: i.e. he MUST have been pretending). Of course, it would be just as wrong to argue the opposite. I'm not going to say that Dahl was absolutely incapable of hatred, but, as long as we're generalizing, I'll be the one arguing FOR Dahl. I'm much more inclined to read Dahl's texts as ironic--wonderfully ironic--in their so-called "nasty" moments (I mean, this guy is FUNNY). Take, for example, the poem that Dahl sent in reply to one of his readers: "Dear Children, far across the sea, How good of you to write to me. I love to read the things you say When you are miles and miles away. Young people, and I think I'm right, Are nicer when they're out of sight." I think the fact that Dahl cared enough to actually reply shows he did, in fact, care quite a bit about his little readers. But how delightfully mischievous to write such a reply! How FUNNY! Is it possible that he is being genuinely hateful here? I doubt it. Consider also a few words from Dahl in an interview with Brian Sibley broadcast by the BBC in 1988: DAHL I think probably kindness is my number one attribute in a human being. I'll put it before any of the things like courage or bravery or generosity or anything else. B.S.: Or brains even? DAHL Oh gosh, yes, brains is one of the least. You can be a lovely person without brains, absolutely lovely. Kindness--that simple word. To be kind--it covers everything, to my mind. If you're kind that's it. Finally, think of Eric Snider. Eric has been accused more than once of misanthropy, and yet (at least in my experience with him) he's one of the most genuine, thoughtful, and sensitive people I know. Sure, he mocks people a lot (I can recall several times when Eric has told me that I "have no butt"), but it is never done maliciously. It's funny! --John Williams. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Clark Draney" Subject: [AML] Story Beginnings (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 07 Dec 2001 23:47:35 -0700 D. Michael wrote: >I believe there is no good excuse for starting a book out this way. Why >any author would think the reader should be willing to slog through a >lackluster beginning is beyond me. If it doesn't grab in the first few >pages--one way or another--I don't think the most exquisite writing on >earth in the following pages can justify a poor opening. Hello everyone, I have been lurking on the list for awhile and D. Michael has been encouraging me to post. I guess the time has come, and in response to a D. Michael post at that. A brief (very brief) intro, first. I don't write fiction of any kind (so far). Instead, I am a graduate student in English and I *teach* academic writing at Idaho State University. I have an interest in AML because of the impact it has on me as a critic. I appreciate very much the insightful and stimulating conversations held in this forum. D. Michael has a point, I think, about the beginning of a piece grabbing you and pulling you in. Certainly reading like that is the easiest to "get into." I wonder, however, if there isn't something to be said for "working at it" to get into a piece of writing. I was thinking of Dickens's _Bleak House_ for example. That begins with a long and pretty dry segment about the legal system in Great Britain at the time. When I first read that for a class I really had to slog through it to understand what Dickens was talking about and why it was there. But having done so, _Bleak House_ then became a rich and wonderful experience dealing with complex characters and situations whose complexity arose partly out of what I knew about the legal system in London. The tie it to Mormon Letters is simply that *our* mindset and outlook on things is so complex and interesting in itself (and so indecipherable to many outside the church) that it may also be fodder for additional layers of meaning in your (OK, our) writing. I can hear the counterarguments too. Will a semi-interested reader take the time and exert the energy to get through the "stage-setting" and "background" necessary to convey these complex things in print. I think that experienced, committed readers will, especially if a book is published by a reputable publisher and comes recommended in some form. (And I know that many books with difficult (notice I didn't say "lackluster") beginnings get read because they are assigned in classes, etc. Sometimes that's what it takes for us to get into and therefore appreciate the tougher, but no less valuable, classics.) Best, Clark Draney -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Clark Draney" Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Movie Date: 07 Dec 2001 23:52:10 -0700 Jim Picht wrote: >Could anyone be a little more direct about Rowling's literary virtues? I don't recall >seeing a post regarding just what it is that many of you like about her. Myself, I am drawn to the detailed and workable world that she creates. Not only does she drawn usefully and successfully on classic and mythological sources, but she also adds dimension to her world by shifting the referents a little and making them work HER WAY. (It doesn't hurt to have a sympathetic orphan to be concerned about either.) Clark D. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christine Atkinson Subject: [AML] RE: (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 08 Dec 2001 00:06:19 -0700 I read because I can't not read. I've always been a reader. In third grade I got in trouble for writing corrections in the margins of my library books. (It wasn't disrespect for the books, it was an attempt to help other readers have a better reading experience. Honest.) If there is something in my line of sight, I will read it. I have memorized my shampoo bottle. (I still, after all these years of trying, have not figured out a way to read books in the shower.) In lines at grocery stores I read the covers of all the magazines. At banks I read the announcements of changes in their policies - even if I don't bank there. I read every word of the Sacrament Meeting program. I buy a purse with only one requirement - a paperback must fit. I don't know how to get to sleep if I can't read, even if it's just for thirty seconds. I read while I brush my teeth. I read while I cook. I read while I work out. I even read while I watch television. Is it a waste of my time? No, I don't think so. Partly because reading has had a significant affect on who I am - how could I call that a waste of time? And partly because it doesn't take all my time. I still go to work. I still have about a zillion things I like to do that don't allow me to read. I still babysit my nieces and nephews, go out on dates, clean my house, visit my family, go shopping, play on my computer, have conversations, make pottery, watch movies, listen to music, spend time with my friends... I have a full life. And it includes reading. I suppose a full life for another person might not include reading, and for that person reading would be a waste of time. But a full life for me *must* include reading - watching more TV would be a waste of time. Or ironing. (Sorry, Mom.) By the way, I've solved almost all of my "what to read while waiting in line" problems with my Palm Pilot - all but that pesky shower issue. When they release a waterproof PDA with a shower-mounted stand, I'll be completely set. -Christine Atkinson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Writer's Lament (pt. 2) Date: 08 Dec 2001 00:40:11 -0800 On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 17:42:39 -0700 "Scott Parkin" writes: > [MOD: This is Part 2 of a 2-part post.] > I wish I knew whether I could dismiss the dream as just a dream, > because it's completely confused my goals as a writer. (If anyone > is interested, I'm willing to share the details of the dream in a > private note.) I'm interested. > * Event 3 -- The AML-List * > I started lurking on the AML-List in late 1995, and started > participating actively in early 1996. By the middle of that > year I was a regular contributor and was writing one of > the weekly columns. The AML-List had completely > engaged my interest. > > This was both good and bad. > My time began to be taken up by reading and writing for the List. Wait a minute, the voice is the voice of Parkin, but the story is the story of Clarkin (Sorry, Scott, I couldn't resist a good rhyme--Emily Dickinson's advice to say all rhymes but say them slant notwithstanding.) > I began to focus on pop criticism as much as adding my own bits to > the literary canon. I became a popularizer, not a producer. Except that criticism is itself a literary activity for me. I see myself as carrying on the spirit of Thurber's insightful and hilarious "The Wings of Henry James." > I still spend hours a day writing (yes, these mini-essays take me > hours to write), but none of it is the body of work that I would > like to be known for--my fiction. I feel the same way. But I also have done some very good work combining personal essay and literary theory and lit crit and creative non-fiction, something I've wanted to do for a long time because I think it's a grave mistake to divorce criticism and creative writing the way we do in most English departments. There was a lot of tension between the critics and writers at the UW, and that's not unique. But I'm both. > I could be content as a cheerleader if I weren't so desperate to be > a player in the game. I want to write, and I want to do it well. Likewise. > But like Salieri in _Amadeus_ I feel like I've been cursed by > God with a desire to do something that I'm ill-equipped to > succeed at. Just take the leap of faith and write. You may simply have to turn off your critical faculty when you write. I remember a wonderful book that I only read part of by one of my professors, Roger Sales, _On Not Being Good Enough_. He says "None of us is good enough to teach the literature that we teach." That's true--I'm a lousy teacher, but I _am_ good enough to criticize the literature that I criticize, and if I keep working hard enough I may yet write something worthy of someone else's critical energies. > I have enough critical faculty to know what I want, but I'm > not sure I have enough talent to realize it. You may simply have to spend more years writing before you realize what your achievement is. I love Ray Bradbury's image of the writer as Zen archer. Quantity will eventually produce quality just as the Zen archer becomes a master not by doing a few shots superbly, but by practicing his discipline over and over and over thousands of times. (See his Capra Press chapbook _Zen and the Art of Writing_ or it's expansion (also from Capra) _Zen in the Art of Writing_.) > And worst of all, it plays back into the fears that had started years > ago, that I never did have the talent to succceed, that I've been a > self-deluded imposter all this time. We all feel that way at times. Thanks for the eloquent expression/exorcism of that feeling, Scott. Harlow S. Clark (another relatively short post. I must be losing it.) ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Character Preferences Date: 08 Dec 2001 00:05:43 -0800 On Tue, 20 Nov 2001 15:42:47 -0800 (PST) William Morris writes: > I, much to my chagrin, recently realized that out of the 5 short > stories I have written or have in the works, 3 of them feature > main characters that are old men. What's that all about? Peter Straub uses an epigraph for _Floating Dragon_ to the effect that the earliest heros of Am. Lit. were old men. His old men heros are a couple of lawyers named Hawthorne and James. (I think at the end of the story the lawfirm takes on the name Hawthorne, James & Poe.) The epigraph adds poignance to the novel because you realize the heros can't stay around long, no matter how the story turns out. He ends _Ghost Story_ (essentially the same story, different setting and characters, epigraph from Hawthorne) with the main character feeling "a wave of love for everything mortal, for everything with a brief, definite life span--a tenderness for all that could give birth and would die, everything that could live, like these men, in the sunshine." Incidentally, I really like the opening to the prologue of _Ghost Story_: _What was the worst thing you've ever done?_ _I won't tell you that, but I'll tell you the worst thing that ever happened to me . . . the most dreadful thing . . . _ Maybe _Ghost Story_ is a metaphor for the worst thing that ever happened to me. It intersects with that worst thing in many ways. I read it when Donna and I flew back to NYC eleven years ago when my oldest son was baptized and he wouldn't let me participate--which is not the worst thing that ever happened to me, but it's part of it. >Is there something to be said to sticking to a specific type for > awhile----maybe you'll really get it right? I notice that a lot of my characters are people in deep emotional pain. I'm not sure I like to read about that, but it's often what I write about. (I wish I were funny.) The longest story in my thesis was a short novel about a BYU student whose marriage is in deep trouble but he can only admit it to himself in his dreams. (The opening dream has him dreaming Lehi's dream, set on BYU campus, struggling toward the great and spacious building (the library) while people drown in the fountain-that-isn't-there-anymore just south of the Brigham Young statue.) After writing that and some other stories I decided to write a funny story with lots of elaborate wordplay (Honk if you love Groucho), but the wordplay turned out to be elaborate word games the character plays to take his mind off impending and tragic divorce. He prays for relief, and gets it. He backs his car into a ditch at midnight and three teenaged girls come along and help him get out, so it's a Three-Nephites story, but instead of the girls disappearing into the fog, he does. I haven't written a lot of fiction the last few years though. In 1996 I signed onto an e-discussion group and got diverted into the personal essay, and for the past 10 years I've been developing an odd mix of personal essay / literary theory / lit crit. Harlow Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Writer's Lament (pt. 1) Date: 08 Dec 2001 00:18:49 -0800 On Fri, 23 Nov 2001 17:42:39 -0700 "Scott Parkin" writes: > I saw the creative and stylistic and philosophical depth of their > work and I wanted to be like them. I also knew that I didn't have > a powerful vision for my fiction like they seemed to have, only > a desire to tell and sell stories. I began to feel like a hack > surrounded by Artists. Back in the late 80s when I first contemplated applying for a Guggenheim Fellowship someone said, "You're that good?" "I'm one of the best writers in America." (I'm not a good grant writer, however and didn't get it in 1991, or when I applied again several years later, taking my application to the Eastbay P.O. the day the Space Shuttle flew over Utah County, right over my head, piggyback on a Boeing 707(?), and then Hugh Pinnock's brother (I think) stopped as I was running along the overpass over the RR tracks to catch the bus at 3rd S. and gave me a ride out to the U. Mall to catch the connecting bus, and bought donuts on the way. (I was sorry to hear Elder Pinnock had died a couple of years ago (tie-in to Mo-lit? He appears in Linda Sillitoe and Allen D. Roberts' _Salamander_).) wouldn't it be nice sometimes if e-mail programs had color-coded parentheses like spreadsheets so you could keep track of how deeply embedded your expression is?) Ok, so really, I'm a hack surrounded by artists, but even a chainsaw can turn out great art if it just keeps hacking away. > The weird part is that I think the last five stories I wrote are five > of the seven best stories I've ever written. At the same time, > those same stories haven't received even a sniff from the markets > I submit to. Maybe it's because I'm slowly changing from an sf > genre writer into something else (don't ask me what; sort of > mainstream-y or pseudo-absurdist-y or light literary-y or something > that allows for fantastic elements but that still focuses on issues of > personal evolution--if I could identify a specific marketing category > I'd start submitting there tomorrow). Why not call it magical realism? Knowing what to call a story can help a lot in defining the audience likely to read and understand it. My father wrote a brilliant sci-fi story called "Aryan Jew" about an Aryan man and a Jewish woman who have been put aboard a space ship after the nuclear holocaust to become the new Adam and Eve. It's the kind of story where you have a council or organization that has taken over the earth. He hasn't published it because the premise is scientifically implausible. The council has been treating these two (son of a Nazi, daughter of a holocaust survivor) for years with small amounts of radiation to build up their immunity so they can raise up a race that would be immune to nuclear holocaust. One of my father's scientist friends told him that the body doesn't develop immunity to radiation that way. It occurred to me a couple of years ago, and I mentioned it to him, that he could make it an alternate history story, where WWII ended with a massive germ warfare attack and the cold war was biological not nuclear. In that context immunity makes perfect sense. I need to mention this to him again, and see if I can get him to rewrite it. He tried to expand it into a novel, but says he doesn't have the vision to structure a novel. I think Leslie Norris once told me the same thing about himself. So, Scott, you may be calling your stories by the wrong name. There's a large audience for magical realism, as there is for allo-history. Find out where the magical realists are publishing and target those publications. Harlow Clark (a short post for once? Take a deep breath . . .) ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 08 Dec 2001 02:09:00 -0700 I find it interesting that your TA would have wanted more description. I guess I'm from the Struck and White school; be concise, be concise, be concise. My own work has short, simple descriptions. That's what I like myself, and that is what appears in my favorite Great Books. I don't suppose there's any need to emulate anybody except great writers; many of the most descriptive writer I've read over the last few years didn't get very far. I think flow is more important; instead of setting the scene give the reader a little credit. Doubtless he has an imagination of his own, and will use it. A short, clear description is my ideal, and one I have to work at because I tend to get wordy and carried away. Personally I think your TA was an idiot. I'm not a very good critic, and tend towards perfectionism, but that's too much. A writer ought to have more compassion for another. After all, who else can understand? I haven't been published yet either, but the idea of spending several pages describing raindrops is rather horrifying. I don't suppose they could drip much differently than usual, and focusing on trivial beauties doesn't make them more beautiful. Criticism is always hard to take, but " bits of ivory" are like children, and a parent grieves to have a child slandered. H. Beam Piper, a science fiction writer who shot himself because an editor told him he would never make it as a writer, had great success after his death. Millions of his various books sold through the seventies and eighties. I go with Teddy Roosevelt on this one. Criticize all you want, but make sure there's sand between your toes first. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: katie@aros.net Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 08 Dec 2001 09:12:16 -0700 > Could > anyone be a little more direct about Rowling's literary virtues? I don't > recall > seeing a post regarding just what it is that many of you like about her. > > Jim Picht > One thing that she has done that I believe has worked to her advantage, and to Harry Potter's, is to use the familiar to create something new, yet familiar. She's taken some familiar elements of fantasy and Halloween-type witchcraft, like spells, potions, broomsticks, etc. and she's woven them into yet another familiar setting: that of a school. Now, most people who read Harry Potter will have attended a school of some sort. They know what it's like to deal with teachers, homework, other students, and so forth. So readers can sympathize with Harry quite easily, simply because they know what he's going through. The magical elements make the story interesting. So we can sympathize with Harry because we know what it's like to have to do a difficult assignment in school, but his story interests us because his difficult assignment is to levitate a frog. We can sympathize with him when he plays Quidditch, because we've also played and enjoyed watching sports. The fact that he and the others play this sport on flying broomsticks, and have to deal with enchanted balls that fly around on their own, makes it more interesting. But the details are what really bring the story to life. Just one example is of the broomsticks. Rowling could have simply had them ride on flying broomsticks and that be the end of it. But instead, there are different brands of broomsticks, and in the first book Harry is thrilled to get a top-of-the- line Nimbus 2000, which makes him the envy of all around him. This is another realistic detail added to something that's not too real. --Katie Parker Salt Lake City, UT -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Carter Subject: RE: [AML] YOUNG & GRAY, _Standing on the Promises_ Date: 08 Dec 2001 14:14:38 -0900 Margaret Young wrote: Perhaps the most >troubling thing I've heard lately--and this from three returned missionaries >who served in different missions--is that some false doctrine is circulating >again (a discourse by Alvin Dyer which talks about valiency in the >pre-existence). These missionaries received it ON their missions. Can we >call that discourse Mormon literature and hence tie it in with the list's >objectives? Here's my question: How on earth can we get that talk out of >circulation? Is it possible? Or how can we train missionaries to recognize >that its teachings are contrary to the scriptures? Do we need a special class >at the MTC for this? I received a copy of this talk on my mission. It had been copied so often that the text was barely a ghost on the page. It must have been at least 20 generations from the original. I was interested in the ideas the essay presented, especially because THE most spiritual people I met on my mission were from Africa. While the Caucasian investigators I was teaching muddled around trying to pray, the Africans had visions of angels (seriously). I don't remember having much of a reaction to the speech, probably because it went so much against my experience that I just figured I misunderstood it. To address Margaret's question, I'm not sure it is possible to get the speech out of circulation. I'm not even sure it's desirable. Censorship, especially from the likes of us literary types, is hard to justify. What we do need is a missionary culture that values critical thinking a little more. I know from my experience on my mission in Canada (it may be different elsewhere) that unquestioning obedience is THE rule. When something like Dyer's speech comes around, it's my opinion that most missionaries have little enough practice in critical thinking and enough vague, but powerful awe of authorities, that they assign the talk to the class of obscure (and therefore interesting) general authority pronouncements. In some ways this lack of critical thinking is both a boon and a bane, because often the talk won't make any substantive impact on the missionary's mind at all. However, in some circumstances, its ideas may surface again and cause damage. The only defense against misguided ideas is the spirit-informed critical faculty. Believe me, there is a lot more than just that talk floating around in missionary land. Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 09 Dec 2001 07:07:09 -0700 Jonathan Langford wrote: > My point is that, taking these as my > baseline, I don't think Rowling quite makes the "great" category--at least, > not yet. It may be that by the time the series has ended, I'll revise that > opinion. Taken in isolation, I don't think the film _God's Army_ is great. It's a pretty good, sufficiently entertaining story. But placed within its cultural context, where it had significant influence, it achieves the status of greatness. It pioneered new trails, accomplished something people were saying was impossible, opened up new potential for a new genre of art. That makes it great in my mind. I think the Harry Potter books fall under the same classification. Sometimes you have to look beyond the words to the cultural influence to find the greatness in a work of literature. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Fw: MN Bigfoot and Mormons?: Shane Lester Press Release 3Dec01 Date: 09 Dec 2001 07:15:13 -0700 > Clan of Cain: The Genesis of Bigfoot is a newly > published book that offers a different dimension to the Bigfoot > mystery. > The book asserts the theory that Cain is in reality the legendary > Sasquatch. Unlikely as it is, I hope this turns out to be true. Then maybe Mormons can get rid of the theory that the mark of Cain is black skin--it's really a fur-covered body. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Webmaster" Subject: [AML] What Sells Novels? Date: 09 Dec 2001 11:40:13 -0700 I've been following the Harry Potter commentaries along with the discussion of pov, and thinking about things I've been learning of late, and I thought I'd write some comments that might be discussed, analysed, and maybe even used by some of us writers to improve our work. I recently read the first Harry Potter book, and must say that it needed some editing, IMHO. I would also say that it was only slightly better than many books I've recently edited. I say that to encourage us writers. I don't think there is a vast difference between wealth/greatness as a writer and being unpublished or less successful. So those who are out there trying, keep at it! But what's the difference? How can we improve our writing so that we, too, can make the big bucks like J.K. Rowling? I would suggest that the elements of fiction that seem to make the greatest difference in the popularity of novels--and hence in our financial success (and I know many of you do not write for that purpose--that's fine, I understand that, but this is written to those who want to tell stories to the masses)--are characterization and plot development. The technical aspects of pov are helpful in making our stories engrossing, but no one will be engrossed in them if we do not develop interesting characters and hatch intriguing plots. I wonder if the list might like to comment on these elements and see if the collective wisdom residing here (and you all have more of that than you are willing to admit) can help us to improve. Some specifics, please. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] BYU WDA Theatre Readings (Deseret News) Date: 10 Dec 2001 01:41:35 +0000 Sunday, December 9, 2001 Theater openings include pair of one-man shows By Ivan M. Lincoln Deseret News theater editor STAGED READINGS of three original plays, all developed as part of BYU's highly acclaimed Writers/Directors/Actors (WDA) Workshop, will be presented Dec. 11-13 in the Nelke Experimental Theatre of the Harris Fine Arts Center. Dates and plays to be read are: =97 Tuesday: "For Name's Sake," by graduate student Char Nelson. =97 Wednesday: "Slaying the Greeble," a theater-for-young- audiences piece by faculty member Eric Samuelsen. =97 Thursday: "Let Me Call You Sweetheart," a romantic comedy by Tawnya Cazier, a playwright and recent BYU graduate. All performances begin at 5 p.m. and are free; the general public is welcome to attend. The class is composed of six writers, six directors and a handful of actors. It's team-taught by Samuelsen and Robert Nelson. =A9 2001 Deseret News Publishing Company _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Pete EARLEY, _Prophet of Death_ (Review) Date: 10 Dec 2001 10:46:52 -0700 Rich Hammett wrote: > On my returned missionary e-mail list, we recently had a discussion > about this same topic, sparked, of course by the religiously-motivated > events of 9/11/01. > > At least half the people participating in the discussion said that > they would kill anyone if told to by their prophet or priesthood > leader. They somehow thought this differentiated them from the > terrorists, because the returned missionaries were _right_. This is so frigtening a thought that I can hardly bring words to wrap around it. I've writtne a play about another set of Prophets of Death, the Lafferty Brothers who (they claim) received a revelation "hit list" of people to kill, two of which where their sister-in-law and her seventeen month old baby. Since it is a play, and not just an historical treatise, I explored the similarities between the call of the Lafferty brothers to kill and that of Nephi. In my play, the Lafferty's consider Nephi as having come off wanting because he had to be told three times to cut off Laban's head while they only had to be told once. > > I didn't read this list much in the last two months, so I apologize > if this has been discussed already. Tying it back to mormon lit, > does Deseret, for example, publish books that examine when the > "right" time to disobey a leader is? You'll go wanting if you try to find articles like that, at least in any Church publication over the last couple of decades. In the 50's, L Reuben Clark wrote a pretty good article giving suggestions on how we could tell if our leaders were giving us inspired counsel or their own opinions. I'll bet Bill Gates' tithing for one year that your returned missionary list buddies have never read the following: "The very words of the revelation (D&C 68:2-4) recognize that the Brethren may speak when they are not 'moved upon by the Holy Ghost,' yet only when they do so speak, as so 'moved upon' is what they say Scripture. No exceptions are given to this rule or principle. It is universal in its application. "The question is, how shall we know when the things they have spoken were said as they were 'moved upon by the Holy Ghost?' "I have given some thought to this question, and the answer thereto so far as I can determine is: We can tell when the speakers are 'moved upon by the Holy Ghost' only when we, ourselves, are 'moved upon by the Holy Ghost.' "In a way, this completely shifts the responsibility from them to us to determine when they so speak. "In considering the problem involved here, it should be in mind that some of the General Authorities have had assigned to them a special calling; they possess a special gift; they are sustained as prophets, seers, and revelators, which gives them a special spiritual endowment in connection with their teaching of the people. They have the right, the power, and authority to declare the mind and will of God to his people, subject to the over-all power and authority of the President of the Church. Others of the General Authorities are not given this special spiritual endowment and authority covering their teachings; they have a resulting limitation, and the resulting limitation upon their power and authority in teaching applies to every other officer and member of the church, for none of them is spiritually endowed as a prophet, seer, and revelator. Furthermore, as just indicated, the President of the Church has a further and special spiritual endowment in this respect, for he is the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator for the whole Church. "There are those who insist that unless the Prophet of the Lord declares, 'Thus saith the Lord,' the message may not be taken as a revelation. This is a false testing standard. For while many of our modern revelations as contained in the Doctrine and Covenants do contain these words, there are many that do not. Nor is it necessary that an actual voice be heard in order that a message from our Heavenly Father shall be a true revelation, as shown by revelations given in former dispensations, as well as in our own." ("When Are the Writings or Sermons of Church Leaders Entitled to the Claim of Scripture?", an address delivered to seminary and institute of religion personnel, BYU, July 7, 1954; see "Church News Section," Deseret News, July 31, 1954.) [Thom Duncan] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Story Beginnings (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 10 Dec 2001 12:29:16 -0600 D. Michael Martindale wrote: > >I believe there is no good excuse for starting a book out this way. Why >any author would think the reader should be willing to slog through a >lackluster beginning is beyond me. If it doesn't grab in the first few >pages--one way or another--I don't think the most exquisite writing on >earth in the following pages can justify a poor opening. I'm not sure I agree. This notion that a story should be engaging from the first few pages *sounds* like a safe enough bet as a universal principle of storytelling, but in practice, I'm not sure this is the case--though it may be that Michael broadens his statement enough with the phrase "one way or another" that it may hold true after all. But I'm not convinced even of that. I need to start by admitting that I think Chapter One of the first Harry Potter book (The Boy Who Lived) works very well. In trying to guess why others don't like this chapter, I think it may be because Rowling starts not with Harry as a character, but rather with a larger-focus introduction to the world Rowling has created and Harry's place within it--a historical introduction. Some people don't like that approach, but it's an eminently defensible one from the context of the worldbuilding-type fantasy genre in which Rowling is writing. Part of the promise with worldbuilding fantasy is that the author will create a richly detailed setting that is enjoyable and worth exploring in its own sake (if you like that sort of thing). Rowling begins to deliver on this promise from the very first chapter. If, on the other hand, the problem is not with this approach but rather with how it's carried out, then I can only say that I think the writing in this chapter is certainly on a par with what we find in the rest of the series... But back to the larger point. Michael is certainly right that many readers nowadays are willing to grant only a paragraph or a page or two for a story to engage their attention; then, if the story has failed to capture them, they go on to something else. But I don't think that's anything like a universal reaction. Indeed, I think that for some genres--such as worldbuilding fantasy (as opposed to swashbuckling fantasy, an entirely different type)--it's more common for readers to expect that it will take a *long* time for things to take off, and for them to allow that time. Many readers find Tolkien slow going, but that hasn't stopped him from being popular. And Tolkien's first chapter is arguably much worse than, say, Rowling's, from that point of view: It's *25 pages* long, it takes place 17 years before the rest of the story, it focuses on a character who all but vanishes for the rest of the book, and (worst of all) it continues in the silly vein of _The Hobbit_ without any real indications of the much more serious stuff that's to follow. No one, I say, who likes _The Lord of the Rings_ can possibly know it by the end of the first chapter (though one may, of course, like chapter 1 for other reasons). For that matter, some people don't think the book picks up until Frodo gets to Bree (160 pages in--I'm using the standard-sized three-volume paperback edition), or gets to Weathertop (200 pages), or reaches Rivendell (240). The fact that the book is so immensely popular despite that is evidence, in my view, that many readers--at least in this particular genre--are willing to allow time for the story to get going. Of course, part of the issue, as I noted previously, may be with that "one way or the other" Michael alludes to. In the case of a fantasy novel, it may be that all that is needed to hook the reader is a promise that eventually you *will* explore a world you come to love as the story unfolds. But I think in such cases it's often the promise of things to come, rather than anything that has happened so far, that keeps readers going. In fantasy, at least--and in other genres that typically take a great deal of space to develop, such as in-depth character development novels, or multi-generational epics--I don't believe most readers keep a running cost-benefit tally, and stop reading the minute the labor of reading exceeds the enjoyment they have so far received. Rather, I think they view the reading as a long-term investment, with a payoff that may not occur fully until after the book is finished. Such readers, if they stop reading at all, do so because they have lost faith in the writer--that the writer ever will repay the investment. Which can I suppose be viewed as a failure to engage the reader, but if so, it's of a very different type than simply not "grabbing" the reader in the first few pages. Reading a story, as I see it, is a lot like a nature hike. There's a place you want to go, because you've heard about it, or see it marked on a map, or you're driving along and a sign at the side of the road catches your eye. You get out. You see (in many cases) a sign telling you how long the trail is. Looking at the path, and the general terrain, you get an idea of how tough the hike is likely to be. Then, if you think you can spare the time and energy for the hike, and you believe you'll enjoy the experience, you take off. You don't stop every ten feet and ask yourself, is the scenery pretty yet? Rather, you keep going--at least a minimum period of time, perhaps until something makes you decide that you don't have the time to finish the path after all, or you start to believe the trail isn't taking you where you wanted to go. Certainly, if you get to the end of the trail and you never found the lake or waterfall or peak that was promised you, you may feel cheated. Or you may get there and discover that the waterfall isn't all that impressive, and the trail itself was pretty dreadful (since, after all, part of the point of most hikes is to enjoy yourself along the way, as well as to get somewhere), and decide that it really wasn't worth your time after all. But you don't expect that every step will be breathtaking. Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List jlangfor@pressenter.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 10 Dec 2001 11:42:54 -0700 >In lines at grocery stores I read the covers of all the magazines. At > >banks I read the announcements of changes in their policies - even if >I >don't bank there. Ha! I thought I was the only one who read the policy statements of banks that I don't bank at :-) I read shampoo bottles too. We have a GIANT pile of books and magazines in the bathroom and piles of books all over the house. I would go insane with boredom in this wait-around-world if I didn't have a pile of books to read. All those "it'll just be five minutes" add up! One humorous thing I wouldn't have found if I didn't have this compulsion: there is a drink out there with 0's all down the "nutrition facts" section and when it first came out it actually said at the bottom, "Not a significant source of anything." (They have since deleted that statement.) :-) Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: [AML] SL Tribune Series on Utah "Cultural Divide" Date: 10 Dec 2001 15:40:58 -0800 (PST) The Salt Lake Tribune has published an interesting, massive new series of articles on the "cultural divide" between Mormons and non-Mormons in Utah. It can be found at: http://www.sltrib.com/2001/dec/12092001/utah/utah.htm ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Story Beginnings (was: Harry Potter Books) Date: 10 Dec 2001 16:42:37 -0800 I have to add my two cents to what Clark wrote here about lack luster beginnings. I picked up a book by Piers Anthony several years ago (first I had read by him) and it had won the British Fantasy Award for the year before (sorry - I don't remember the actual name of the award). I tried two or three times to get going on that book and finally I told myself there must be something about this to have won a distinguished award for fantasy. Once I got through he first few chapters I was hooked on this author and the first of the Magic of Xanth series. I got a little out of touch with the series after it got past 7 or 8 books but his Bio of a Space Tyrant series, Apprentice Adept (fantasy and SF combined) series, and Incarnations of Eternity series were all very good (my opinion of course).=20 The point is sometimes you have to slog through the first part of a book to understand the authors style and if it grabs you then you understand how to read his or her other works as well. One disclaimer. Not every author will appeal to all people. That goes for any book be it fiction, doctrinal, or other. Think of the Scriptures - who hasn't had to slog through the Isaiah portion of the Book of Mormon in 2 Nephi. Anyone who has read the entire Old Testament (I did one time while on my mission - hardest goal to finish I ever made) knows what it is to slog through certain parts. Where other parts of the Scriptures seem to grab and hold your heart mind and soul. Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: RE: [AML] Dahl (was: Harry Potter Movie) Date: 10 Dec 2001 18:08:52 -0700 John Williams: > >Finally, think of Eric Snider. Eric has been accused more than once of >misanthropy, and yet (at least in my experience with him) he's one of the most >genuine, thoughtful, and sensitive people I know. Sure, he mocks people a lot >(I can recall several times when Eric has told me that I "have no butt"), but >it is never done maliciously. It's funny! I agree that if one is to think of me, one should do it "finally"; i.e., only after all other thought-worthy topics have been exhausted. Roald Dahl seems like the kind of person I would have enjoyed knowing. I agree with John's assessment of him: grouchy, cantankerous, or whatever, but still a nice guy. I picture Captain Moroni being approximately the same way: A great leader and spiritual giant, but DON'T MESS WITH HIM! Eric D. Snider P.S. John really has no butt. It's not even slanderous to say so; it's really true. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: Re:[AML] (Andrew's Poll) What's the Point? Date: 10 Dec 2001 19:20:55 -0800 I have to read something everyday even if it's the back of a cereal box. I think I'd go insane otherwise. As lazy as I am about getting physical exercise I must get mental exercise and I'm losing too many brain cells to leave any to chance. For a long time I was mostly reading magazine articles but I've tried to get away from that because I felt I was shortening my literary attention span. I still read some articles and check internet newspapers and other news sites at least a few times a week to keep current. I like reading biographies because I'm curious about peoples' lives and times, how their personality was formed and why they did what they did. Especially when their actions had the effect of causing change to the societies in which they lived for good or ill and if these effects are still felt today. I like humor books, not so much joke books as humorous stories and anecdotes for no other than reason than I love to laugh. There is much in this world of sorrow and sometimes the ability to laugh takes us outside of ourselves to see the bigger picture. Besides, I need the endorphins. I once told my dad an irishman would rather lie than tell a dull story-he laughingly agreed. I don't generally like or read straight romances. Not LDS, general Christian or the type we at the library loving referred to as "Bodice Rippers". I'll read it if it has a historical context to it, usually about a real person because I love history and want to see if they've done their homework about the person and time besides being a good story. I like Anne Perry's Victorian murder mysteries, she knows the times, and I like her characters even if I have to slog through the first chapter or two to get to the good stuff. I feel I have neglected fictional novels for a long time. I just didn't feel there was much out there worth reading unless it was a classic. I however am repenting of that view especially since I am discovering some really good fiction in the LDS market and am starting to go through the stack I brought home from the AML conference. If fiction is well done it can take you away to other times and places, help you almost experience things you never have, or see things in a different way, expand your whole being in some strange way. For me Children's literature is the top of the line. I know some people look down their noses at it, but to be a good children's author you have to have imagination and have some remnant of the child-like wonder the world has for the young. You can't rely on what can be called "the obligatory bedroom scene", or too much violence and profanity. You have to know your audience and what will hold their attention, is appropriate to the general understanding of certain age groups, all the while while not talking down to them and trying to be entertaining and exciting. They and their parents can be a tough audience to please, but if you do you have their loyalty. I like all different kinds-read-a-louds, YA novels, chapter books and especially picture books. The right text and illustration in a picture book is enchanting. Maybe that's why I like writing in that category and collecting particular authors and antique picture books. I have pondered on why it seems Brother Brigham disdained novels. IMO, perhaps it was that life was short in the nineteenth century, work was hard and physically demanding and to him there was no time to dilly-dally on such things, stick to the scriptures, etc. Perhaps also novel reading was seen as a luxury of the idle rich, for who else would have the time? Although I wonder if I would have the chutzpah to argue with him I might point out certain scriptures to defend my position: D&C 93:24,53, D&C 130:19, and D&C 88:77-80 out of modern scripture and out of the Bible, Proverbs 4:7-"Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding." He'd probably have some sharp comebacks with other scriptures, but hey I'd have tried. Finally, I think reading both fiction and non-fiction makes for a more well rounded person, open to the spirit and compassionate, able to defend their own faith while respecting others. I read to live-I know no other way. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: Re: [AML] Quotation Marks Date: 10 Dec 2001 23:07:32 -0500 I've been reading Cry the Beloved Country. The dialogue is sometimes set apart with -- and sometimes just mixed in with regular prose. At first I found it distracting. But as I've continued reading I've found that it has helped me slow down and catch the rythmn of the book. Tracie ----- Original Message ----- I'm anxious to know what you think of the book, Terry. As far as I'm concerned you are right on with your points as to why an author would use no quotes. It is "stylistically" more literary. Makes it "better." Marilyn -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Angela Lansbury Celebrates Christmas with Tabernacle Choir: LDS Church News Release 7Dec01 A1 Date: 10 Dec 2001 23:03:03 -0500 Angela Lansbury Celebrates Christmas with Tabernacle Choir SALT LAKE CITY - Vocalist Angela Lansbury, renowned star of film, television and stage, joins the Mormon Tabernacle Choir in its annual public Christmas concerts beginning tonight in the Conference Center near Temple Square. The program features 20 numbers including traditional Christmas hymns and classical compositions by Handel and Bach, plus contemporary songs written by John Rutter and Victor Herbert. Ms. Lansbury adds her own flair with numbers from her stage repertoire such as "We Need a Little Christmas" from Mame, and the title song from "Beauty and the Beast." Ms. Lansbury is most recently known for her 12-year role as Jessica Fletcher in the TV series "Murder, She Wrote." She is the winner of 12 Emmy Awards and four Tony Awards, and was nominated three times for an Academy Award. Ms. Lansbury says working with the Tabernacle Choir as a "backup" to her solo numbers made her a little nervous. "I felt I was working with a group of people who are so wonderfully integrated among themselves to produce wonderful sound, music, and singing - their voices are so pure, so pure." The Orchestra at Temple Square joins the choir and Ms. Lansbury. All three conductors of the choir, Craig Jessop, Mack Wilberg and Barlow Bradford share directing responsibilities. John Longhurst and Clay Christiansen take turns at the organ. Ms. Lansbury's accompanist is Todd Schroeder. While reserved tickets for the free performances were all distributed some weeks ago, most people waiting in standby lines at the Conference Center are expected to be admitted. The 7:30 p.m. concert will be repeated tomorrow evening. Ms. Lansbury will also appear with the choir on the weekly Music and the Spoken Word broadcast at 9:30 a.m., followed by a brief concert with additional selections. Source: Angela Lansbury Celebrates Christmas with Tabernacle Choir LDS Church News Release 7Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/news/article/0,5422,116-7190,00.html >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN New plays featured in staged readings Dec. 11-13 at BYU: BYU Press Release 8Dec01 US UT Prov A2 Date: 11 Dec 2001 12:24:50 -0500 New plays featured in staged readings Dec. 11-13 at BYU PROVO, UTAH -- Brigham Young University's Department of Theatre and Media Arts presents the annual Writers/Directors/Actors (WDA)Workshop Tuesday through Thursday (Dec. 11-13) from 5 to 7 p.m. in the Nelke Experimental Theatre. The staged-reading workshop is free and the public is welcome to attend. Two student plays and one faculty play will be read. Tuesday (Dec. 11) will feature "For Name's Sake" by theatre graduate student Char Nelson. On Wednesday (Dec. 12) "Slaying the Greeble," a "theatre for young audiences" piece by theatre faculty member Eric Samuelsen, will be presented. Thursday (Dec. 13) will feature "Let Me Call You Sweetheart," a romantic comedy by Tawnya Cazier, playwright and recent BYU graduate. The WDA is a class for theatre students experimenting with playwriting, directing and acting. The experience gives them an opportunity to fine-tune their skills and learn from their classmates.The class--comprised of six writers, six directors and a handful of actors--is team-taught by BYU Theatre and Media Arts Department chair Robert Nelson and Eric Samuelsen. "The WDA provides an intensive writing experience for our students," said Samuelsen. Each writer and director work together in a team receiving observation and feedback in a staged-reading setting. "This experience is helpful for writers to see different perspectives and see what works and what does not," said Tawnya Cazier. "It also enables the students to hear different readings of their piece and experience different interpretations," Samuelsen said. The audience is an essential part in the staged readings of these works and the workshop is the best thing a writer can go through, according to Samuelsen. -###- Source: New plays featured in staged readings Dec. 11-13 at BYU BYU Press Release 3Dec01 A2 http://www.byu.edu/news/releases/Dec/plays.htm >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN New book on Spori Building features photos and history: BYU-Idaho Press Release 8Dec01 US ID Poca D3 Date: 11 Dec 2001 12:25:19 -0500 New book on Spori Building features photos and history REXBURG, IDAHO -- A pictorial book commemorating the historic Jacob Spori Building is off the presses and should be available at the BYU-Idaho Bookstore by Dec. 7. The book will retail for $24 but will be on sale for $19.20 through Dec. 28. Shipping and handling is an extra $4. Phone orders are accepted at the Bookstore by calling (208) 496-2211. The oversized book entitled Remembering the Spori is a compilation of photos, memories, and essays commemorating the building that was torn down a year ago. A new Spori Building is being constructed at the same location on the north end of campus. The concept of preserving the imagery, memories, and histories into a book was conceived at a time when the end of a building was eminent. The book is intended not only to honor the Spori Building but also to preserve and enhance the legacy of the "Spirit of Ricks" by deepening understanding and appreciation for those who laid the foundation. The book was designed by BYU-Idaho graphic designer Brian Memmott. Much of the writing, research, and coordination was done by LaNae Poulter. Steve Moser, who retired from the Public Relations Office in August, compiled much of the information used in the book. Besides historic photos, many of the photos were taken by BYU-Idaho photographer Michael Lewis and faculty member Kelly Burgener. Besides photographs, the book also includes a history of Jacob Spori, a history of the building, and 50 memories by former students and employees. The structure was originally known as the Academy Building when completed in 1903 and was renamed the Jacob Spori Building in 1963 in recognition of the first principal at Bannock Stake Academy, the forerunner of Brigham Young University-Idaho. # # # Source: New book on Spori Building features photos and history BYU-Idaho Press Release 8Dec01 D3 http://www.byui.edu/News/NewsReleases/sporibook.html >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: [AML] Hybrid Genres (was: Writer's Lament) Date: 11 Dec 2001 10:49:04 -0800 (PST) --- harlowclark@juno.com wrote: > > I feel the same way. But I also have done some very good work combining > personal essay and literary theory and lit crit and creative > non-fiction, > something I've wanted to do for a long time because I think it's a grave > mistake to divorce criticism and creative writing the way we do in most > English departments. There was a lot of tension between the critics and > writers at the UW, and that's not unique. But I'm both. > Harlow had INDEED done some very good work combining the elements he describes above. It's a genre I'm interested in because I think that in many ways it's a rather Mormon-discourse way of approaching things. After all, many of the talks we hear from the pulpit combine scriptural exegesis with personal narratives and, sometimes, creative non-fiction (or even fiction). While I haven't yet tried to do this outside the classroom, I wrote a couple of term papers in my just-barely-ended college career that combined lit-crit with 'creative' writing. For instance, for a class on the Literature of the Americas, I wrote an essay exploring comparisons and differences (that's what us comparatists do, ya know) between Paul Auster's _City of Glass_ and Roberto Arlt's _The Seven Madmen_ [Note to Tom Johnson from way back in June: sorry you didn't like the work---you mentioned Auster, I made the leap because I had in this class---that's why I brought it up]. I conceived the essay as a song. The first verse was on Arlt; the second on Auster and the chorus on the two together. But between the two verses and the verse and the chorus, I wrote bridges. They were works of fiction that explored connections between the two authors. The whole thing didn't work super well because the chorus part was weak, but writing the bridges was fun and interesting, exploring lit crit as fiction (kind of like Borges and some of his work [e.g. "Pierre Menard, author of the Quixote"}). The genius of Harlow's work in this area is that not only is it incredibly funny, but he often makes connections between texts or between texts and his life that are unexpected but also illuminating. But to get back to this idea of hybrid works. Certainly mixing scriptural exegesis and personal experience isn't unique to Mormon dicourse, but I wonder if because it is a feature of the Mormon experience, it has made Harlow more prone to this kind of work. Or, more importantly, if some Mormon readers might be more interested in this kind of work because we already have interpretive schema that can deal with it, approach it easily. Which then, hopefully, could lead to a criticism that is less-alienated from readers of Mormon fiction. Or maybe Harlow and I are just hybrid freaks. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: [AML] Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 11:19:13 -0500 Maybe a year ago 60 Minutes did a story about a skeleton up in Washington State that was creating quite a ruckus. It was a male, non-Indian, that pre-dated the tribes of the pacific NW. The dispute was that the Indians were claiming the skeleton to dispose of as they saw fit, the archaeologists felt it belonged to science, the Army Corps of Engineers defied a court order and bulldozed the site where the skeleton was found into oblivion, and that was that. I've wanted to research this story for a writing project, but have been unable to Boolean Search any info. Does anyone up in the Pacific NW have any knowledge about this story--how the skeleton is referred to in news stories? Thanks! Tony Markham -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 11:00:28 -0800 (PST) --- Tony Markham wrote: > Maybe a year ago 60 Minutes did a story about a skeleton up in > Washington > State that was creating quite a ruckus. It was a male, non-Indian, that > pre-dated the tribes of the pacific NW. > > The dispute was that the Indians were claiming the skeleton to dispose > of > as they saw fit, the archaeologists felt it belonged to science, the > Army > Corps of Engineers defied a court order and bulldozed the site where the > skeleton was found into oblivion, and that was that. > > I've wanted to research this story for a writing project, but have been > unable to Boolean Search any info. Does anyone up in the Pacific NW > have > any knowledge about this story--how the skeleton is referred to in news > stories? > I believe what your referreing to is "the Kennewick Man controversy." ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 11 Dec 2001 12:07:30 -0700 D. Michael Martindale wrote: >Taken in isolation, I don't think the film _God's Army_ is great. It's a >pretty good, sufficiently entertaining story. But placed within its >cultural context, where it had significant influence, it achieves the >status of greatness. It pioneered new trails, accomplished something >people were saying was impossible, opened up new potential for a new >genre of art. That makes it great in my mind. > >I think the Harry Potter books fall under the same classification. >Sometimes you have to look beyond the words to the cultural influence to >find the greatness in a work of literature. I agree, except to say I think you ALWAYS have to look beyond the words to the cultural influence to find the greatness in a work of literature. Like I said back in the "greatness" in literature post, any definition of bookish greatness (always) ALREADY carries with it certain cultural "influence." Furthermore, the phrase "taken in isolation" seems like an impossibility to me, as if to suggest that the movie _God's Army_ could somehow be disconnected from the culture that made it possible, suspended in an interpretive vacuum and judged objectively. But I can't imagine any circumstances where something could actually be "taken in isolation." --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rich Hammett Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:22:50 -0600 (CST) This is the Kennewick Man. If you're really bored, you can use google to follow a USENET argument we had a couple of years ago about it on talk.origins and....hmmmm.....I think, soc.culture.native-american or something like that. I don't _think_ the Corps ever defied a court order, though. Some of the anthropologists did, as I recall, by keeping some of the bones or fragments. I don't remember if it was intentional, or not. rich On Tue, 11 Dec 2001, Tony Markham wrote: > Maybe a year ago 60 Minutes did a story about a skeleton up in Washington > State that was creating quite a ruckus. It was a male, non-Indian, that > pre-dated the tribes of the pacific NW. > > The dispute was that the Indians were claiming the skeleton to dispose of > as they saw fit, the archaeologists felt it belonged to science, the Army > Corps of Engineers defied a court order and bulldozed the site where the > skeleton was found into oblivion, and that was that. > > I've wanted to research this story for a writing project, but have been > unable to Boolean Search any info. Does anyone up in the Pacific NW have > any knowledge about this story--how the skeleton is referred to in news > stories? > > Thanks! > > Tony Markham > > > > > > - > AML-List Magazine, a daily selection of posts from AML-List. > See AML-List archives at http://www.xmission.com/~aml/aml-list.htm > -- \ Rich Hammett http://home.hiwaay.net/~rhammett / rhammett@HiWAAY.net \ They that can give up essential / liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve \ neither liberty nor safety. -- Benjamin Franklin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rich Hammett Subject: Re: [AML] Pete EARLEY, _Prophet of Death_ (Review) Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:49:24 -0600 (CST) Thanks, Tom. Do you mind if I post some of this to that list? I'm assuming I haven't been banned, yet. Several list members considered questioning the order to murder quite heretical. In this connection, the story in the old testament about the aftermath of the Golden Calf incident has come up several times recently. Many of these same list members considered that story (random men, women, and children were hacked to death by vigilantes as partial atonement for making the calf, as I recall) to be a warning to people in their wards. Several people told me that if their stake president told them to, they would walk into their ward with a machine gun and perform the modern equivalent. I had thought that the failure I perceive in them was just a failure to get into the literature, to understand that people in the old testament and other books are actually people, but it seems to be deeper than that. If these people, well-educated professionals that they are, can get that kind of lesson out of books (scriptures), why can't they learn compassion? How can your reach somebody like that? I'm afraid that most of them wouldn't ever make it to see a Thom Duncan play. rich -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:06:29 -0700 On Mon, Dec 10, 2001 at 12:29:16PM -0600, Jonathan Langford wrote: > Reading a story, as I see it, is a lot like a nature hike. There's a place > you want to go, because you've heard about it, or see it marked on a map, > or you're driving along and a sign at the side of the road catches your > eye. This model represents the situation where the reader has seen good press about a book. Maybe Oprah has recommended the book, or _PW_ has given the book a star, or a friend has raved about the book, or the reader has read other books by this author. In this case, the reader will probably forgive a less-than-gripping opening. In most of the cases we have discussed so far, I pictured the reader coming to the work cold -- perhaps browsing in the bookstore. If the reader has no prior experience with a book, then the reader will make a decision based on either the cover art, the cover blurbs, or the author's words -- usually from the first chapter. Since authors cannot guarantee that readers will always have prior, informed information, it behooves the author to make the opening as interesting as possible. Why risk that the browsing reader will put your book? Also, when the reader starts a story out with a bang, I find reading the rest of the book something I look forward to. When I have to trudge through a chapter or two before the real action of a book gets going, that slow start colors my experience with the rest of the book, no matter how interesting or engaging the author makes the rest of the story. Just like my observations about why authors would choose not to use quotation marks, I think authors write dull beginnings at their own risk, and in doing so, equates the the author-reader relationship with master-slave rather than person-person. -- Terry L Jeffress | I love being a writer. What I can't stand is the South Jordan, UT | paperwork. -- Peter de Vries -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:24:12 -0700 On Mon, Dec 10, 2001 at 04:42:37PM -0800, Jerry Tyner wrote: > I have to add my two cents to what Clark wrote here about lack luster > beginnings. I picked up a book by Piers Anthony several years ago (first > I had read by him) and it had won the British Fantasy Award for the year > before (sorry - I don't remember the actual name of the award). Anthony, Piers. _A Spell for Chameleon._ British Fantasy Award, 1978 Nominations - Hugo - Gandalf Locus Reader's Poll - 9th best novel > The point is sometimes you have to slog through the first part of a book > to understand the authors style and if it grabs you then you understand > how to read his or her other works as well. Sometimes you have to, but that doesn't make this a good practice for authors. Certainly, as Jonathan pointed out, we have to make allowances for the traditions of a particular genre. I will give one of those enormous fantasy tomes a chapter or two to get rolling, but by the authors should have convinced me that enough interesting things happen in the fantasy world that will make me interested and want to continue. I don't think that as authors we should ever look at our work and say, "Oh well, just let the reader slog through the first third of the book because then it gets really interesting." As reader's we should demand our right to have interesting works. Great authors know how to write an interesting opening scene that has just the right amount of interesting movement, establishing shots, character development, and revelation of backstory. Certainly not easy, but certainly worth reading when done well. -- Terry L Jeffress | The secret of popular writing is never to put South Jordan, UT | more on a given page than the common reader can | lap off it with no strain whatsoever on his | habitually slack attention. -- Ezra Pound -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Melissa Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:30:29 -0700 On Tue, 11 Dec 2001 11:19:13 -0500, Tony Markham wrote: >Maybe a year ago 60 Minutes did a story about a skeleton up in = Washington >State that was creating quite a ruckus. It was a male, non-Indian, that >pre-dated the tribes of the pacific NW. > >The dispute was that the Indians were claiming the skeleton to dispose = of >as they saw fit, the archaeologists felt it belonged to science, the = Army >Corps of Engineers defied a court order and bulldozed the site where the >skeleton was found into oblivion, and that was that. > >I've wanted to research this story for a writing project, but have been >unable to Boolean Search any info. Does anyone up in the Pacific NW = have >any knowledge about this story--how the skeleton is referred to in news >stories? I believe they call him Kennewick Man, but it's been so long I don't remember. Plus I wasn't living there at the time; my parents live in the Tri-Cities. There's a section of _Darwin's Radio_ by Greg Bear that = touches on the subject, but calls him by a different name. You might try looking= at the resource list at the back of that novel. Melissa Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Carter Subject: RE: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 11 Dec 2001 11:46:20 -0900 James Wilson wrote: I haven't >been published yet either, but the idea of spending several pages describing >raindrops is rather horrifying. I don't suppose they could drip much >differently than usual, and focusing on trivial beauties doesn't make them >more beautiful. I recently read a provocative article in the Atlantic Monthly called "A Reader's Manifesto." I can't find it at the moment so I can't tell you issue or page, but it's recent. It follows along the lines of this monstrous TA and his literary quirks. The author takes down some of the greats like Annie Proulux (is that how you spell it?) and whoever it was that wrote Snow Falling on Cedars. I was laughing along with the author as he disemboweled these big names until he blasphemed Cormac McCarthy, then I had to actually think. Anyway, if you want a good read that really takes modern literary styles to task, seek this article out. Believe it or not, he actually favors good plots. What a relief. Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike South Subject: RE: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 11 Dec 2001 13:47:53 -0700 Jerry Tyner wrote: > The point is sometimes you have to slog through the first part of a book > to understand the authors style and if it grabs you then you understand > how to read his or her other works as well. I often take a while to get into the rhythm of the author's language, particularly if the book was written a hundred years ago or more. I find my attention wandering and discover that I'm reading the same paragraph over and over, even if I find the language beautiful. A trick I've found that helps immensely is to alter the "voice" in my head. Usually, I'll pick an actor I'm familiar with (one I usually associate in some way with the story at hand), and I will intentionally hear his voice "reading" the words to me. Kelsey Grammer helped me get started on _Great Expectations_, Liam Neeson read much of _Les Miserables_ to me, and Patrick Stewart got me through the first few chapters of _Moby Dick_. Within a few chapters I realize I've dropped the voice and I am just simply reading. But the voice trick helps me get into a book without feeling like I have to slog my way through. --Mike South -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: lajackson@juno.com Subject: [AML] Re: Harry Potter Books Date: 11 Dec 2001 14:17:10 -0600 D. Michael Martindale: Sometimes you have to look beyond the words to the cultural influence to find the greatness in a work of literature. _______________ On the other hand, sometimes the words themselves provide all the fun. My younger children, for example, were quite amused when I pointed out that Diagon Alley was appropriately named because none of the buildings were straight. My older children were amused that they had missed it and someone as "anciently challenged" as I had pointed it out to them. Larry (diagonally speaking) Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Mormon Refs in _Ocean's 11_ Date: 11 Dec 2001 15:46:06 -0700 I just got back from seeing _Ocean's 11_ but somehow I missed the voiceover introducing the two Mormon boys. What did it say? (Something about six months something?) The movie didn't do any Mormon jokes but squeezed in an ironic Provo jab. The movie was OK, one of those with criminals using gadgets and technology. The performers were fun to watch. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Date: 11 Dec 2001 16:29:25 -0700 There's some strengths to Rowling's work that haven't been addressed yet, as far as I've seen. For one, her work is surprising complex. Some of it might not be obvious, but if you reread the series, you can tell clearly that from the first word, she knows exactly where she is going and what led up to the beginning. You can read the books more than once and still catch new things you missed the first time. More than once I've had to stop as I've read part of an earlier book and think, "Wow, she knew about _that_ this early? I didn't notice that before." She had the entire arc of the story planned out, and it's rather complex. This isn't any simple fairy tale. She also has great skill in selecting a few wonderful details to convey a mood or image (Snape's classroom, among many other places, come to mind). I first read Harry Potter about a year and a half ago, mostly so I could know what everyone was talking about. I first _heard_ of Harry from my doctor--at every prenatal visit, he would go on about this great series he was reading to his kids (I could go on about his reluctant readers, but you've heard similar stories). I began the journey hugely skeptical, waiting for Rowling to prove herself to me that she wasn't another RL Stine. And now, yes, I am hooked. After I read the first book, I read it to my husband (who grudgingly agreed to listen in the car on the way to Idaho). We finished the book about 20 minutes from home, and he insisted we buy the second one right away. We read the entire series together when the kids were asleep. He has since read all four books by himself twice (that ended up being three times he read the series in a year)--and my husband is NOT a reader. If nothing else, I got several weeks of no evening TV, and instead one-on-one time with my husband as we read and talked about the books. It was like a daily date. Sometimes the discussion turned gospel-oriented or even scriptural (how's that for my Mormon-lit tie-in?) It was wonderful. I am looking forward to the next book so we can read it together, too. Annette Lyon -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: RE: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 11 Dec 2001 16:45:57 -0700 [MOD: I need to remind everyone that we're drifting away from a literary connection here toward more purely doctrinal discussions. I'd like to ask anyone posting further on this thread to pick up on some of the various literary connections people have raised from time to time in connection with this topic...] I'm glad to finally know that the source for that so-called doctrine is a talk and isn't founded in anything. I was taught the same thing in 9th grade seminary, and it rubbed me the wrong way, especially since my mother was born into a Lutheran home in a country far from the US, so according to my teacher she hadn't been as valiant in the premortal life--yet she is one of the most faithful, spritually in-tune, and devout people you'll ever find. I couldn't believe my teacher, but as a naive 14-year-old, I couldn't exactly disbelieve him either. This takes me back to the recent discussion on artist's responsibility. Granted, my teacher and Dyers aren't exactly artists in this sense, but their work has done harm, whether or not they are responsible for it. Annette Lyon -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: [AML] Alternative Press Date: 11 Dec 2001 14:51:57 -0700 This a note to announce that J. Scott Bronson and humble I have taken = the first step toward forming the press everyone on this list has been = yearning for. Scott has allowed me to hand-bind a projected 10 copies = of his manuscript, "The Whipping Boy." I chose to do this one first, = because it is an extremely worthy,worthy manuscript. We don't as of yet have plans to distribute or market these books. = Perhaps, in the future, we will find a niche where we can distribute and = sell, but as for now the only distribution we have planned is for me to = take the ten copies and drive to his house. This kind of an experiment = we're doing. I would appreciate any comments you might have. Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Kumiko" Subject: [AML] Re: Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 19:03:10 -0600 I believe you should check out the book _Darwin's Radio_ (available at the library), written by Greg Bear and published in 2001. This subject is discussed in some detail. Sample, form page 161: '...they tell me I am fabricating evidence to support my lies. They say they have the government and the law on their side. Our old nemesis, NAGPRA.' That stood for the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act. Mitch was very familiar with... this legislation. ...'What evidence did you fabricate?' Mitch asked lightly. 'Don't joke.' But Ripper's expression loosened... 'We took collagen from the bones and sent it to Portland. They did a DNA analysis. Our bones are from a different population, not at all related to modern Indians, only loosely related to the Spirit Cave mummy. Caucasoid, if we can use that term. But hardly Nordic. More Ainu, I believe.' 'That's historic, Eileen,' Mitch said. 'That's excellent. Congratulations.' - Preston Hunter www.adherents.com ---------- -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sammie Justesen" Subject: [AML] Re: Skeleton Story Date: 11 Dec 2001 18:59:26 -0700 Tony, The skeleton was called "Kennewick Man." If you do a search on Ref Desk (www.refdesk.com) you'll find many items, including an e-mail service providing updates about the issue. There's also a book on Amazon.com -- at the second URL below. http://www.saa.org/publications/saabulletin/14-5/SAA5.html http://www.data4all.com/list/500/512000/0465092241 This is an interesting story. Sammie Justesen sammiejustesen@msn.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Fw: MN Bigfoot and Mormons?: Shane Lester Press Release 3Dec01 A2 Date: 12 Dec 2001 00:48:49 -0700 On Sun, 09 Dec 2001 07:15:13 -0700 "D. Michael Martindale" writes: > > Clan of Cain: The Genesis of Bigfoot is a newly published > > book that offers a different dimension to the Bigfoot mystery. > > > The book asserts the theory that Cain is in reality the legendary > > Sasquatch. > > Unlikely as it is, I hope this turns out to be true. Then maybe > Mormons can get rid of the theory that the mark of Cain is > black skin--it's really a fur-covered body. I guess that makes me a direct descendant. scott -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 01:49:41 -0700 Clark Draney wrote: > I have been lurking on the list for awhile and D. Michael has been > encouraging me to post. I guess the time has come, and in response to a D. > Michael post at that. Then I guess I'd better respond to the response. Clark was my elders quorum instructor, then we served together in the elders quorum presidency until he foolishly moved from Utah to Idaho. He is an intelligent, well educated fellow, who comes across as rather conservative, but somewhere in there has a streak of the devil in him that he lets see the light of day every so often. So he ought to fit in here well. > I wonder, however, if there isn't something to be said for "working > at it" to get into a piece of writing. I was thinking of Dickens's _Bleak > House_ for example. That begins with a long and pretty dry segment about > the legal system in Great Britain at the time. When I first read that for a > class I really had to slog through it to understand what Dickens was talking > about and why it was there. But having done so, _Bleak House_ then became a > rich and wonderful experience dealing with complex characters and situations > whose complexity arose partly out of what I knew about the legal system in > London. >From the reader's point of view, there are no doubt treasures out there that are hard to get into, and a reader may decide he wants to tough out the difficult part to find them. But as an author, I dare not even consider such an approach. I want my readers to slide in effortlessly. I want my readers to be more than irate English students forced to read my stuff. My point of view is also decidedly not from a scholarly or literary mindset. I don't have a lot of interest in words as art, although that's a perfectly viable thing to be interested in. For me, the art is in the story itself, and the words mere vehicles for conveying that story. For me, it's the journey that I care about, and my vehicle only needs to be comfortable and spacious and easy to operate. I don't want my vehicle distracting me from the sightseeing. So for me, difficult beginnings or excessively literary or poetic prose is just a distraction. I want to read the story, not admire or fight through the words. I don't mind if my minivan has an appealing color and a sleek design, nor do I mind a pleasing turn of phrase in a story. As long as either doesn't distract from my journey. It so happens that the storytelling point of view has the upper hand in today's environment, because that philosophy is what has the greatest chance of selling books to today's audience. Therefore I tend to promote strategies that facilitate that approach as if they were gospel--they are, if you want sales. If you don't, then never mind. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 12 Dec 2001 02:51:11 -0700 rwilliams wrote: > Furthermore, the phrase "taken in isolation" seems like an impossibility to > me, as if to suggest that the movie _God's Army_ could somehow be disconnected > from the culture that made it possible, suspended in an interpretive vacuum > and judged objectively. But I can't imagine any circumstances where something > could actually be "taken in isolation." Oh sure you can, if you don't take my phrase too literally. If you imagine _God's Army_ being made five years from now, it would not likely stand out all that much compared to the LDS films that would have been made in the interim. _God's Army_ was great because it was first. The story itself can be divorced from its circumstances and placed--not in a vacuum--but in other more mundane circumstances, to see what we think of it then. Nobody sings inspiring hymns about the construction workers who built the new-and-improved I-15 corridor through Salt Lake county. We sing hymns about the pioneers who barely scratched out a trail at all, even though I-15 is a much more impressive feat of construction, because the pioneers were first and did the hard work of going where no one else had. If someone were to build a pioneer-like trail today, no one would even notice. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 11 Dec 2001 17:38:06 -0700 James presents a commonly-argued point about criticism; however, undue praise (also known as blowing smoke) is just as bad, if not worse, in my opinion. Sometimes it is possible to get a person's hopes too high. Writing is a racket, when you get down to it, but some people tell others that they are good (when they are not) because they don't want to hurt this person's feelings. It is hard to know how to use the right language in situations like these, and it's hard to know when it is appropriate to tell people the hard facts and when it is best to help them along. Maybe this is something that only creative writing teachers have to worry about--perhaps it isn't. I know it sounds draconian, but in certain circumstances it is nicer, kinder, and more loving to criticize someone honestly, showing, of course, an increase of love afterwards. The truly cruel thing might, in fact, be to aid in a person's delusions. And alas, one man's delusions are always another man's dreams, so we must step lightly. But I don't think that it is incumbent upon us to lie. Clearly this could be taken to mean that one must be cruel to be kind, and I don't mean it like that. The other part of that song is cruel to be kind, in the right measures. And these measures are oh, so difficult to weigh out. The LDS tie in is this: LDS writers are going to have to be twice as good as everyone else in order to make it in a national market with LDS themed work. Twice as good. This is not something that we've talked about much here. I think that sometimes we think that we need to be equal with other writers, but that's not true at all. Writing from a Christian perspective is an albatross around a writer's neck that few writers can cut loose. There are exceptions, but they really just support the rule. Because we're going to have to be twice as good means that we're going to have to be twice as hard on each other and twice as encouraging and twice as cruel and twice as kind. I know Orson Scott Card has said otherwise, but he is not trying to get his foot in the door--he's already in the living room, and that is a whole lot different than being out in the cold on the front lawn. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 04:05:31 -0700 Jonathan Langford wrote: > I'm not sure I agree. This notion that a story should be engaging from the > first few pages *sounds* like a safe enough bet as a universal principle of > storytelling, but in practice, I'm not sure this is the case--though it may > be that Michael broadens his statement enough with the phrase "one way or > another" that it may hold true after all. But I'm not convinced even of > that. I deliberately inserted that phrase as an afterthought to try and broaden what I meant. I didn't want to come across as sounding like everything had to start out Indiana-Jones-action-packed. All sorts of things might draw me in to a story. Since there are all sorts of possibilities to grab me with, if an author doesn't grab me with _any_ of them, I don't feel much charity toward that author. > Indeed, I think that for some genres--such as > worldbuilding fantasy (as opposed to swashbuckling fantasy, an entirely > different type)--it's more common for readers to expect that it will take a > *long* time for things to take off, and for them to allow that time. That must be true, otherwise there's no accounting for the popularity of the Thomas Covenant books. That has to be my biggest personal grudge for bad beginnings, made more irritating by the broken promise of chapter one. The book starts out with a day in the life of a leper living in modern society. It was quite fascinating. With chapter two, the hero was inexplicably transported into a fantasy world and healed of his leprosy. The promised fascinating story of a leper trying to live his life evaporated. No, that's too mild a word. It was violently wrested from me. If the author had replaced it with another fascinating story, I might have forgiven him. But for many pages following this breach of contract, literally nothing happens. The hero travels with his newfound companions indefinitely, with no sense of plot advancement. I tried as long as I could stand, then bailed. Twice. > Many > readers find Tolkien slow going, but that hasn't stopped him from being > popular. And Tolkien's first chapter is arguably much worse than, say, > Rowling's, from that point of view Lord of the Ring's first chapter isn't the first chapter. That would be the Hobbit's first chapter. By the time you get to LOTR, you already care enough to want to read on. I tried reading LOTR first and didn't make it. After the Hobbit, I sailed right in. > But I think in such cases it's often the promise of things to > come, rather than anything that has happened so far, that keeps readers > going. A promise of things to come pretty much covers all beginnings, since you can't give everything to the reader all at once. A grabber _is_ a promise of things to come. In fact, I prefer that over an action-packed scene where I don't know what the heck is going on. A book isn't grabbing me if I don't perceive a promise of something interesting coming up. Harry Potter didn't grab me because I didn't read anything in the first chapter and a half that said to me, "Here's why this fantasy will be fresh and interesting and different from anything you've already read." A kid who's never read anything is likely to react much differently to what's there than I. > I don't believe most readers keep a > running cost-benefit tally, and stop reading the minute the labor of > reading exceeds the enjoyment they have so far received. Rather, I think > they view the reading as a long-term investment, with a payoff that may not > occur fully until after the book is finished. I believe they do keep the running cost-benefit analysis going, just subconsciously. Especially in the first few pages or chapters. At some point the mind decides the benefits are not accruing fast enough, and there's no indication they will. This manifests itself consciously in the reaction: "I'm bored!" and throwing the book across the room. If you are willing to wait until a book is finished before getting a payoff, you are a much more patient soul than I. Once upon a time that may have been a viable approach. But today there are so many things I want to read that I'll never have time to get to in my lifetime, that I can't see the point in bothering with something that doesn't start delivering soon. Why "slog" when there are a million books out there that will draw me in effortlessly? I make an exception to that rule only if I have strong testimonials convincing me it will be worth it--and even then I don't always make it. > Which can I suppose be viewed as a > failure to engage the reader, but if so, it's of a very different type than > simply not "grabbing" the reader in the first few pages. Engaging _is_ grabbing. Jerry Tyner wrote: > The point is sometimes you have to slog through the first part of a book > to understand the authors style and if it grabs you then you understand > how to read his or her other works as well. No, I don't have to slog through it. I can throw the book across the room and pick up something else. In previous generations, things were different. There was literally less to read. They lived life at an easier pace. They weren't weaned on the energy of television and films. They allowed their authors time to get things going. There are still some readers willing to do that today, but for the most part, not so. The phrase "MTV generation" is generally used derogatorily, but I don't think we need to condescendingly resort to short attention spans to account for the audience of today. Life is simply more fast-paced now, and our art needs to reflect that. It's just the way today's audience is. Tastes change. You can write to the slower-paced generations of the past if you want, like your favorite classical authors did, but grave dwellers don't buy many books. Terry L Jeffress wrote: > I think authors write dull beginnings at their own > risk, and in doing so, equates the the author-reader relationship with > master-slave rather than person-person. Well put. I think it's the height of arrogance for an author to assume his writing is so valuable that others should be willing to work to get into it. I consider myself to be asking the reader for a favor to pick up my book. If charities approached potential donors like the DMV treats their clientelle, they wouldn't survive long. If I am asking for a favor, I want to make it as easy as possible for the donor to deliver. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Anna Wight Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 12:00:32 -0600 I had no trouble getting through the first part of Harry Potter. It enchanted me right away. So D. Michael wasn't enchanted. That doesn't mean that the author didn't do it right. Many people are enthralled by Rowlings style from the beginning. If not, then children all over the world wouldn't be reading her. You can't base an authors ability to grab the reader on a few people's responses. I think Rowling did a fine job introducing us to Harry's world. So who's right? Me or Michael? It's simply a matter of a difference of opinion. Seems to me that Rowling is doing something right. Anna Wight -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] Pleasant Grove High Christmas Choir Concert Date: 12 Dec 2001 14:08:45 -0800 [Here's a review that may or may not have appeared in this morning's PG Review--I haven't got my copy yet. There's another performance scheduled for Thursday night. I was amazed at the performance of Rutter's "Magnificat." When we sing Rutter in ward choir, some of the trained musicians always say, "I had forgotten how difficult Rutter is." Mormon lit. connection to this concert? Playwright and actress Erica Glenn is one of the accompanists.] Pl. Grove High choirs perform Christmas concert The Pleasant Grove High School choirs showed their range, versatility and skill to an almost full house in their Christmas concert Monday night, and will perform again Thursday Dec. 13 at 7 p.m. Choir members sold tickets door to door earlier this month, but there are some available at the door. Prices are $10 for a family or $4 Adult, $3 Student, $2 child. Age 2 and under are free. The Men's Choir, Women's Choir, Chamber Choir and Concert Choir alternated with numbers ranging from traditional carols like Silent Night to a Hannukah song, "Eight Nights, Eight Lights," to a medley drawn from about 10 modern tunes. Other songs included the Latin hymn "Dona Nobis Pacem," a Benedictine plainsong, a spiritual, "Born, Born in Bethlehem," and "Christmas Calypso," with Hilary Butler conducting the Women's Choir, Valerie Porter on the piano, Lindsey Robinson on the bongos, Stephanie Allred on steel drums and Tiffany Walgren on claves. Rather than having a printed program, the name and author of each number, the choir involved and the director, were projected onto the walls. This was useful when the A Capella Choir, under Jim Wilcock's direction, sang John Rutter's "Magnificat." Except for the second section, a 16th century English allegorical poem about a rose, the work is in Latin, and the text and translations were projected on the walls. Rutter is a popular choral composer, but demanding, and it is a tribute to the choir and to accompanist Brock Susov that they performed this beautiful piece (nearly a half hour long) so well. This was followed by "A Musicological Tour Through the Twelve Days of Christmas," which begins with a partridge in a Roman pear tree and ends with twelve drummers drumming to John Phillip Sousa's "Stars and Stripes Forever." For the last number, "The Hallelujah Chorus," Wilcock invited all past members of the A Capella choir on stage, and of course, the audience stood. There is an Angel Tree in the lobby for people wanting to be Christmas angels for others. Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] YOUNG & GRAY, _Standing on the Promises_ Date: 12 Dec 2001 13:58:32 -0800 On Wed, 05 Dec 2001 09:38:02 -0700 margaret young writes, about missionaries dealing with former restrictions on the priesthood: > Perhaps the most troubling thing I've heard lately--and this from > three returned missionaries who served in different missions--is > that some false doctrine is circulating again (a discourse by Alvin > Dyer which talks about valiency in the pre-existence). These > missionaries received it ON their missions. Can we call that > discourse Mormon literature and hence tie it in with the list's > objectives? Yes. There are a lot of ways that sermons affect cultures. I love Louis Owens' novel, _The Sharpest Sight_, in which, among many other things, the Choctaw afterlife meets the Catholic afterlife. The person who plays the part of the murderer (he's not the murderer but he has the verbal showdown with the hero at the end, signalling to readers aware of the conventions of murder mysteries that he's functioning in the role of murderer--something Anne Perry also does in _Bethlehem Road_) has read Jonathan Edwards (the title comes from "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God") and discovered in him his true potential for evil, and has chosen to embrace that potential. > Here's my question: How on earth can we get that talk out of > circulation? Is it possible? Probably not, as Stephen Carter said on 12/8, "Censorship, especially from the likes of us literary types, is hard to justify," and the talk has a general authority's name on it. > Or how can we train missionaries to recognize > that its teachings are contrary to the scriptures? Well, we can do what my new mission president did right after the August 1978 Church Education System conference and give a copy of Elder McConkie's instructions to church educators, "All are Alike unto God," to every missionary, emphasizing the passage about disregarding everything spoken by the likes of Brigham Young, Joseph Fielding Smith, Bruce R McConkie and others before June 8, 1978. "We spoke according to our limited light and knowledge." > Do we need a special class at the MTC for this? I don't know whether that's an issue you'd want to raise at the MTC or not. Just try defining the pronoun, _that_ in the last sentence. Does it refer to former limitations on the priesthood, or to how to understand the incorrect pronouncements of authority figures or to how those two issues are combined? Most of the MTC instructors are fairly recently returned missionaries, college students who probably haven't yet developed the philosophical maturity to explore such issues in the classroom. I suppose branch presidents could deal with it in sacrament meetings, but I suspect the best way to help people understand that sometimes authorities preach false doctrine is simply to present the idea (in a source like Elder McConkie's talk) without comment, as Jesus presented many of his parables without comment (except to the apostles, who were mystified by the stories), and hope that when the moment comes that they need that idea it's enough in their mind that the Holy Ghost can bring it to their attention. My father says that one religion professor distributed the talk by stealth. He would hang a copy of it outside his office, and, since office doors are always a bit irreverent, students would read it and make off with it. And he'd hang out another copy. Harlow Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Alternative Press Date: 12 Dec 2001 14:41:42 -0700 <<>> Well, at the least you ought to say how much we could buy a copy for, how much to add for shipping, and where to send our order. You could also buy a $50 full-page ad in Irreantum. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "jana" Subject: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 12 Dec 2001 11:07:47 -0800 A friend of mine from ANWA (American Night Writers), asked me to forward this query to AML-List: ----------------- Yesterday, I recieved the strangest letter in the mail. It came from a person named Brent Hendrickson who purports to be an employee of Horizon Publishers. The letter was hand written on six pages of lined stationery. The gist of the story is that he felt "inspired" to pull my manuscript (Forever Yours, which many members of this group helped me edit about a year ago) out of the slush pile and take it home to read. He never quite states his actual job description, but he seems to imply that reading unsolicited manuscripts is not part of it. He says that although Horizon rejected it, he was touched by the story and thought it had some promise. (His letter arrived about a week after a standard rejection from Horizon.) He went into great detail about himself personally (including various references to his wife, children, parents and the fact that his family had been in the church for 7 generations). He said he wanted to hear from me and gave his (presumably) home address. He told me I should rewrite my manuscript by hand (he didn't explain why) and he told me I should have a friend of his named Larry Brady (who apparently has a PhD from BYU, according to the letter) edit it for a fee. This morning I did a Google search on Larry Brady and the only thing I found that could have been him was a book called "How to raise children without climbing the walls" by Larry Brady and published by Deseret. Same guy? I don't know. Is this weird or what? I don't know what to think. Could it be some sort of scam? Is it possible that this person writes letters of this sort to writers of rejected manuscripts to drum up business for his editor friend? He made it clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. I had pretty much given up the idea of publishing my manuscript. One of the publishers that I wrote to forwarded my manuscript to a company who would supposedly rewrite it into a novel for a fee, but the sample pages that they sent to me were terrible. So, I never contacted them. I'm hesitant to pay money for editing services. If my book was good enough, wouldn't the publisher asign one of their own editors to work with me? (I've just finished reading The Novel by Mitchner. Has it given me the wrong idea?) All the "name dropping" about his personal life and the church makes me leary. I feel like I'm being buttered up somehow. Isn't that the way scam artists work? ---------------- Any info on Larry Brady or Brent Hendrickson would be appreciated. Thanks, Jana Remy Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 12 Dec 2001 14:46:44 -0700 On Tue, Dec 11, 2001 at 11:46:20AM -0900, Stephen Carter wrote: > I recently read a provocative article in the Atlantic Monthly called "A > Reader's Manifesto." Myers, B. B., "A Reader's Manifesto," _Atlantic Monthly,_ July/August 2001 (288: 1): 104-22. Available online at: http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2001/07/myers.htm P.S. Ok people, I really do have fun find finding these little tidbits, but in the last few cases I spent no more than 15 seconds finding the answer. How about spending an extra minute or two so we can preserve our precious posts for those with more valuable content. -- Terry L Jeffress | If you are out to describe the truth, leave South Jordan, UT | elegance to the tailor. -- Albert Einstein -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Dixon" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Refs in _Ocean's 11_ Date: 12 Dec 2001 16:50:35 -0500 Chris Bigelow wrote: >I just got back from seeing _Ocean's 11_ but somehow I missed the voiceover >introducing the two Mormon boys. What did it say? (Something about six >months something?) It was a very fleeting reference -- George Clooney and Brad Pitt's characters are talking about who they've gotten for the heist and Clooney mentions the "two Mormon brothers from Utah," or something to that effect, right as the scene flashes to a Utah racetrack (where the brothers are racing a giant truck against a remote-controlled truck). I think there was car noise partially obscuring the word "Mormon," so the reference didn't come across very well. It would have been interesting to have some character background with these guys -- i.e., how do they participate in a heist like this while considering themselves Mormon? Are there fewer moral compunctions about theft when you're targeting a gambling establishment? Or were they just jackmormons? Eric -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] Alternative Press Date: 12 Dec 2001 15:41:22 -0700 I originally wrote: > << the first step toward forming the press everyone on this list has been = > yearning for. Scott has allowed me to hand-bind a projected 10 copies = > of his manuscript, "The Whipping Boy." I chose to do this one first, = > because it is an extremely worthy,worthy manuscript.>>> Chris Bigalow wrote: > Well, at the least you ought to say how much we could buy a copy for, how much to add for shipping, and where to send our order. > > You could also buy a $50 full-page ad in Irreantum. > To which I respond: Just be cool. I'll burn that bridge when I get to it. Right now I'm trying to see if it can be done. That's what I'm thinking about right now. I really haven't gotten permission from Scott to sell his work, so I'll have to do some more thinking sometime--I hate it when that happens. Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 15:38:40 -0800 On Mon, 10 Dec 2001 16:42:37 Jerry Tyner writes: > One disclaimer. Not every author will appeal to all people. That > goes for any book be it fiction, doctrinal, or other. Think of the > Scriptures - who hasn't had to slog through the Isaiah portion of > the Book of Mormon in 2 Nephi. Anyone who has read the entire > Old Testament (I did one time while on my mission - hardest > goal to finish I ever made) knows what it is to slog through > certain parts. I had a seminary teacher who said that after reading every word in the Old Testament he promised the Lord he would never do that again. For me the slog through book was Numbers, with its endless lists of names. I hope to read the whole OT, Apocrypha included, next year. (If I read 7 1/2 pages a day I can read the whole Standard Works.) I picked up William Tyndale's translation of The Pentateuch 20 years ago at a 25 cents a pound sale at the BYU Bookstore (it cost 75 cents) and plan to start with that, then read KJV for some books and other translations for others. (I should have Apostelgeschichte finished in my Luthertext of Das Neue Testament by the end of the month. It's a good way to study scriptures, reading them in a language that's only partly familiar. I know the Gospels well enough that I could recognize what I was reading. I haven't read Acts since 9th grade so it's not as familiar. I haven't read the Letters since 9th grade either, so this could be a real challenge.) Tyndale's translation was a main source for King James' translators, so it will be interesting to see what he says. I noticed one thing when I first bought the book, and commented on it in priesthood meeting. The word "weakedness" is his spelling for "wickedness." Assuming that his spelling represents the word's etymology, wickedness is a weakened condition. I suspect I may like the lists of names better this time through--simply because I may know more about language. Still, reading lists of names is not going to be easy because there's no narrative thread to care about, but I'm not sure it's a bad thing to slog through something. Every word in the scriptures (and elsewhere) can teach us something. Harlow S. Clark -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 12 Dec 2001 16:49:37 -0600 >I'm hesitant to pay money for editing services. If my book was good enough, >wouldn't the publisher asign one of their own editors to work with me? YES. They would accept your manuscript, offer you a contract to negotiate and sign, and assign you an editor. All the "name dropping" about his personal life and the church makes me >leary. I feel like I'm being buttered up somehow. Isn't that the way scam >artists work? >---------------- >Any info on Larry Brady or Brent Hendrickson would be appreciated. I have no knowledge of either of these people, but several things about this do *scream* "scam." First and foremost, they are asking an author to PAY money for editing services. This is always the mark of a company/individual out to make a buck. They are also NOT a literary agency, who are the ONLY people you should ever pay money to for helping you with your writing career--and the way agents work is that they don't get paid until you do. Agents take a % of your royalties after they are earned. They do not ask for money up front (if they are a reputable company.) Agents also never come to you begging to take on your writing if you are unknown and unpublished. The other huge clues here are: handwriting lined stationery name-dropping personal family details None of this is professional. Nor is it standard business practice. Professionals do not bully you into thinking they are a church big-shot or write handwritten notes telling you about their family life. Professional editors do not solicit services individually; they advertise in the paper. I would thank them for reading the MS, thanks for saying the work "inspired" him (if I even went that far) and inform them I was not interested, thank you very much. >Is it possible that this person writes letters of this sort to writers of >rejected manuscripts to drum up business for his editor friend? He made it >clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. Then it is clear to me that what this author *should* do is photocopy the entire letter and send it to the President of Horizon with a note of explanation, so he may see for himself what his employees are doing behind his back. It sounds to me that this individual is hoping to prey on a novice author's lack of experience in the business end of publishing, by using the "buttering-up" techniques listed above (which BTW, additionally sickens me that they use Church references to do it). Only someone brand-new to the business part of submitting, editing, and publishing could possibly be sucked in by such a technique. Congratulations that this author is naturally suspicious. The bottom line is, if you believe in your writing, NEVER pay someone else to edit it. Shop the MS around until it finds a home that will pay YOU. If it is good, it WILL get published. Linda Adams Author, _Prodigal Journey_ ================ Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: [AML] ADAMS, _Prodigal Journey_ in MCPLibrary Date: 12 Dec 2001 16:57:32 -0600 Hi, I hate to toot my horn but I will because this is exciting. To me. This summer I called our local library system to see if they would carry my book. They said they would buy and evaluate a copy and let me know. They did decide to keep it, and it is now cataloged and available for checkout. What surprised me was that they ordered FIFTEEN copies, one for each library unit in the Kansas City Metropolitan Area. Wow! Somebody must have liked it! And these are by and large not LDS people, either. It's in the Mid-Continent Public Library, for any of you out my way who are interested. I can't tell you how cool it is to type my name in on a library search engine and come up as an Author. That is way cooler even than walking into a bookstore and finding my book on display. I feel official. :-D Linda ============ Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: RE: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 16:07:56 -0700 I think that the advice to make a catchy beginning is well-intended, but it backfires into cute, self-aware garbage sometimes. I tossed out so many stories at the Cimarron Review because they were simply trying too hard. Hemingway's advice was best: begin with a simple declarative sentence and go from there. Faulkner's "The Bear" and "Old Man" are about the only exceptions to this maxim that seem to work for me. The opening of Michael Ondaatje's THE ENGLISH PATIENT and IN THE SKIN OF A LION. Are amazing openings. Simply stunning. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: [AML] MOORE & CAMPBELL, _From Hell_ (Was: Mormonism as Distinctive) Date: 12 Dec 2001 18:30:23 -0800 (PST) An older discussion we had on the list talked about the appeal of the "deeper" doctrines in LDS literature: how the more "Gnostic" teachings can be especially effective in storytelling. I've just finished reading "From Hell", the graphic novel by Alan Moore and Eddie Campbell. It's ostensibly about the "Jack the Ripper" murders, but to say it's just about murder is like saying "Moby Dick" is just about whale-hunting. Moore has created a genuine epic that includes speculations on religion and mythology, as well as gut-churning horror. It's based on an amazing amount of research, with extensive annotations at the back of the book. (The recent movie version starring Johnny Depp and Heather Graham is a shamefully dumbed-down abridgement. It would take a TV miniseries to really do justice to the graphic novel, but the filmmakers didn't even try.) Moore's solution to the killings involves a convoluted conspiracy featuring Freemasons and Queen Victoria. Rantings in 19th-century literature about Masonic plots are similar to the paranoia of similar anti-Mormon literature., so you can take this aspect of the story with a grain of salt (It resembles Oliver Stone's "JFK".) But on the whole, "From Hell" is a mind-blowing exploration of the "fourth dimesnsion"--the inner architecture of history. Check it out. ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: [AML] LANSBURY and THE MORMON TABERNACLE CHOIR, _The Joy of Christmas_ Date: 12 Dec 2001 18:53:54 -0800 (PST) Last weekend our family attended the program in the Conference Center at Temple Square in Salt Lake, "The Joy of Christmas", featuring Angela Lansbury and the Mormon Tabernacle Choir. Here are a few quick observations. (1) The human scale is easily lost in the Conference Center. It's such a huge place that only the biggest, most spectacular events should be staged there. This show qualified because of the large orchestra and the choir, but if it weren't for the huge TV screens on the walls most of the visual impact would be lost. Providentially, the spirit picks up the slack. (2) The Mo Tab has never sounded crisper and more forceful than under Mack Wilberg's arrangements and directions. They are genuinely thrilling. (3) The crowd greeted Angela Lansbury like a beloved old aunt or friend. She sang some popular tunes, like "Beauty and the Beast." One song she sang gave me a little frisson. It was Stephen Sondheim's gorgeous "Not While I'm Around", from "Sweeney Todd." She dedicated it to children who needed to be reassured for their safety after the 9/11 attacks. That is the literal meaning of the lyrics "No one's going to harm you/not while I'm around." Those who are familiar with "Sweeney Todd" know, however, that it's a blackly comical musical filled with mayhem and death. The characters involved with the song come to terrible ends, so "Not While I'm Around" becomes chillingly ironic, in context. Plus it was entertaining to hear the choir crooning in the background the line, "Demons are prowling everywhere." The program is being telecast all this week on KBYU-TV, if you want to catch it. It's a nice annual tradition and I hope they keep it up. ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Covell, Jason" Subject: RE: [AML] Harry Potter Books Date: 13 Dec 2001 15:17:52 +1100 I've been following the discussion about the Harry Potter series in general, and especially people's reactions to the opening of the first book. I remember being told by someone more cinema-literate than I am that there is a kind of dictum about the beginning of movies - you can only afford to bore (or confuse) your audience for the first 10 minutes, because that's how long they'll stay before they start walking out. Plenty of movies work along these lines; before even the opening credits roll you're plunged into the middle of a scene where you haven't a clue who everyone is, who the good guys & bad guys are, what on earth is going on etc. Eventually things become clearer, but the point is that the movie feeds off the dramatic tension of _not_ knowing, and quite often there are details shown or hinted at that only become resolved at the movie's denouement. [The interesting thing to me is that Joanne Rowling is a very cinematic writer anyway. Lots of action, dialogue is very much a device to advance the plot rather than dwell on character, little descriptive or visual narrative beyond what establishes character quickly or, again, advance the plot. A lot of her scenes come across as big set pieces that seem to be framed in her imagination from a quasi-cinematic perspective. It was hardly surprising then that Hollywood found the subject matter irresistible.] I suppose it must be asked then, can you actually do this in a novel the way you can in a movie? It would be easy to argue no, that readers are much fussier about what they are willing to commit themselves to: one or two pages of flat, uninvolving prose or impenetrable ravings would be quite enough to make most people close up a book forever. It's different if you've forked out your money and settled yourself in a comfy seat in a big dark theatre. You can frame that question in a number of ways, and I don't intend to offer much of an answer. The first time I opened up Harry Potter and started reading, I admit that I did find the opening - well, somewhat flat. I read the emotional reactions of Dumbledore, McGonagall and Hagrid to the deaths of Harry's parents, as well as the rejoicing of the wizarding community to the downfall of Voldemort, and it just didn't connect with me at first. (That impression, while still understandable to me, no longer seems tenable: I now think the cautious opening is vitally necessary, both in tone and content.) And yet, as Annette Lyon has pointed out, the backstory which is established right at the start, and grows and enlarges throughout all the books published so far, is magnificent in the way it foreshadows (by hints or broad brushstrokes) everything that unfolds in the entire series. It is amazing how Rowling, rather than running the backstory elements dry (many of which seem to be straightforward), manages to thicken the brew to such an extent that by the end of the fourth book I feel I know less fundamentally about what happened than when I first began! [Mormon sidetrack: I sometimes like to imagine Harry as a kid who enters Young Men and receives the Aaronic Priesthood (learns of his wizarding powers). As he goes along from year to year he discovers that the gospel (the salvation wrought by his parents' sacrifice) is both consistent with the simple version he learned at first in Primary, but also more subtle, complex and world-shaking than he imagined - enough so to keep High Priest Groups (the mature adult world of wizarding) expounding and debating ad infinitum.] Consistent with all this is the deepening maturity of the books themselves. I can only say to those who have read some or all of the first book and remain unimpressed, keep reading. While I can look back now and admire the first book for many things - the joy of exposition and first discovery, the meetings of friends and mentors - it really pales beside the later books, especially the third and fourth (the third is actually my favourite by a slim margin, but the ending of the fourth is an breathtaking whizzbanger). This is why even all the queues and crowds seen so far are nothing in comparison to what will come with the publication of the fifth book! The manipulation of dramatic tension is, in my opinion, one of Joanne Rowling's greatest gifts. Along with the remarkable control of interweaving plot elements (many of which manage to span all four books), this is the engine that keeps the series ticking. What noone seemed to make clear to me before I read the books is that the books are essentially thrillers; however, the mysteries and dangers faced by Harry and his friends (and mentors) are not artificial devices that intrude into their worlds (as with many serial adventures, such as whodunnits or spy novels), but are essential to their personal development and maturation, having been set in motion with all the other elements of the backstory. And add to that, Rowling's power of imagination... I can't help turning in my mind to the spectacle of a juggler with several balls in the air, performing various fantastic routines; and then watching more and more balls added, without any dropping, and the new balls mingling with the old as the patterns become increasingly complex. Jason Covell ************************************************************************** This message is intended for the named addressee(s) only. It may be confidential. If you receive this message in error please notify us immediately by return mail and delete the message (and any attachments). Neither the NSW Department of Community Services nor the NSW Department of Ageing, Disability & Home Care are responsible for any changes to this message, or the consequences of any changes to this message. ************************************************************************** -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Clark Draney" Subject: RE: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 21:39:07 -0700 Michael wrote: >For me, the art is in the story itself, and the words mere vehicles >for conveying that story. For me, it's the journey that I care about, >and my vehicle only needs to be comfortable and spacious and easy >to operate. I don't want my vehicle distracting me from the sightseeing. That's just the thing, isn't it? words as a vehicle AREN'T easy to operate. On the contrary, they are notorious for bad handling, slow acceleration, sudden stalls, and the airbag sometimes goes off in your face. >So for me, difficult beginnings or excessively literary or poetic prose >is just a distraction. I want to read the story, not admire or fight >through the words. While I agree that an author (especially one not yet published) must consider whether the editor and eventually the reader will "get it" quickly and easily, I don't agree that difficult (lets say "demanding" instead) writing is merely a distraction. If the *destination* is all that counts, then almost any vehicel will get you there. If the *journey* does count, then the vehicle must suit the terrain. And amazingly, this particular vehicle--language--sometimes takes off on its own, carrying us into vistas and visions we hardly dared hope for. >It so happens that the storytelling point of view has the upper hand in >oday's environment, because that philosophy is what has the greatest >chance of selling books to today's audience. Therefore I tend to promote >strategies that facilitate that approach as if they were gospel--they >are, if you want sales. If you don't, then never mind. As a bottom line, this works fine. I can't, however, dismiss the complex, intricate, amazing beauty of some writing because I didn't slip in to it effortlessly. Clark --------- Read, read, read. Read everything-- trash, classics, good and bad, and see how they do it. Just like a carpenter who works as an apprentice and studies the master. Read! You'll absorb it. Then write. If it is good, you'll find out. If it's not, throw it out the window. -William Faulkner -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: lajackson@juno.com Subject: [AML] Re: Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 22:56:47 -0600 D. Michael Martindale: Harry Potter didn't grab me because I didn't read anything in the first chapter and a half that said to me, "Here's why this fantasy will be fresh and interesting and different from anything you've already read." A kid who's never read anything is likely to react much differently to what's there than I. _______________ Being grossly occupied with more important things to do (i.e., lazy), I threatened to wait until Harry Potter showed up at the dollar theatre (misnomer -- it's $1.50) to go see it. But, when my precious children were willing to fork over the big bucks on opening night (ok, $4.50 on Saturday afternoon, day two), I decided to go along. After all, as a caring father I had kept myself informed on the nefarious effects this story would have on a God-fearing, Christian home, and had decided to judge for myself. So I saw it. Twice. (One of the children couldn't make it that Saturday, and someone had to go with him to see it, and so ... Then, I noticed on this Very List a haunting and absolute boredom associated with the beginning of the book. Since the film began in a most interesting way, I leaped to the conclusion that the first chapter had simply been left out of the movie. Curious now, I decided it would be worth the investment to read the actual first chapter of the book and see for myself if these things were true. Right on page 1, the Dursley's had a secret, and their greatest fear was that somebody would discover it. On page 2, Mr. Dursley notices a cat reading a map. Page 3 is filled with strangely dressed people ... people in cloaks, whispering. By page 9, some mysterious fellow in a colorful robe has clicked this little do hickey and the nearest street lamp went out with a little pop. Twelve times, in fact. A huge motorcycle fell out of the air and landed on the road in front of them on page 14. These are things that piqued my interest. I was not bored at all. I was not even put out by the Out-Putter because I noticed it worked differently and much more effectively in reverse. He clicked it once, and twelve balls of light sped back to their street lamps. To me, this was fascinating, if childlike, stuff. And there were owls and other unusual sounding things. I wasn't able to stop after the first chapter. As an adult, I will admit to being terribly disappointed that a scene on page 40 was not included in the film. It was the mailbox closing scene, Uncle Vernon, trying to knock in a nail with the piece of fruitcake Aunt Petunia had just brought home. (I thought it very funny in passing, because I had recently heard that fruitcake could not be mailed this season, since it is considered lethal.) But I believe the key to the success of the book was the self-fulfilling prophecy on page 13 where, after the cat turned into Professor McGonagall, she said, "He'll be famous -- a legend -- ... there will be books written about Harry -- every child in our world will know his name!" Personally, I found it to be a grabbing first chapter, on many different levels. Even if the staircases did swing around a wee bit. Larry Jackson ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Clark Draney" Subject: RE: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 12 Dec 2001 22:15:34 -0700 Again, responding to my friend, Michael: >Why "slog" when there are a million books out there >that will draw me in effortlessly? I make an exception to that rule only >if I have strong testimonials convincing me it will be worth it--and >even then I don't always make it. Sometimes the payoff comes weeks or months later when you see how a book fits into a historical context, for example, and pushes you into a new appreciation of an author or a text or a story. >No, I don't have to slog through it. I can throw the book across the >room and pick up something else. Won't you miss a lot of good stuff by having that (it "grabbiness") as your only (or at least primary) criteria for deciding whether to finish a text? But then, none of us have time to get to all the the good stuff. Maybe _a_ criteria is a good thing. This one just makes me a little uncomfortable (speaking primarily as a reader). Clark Draney ------------ Everywhere I go, I'm asked if I think the universities stifle writers. My opinion is that they don't stifle enough of them. There's many a best seller that could have been prevented by a good teacher. -Flannery O'Conner _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: [AML] Reading in the Bath (was: Andrew's Poll: What's the Point?) Date: 12 Dec 2001 22:10:43 -0700 At 12:06 AM 12/8/01, you wrote: >By the way, I've solved almost all of my "what to read while waiting in >line" problems with my Palm Pilot - all but that pesky shower issue. When >they release a waterproof PDA with a shower-mounted stand, I'll be >completely set. A woman on one of my writers' lists says she puts hers into a ZipLoc bag when she's reading in the tub. barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 13 Dec 2001 05:13:00 -0700 It's the difference between competition and opposition, as the Yorgason brother might say. There is competative criticism, which intends to break down and destroy, and oppositional criticism, which dwells on both weakness and strength--the greater the opposition the greater the struggle, and the better the work. There is a big difference between the "delightful task...to teach the young idea how to shoot" and the sort of criticism that masquerades as constructive. To criticize properly one read the person as well as the work, and no matter how bad the work there is always something praiseworthy to dwell on...well maybe not always. It is always imperative to find something true and good to praise, otherwise criticism is Shiva instead of Vishnu. As far as an LDS-themed book needing to be twice as good as usual, I beg to differ. In the current climate for such a book to be very successful it would require true greatness. We're talking Sir Walter Scott or Charles Dickens and maybe not even them. Imagine a Jane Austen novel with LDS themes--it ain't going to work commercially. Nobody would believe that people like us even exist any more. So many are so convinced that piety is a sham that they don't believe it even when it's obvious and right out in the open. I think people today have a great longing for goodness, exceeding that which has been in most times before, but they're terrified to believe. When you've had the Big Lie practiced upon you a bazillion times it's a miracle if you're only skeptical instead of cynical. I invented my own religion for my books and though any Mormon will instantly recognize much of it there's plenty of Catholicism and Zoroastrianism and Islam to obscure it as well. For any who are attempting this Herculean task, I can only say that I salute your courage. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: [AML] Sheri Dew (Advice for Authors) Date: 12 Dec 2001 22:57:08 -0800 Did anyone else see the article about Sheri Dew speaking to aspiring authors at a BYU workshop? I saw this on the Church site, LDS.org, having linked it from the BYU website. I'm curious to see how her advice struck my fellow AMLers. So what think ye? What say you on the matter? Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA SISTER SHERI L. DEW ADVISES ASPIRING AUTHORS See http://www.newsnet.byu.edu/story/35578 Link Sheri Dew, executive vice president of Deseret Book and second counselor in the Relief Society general presidency, recently offered guiding principles to aspiring authors seeking publication. Dew advised the group to write if they have something to say, if they can tell a great story, and if they can capture the publisher's attention. "Some just want to publish for the sake of publishing," Dew said. "You need to have a fresh insight. Having the 'aha' factor, or being able to put a subject in a new light, is crucial in becoming published. You have the Holy Ghost. Get the skill, and you will help people bump into the gospel." -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 13 Dec 2001 09:59:14 -0700 > The LDS tie in is this: LDS writers are going to have to be twice as > good as everyone else in order to make it in a national market with LDS > themed work. Twice as good. This is not something that we've talked > about much here. I think that sometimes we think that we need to be > equal with other writers, but that's not true at all. Writing from a > Christian perspective is an albatross around a writer's neck that few > writers can cut loose. You are absolutely correct, Todd. And it's not just "writing from a Christian Perspective." It is "writing from a Mormon perspective" that is TWICE the albatross. And maybe THRICE! (A pretty heavy bird to carry.) And because "good" is so subjective, the "goods" are just flying around like very heavy albatrosses, not landing anywhere, not finding a ship to sit on. If I were to pick someone who might DO IT, though, I'd pick you. If you will notice, ALL of the great Mormon authors who have written for the national market (Levi, Neal LaBute, Brady Udall, etc.) don't really look like Mormons anymore. Marilyn Brown -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Re: A Curious Letter from Horizon? (comp 1) Date: 13 Dec 2001 11:59:33 -0600 [MOD: This is a compilation post.] >From Turk325@aol.com Wed Dec 12 14:54:44 2001 << He made it clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. >> This *really* sounds like a scam. Contact Horizon. Tell them everything you've told us. (At the very least, this guy is stealing from his employer. He took your manuscript.) Kurt Weiland. >From marianne_hales_harding@hotmail.com Wed Dec 12 14:58:40 2001 Sounds like a scam to me--I felt inspired to take your money? Don't talk to Horizon about it? Handwrite the whole thing? Odd. Run, do not walk, to the nearest exit. Marianne Hales Harding >From parisander@freeport.com Wed Dec 12 15:01:26 2001 Jana, [MOD: Not actually her but her friend.] I don't know for sure, but a few months ago another list I am on was talking about an editor named Brady who seemed to be running a scam. I think the first thing you should do is contact Horizon. If this man aquired your manuscript while it was in their care they would be liable. Smells like scam to me. Paris Anderson >From sammiejustesen@msn.com Wed Dec 12 15:57:58 2001 I believe I met Larry Brady at the League of Utah Writers Roundup this past September. He's lives in Ogden and is a free lance editor who's just started as an agent. He was meeting with prospective clients at the writing workshop. I have his business card somewhere. Anyway, I think this is probably the same Larry Brady, but I can't tell you how legitimate he is. As for the handwritten letter -- it sounds highly suspicious to me, for whatever that's worth. On the other hand, I don't believe most publishers will spend their resources editing a manuscript. Sammie Justesen sammiejustesen@msn.com www.thewritersroost.com >From rwilliams@english.usu.edu Wed Dec 12 16:06:09 2001 Jana writes: >I'm hesitant to pay money for editing services. If my book was good enough, >wouldn't the publisher asign one of their own editors to work with me? I'm not in the publishing business, but it sounds like a scam to me. If he really wants to publish it, let him publish it (and pay for it). I wouldn't give the guy a dime. --John Williams. >From eskarstedt@sonici.com Wed Dec 12 16:26:36 2001 Speaking from life experience only (I've not had a novel published nor ever even sent one in) I'd not only be leary of any publishing advice this guy gives you, I'd be nervous that he has your home address. Rewrite your manuscript, by hand, for editing? Come on. What a whacko. Does he really work for Horizon, anyone? Ethan Skarstedt >From cloudhill@yahoo.com Wed Dec 12 21:35:58 2001 Jana, I would contact Horizon directly and ask if they employ a person by that name, Brent H., and I would also tell them that he has contacted you, and explain his letter. This smells so fishy, the Great Salt Lake smells like roses compared to it. Dallas Robbins cloudhill@hotmail.com >From rrhopkins@email.com Thu Dec 13 01:09:57 2001 Jana Remy wrote: > A friend of mine from ANWA (American Night Writers), asked me to forward > this query to AML-List: (snip) > Any info on Larry Brady or Brent Hendrickson would be appreciated. Brent Hendrickson is the pressman at Horizon Publishers. You were quite right to guess that he does not read manuscripts for them. He is a good personal friend of mine and a very nice fellow, though he does not always choose the right things to say and I wouldn't necessarily rely on his judgment about rewrites. Larry Brady runs a legitimate editorial service called Impact Manuscripts (I believe that's the name). I have personally done some editing for Larry's clients. BTW, the book he wrote was published by Horizon, not Deseret, and his Ph.D. is in Family Counseling, but he's a good editor. He has edited for Horizon and for Gibbs Smith. No single editor catches everything, but he is an exceptionally good editor of non-fiction. I don't know how good he is on fiction right now, but I did coach him a bit when he was at Horizon, and he's had a lot of experience. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 13 Dec 2001 13:28:18 -0800 I don't blame Linda for any of the statements made below, but since I know these people personally, I can assure you that, as clumsy as Brent Hendrickson can be, he is NOT a scam artist and neither is Larry Brady. That Larry is trying to make a buck is, obviously, true. But that's what many professional editorial services do. Many writers do, legitimately, pay editors to help them edit their manuscripts. These are not manuscripts that would get a publisher's attention (and therefore their editorial help) at the stage they are in, but which, with a little help, could get a publisher's attention. Let's be careful here before we fly off and do damage to the reputations of perfectly legitimate businessmen. Thanks. Richard R. Hopkins ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 2:49 PM > > >I'm hesitant to pay money for editing services. If my book was good enough, > >wouldn't the publisher asign one of their own editors to work with me? > > YES. > They would accept your manuscript, offer you a contract to negotiate and > sign, and assign you an editor. > > All the "name dropping" about his personal life and the church makes me > >leary. I feel like I'm being buttered up somehow. Isn't that the way scam > >artists work? > >---------------- > >Any info on Larry Brady or Brent Hendrickson would be appreciated. > > I have no knowledge of either of these people, but several things about > this do *scream* "scam." > > First and foremost, they are asking an author to PAY money for editing > services. This is always the mark of a company/individual out to make a buck. > > They are also NOT a literary agency, who are the ONLY people you should > ever pay money to for helping you with your writing career--and the way > agents work is that they don't get paid until you do. Agents take a % of > your royalties after they are earned. They do not ask for money up front > (if they are a reputable company.) Agents also never come to you begging to > take on your writing if you are unknown and unpublished. > > The other huge clues here are: > handwriting > lined stationery > name-dropping > personal family details > > None of this is professional. Nor is it standard business practice. > Professionals do not bully you into thinking they are a church big-shot or > write handwritten notes telling you about their family life. Professional > editors do not solicit services individually; they advertise in the paper. > > I would thank them for reading the MS, thanks for saying the work > "inspired" him (if I even went that far) and inform them I was not > interested, thank you very much. > > >Is it possible that this person writes letters of this sort to writers of > >rejected manuscripts to drum up business for his editor friend? He made it > >clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. > > Then it is clear to me that what this author *should* do is photocopy the > entire letter and send it to the President of Horizon with a note of > explanation, so he may see for himself what his employees are doing behind > his back. > > It sounds to me that this individual is hoping to prey on a novice author's > lack of experience in the business end of publishing, by using the > "buttering-up" techniques listed above (which BTW, additionally sickens me > that they use Church references to do it). Only someone brand-new to the > business part of submitting, editing, and publishing could possibly be > sucked in by such a technique. Congratulations that this author is > naturally suspicious. > > The bottom line is, if you believe in your writing, NEVER pay someone else > to edit it. Shop the MS around until it finds a home that will pay YOU. If > it is good, it WILL get published. > > Linda Adams > Author, _Prodigal Journey_ > > ================ > > > > Linda Adams > adamszoo@sprintmail.com > http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 13 Dec 2001 13:35:18 -0800 Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scot" Subject: [AML] Re: A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 13 Dec 2001 11:41:50 -0700 May I inject a more moderate response to the Horizon employee's letter? I don't think it is necessarily intended as a scam. The con-man does everything in his power to appear professional. This guy either doesn't understand what is professional or he doesn't care. Any scam artist would at least have typed the letter on some official looking letterhead. I have found that within the Mormon culture, talking about your ancestry and your personal commitment to the church is often the innocent attempt to establish one's bon fides. Many members naively think such information makes them more acceptable or presentable to other members. Yes, this is also a technique used by scam artists to con naive Mormons, but the reason scam artists employ this technique is because they know it works. they know it works because they know many Mormons expect it. And many Mormons do expect it. I have been given this type of information many times both in and out of a business setting by people who seem to think it will make me think more highly of them. Their motives have almost always been nothing more than a severe case of personal insecurity. Several on this list have made the assertion that reputable editors or agents never ask for a fee up front. This is not true. Many reputable agencies offer to read and edit a manuscript for a set fee. Many agencies refuse to read unsolicited manuscripts. Some charge a fee. In this way they are not investing agency resources for nothing. They do not guarantee to represent you, but for the fee, they will give you an honest appraisal of your manuscript and their best suggestions as to what you should do with it next. Needless to say, this letter does not come from an established agency. It is not professional, but that does not necessarily make it a scam. It could be sincere. He could be a guy bored with the routine of the job who likes reading rejected manuscripts. Maybe he thinks it helps him learn about the business. If you send his letter to Horizon management you could get the poor schlub fired. You don't want that on your conscience. I suggest that you call Horizon and ask for the man by name. That will at least tell you if he is even employed there. If you get the chance to speak to him on the phone, you can ask him some of the questions that are plaguing you. To be sure, you do not want to pay to have his BYU professor friend edit your manuscript. Just because you teach writing doesn't make you a good editor. Just because you have written a book doesn't either. Scot Denhalter -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Subject: Re: [AML] Critiques and Writer's Dreams Date: 13 Dec 2001 11:41:43 -0700 on 12/13/01 9:59 AM, Brown at wwbrown@burgoyne.com wrote: > If you will > notice, ALL of the great Mormon authors who have written for the national > market (Levi, Neal LaBute, Brady Udall, etc.) don't really look like Mormons > anymore. Marilyn Brown Marilyn, Will you elaborate on what you mean by this? Steve -- skperry@mac.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] John BENNION, _Falling toward Heaven_ (Review) Date: 13 Dec 2001 12:44:11 -0800 On Tue, 4 Dec 2001 21:19:59 -0700 "Scott Parkin" writes: > Bennion, John. _Falling toward Heaven._ Salt Lake City: Signature > Books. > 2000. 312 pages; Trade paperback; $19.95. ISBN 1-56085-140-6. > Even the closet feminists among us are forced to rethink some of our > own behaviors when Allison proclaims of Utah (and by extension, > patriarchal Mormon culture), "It's worse than Texas for--ah--a kind > of deference toward women that is really contempt. They're > diseased with it" (240). When I first read this paragraph I read, "Even the closest feminists us are forced to rethink some of our own behaviors," and thought, 'Ah, here's some nice complexity, Bennion is showing us through inversion that women also have the ability to marginalize others, that the marginalization is a function of dominance, not gender. That makes the story a double critique, a critique of patriarchal culture, and a critique of the idea that all problems would be solved if we simply invert the power structure.' Then I read this, > At times, though, that commentary seemed overstated and a little > forced. Allison spoke a few too many pronouncements for my tastes > and acted too much the emasculating man-eater for most of the novel > for me to really like her all that much. In choosing to invert expectations, > I think Bennion sometimes undercut the righteousness of his womens' > causes and made them seem more like caricatures of the dominating > patriarchs they claimed to hate. and decided that that's probably what Bennion is doing, questioning the idea of hierarchical power structures both by undercutting his women and by examining the problems of Mormon patriarchal culture. I know if I were writing a novel where the social situation was inverted that's what I would be doing--because I am writing a novel, a story cycle, where the social structure is inverted. It's about a man who longs for a revelation that would extend the priesthood to all worthy women as a revelation once extended the priesthood to all worthy men. He sees that as a progression of the expanding priesthood, from the time when it was held only by Levites, to a time when it would be held by all people, where every man and woman would be their own priest and priestess. His wife refuses to discuss the issue with him, and without discussion decides he's lost his soul and apostatized, and when she decides to divorce him she uses this apostasy as an excuse to try and destroy him emotionally. But her attitudes are also deeply mixed. She has great respect for the priesthood, but says at one point to her husband, "I'm damaged goods. How many of theses patriarchal Mormon men are going to want to marry a woman with two children?" "I would," he replies. That is, she doesn't understand the depth of her anger at the idea of male priesthood (or is it that she doesn't understand her anger at men (and her father and brother), or at the idea that there would be some kind of privelege for men?). Toward the end she ratifies her decision by thinking, "Women couldn't hold the priesthood, it was true. And if she couldn't hold the priesthood she could d--n well not hold it without him." So the husband finds the situation inverted--he finds himself without power, and understands he's been pushed into the margins (the story where his wife decides to divorce him is called "Marginalia") much as many women have been. > Again, that's an issue of taste. Unless Bennion wanted to undercut his women, in which case it's part of the story's form. > I admit that I wanted his women to be morally and ethically superior > to his men, perhaps illustrating my own guilt at showing "a kind of > deference toward women that is really contempt." It's possible that all deference is a kind of contempt. (Of course, blanket statements trouble me, but I'll let someone else challenge the comment.) > Or maybe I just wanted to see the focal characters being better than > real, regardless of gender. I think that's a common desire of readers. It might be worth some good discussion. Harlow Clark (who, for some reason, tends toward brevity the last few days. Maybe brevity really is the soul of half-wit.) -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] What Sells Novels? Date: 13 Dec 2001 13:01:56 -0700 At 11:40 AM 12/9/01, you wrote: >The technical aspects of pov are helpful in making our stories engrossing, >but no one will be engrossed in them if we do not develop interesting >characters and hatch intriguing plots. I wonder if the list might like to >comment on these elements and see if the collective wisdom residing here >(and you all have more of that than you are willing to admit) can help us to >improve. Some specifics, please. I've always felt that plot and character are the elements that make fiction compelling. Once reason I have no interest in the SF films that are so heavy on special effects is that they often lack strong, clear plots and interesting characters. I don't want to watch an hour-long space battle; I just want to know who wins, and what the outcome means to the characters. Some readers are more interested in a complex plot, and others in complex characters; I am in the second group. But POV is, as you say, a secondary consideration. I've recently read a few Clive Cussler novels, because I want to see what's going on in the genres I know nothing about. The hero, Dirk Pitt, is a modern Indy Jones; in every book he does half-a-dozen impossible things and saves civilization as we know it. But I have little knowledge of his inner self, and that keeps the books from holding my attention. I'm always skimming over pages and pages of raids and rescues and chases and attacks because it's all so distant. As for POV, Cussler does a lot of head-hopping, which bugs me but apparently not his primary audience. What I especially hate is that he hops into the heads of characters right before they die so readers can wallow in their despair and pain and hopelessness. Yet, he creates individual scenes that are quite memorable. Not my cup of tea, but interesting to analyze. I suppose it's the adventure that sells these novels. Must be a guy thing. Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: Re:[AML] Story Beginnings Date: 13 Dec 2001 13:07:06 -0800 Despite the variety of opinions I've seen expressed on the list about the first chapter(s) of Harry Potter every kid I've talked to who likes these books says almost verbatim, "It grabbed me from the very first page or pages." What writer doesn't dream of that being said about their own work? And the vote is in the millions on Harry Potter. I went back and skimmed the first chapter today and while some of the criticisms have a point I think just the title of the chapter alone helps set it all up-"The Boy Who Lived". I think this chapter is necessary to help set up among other things the differences between these two worlds that operate parallel and next to each other but with ignorance on both sides. Just the first few sentences tell so much about the Dursleys-"Mr. and Mrs. Dursley, of number four, Privet Drive, were proud to say that they were perfectly normal, thank you very much. They were the last people you'd expect to be involved in anything strange or mysterious, because they just didn't hold with such nonsense." I think that says it well about what narrow-minded insular people they are. As you can tell I just love to hate these particular characters. "The Dursleys had everything they wanted, but they also had a secret, and their greatest fear was that somebody would discover it." Kids like secrets, gets them every time, yet I don't look on this a cheap plot vehicle to get their attention. Rowling uses this and other things to constantly advance her plots even briefly mentioning characters that will make bigger appearances later in the series such as the mention of Sirius Black on page 14. J.K. Rowling already has all the books laid out in her head and has notebooks she's put together on the characters including their childhoods and eventual fates and shared some of this with the actors who played them. I have rarely heard of an author having such a detailed layout of their characters and backgrounds and the world which they inhabit. Some authors probably wouldn't even like to have things that way; they might like to be as surprised at the directions and growth of their own characters as their readers do. But for the Harry Potters books I think this works well, sort of like a piece of Baklava-so many layers, but each just as sweet. The original question that is vaguely stated in the first book becomes larger with each new volume-Why would a powerful dark wizard be so determined to destroy a little boy? What threat is the youngster to him? Sort of like why would villagers of upstate New York be so upset about the stories of a fourteen year old boy and his account of a vivid brush with Deity? Or the powers of darkness so determined to destroy him? Hmmm. BTW, I'm sure most people recognize the parallel of the Dark Lord trying to force people to do things his way and all the glory be his, but has anybody else noticed how Rowling seems to be setting up a least one character who is ambitious and obsessed with rules to become sucked into being a servant of his as well-I mean Percy Weasley, of course. Everyone agree? Show of hands? I thought so. I've defended these books so much, I almost swear I had a piece of the action, ( I should be so lucky). But might I suggest for anyone trying to catch up on all of this that they might get the books on tape of these stories. They're completely unabridged and Jim Dale does a good job coming up with voices for all the characters. (He won an emmy for his voice work on the fourth book). Finally, I know an author can be asking a lot of a reader to put up with a slow beginning to a book and they do so at their own peril, but sometimes it's necessary to help set up the background for the rest of the story. For instance, "Marley was dead to begin with, as dead as a doornail, that one thing you must remember or nothing else that follows will seem wondrous..." Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: Re: [AML] Skeleton Story Beginnings Date: 13 Dec 2001 16:15:21 -0500 Thanks to all who helped me come up with "Kennewick" Man. As to having to plod through difficult beginnings, I think no novel was as hard to penetrate and yet was so worthwhile in the long run as "Gravity's Rainbow." I really can't recommend it to anyone without the disclaimer to give yourself about 150 pages to pick up the rhythm. Way back when we were getting started with "The Leading Edge," I was privileged to conduct the Fritz Lieber interview and peppered him with questions about GR. It had been nominated for a Hugo a few years previously, but he hadn't read it. All that semester I kept trying to get the other Xenobia (a sci-fi writer's group) members to read it, read it, read it. But that didn't work so well either. They all politely ignored me. The beginning is daunting. And the middle and the end. And the aftermath. I suppose a lot of people would find it a pretentious bit of academic nonsense. But no reading experience before or after has ever hit me with such power (Except for once when I read Shakespeare's "The Tempest" after about a week of fasting and his ghost explained the whole play to me as a wonderfully complex allegory about the three degrees of glory). Tony Markham -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit (was: Critiques and Writer's Dreams) Date: 13 Dec 2001 15:16:03 -0800 On Dec. 11, Todd Peterson said, "The LDS tie in is this: LDS writers are going to have to be twice as good as everyone else in order to make it in a national market with LDS themed work. Twice as good. This is not something that we've talked about much here. I think that sometimes we think that we need to be equal with other writers, but that's not true at all. Writing from a Christian perspective is an albatross around a writer's neck that few writers can cut loose." Yes. We do need to talk about this. I've heard this statement several times and I'm always struck at how it repeats verbatim a theme I come across repeatedly in African- American culture. If you look at "twice as good" in that context, it's clear that the unstated assumption is, "The world is so bigoted that it's not going to appreciate us for who we are. They're so bigoted we have to be twice as good as they are just to get noticed. Do we really want to think of our potential audience as a bunch of bigots? Mind you, I could have used a different adjective there as James Wilson did on 12/13: "So many are so convinced that piety is a sham that they don't believe it even when it's obvious and right out in the open. I think people today have a great longing for goodness, exceeding that which has been in most times before, but they're terrified to believe. When you've had the Big Lie practiced upon you a bazillion times it's a miracle if you're only skeptical instead of cynical." But, do we really want to think of our potential audience as having been deceived by Satan? I have often found non-Mormon audiences more receptive to my stories, and the spirituality in them, than Mormon audiences. In grad school I wrote a story called "The Covenant Breaker" about a 30 year old man naming and blessing his baby daughter, who starts thinking about a time he was molested 15 years earlier on the banks of the Susquehanna river by a returned missionary who then asked him the Golden Questions, and turned up in the boy's ward in Elmira, NY, seventy miles away the next Sunday. There's a scene where the molester stands up after sacrament meeting, turns around and sees Brendan and says, "Oh God." "No, it's just me, Brendan." I had two fascinating reactions to that passage there at the exceedingly secular U of (There is no R in) Warshington. One class member wrote in the margin, "That's a pretty b_llsy thing to say, and David Bosworth, the teacher, said, "It's good to be reminded sometimes that when we say that we _are_ taking the Lord's name in vain." The reaction from a liberal (votever dot meinz) Mormon publication that awarded the story 3rd place in the D.K. Brown fiction contest that year? "We feel that publishing the story in its present form would be a good way to lose a third of our subscribers." He was referring to the rape scene itself, involving the man's mouth and the boy's--I can't say the word, the Scungebone editors thought the anatomical name of that particular body part was too offensive to print. There are multiple ironies here. One class member said the offending scene was too trivial to build a story around because Brendan only "almost gets . . ." (sorry for the tasteful ellipses, but I do want this to get posted). I described it clinically because one of the issues in the story is that Brendan is too embarrassed for 15 to speak the words that describe in detail what happened to him. This past spring I was part of a jury in a mock rape trial the UofU law school does each spring to give their law students a peek into how a jury deliberates. When the prosecutor described one part of the rape it sounded like a direct quote from my story. I have more to say on the outside world's willingness to read Mormon Lit, but for now I'll just say that in his "Toward the Dawning of a Brighter Day" speech (1983, I think, because my oldest son, Mason, took his first step at that speech--toward an electrical outlet he wanted to play with (or did Gene say it in a different speech?) Eugene England noted that there are a lot of LDS professors teaching at a lot of non-BY universities, and invited them, next time they taught a short story, to teach a Mormon story. So here's a question for you teachers on the list, When was the last time you taught a piece of MoLit in your class? and when was the last time you wrote about MoLit in (or for) an academic journal? These are not rhetorical questions. I want to know. To paraphrase scripture, How shall they read a literature they haven't heard about? Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christine Subject: Re: [AML] Reading in the Bath (was: Andrew's Poll: What's the Date: 13 Dec 2001 16:06:39 -0700 >>By the way, I've solved almost all of my "what to read while waiting in >>line" problems with my Palm Pilot - all but that pesky shower issue. When >>they release a waterproof PDA with a shower-mounted stand, I'll be >>completely set. > >A woman on one of my writers' lists says she puts hers into a ZipLoc bag >when she's reading in the tub. > >barbara hume Hey, that'd work! Except that I never take baths. Too slow. I've got too much to do. -Christine Atkinson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kathy_f@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 13 Dec 2001 16:55:41 -0700 > > The bottom line is, if you believe in your writing, NEVER pay > someone else to edit it. Shop the MS around until it finds a home that will pay > YOU. If it is good, it WILL get published. > > > > Linda Adams > > Author, _Prodigal Journey_ While in principle I agree with Linda, in practice I've seen some would-be writers who need the one-on-one teaching process a freelance editor can give to develop their skills to a level a publisher would be willing to work with. A writer's critique group can also help as much but one isn't always available. For example, I onced helped a would-be author with his manuscript, ruthlessly suggesting major rewrites because I thought the writer and the story line held some promise, though it was major Fluff with a capital F. (He had a hook that hadn't been tried yet in the LDS market, but was popular in secular light romance fiction, so was pretty sure it would sell if it could be better written.) He rewrote that manuscript three separate times, with me looking it over and suggesting fewer and fewer changes, before sending it to Covenant. They accepted it and published it, and asked him for more. I looked over his second manuscript at his request and made suggestions for changes again, though not anywhere near as many. It also was published. He wanted me to look over his third one as well, and I did. He had learn so much in the process of working on his first two books he didn't need my help at all anymore. I told him the only editor he needed now was his publisher's. I can guarantee that if he had sent his first manuscript in to them in the condition I first saw it, they would have rejected it with a form letter without a second thought. It was really, really bad. So much so that they wouldn't have put the time and effort it would have taken to get it to a publishable level. But for me, that was okay. I knew enough to spend the time and help him make it good enough for them to take a second look. I couldn't have done it for more complex fiction, mind you. Not then, and I'm pretty sure not today either. But for the kind of fiction he was writing I was just right. He's earned back the $100 he paid me several times over, so we both benefited. The guy's name is Dan Yates. He had titled the manuscript _The Typo_, but Covenant rightly suggested a better name -- _Angels Don't Knock_. Covenant has since published 8 of his novels and apparently they sell well enough that he keeps writing more at their request. So, while I agree that paying a freelance editor isn't usually a good idea, sometimes if you know you have talent but lack skill, it can be worth it. On a personal note, the amusing and ironic thing about this for me is... I can't *write* decent fiction to save my life! I've tried. I can't put a plot together at all. I can only take what someone else has written and can often show ways to improve it, but even then I feel very limited by my lack of education and experience in the real world. Oh well. Right now most of my creative efforts lean toward living, breathing human beings, as they have for the last 15+ years, and my interests have swung around to non-fiction anyway. I let go of my dream of writing the great LDS novel a long time ago. But I'd love to write my own journey on the road from serious and suicidal clinical depression to discovering deep abiding happiness regardless of outward circumstances. That's the story that's in my heart to tell. Someday soon I'll do it, and then maybe some of you will kindly critique it and be as ruthless with it as I was with my friend's husband Dan's ms. ;-) Kathy F[owkes] ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "robert lauer" Subject: RE: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 13 Dec 2001 19:07:38 -0500 Annette Lyon wrote: > >I'm glad to finally know that the source for that so-called doctrine is a >talk and isn't founded in anything. I was taught the same thing in 9th >grade >seminary, and it rubbed me the wrong way, especially since my mother was >born into a Lutheran home in a country far from the US, so according to my >teacher she hadn't been as valiant in the premortal life--yet she is one of >the most faithful, spritually in-tune, and devout people you'll ever find. Actually, what follows is the truth behind the so-called doctrine that your seminary teacher taught. There has been great confusion on this issue and it has inspired not only debate among Church members, but also several LDS musicals. Let me set the record straight: The MOST valiant spirits are born OUTSIDE the Church in the most remote parts of the world because the Lord knew that--being so valiant--nothing would stop them from finding the Church. And in his wisdom, He allowed many of the--how to put this politely?--He allowed the LESS valiant spirits to be born into the Church in small,heavily LDS communities throughout the Rocky Mountain West--knowing that unless these poor struggling souls were completely emerged in the Gospel socially they would never find it. The scripture in which this doctrine is spelled out can be found in Doctrine & Covenants, Section 166, verse 58. ROB LAUER -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "jana" Subject: [AML] Books Up for Review Date: 13 Dec 2001 16:45:05 -0800 Folks: Here's a huge list of books up for review. Please read the Review = Guidelines for = details about the AML-List Review Program. If you are interested in = applying for a title on this list, please send me an email at = with your reasons and/or qualifications. Do not = request a book if you haven't completed your last review.=20 Thank you to all who participate in the Review Program-your = contributions are an asset to this List! Jana Remy AML-List Review Editor jana@enivri.com Weeks, Hillary. I Will Not Forget (music CD) http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100037514 Bytheway, John. How to Be Totally Miserable http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100035340 Hinckley, Gordon B. Stand a Little Taller http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100037944 Bradshaw, Anne. Chamomile Winter http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175589.html Rowley, BJ. Sixteen in No Time www.bjrowley.com Weyland, Jack. Megan http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100035356 Card, Orson Scott. Rebekah http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100039650 Lund, Gerald. Come Unto Me http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100035401 Orullian, Peter. At the Manger www.atthemanger.com Wilcox, S. Michael. Don't Leap With the Sheep http://deseretbook.com/store/product?product_id=3D100035335 Blair, Kerry. The Heart Only Knows http://www.covenant-lds.com/osb2/itemdetails.cfm?ID=3D23 Tarr, Kenneth. The Last Days: Zion's Trail http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175309.html Guymon, Shannon. Never Letting Go of Hope http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175341.html Wright, Julie. To Catch a Falling Star http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175643.html Leach, Frank. Mission Accomplished http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175686.html Brown, Marilyn. The Macaroni Christmas Tree http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175813.html Brown, Marilyn. The House on the Sound http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175848.html Peck, Lisa J. Nauvoo's Magic http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175368.html Randalls, Vickie Mason. Red Moon Rising http://www.cedarfort.com/catalog/1555175287.html -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 14 Dec 2001 00:26:12 -0700 "The Other Side of Heaven" Written and directed by Mitch Davis Review from The Daily Herald, Dec. 14, 2001 By Eric D. Snider "The Other Side of Heaven" is an account of Mormon general authority John H. Groberg's missionary experiences in Tonga in the 1950s, based on his book, "In the Eye of the Storm." It is mildly uplifting and reasonably enjoyable, but lacks the emotional or spiritual power that, say, one of Elder Groberg's general conference talks might have. Adapted and directed by Mitch Davis, "Heaven" faithfully tells the stories from Groberg's mission as if faithfully telling the stories from Groberg's mission is all it needs to do. It starts with the beginning of his mission, ends with his homecoming, and in between is full of healings, baptisms and South Pacific islander shenanigans -- but no sense of purpose. Groberg (played here by Christopher Gorham) does not appear to change or grow over the course of it. He is friendly and righteous and rather non-descript to begin with, and he's that way at the end, too. The blame for the lack of dynamics is shared between Davis the writer/director and Gorham the actor. The script is episodic, moving from one event to another with little sense that any of them are having any lasting effect, and no sense of building toward something in particular, plot-wise. There's very little adversity that isn't overcome quickly and easily; the closest thing the movie has to a "villain" is a bureaucratic mission president -- and he immediately apologizes for it. Even when emotional depth might be called for, Gorham doesn't do it. Sure, he cries a couple times, and Groberg does some amazing act-of-faith kind of stuff. But Gorham's attitude throughout is so blandly go-with-the-flow -- almost cavalier -- that we wind up liking him, but not knowing him. To his credit, Davis has control of his craft in terms of making things look good. No amateur (despite this being his first feature film), Davis makes good use of beautiful locales, has an able cast of actors, and doesn't let the pace slow down too much. A couple storm sequences are very exciting. This all makes it a decent film, if not a great one. To be interesting or memorable, movies must be driven by plot or character. Either we like the stuff that's happening, or we like the people it's happening to. The best movies do both. "The Other Side of Heaven" does neither. Nothing happens, and it happens to flat characters. It is not beyond enjoyment, but it is so soft and weak-willed that it's not liable to live in anyone's heart for longer than it takes to watch it. Grade: C+ -- *************************************************** Eric D. Snider www.ericdsnider.com "Filling all your Eric D. Snider needs since 1974." -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 14 Dec 2001 03:05:16 -0700 Clark Draney wrote: > Won't you miss a lot of good stuff by having that (it "grabbiness") as your > only (or at least primary) criteria for deciding whether to finish a text? > But then, none of us have time to get to all the the good stuff. Maybe _a_ > criteria is a good thing. This one just makes me a little uncomfortable > (speaking primarily as a reader). Yes, I'll miss a lot of good stuff that way. And I'll miss a lot of good stuff by laboriously wading through a difficult opening until the book starts becoming worthwhile. I'll miss a lot of good stuff by restricting myselt to romances or westerns. I'll also miss a lot of good stuff by restricting myself to classics that are on the English Lit reading list. No matter what criterion I use to choose the next book to read, I will miss out on a lot of good stuff. Being mortal, there's nothing I can do about that. I'll catch up in the next life. Meanwhile, I use the criterion that works best for me: if an author can't convey to me someway, somehow, in the first chapter or two, that there will be something in this book of value to me--enough to peak my interest so I'll read on--then I am too mortal to waste my time on it. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Literary Style (was: Critiques and Writer's Dreams) Date: 14 Dec 2001 02:43:25 -0700 Terry L Jeffress wrote: > > Stephen Carter wrote: > > I recently read a provocative article in the Atlantic Monthly called "A > > Reader's Manifesto." > > Myers, B. B., "A Reader's Manifesto," _Atlantic Monthly,_ July/August > 2001 (288: 1): 104-22. > > Available online at: > > http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2001/07/myers.htm This is a lo-o-o-ong article, but well worth the time. I walked away from it thinking, "If this is what literature is, then I haven't been missing a thing." BR Myers has the same contempt for the modern literary crowd as Orson Scott Card, but provides detailed ammunition to back up his attitude, something I haven't experienced from Card. Because I know some of you will not want to take the time to read the lenghty piece, I want to include some of my favorite quotes from it: =================== Today any accessible, fast-moving story written in unaffected prose is deemed to be "genre fiction"--at best an excellent "read" or a "page turner," but never literature with a capital L. Everything written in self-conscious, writerly prose, on the other hand, is now considered to be "literary fiction"--not necessarily good literary fiction, mind you, but always worthier of respectful attention than even the best-written thriller or romance. But what we are getting today is a remarkably crude form of affectation: a prose so repetitive, so elementary in its syntax, and so numbing in its overuse of wordplay that it often demands less concentration than the average "genre" novel. Even today's obscurity is easy--the sort of gibberish that stops all thought dead in its tracks. I doubt that any reviewer in our more literate past would have expected people to have favorite sentences from a work of prose fiction. A favorite character or scene, sure; a favorite line of dialogue, maybe; but not a favorite sentence. We have to read a great book more than once to realize how consistently good the prose is, because the first time around, and often even the second, we're too involved in the story to notice. If Proulx's fiction is so compelling, why are its fans more impressed by individual sentences than by the whole? This is the sort of writing, full of brand names and wardrobe inventories, that critics like to praise as an "edgy" take on the insanity of modern American life. It's hard to see what is so edgy about describing suburbia as a wasteland of stupefied shoppers, which is something left-leaning social critics have been doing since the 1950s. Still, this is foolproof subject matter for a novelist of limited gifts. The American supermarket is presented as a haven of womblike contentment, a place where people go to satisfy deep emotional needs.... This sort of patronizing nonsense is typical of Consumerland writers; someone should break the news to them that the average shopper feels nothing in a supermarket but the strong urge to get out again. It is left to real-life professors to explain the passage in light of what DeLillo has said in interviews and other novels about how people use words to assuage a fear of death.... A good novelist, of course, would have written the scene more persuasively in the first place. The point, as Auster's fans will tell you, is that there can be no clear answers to such questions... All interpretations of the above passage are allowed, even encouraged--except, of course, for the most obvious one: that Auster is simply wasting our time. Like DeLillo, Auster knows the prime rule of pseudo-intellectual writing: the harder it is to be pinned down on any idea, the easier it is to conceal that one has no ideas at all. Nobody's perfect. But why should we forgive a writer for trying to pass off a schoolboy anagram as a celestial pun, or snowball as a meteorological reference, or tonality as a synonym for "tone," when he himself is trying so hard to draw attention to his fancy-pants language? A thriller must thrill or it is worthless; this is as true now as it ever was. Today's "literary" novel, on the other hand, need only evince a few quotable passages to be guaranteed at least a lukewarm review. This reflects both the growing influence of the sentence cult and a desire to reward novelists for aiming high. It is perhaps natural, therefore, that the "literary" camp now attracts a type of risk-averse writer who, under different circumstances, might never have strayed from the safest thriller or romance formulae. Many critically acclaimed novels today are no more than mediocre "genre" stories told in a conformist amalgam of approved "literary" styles. You could study that passage all day and find no trace of a flair for words. Many readers, however, including the folks at Granta, are willing to buy into the scam that anything this dull must be Serious and therefore Fine and therefore Beautiful Writing. Like Cormac McCarthy, to whom he is occasionally compared, Guterson thinks it more important to sound literary than to make sense. The answer, of course, is that it doesn't matter one way or the other: Guterson is just swinging a pocket watch in front of our eyes. "You're in professional hands," he's saying, "for only a Serious Writer would express himself so sonorously. Now read on, and remember, the mood's the thing." On the positive side, Guterson has more of a storytelling instinct than many novelists today. Beneath all the verbal rubble in Cedars is a good murder mystery crying out to be heard--feebly, to be sure, but still loud enough for The New York Times to have denied the book its "non-genre" bonus of a second review. Almost every fourth amateur reviewer on Amazon.com complains about the repetitiveness of Snow Falling on Cedars. Kirkus Reviews, on the other hand, called the 345-page novel "as compact as haiku," and Susan Kenney, in The New York Times, praised it as "finely wrought and flawlessly written." At the 1999 National Book Awards ceremony Oprah Winfrey told of calling Toni Morrison to say that she had had to puzzle over many of the latter's sentences. According to Oprah, Morrison's reply was "That, my dear, is called reading." Sorry, my dear Toni, but it's actually called bad writing. Great prose isn't always easy, but it's always lucid; no one of Oprah's intelligence ever had to wonder what Joseph Conrad was trying to say in a particular sentence. This is what the cultural elite wants us to believe: if our writers don't make sense, or bore us to tears, that can only mean that we aren't worthy of them. This must succeed in bullying some people, or else all the purveyors of what the critic Paul Fussell calls the "unreadable second-rate pretentious" would have been forced to find honest work long ago. Still, I'll bet that for every three readers who finished Passaro's article, two made a mental note to avoid new short fiction like the plague. Even a nation brainwashed to equate artsiness with art knows when its eyelids are drooping. This is not to say that traditional realism is the only valid approach to fiction. But today's Serious Writers fail even on their own postmodern terms. They urge us to move beyond our old-fashioned preoccupation with content and plot, to focus on form instead--and then they subject us to the least-expressive form, the least-expressive sentences, in the history of the American novel. Time wasted on these books is time that could be spent reading something fun. It's easy to despair of ever seeing a return to that kind of prose, especially with the cultural elite doing such a quietly efficient job of maintaining the status quo. (Rick Moody received an O. Henry Award for "Demonology" in 1997, whereupon he was made an O. Henry juror himself. And so it goes.) But the paper chain of mediocrity would probably perpetuate itself anyway. Clumsy writing begets clumsy thought, which begets even clumsier writing. Many readers wrestle with only one bad book before concluding that they are too dumb to enjoy anything "challenging." Their first foray into literature shouldn't have to end, for lack of better advice, on the third page of something like Underworld. At the very least, the critics could start toning down their hyperbole. How better to ensure that Faulkner and Melville remain unread by the young than to invoke their names in praise of some new bore every week? -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] DAVIS, _The Other Side of Heaven_ (SL Tribune review) Date: 14 Dec 2001 11:48:15 +0000 Sincere Mission Overcomes a No-Frills Budget in 'The Other Side of Heaven' Friday, December 14, 2001 BY SEAN P. MEANS THE SALT LAKE TRIBUNE 2 1/2 stars out of 4. An LDS missionary's experiences make for a heartfelt, if uneven, movie. Rated PG for thematic elements and brief disturbing images; 113 minutes. Opening today at the Megaplex 17 at Jordan Commons, Sandy, and the SCERA, Orem. "The Other Side of Heaven" is by no means a great movie, but it is a refreshingly forthright one. Its emotional honesty pulls it past some of its storytelling shortcomings. Based on In the Eye of the Storm, a memoir by John H. Groberg -- now a member of the LDS Church's First Quorum of the Seventy -- "The Other Side of Heaven" begins in 1953 with Groberg (Christopher Gorham) learning he has been called on his mission to the Pacific nation of Tonga. This means leaving behind his Idaho family and the lovely Jean (Anne Hathaway, the star of "The Princess Diaries") -- who has plenty of suitors at BYU trying to pull her away from her absent boyfriend. Arriving in Tonga after an eventful voyage, Groberg is given simple orders from his mission president (played by "Schindler's List" producer Gerald R. Molen, one of this film's producers): "Learn the language and build a kingdom." But learning the customs of the Tongan people, and overcoming the prejudices of a rival Christian minister, is a hard nut to crack -- even with a Tongan, Feki (Joe Falua), as his missionary companion. With a miniscule budget of $7 million, writer-director Mitch Davis makes the best of what he has. The location footage, shot in Raratonga, is gorgeous -- and the cast and crew from nearby New Zealand are as professional as can be. The budget constraints show only in the climax, with a computer-generated tidal wave that looks like a half-finished outtake from "The Perfect Storm." Davis plods through the episodes of Groberg's mission experience, including several obvious fish-out-of-water cliches (tasting strange cuisine, mangling the language, etc.). Thankfully, Davis avoids the two biggest cliches by never showing Groberg either as someone who "goes native" or as an all-knowing Anglo among the "heathen" Tongans. Groberg -- portrayed with unassuming charm by Gorham (from the canceled WB series "Popular") -- is simply someone who believes in his faith, works hard to help the people around him, and thinks about getting home to his true love. His plain- spokenness gives "The Other Side of Heaven" a sincerity that money can't buy. =A9 Copyright 2001, The Salt Lake Tribune _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:=20 http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] DAVIS, _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Daily Herald) Date: 14 Dec 2001 11:53:26 +0000 [MOD: This is a compilation of two articles.] 'Heaven' not just for Mormons The Daily Herald Friday, December 14 By ERIC D. SNIDER The people behind "The Other Side of Heaven," the new film based on Mormon general authority John H. Groberg's experiences as a Mormon missionary, want you to know one thing: This is not a "Mormon film." "This is a movie made by Hollywood filmmakers, for the world, about a Mormon," said director Mitch Davis, who adapted the screenplay from Groberg's book "In the Eye of the Storm." "Out of about 600 people involved in the film, only four are Mormon." Those four are Davis himself, two of the producers and the film editor. The cast members are not LDS. The budget was $7 million -- small by Hollywood standards, but big for an independent film, and more than the two established Mormon films, "God's Army" and "Brigham City" cost. "I think 'God's Army' demonstrated that there is a viable Mormon niche market out there, but this movie was not made at all for that niche market," Davis said. "This movie was frankly made for a worldwide audience, which audience we hope it will find." Indeed, though the movie follows a young Elder Groberg on his mission to Tonga in the 1950s, there are few references to LDS doctrine. Viewers need to know only what everyone knows already anyway: that young Mormon men usually go on missions. "If there's any religion in this movie, I would hope it comes from the spirit of the Polynesian people and not from any specific dogma preached by any of the missionaries," Davis said. The film opens today at the SCERA in Orem and Jordan Commons in Sandy. It will spread to other theaters starting next week. Davis is careful to point out that while few Mormons were involved in the making of "The Other Side of Heaven," it was not due to any ill will on his part. "We just auditioned the very best actors that were available," he said. "I think one or two who auditioned were LDS, but that really was not a factor for or against." The film was shot in the Cook Islands and in New Zealand, and most of the casting was done locally -- which means there weren't many Mormon actors to choose from anyway. The star of the film, 27-year-old Christopher Gorham, agreed that it should appeal to a wide audience. "The movie deals with far more universal themes, like love, relationships, faith in general, faith in yourself," he said. "It's a coming-of-age story. It's about a boy who grows up." That said, however, Mormons may find a bit more in it than others do. "Even though the movie is not a 'Mormon movie,' I think Mormons will take something extra away from it," he said. "Anyone who's been on a mission will certainly be flooded with memories. I think it will affect people here (in Utah) a little bit more." Gorham appeared in the independent film "A Life Less Ordinary" in 1997, and is best known for his two seasons on TV's "Popular." He currently has a recurring role on "Felicity," where he plays "an alcoholic frat boy" -- which he suggested might balance out the "Other Side of Heaven" role as far as public opinion of him is concerned. Davis, who is 43 and, like Gorham, a California native, said he auditioned more than 500 people for the lead role, and settled on Gorham because "he has a very gentle soul." "It comes through in his performance, but he also adds to that a little bit of mischief and humor, which we found very endearing," Davis said. "By the time he finished his audition, I knew the part was his." Gorham, in Utah this week to promote the film, said he learned he'd gotten the job only three days before he had to leave for the Cook Islands. "I made a mad dash to find the book, and I got it the day I was leaving, and read it on the plane," he said. "It's fascinating. It's why I took the part. It's such a great challenge, with so much happening to him as a young man." Davis speaks passionately about the movie, which was shot over 55 days in the summer of 2000, though it was wintertime in the southern hemisphere. "It's a movie about a beautiful people and a beautiful time in a beautiful place," he said. =A9 2001 by HarkTheHerald.com Director's search ends in unexpected place The Daily Herald Friday, December 14 By ERIC D. SNIDER Mitch Davis, writer and director of "The Other Side of Heaven," said he's wanted to make a movie about a Mormon missionary for more than 20 years, but only recently found the right project. "The Other Side of Heaven" is based on "In the Eye of the Storm," the 1993 book by LDS general authority John H. Groberg, covering his missionary experiences in Tonga. "I kept looking for the right vehicle, hoping to find a story that I thought could be universally appealing," he said. "I had a couple different people recommend Elder Groberg's book to me, and frankly, I ignored both of them, because I incorrectly assumed that you could not find a Hollywood movie in a 'church' book. Perhaps I was a bit arrogant about it." Finally, a friend took his own copy off the shelf, "shoved it in my face and said, 'Just read this,' " Davis said. "I immediately saw what this gentleman saw, which was a real swashbuckling adventure, a romantic location in the South Pacific, a lot of rich, colorful characters. I realized this would be the perfect vehicle to tell the story of a Mormon mission, but in a manner that would be accessible and entertaining to everyone." He contacted Bookcraft and said he wanted to buy the movie rights to the book -- a request Bookcraft, which has since merged with the LDS Church-owned Deseret Book, does not get very often. "It was actually a very comical conversation," Davis said. "I told them what I wanted to do, and there was this very long pause on the other end of the line. Finally, they said, 'Oooooo-kay, let us look into that.'" Bookcraft wanted to make sure Groberg was comfortable with his personal memoirs being turned into a Hollywood movie, and arranged for him to meet with Davis. "The Groberg family are certainly not the kind of people who seek the limelight," Davis said. "At first, they were pretty leery of the whole idea, but once they took us in and accepted the idea, they were very trusting." Davis said Groberg consulted with him on the script and visited the set with his wife, Jean (played in the movie by Anne Hathaway, recently of "The Princess Diaries"). In fact, the real Grobergs can be seen as extras in the scene where the movie Grobergs are married. Groberg, speaking from his office at church headquarters in Salt Lake City, said of the film, "I think they did a good job. They promised they would keep it true to the spirit of the book, and I think they've done an excellent job." He said Davis sought his opinion often on technical issues. "Like for instance, they'd say, 'Did you really wear a shirt and tie every day?' or how far was it from there to here, -- that sort of thing." Of Christopher Gorham, the actor who plays him in the movie, Groberg said, "I thought he did a good job. I'm sure I wasn't as good-looking as he is, and I wasn't as good a dancer as he is, but I felt he conveyed the spirit very well." Groberg said he checked with his superiors at church headquarters before allowing Davis to make the film, and that he has "felt a lot of support." "Most of the general authorities have seen it and seem to be favorably inclined," he said. =A9 2001 by HarkTheHerald.com _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? (comp 2) Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:26:46 -0600 [MOD: This is another compilation post.] >From ThomDuncan@prodigy.net Thu Dec 13 10:50:16 2001 jana wrote: > > Is this weird or what? I don't know what to think. Could it be some sort > of scam? Run, don't awake, away from this sheister. > > Is it possible that this person writes letters of this sort to writers of > rejected manuscripts to drum up business for his editor friend? He made it > clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. You should contact Horizion, so they can fire his a**. > > I had pretty much given up the idea of publishing my manuscript. One of the > publishers that I wrote to forwarded my manuscript to a company who would > supposedly rewrite it into a novel for a fee, but the sample pages that they > sent to me were terrible. So, I never contacted them. > > I'm hesitant to pay money for editing services. If my book was good enough, > wouldn't the publisher asign one of their own editors to work with me? Yes. And they would pay the editor, not you. > (I've just finished reading The Novel by Mitchner. Has it given me the > wrong idea?) > > All the "name dropping" about his personal life and the church makes me > leary. I feel like I'm being buttered up somehow. Isn't that the way scam > artists work? He's essentially saying, "You can trust me because I'm righteous." At the very least, ignore the guy. At the very most, report him to his boss at Horizon. He is engaging in very unethical publishing practices. Thom Duncan >From barbara@techvoice.com Thu Dec 13 11:19:39 2001 At 10:59 AM 12/13/01, you wrote: >I don't believe most publishers >will spend their resources editing a manuscript. If they believe in the book, they'll have an editor go over it. If your book is so far from being publishable that you need to hire an editor before submitting it, you need to learn your craft better. I think this person is drumming up business for someone, who might edit the book without improving its marketability at all. barbara hume >From iaw2@email.byu.edu Thu Dec 13 12:12:49 2001 > >From Turk325@aol.com Wed Dec 12 14:54:44 2001 > > << He made it clear that I shouldn't contact Horizon, but only him. >> A similar thing happened to my father after he submitted a manuscript to(and was rejected by)Horizon? Is there some sort of con-man working in the inner bowels there? My dad also did not take the guy up on his offer, bieng a mite suspicous. --Ivan Wolfe >From jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Thu Dec 13 15:17:46 2001 I'm not a published author yet, but it sure sounds fishy to me, especially "don't tell Horizon". It really irks me when someone uses the good name of the Church to further their own ethically challenged enterprises. Sounds like there's an Ensign article in there somewhere about honesty, integrity and not taking the Lord's name in vain. Because when you use his and the Church's name in this manner, you're taking the name in vain. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA >From Chris.Bigelow@unicitynetwork.com Thu Dec 13 15:42:21 2001 I think Horizon needs to know if an employee is misusing their slush pile. It's as bad or worse than someone using a ward directory to prospect people for Amway. The employee needs to be stopped. Chris Bigelow >From LuAnnStaheli@prodigy.net Thu Dec 13 18:36:19 2001 We just had an interesting discussion on the Utah Children's Writers listserve about Larry Brady. I don't think I'd get involved with his company if I were you from the comments and conclusions that were reached there. [LuAnn Staheli] >From eskarstedt@sonici.com Fri Dec 14 08:53:48 2001 Richard wrote: "Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks." speaking of Brent Hendrickson. Perhaps, Richard, if you really expect her not to contact Horizon, you ought to offer to speak to Brent and let him know that his behavior is unprofessional and could get easily get him fired. Something needs to be done to correct the situation and speaking to Horizon is the obvious course of action. If you don't want that to happen because of some personal liking for Mr. Hendrickson, then take responsibility for it and offer to speak to him yourself. -Ethan Skarstedt >From ThomDuncan@prodigy.net Fri Dec 14 09:48:02 2001 Richard R. Hopkins wrote: > I don't blame Linda for any of the statements made below, but since I know > these people personally, I can assure you that, as clumsy as Brent > Hendrickson can be, he is NOT a scam artist and neither is Larry Brady. That > Larry is trying to make a buck is, obviously, true. But that's what many > professional editorial services do. Many writers do, legitimately, pay > editors to help them edit their manuscripts. These are not manuscripts that > would get a publisher's attention (and therefore their editorial help) at > the stage they are in, but which, with a little help, could get a > publisher's attention. Let's be careful here before we fly off and do damage > to the reputations of perfectly legitimate businessmen. Thanks. There is a big difference between legitimate and ethical. I regard what these men as doing is unethical and so does the Writers Guild. Like vanity publishers, they pry on the hopes of the naive, holding out a bone that maybe -- just maybe -- if someone with supposed knowledge edits their work, they could have a shot at getting published. Thom Duncan >From ThomDuncan@prodigy.net Fri Dec 14 09:50:42 2001 Richard R. Hopkins wrote: > Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and > he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks. And why should he not get in trouble, is my question? If he's serious about continuing in the legitimate publishing business, he needs to learn the lesson now that respectable business people don't rely on such business techniqes to get jobs. Let him take out ads in Irrenatum, or do a mass mailing to all of Horizon's wannabe authors, making his service and its results clear. Thom Duncan >From Turk325@aol.com Fri Dec 14 11:20:22 2001 In a message dated 12/14/01 11:03:37 AM, sdenhaltersprint10@earthlink.net writes: << Needless to say, this letter does not come from an established agency. It is not professional, but that does not necessarily make it a scam. It could be sincere. He could be a guy bored with the routine of the job who likes reading rejected manuscripts. Maybe he thinks it helps him learn about the business.>> And he has no business reading what neither belongs to him nor was submitted to him. He's taken--note that word: TAKEN--something that belongs to someone else and tried to make money off it for himself or a friend. <> Why not? Silence is consent. Either he's dishonest or stupid. (I'm not going to say naive. He's an adult, isn't he?) If you were Horizon, would you want someone like this working for you? Reflecting on your professionalism? Some lessons are expensive but worthwhile. Kurt Weiland. >From adamszoo@sprintmail.com Fri Dec 14 11:51:52 2001 At 03:28 PM 12/13/01, you wrote: >I don't blame Linda for any of the statements made below, but since I know >these people personally, I can assure you that, as clumsy as Brent >Hendrickson can be, he is NOT a scam artist and neither is Larry Brady. That >Larry is trying to make a buck is, obviously, true. But that's what many >professional editorial services do. Many writers do, legitimately, pay >editors to help them edit their manuscripts. These are not manuscripts that >would get a publisher's attention (and therefore their editorial help) at >the stage they are in, but which, with a little help, could get a >publisher's attention. Let's be careful here before we fly off and do damage >to the reputations of perfectly legitimate businessmen. Thanks. > >Richard R. Hopkins Okay then, Richard, if you're vouching for them I withdraw my arguments; but if they're friends of yours, you might consider mentioning to them how what they're doing obviously APPEARS, and that continuing to operate this way will create bad press and a bad reputation, as well as possibly land them in legal (or employer) difficulties. Linda Adams >From ThomDuncan@prodigy.net Fri Dec 14 12:55:29 2001 Richard R. Hopkins wrote: > Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and > he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks. Shouldn't he be gotten in trouble? If what he is doing is completely kosher, than telling Horizon should cause no problems at all. As it is, maybe he needs to be whupped upside with the reality stick that people don't business this way. Let's say no one calls him on it and he gets a bunch of customers for his own private business interests. Isn't he misuing Horizion's facilities for his own gain. I used to work for the Novell AppNotes. After I was laid-off, I contacted a client for whom I'd written a pleasant review and got a writing contract, a client I would never have known existed except for my connections at Novell. To have done so while I worked at Novell would have got me fired. Thom Duncan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market (was: Critiques and Writer's Dreams) Date: 14 Dec 2001 11:40:49 -0700 I guess what I meant was that the Mormon population as a whole doesn't clamor after their work. Not like they clamored after God's Army for example, or even Saturday's Warrior. (And Gerald Lund and Dean Hughes, and I HOPE Margaret Young, etc.)Though some of our great nationally accepted "Mormon" writers talk about Mormons, etc., their approach to "Mormonness" is so broad or so non-existent or critical that it doesn't even look very sympathetic to Mormonism. I know we've discussed this five thousand times. But I think it's true. The minute any of our nationally geared work, for example, "stinks" (or smells nice) with a bit of provincial "Mormonism" it certainly turns the national editors off, who definitely have antenna for any attempt to proselyte. Youth stories made it nationally, but Todd Petersen is right. Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. And not Maurine Whipple, whose "great smile" and critique of polygamy certainly didn't win Mormon friends and influence Mormon people (except for the literati.) I like Marilyn Arnold's attitude--she's got a great outlook, and she's a top writer, writing about Mormon people. She's an EXCELLENT writer. But did she get her books for the national market published by the national editors? No. She just goes ahead publishing her things for the Mormon market (who doesn't appreciate her either, so leaving the sales so small that even her own publisher tosses out some of her manuscripts!) and just continues on saying, "I don't ever want to criticize the Church." I admire her. Thanks for asking, Steve. I'm very anxious to see "The Other Side of Heaven" and place it somewhere on the continuum. Cheers! Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 11:41 AM > on 12/13/01 9:59 AM, Brown at wwbrown@burgoyne.com wrote: > > > If you will > > notice, ALL of the great Mormon authors who have written for the national > > market (Levi, Neal LaBute, Brady Udall, etc.) don't really look like Mormons > > anymore. Marilyn Brown > > Marilyn, > > Will you elaborate on what you mean by this? > > Steve > > -- > skperry@mac.com > > > > > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a long, long time. The question I put before the panel is this: Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? I don't want to go into details, because I'm insanely secretive and paranoid, but my story is a series of journal entries -- first-person very limited POV -- written by someone whom I find to be a laughable person. Her being laughable is integral to the story: I want readers to laugh at this person, and the fact that she never realizes how clueless she is just part of the joke. Can this work? What examples can we think of where the main character is nothing but an object of derision? I think of "Waiting for Guffman," where the characters never learn, grow, or realize how wrong they are. That one seems to work because it's satire -- which my story is, too, sort of -- and because it's not very long. We don't need any emotional investment in the characters, because the movie is so darned funny and isn't epic-length. Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on this sort of thing? Eric D. Snider _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "J. Scott Bronson" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 16:09:40 -0700 On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 "Eric D. Snider" writes: > I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in > a long, long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for > whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? Not if it's a "real" story about a "real" person. Nobody -- let me repeat that loudly -- NOBODY is that one dimensional. But, considering your slight description of what you're attempting to do, I'd say this is a jape, not a story. So who cares? Of course, the difficult thing about japes is that the joke has to be REALLY good. If not, you might get this response: (chuckle) "That was clever. Anybody want to see Scary Movie 2 again?" If there is no foundation of reality in the character -- which only occurs if you like the character (even just slightly) -- even in a jape you won't engage the reader ... not for any longer than it takes to actually read the thing at any rate. This explains a lot about your reviews. ;-) scott -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Re: Contacting Authors Date: 17 Dec 2001 13:26:14 -0600 Yes, I do think it's unprofessional, though I suspect (based in part on Richard's reassurances) that it's completely well-intentioned in this case. Here's why: As I see it, the author of an unpublished manuscript has the sole right to determine who gets to see that manuscript. By sending a manuscript to a publisher, the author gives that publisher the right to consider the manuscript for publication, as part of the regular publication process. But that's all that the publisher is authorized to do. Someone else going through the publisher's office--even an employee going through the office without authorization--is in much the same position as a guest in someone's house picking up a letter on the desk, addressed to the owner of the house, and reading it. It's unauthorized access. Note, by the way, that my attitude toward this changes if it is an editor at the publishing house who is doing this, and is doing this as an official part of his/her responsibilities. E.g., if the editor writes a letter to an author which says, "We are not willing to publish this story at this time. However, we believe that your writing has promise. You might want to check out some reputable editing service, such as __." In that case, I would suspect a money-making relationship, and would not necessarily trust the advice--but it would not raise the same issues for me as if this were something being done without the publisher's knowledge. Basically, I consider such an independent contact, unauthorized by the publisher, at least a breach of confidentiality. As an author, it would scare me to think that the manuscript I entrusted to a publishing house, in part because of my knowledge of the publisher, had started making the rounds in some sense independently of that publisher. I would wonder who else had access to it. I could also reasonably view it as, in a sense, an act of theft--both in relation to the publishing house (confidential information being made us of for unauthorized purposes) and, potentially at least, in relation to myself as an author, since it is evidence that my manuscript has already been read by people and/or for purposes that are not those I had authorized in submitting it to the publisher. Authors of unpublished manuscripts have to be extremely leery of anything that will dilute their rights; unauthorized distribution is one of those. I suppose that less experienced authors might simply feel grateful that someone had looked at their manuscript and cared about it; but once you start looking at this from a professional perspective, one's view of such actions changes radically. I think that's why this has received such a violent reaction on AML-List: because it threatens the author's control of his/her work. As a publisher, I would feel just as strongly about it, because once word gets out that this is the sort of experience people will have once they send a manuscript to me, reputable authors might not be as willing to submit their work. But that, of course, is only my own set of opinions. What does everyone else think? Jonathan Langford Speaking for myself, not the List -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Today's Posts Date: 17 Dec 2001 14:00:27 -0600 Folks, For some mysterious reason, most of the posts I've sent out today (pretty much a full compliment) seem to have gotten lost in my email server. I'm going to send them out again; however, the easiest way to do this will make them all look like they're from me. So please read the posts carefully to see who they're really from. (And if this doesn't work, we'll try something else...) Jonathan Langford AML-List Moderator -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 13:56:34 -0700 Eric D. Snider wrote: > I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a > long, long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom > the author clearly has nothing but contempt? Andre Gide does it in his _Symphonie Pastorale_. The story of the rape of a young girl by a priest, told from the viewpoint of the priest. Masterful work in that you think at first you are seeing the story of an old man falling in love with a young girl and it is entirely from the priest's POV. All his actions are, therefore, noble. His "love" is pure. The girl is a willing angel. Not too far into the book, however, and you become aware of what has actually happened, despite the main POVs best efforts to hide his crime. Thom Duncan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 14 Dec 2001 13:57:17 -0700 On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 11:40:49AM -0700, Brown wrote: > Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. -- Terry L Jeffress | Man does not live by words alone, despite the South Jordan, UT | fact that he sometimes has to eat them. | -- Adlai Stevenson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:01:28 -0700 AIs it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? The first thing that pops into my mind is a poem: Robert Browning's "Soliloquiy in a Spanish Cloister." The first-person narrator is excoriating another person whom he detests, but is unaware that with every word he gives away his own moral corruption. Browning was good at that. Normally, though, I don't read long works whose protagonist is disgusting. I want to read about people with whom I can sympathize. I want the central character to be someone I can root for. I don't why people want to go to movies about criminals. (So you probably give Ocean's 11 a high rating.) barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:35:37 -0700 Eric writes: >Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the >protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the >author clearly has nothing but contempt? >Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on >this sort of thing? A few suggestions: You might try a strange little book by Steve Brewer called "Lonely Street." It's one in a series of books about a rather clumsy detective named Bubba Mabry. In this episode, Bubba is hired to be a bodyguard for a local "celebrity." (Turns out the celebrity is Elvis himself. It's pretty funny). I think Brewer is constantly making fun of his "hero" Bubba, but I'm not sure he harbors any real "contempt" for him. It strikes me as the same type of satirical mockery done in "Waiting for Guffman," where, as ridiculous as these people are, you still end up somewhat enamored by them. And in the same genre, another interesting narrator/author conflict shows up in Agatha Christie's _Murder of Roger Ackroyd_, where....well, I won't spoil it for you, but trust me, it's brilliant. Just email me personally if you want a real synopsis without reading the book. (I'd feel like I was giving away the plot to "The Sixth Sense" if I explained exactly how the book is relevant to your question, and I don't want to spoil it for anyone). You also might be interested in an essay by Peter Rabinowitz, "Truth in Fiction: A Critical Examination of Audiences," published in _Critical Inquiry_ 4 (1977) pp. 121-141. It's not as fun to read as the aforementioned suggestions, but it does investigate the theoretical implications of the kind of narrative voice you are crafting. Best of luck. I look forward to reading it. --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Melissa Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:58:05 -0700 On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 , Eric D. Snider wrote: >I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a = long,=20 >long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > >Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the=20 >protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom = the=20 >author clearly has nothing but contempt? >I don't want to go into details, because I'm insanely secretive and=20 >paranoid, but my story is a series of journal entries -- first-person = very=20 >limited POV -- written by someone whom I find to be a laughable person. = Her=20 >being laughable is integral to the story: I want readers to laugh at = this=20 >person, and the fact that she never realizes how clueless she is just = part=20 >of the joke. I don't know how successful this is. If it's a naive character--someone whose perceptions are obviously wrong--that's one thing, but the word "contempt" really makes me think twice about the author. What would be = the point of doing it? Vicarious laughter at a laughable person? I think it straddles the line between humor and derision. I think anything is = possible in stories, but I wonder how comfortable readers would feel about this = kind of character. Especially if the reader had some of the laughable character's flaws and foibles; by extension, the author is then laughing = at the reader as well. >Can this work? What examples can we think of where the main character is= =20 >nothing but an object of derision? I think of "Waiting for Guffman," = where=20 >the characters never learn, grow, or realize how wrong they are. That = one=20 >seems to work because it's satire -- which my story is, too, sort of -- = and=20 >because it's not very long. We don't need any emotional investment in = the=20 >characters, because the movie is so darned funny and isn't epic-length. I was thinking of "Seinfeld" myself, though I didn't get the sense that = the writers and actors and producers disliked the characters on that show. I agree about the length. I think a long work in which the characters = never change or grow might seem pointless. >Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on= =20 >this sort of thing? There are two YA novels by the British writer Louise Rennison called = _Angus, Thongs, and Full-Frontal Snogging_ and _On the Bright Side, I'm Now the Girlfriend of a Sex God_ that come close. These are told in diary format and are often compared to _Bridget Jones' Diary_ for all sorts of reasons (diary, British, etc). The main character is a fourteen-year-old girl = named Georgia who writes about her horrible but humorous life. The big secret = is that to discerning readers, Georgia isn't really the hero she believes herself to be. She does stupid things, complains about her best friend's lack of compassion (though she herself is profoundly self-obsessed) and isn't really a nice person. I think the key, though, is that Rennison's presentation makes Georgia laughable without making her the object of derision. I'm also reminded of "May the Good Lord Bless and Keep You," = one of my favorite stories, painful and funny at the same time. Again, the = risk really seems to me that if your reader identifies in any way with the much-derided protagonist, that will be an instant turn off. We don't = mind laughing at others, but we detest being laughed at. Melissa Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ethan Skarstedt" Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 15:15:45 -0700 Eric D. Snider:=20 "Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the=20 protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the=20 author clearly has nothing but contempt?" I would be leery of a story where the author's contempt for the protagonist causes the readers to have contempt for the protagonist as well. I'm fine with reading about villains I have contempt for but not about such protagonists. I can't get interested in them. Now, satire on the other hand, is a different kettle of fish. A truly vicious and bitingly insightful satire is something in which contempt for the protagonist is a good thing. I would buy a work like that by Eric on spec. "Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on=20 this sort of thing?" Dumb and Dumber's humor worked for me but then, I had sympathy for the characters. (and more empathy than I generally like to admit) =20 -Ethan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:11:51 -0800 What is the date of this particular talk by Dyer? Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:35:30 -0800 (PST) --- "Eric D. Snider" wrote: > I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a > long, > long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom > the > author clearly has nothing but contempt? > Evelyn Waugh, of course, who wrote the great misanthropic satires "The Loved One", "A Handful of Dust", and "Vile Bodies." The perspectives in these novels shift between omniscient narrators and hateful first-person narrators. A woman once asked Waugh "How can you write such monstrous things about people and call yourself a Christian?" He replied, "Madam, if it was not for my faith I would scarcely be human at all." Also Tom Wolfe. His books are full of healthy, life-affirming contempt, especially "The Bonfire of the Vanities" and the non-fiction masterpiece "Radical Chic." He is gifted at hilariously entering the minds of thoroughly obnoxious people. ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kathy_f@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 15:58:54 -0700 On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 "Eric D. Snider" writes: > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for > whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? As a reader, if I start a book and the character is someone I feel nothing but contempt for, I would throw the book across the room or into the circular file. I've done it before and I'll continue doing it. I don't have time to waste on fiction that leaves my heart out of the story, or leads me to feel anger, contempt or disgust toward the main character. I strive to remove these kinds of emotions from my heart on a daily basis--I cannot imagine a piece of fiction so well written as to be worth indulging in feelings I am constantly seeking to repent of in real life. The only book I can think of with a character even the author had to have contempt for would be Albert Camus' book, _The Stranger_. I don't know if Camus *had* contempt for his character. I know I sure did. If there was a single work of fiction in the entire world I truly, venomously despised, this would be it. A story not worth the paper it was printed on. And _Waiting for Godot_ runs a close second, IMO. Kathy Fowkes Mesa, AZ ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? (comp 2) Date: 14 Dec 2001 16:23:30 -0800 >>Richard wrote: "Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get >>Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks." >>speaking of Brent Hendrickson. >Perhaps, Richard, if you really expect her not to contact Horizon, you >ought to offer to speak to Brent and let him know that his behavior is >unprofessional and could get easily get him fired. Something needs to >be done to correct the situation and speaking to Horizon is the obvious >course of action. If you don't want that to happen because of some >personal liking for Mr. Hendrickson, then take responsibility for it and >offer to speak to him yourself. >-Ethan Skarstedt I think Ethan and a couple of others have the right course here. Richard - You need to speak to your friend and tell him to not do this. Personally I probably would have pulled out the hammer first thing and called Horizon but this post from Ethan stilled my heat and made me think. If your friend wants to do this extra curricular reading he needs to clear it with the proper authorities and not do this on his own (I would guess for some kind of referral fee?). Unprofessional behavior no matter how well meaning should never be allowed to continue. Richard - Just as a side light...I would print some of this string and show him how close he has come to getting fired or at the very least reprimanded and put on probation. Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Re: Story Beginnings Date: 14 Dec 2001 11:13:59 -0700 This entire thread is something I've been struggling with recently. After reading one of my manuscripts, I had several people tell me that I started the action too quickly, before they got to care for the main character. They each advised me to basically back up and let them get to know her first. At first I tried that, but I ended up adding what amounted to three chapters of padding. I think I solved the problem with that particular story by some serious cutting and them juggling of other story elements and such. But now I'm stuck trying to figure out how to start my next novel, where a character must undergo a lot of turmoil and change because of a major turning point in her life. But can I start with the turning point itself? Don't I have to establish the status quo and the character before the change can occur? (Otherwise, how can the full trauma of the turning point be known to the reader?) How much time do I get to do to establish the background? A paragraph? A page? A couple of pages? A chapter? Or do I rely on clunky backflashes to show what life was like before the event? Jumping into the middle of a dramatic moment is always the pat advice, but somehow I think that works better for thrillers and other action-driven stories, rather than character-driven ones. Any ideas? Annette Lyon -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 15 Dec 2001 13:25:33 -0500 Richard, I don't understand this view at all. Of course contacting Horizon would get him in trouble. And it seems to me that he should be in trouble. I think it's very bad business for someone to hijack professional communication to promote a personal agenda. And to do it in such a manner--with scriptural references or what have you--in any other business scheme it would mark it as a scam in my book. If someone was trying to sell you something else using the same tactics would you view their efforts with the same leniancy? You say he's clumsy but well meaning. Where do his good intentions lie? With the author? I don't think so. At least not from what Jana related. He is preying on the emotions of a would-be author. If this friend of his wants business he should go about it in a more legitimate matter. If Horizon thought it was ok to refer authors to this editor they could say so themselves. Since the employee feels the need to do it in such a shady manner he must know that it is not something he should really be doing. If I was 'the powers that be" as Horizon I would fire this person without a qualm. [Tracie Laulusa] ----- Original Message ----- Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "robert lauer" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit (was: Critiques and Writer's Dreams) Date: 15 Dec 2001 16:18:32 -0500 Harlow S. Clark wrote: >But, do we really want to think of our potential audience as having been >deceived by Satan? Sadly enough, I think that many Church members (artists among them) DO this. But I wonder if the truth of the matter is that many LDS artists either are indeed NOT as good as the artists "of the world," or if perhaps, they ARE as good, but they're simply ignorant about such things as agents, networking, distribution--the BUSINESS of producing, publishing, etc. Perhaps we (like all artists) FEEL very passionately about what we're doing. But whereas the "worldly" artist, when her/his work is rejected, feels that SHE/HE personally is being rejected personally, the Mormon artist, when rejected, deals with those same feeling but imagining that the GOSPEL is being rejected. The "worldly" artist pegs cultural Philistines as the culprits; the LDS artist pegs Satan and his cohorts. >I have often found non-Mormon audiences more receptive to my stories, and >the spirituality in them, than Mormon audiences. This has always been my experience. My first LDS play DIGGER was handled with kid gloves by the LDS/BYU artistic community. It was praised on one hand and given the 1982 Mayhew Award. As the Mayhew Award winner, it was to be produced on BYU's main stage the following year. (Up until that time, this had been the case.)But at the last moment, the play was dropped from the season because it was felt it might offend some Church members. This didn't surprise me. In fact, what DID surprise me was that BYU gave it an award and that individual faculty members praised my work--privately. One good professor even called me to his office and suggested that I transfer to another university because I had talent and (this makes my point)NON-MORMONS would probably be more supportive of my writing......ON MORMON TOPICS!!! DIGGER was produced that year as a Graduate Student production. And while this was going on, a secular theatre--The Generic Theatre in Norfolk, Virginia--was reading the play and considering it for production the following season as their annual new play selection. (They ended up not producing it, but not because it dealt with Mormonism.) Back in the early 1990's, a Utah-based publisher of LDS plays and musicals contacted me while I was living in New York City, requesting a copy of DIGGER; he had heard about it and had an eye towards handling the property. After reading it, he wrote me back saying that the play could never be produced by a Ward or Stake. "Who could possibly produce it?" he asked me. I wrote the play (which deals with Joseph Smith's courtship with Emma and his evolution from a frontier village seer/peep stone gazer into a prophet) as a piece of Americana. (Some people are Anglo-philes; I'm an early Americana-phile.) It never occurred to this particular LDS plat publisher that since Mormonism is America's most successful "homegrown" religion (if not it's ONLY homegrown religion), Americans in general might find the play somewhat interesting. (The Church is never mentioned in the script--since it hadn't been founded yet. The word "Mormon" doesn't appear in it, since Joseph had yet to be given the plates.In short, if one didn't know that Joseph Smith founded the LDS Church, you'd never know you were seeing a play dealing with the social roots of Mormonism.) In 1987, I finished my second LDS play THE BEEHIVE STATE. The reaction by all of my LDS friends at the time who read the script were negative. In 1988, it was produced by the Olde Theatre Company (Portsmouth, Virginia). The audience reactions were overwhelmingly positive. So were the reactions of the area critics. The play was a comedy/drama centered around post-Manifesto polygamy in a Provo, Utah family--the central character being the husband's first wife--a woman in late middle age. One critic said that this character's evolution in dealing with her faith was "one of the most moving and important issues to be dealt with in any area theatrical production this year." SUNSTONE published the play in 1989, and to this day, I have not had a single member of the Church mention the play to me. I'm not saying that either of my plays are "great theatre." They were early efforts and I think they are lacking in many respects. But when I see my--for lack of a better word--competition in the area of LDS playwriting during the 1980's, I'm a more than a little confused. My two LDS plays are in my writer's portfolio; I've submit them to theatres and production companies whenever I've applied for jobs or gone out for writing commissions. And most of the time, I've gotten the jobs. In the case of EVERY one of these writing jobs, the artistic director or producer doing the hiring has commented first and foremost on either DIGGER or BEEHIVE STATE--comment positively, that is. And so it is that I, a self-described Mormon writer, have written two Mormon plays that non-Mormons have tended to appreciate and find interesting and entertaining, but which Mormons have completely rejected--or even worse--ignored. One more thing: Remember that awful (or so I thought) TV movie from 1995 AVENGING ANGEL about Brigham Young's fictional Danite body-guard? The New York Times began their negative review of the film by stating how much dramatic potential the "little know story of the Mormons" has. The review ended lamenting--and I paraphrase--"some day some one is going to discover the story of the Mormons and make a great film. Unfortunately AVENGING ANGELS is not that film." I'll end beating the same dead horse that I always end up smacking around: the "world" is a lot more open-minded and ready for Mormon art than many of us even imagine. And I'm not talking of art that tries to pass itself off as "Christian" or "Evangelical" in nature--that is propaganda in which the artist is trying to convince the world to bestow upon the Church the coveted (Why?!)label of "Christian." Perhaps too often we LDS artists are tempted to walk out into the ring waving our hands over our heads and shouting, "Please like me! Please! You see, Mormons are people just like you! Mormons are Christians, too!" Apologia can never be the foundation of high art. Apologia comes from a place of self-perceived weakness and inferiority. Art comes from a place of values being celebrated--not values being merely explained or defended. How much better off we might be if we just threw out the Church vs. the world paradigm and immersed ourselves in creating works that embrace our unique beliefs, customs and cultures; works built on the foundational concept that we ARE a peculiar people--DIFFERENT from others--and that we're perfectly okay--even happy--about it. ROB. LAUER _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 15 Dec 2001 19:25:24 -0700 There is a big difference between the Church of Jesus Christ and ethnicity or race or culture. There is a Mormon culture, which only vaguely resembles the actual teachings of the Church, and in that context it would be easier to overcome cultural boundaries. If one actually wishes to include Church teachings specifically and have characters that are converted rather than cultural Mormons then the difficulty is much, much greater. In Ocean's Eleven there are two characters called the "Mormon Twins" and they're con-men and thieves. The fact is, Utah is well known for confidence schemes. It is one of the testing ground con men use for new schemes. Obviously the characters in the movie aren't really LDS, but it's a sign that things are changing. Instead of literature that is intelligible only to cultural Mormons or preaching disguised as literature (which is perfectly legitimate in my opinion) the best way to gain acceptance is to simply have a "mainstream" style of story with a Mormon character as a contrast. Pick a genre, avoid the nasty stuff, and add a Mormon character that can fit the story. That way it might get published if it's merely good instead of great. If you look back there aren't very many "preachy" books that have been wildly successful; there aren't even very many classics of that kind. Most of the time great writers have to disguise their preachings to get the message out at all. Look at Sir Walter Scott in Ivanhoe. Everything is sterotyped except Rebecca. She's the modern eye view of the Medieval world. It's the first anti-anti-Semitic literature that was popular. Without being aware one can't help but sympathize with Rebecca more than any other character because she's more like the modern reader than any of the other characters. She's the liberal (old sense) ideal--compassionate, gentle, kind, generous, virtuous and noble. She's even tolerant, unlike every other character in the book. If Sir Walter had just written "it is wrong to despise or hate the Jews," in his time and climate he would not be remembered as he is; instead he planted a seed that eventually bore fruit. How much fruit is difficult to know, but literature does have an effect on people. Whether or not millions of people stopped hating the Jews because of him, he made the attempt and it was a noble one. I think that is a good enough ideal, and that it is more important to influence for good than to try and explain all the cultural vagaries of Mormons. It is just as likely to lose the moral of the story while trying to figure out why so many teenagers in Utah think drinking beer is more sinful than adultery--unless that is the moral of the story. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 15 Dec 2001 19:31:39 -0700 It has been done but not always well. Les Liaisons Dangereuses by Choderlos de Laclos is a good example. It's epistolary and the characters are all pretty contemptible, though it's questionable whether Laclos despised them as much as he pretended. He certainly does claim to hold them all in contempt but that might have been politics talking. The book is a 'classic,' though I can't stand it myself. On the other hand I'm a big Jane Austen fan and I don't like her epistolary stuff either. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Kathleen Dalton-Woodbury Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 15 Dec 2001 22:04:15 -0700 Aren't you describing one form of what is called an "unreliable narrator," Eric? There is a character that I see this way, though others may not: Elizabeth Peters' Amelia Peabody is certainly someone who "never realizes how clueless she is" as she goes about trying to solve the mysteries on which each novel is based. The fact that I see her this way has contributed to my unwillingness to continue reading her adventures, so I don't really know if others (who must continue to buy and read the books, since they continue to do well in the market) perceive her in this way or not. Anyway, that may help answer your question. This reader, at least, is not willing to spend time with such a character. I need to care about the characters I spend time with, and I can't seem to care very much about "one who knows not and knows not that [she] knows not." She's a fool that I am unable to suffer gladly. If you feel contempt for your character, how do you think you can get your readers to want to keep reading about her? (Of course, there is also the example of the woman in the BBC television series, KEEPING UP APPEARANCES, Harriet Bucket, I think her name is, who insists on pronouncing her last name as "Bouquet" and has all kinds of other pretensions. She's quite popular, because people like to laugh at her, I guess. Maybe I'm just not part of the audience for what you're trying to do.) Kathleen Dalton-Woodbury workshop@burgoyne.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: [AML] Novels and History Date: 15 Dec 2001 23:01:33 -0500 I just went to a wedding at the Orlando temple and while there had one of my relatively infrequent visits to an LDS book store. It is quite a nice store, divided, like most stores into categories- - Inspiration --Self Help-- etc. I looked at the section of novels and fiction where I picked up the latest Dean Hughes book, then wandered over to the History section which was topped with one entire shelf of hard cover copies of all of the _Work and the Glory_ series, with a second shelf of soft cover versions and "book on tape" versions. Beneath that were three copies of Margaret Young"s historical novel _One More River to Cross_, then came Hugh Nibley, Truman Madsen, a couple of _FARMS_ things, etc. I questioned the young lady at the counter, expressing some doubt that these books should be placed in church history. I believe a made some comment about people trying to find the Steed home in Nauvoo. Her reply was "Of course they would not find it there". I pressed her on the reason they were shelved in the History section and her reply was "Well, It's not like they were novels." I assured here that, even with the research he did, that Lund would consider them novels. Her reply was "Well, the aren't, and I have a customer to take care of." I walked away somewhat saddened. Margaret, I considered your book a novel (well researched and important but ultimately a novel. Certainly I thing TWATG as novels. I am not sure what more to say, but I think its a little scary. [MOD: Note from subsequent post, added in by moderator]: Actually, right after I pressed the send key, I thought that _One More River to Cross_ is probably more biography than novel. But Lund's characters aren't even real people. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Skeleton Story Beginnings Date: 17 Dec 2001 09:01:30 -0700 Unfortunately, there is an image in Gravity's Rainbow that continues to stay with me and disgust me as much as a porno tv program I once flicked through quickly, and a scene from Rosemary's Baby. I don't think about these horrible things always, but I just wish I had never cluttered my brain with them. Marilyn Brown -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] DAVIS, _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Desert News review) Date: 17 Dec 2001 02:08:52 +0000 Friday, December 14, 2001 'Heaven' lacks depth of real story By Jeff Vice Deseret News movie critic THE OTHER SIDE OF HEAVEN =97** 1/2 =97 Christopher Gorham, Anne Hathaway, Joe Folau, Miriama Smith, Nathaniel Lees, Whetu Fala, Al Fitisemanu; rated PG (violence, brief vulgarity, brief gore); Megaplex 17 at Jordan Commons. "In the Eye of the Storm," the real-life account of the experiences of LDS General Authority John H. Groberg when he was a teenager serving a church mission to the Kingdom of Tonga, would make a great film. "The Other Side of Heaven," a good-looking but rather superficial adaptation of Elder Groberg's novel, is not that film. Not that it's terrible, mind you. In fact, the film's pleas for racial tolerance, compassion and service without expectation of reward are messages we need in these trying times. And during this weak cinematic year, a live-action movie you can actually take the whole family to is a welcome sight. But compared to what "The Other Side of Heaven" could have been =97 should have been =97 this drama is definitely something of a disappointment. We have probably come to expect little depth in most films, but considering the promising source material here, this one should do more than simply skim the surface. Television actor Christopher Gorham ("Popular") stars as the teenage Groberg, who is attending Brigham Young University in 1953 when he receives his mission call. Obviously, he's excited, although it means he must leave behind his true love, Jean Sabin (Anne Hathaway, from "The Princess Diaries"). His exuberance will soon serve him well, however, as the naive missionary-to-be has no idea what's really waiting for him in Tonga =97 starting with the journey there, which takes him nearly three very trying months. And when he finally does arrive, there's nobody waiting there to aid him, except for Feki (Joe Folau), a local who becomes his mission companion. Despite Feki's help, Elder Groberg has a lot of obstacles in his path, not the least of which is a language barrier =97 few of the Tongans speak English. And, of course, they're extremely skeptical about the odd newcomer in their midst. However, the elder quickly proves his worth. First, he does some intensive study to learn the language. Then when a tropical storm threatens to destroy the island, he's there to offer aid and comfort. He must also stay true to Jean, who's busy fighting off suitors of her own. And their long-distance commitment could be in real trouble when it appears that his mission could be extended. Admittedly, this is a handsomely mounted production that belies its $8 million budget =97 which may be large by independent- film standards, but which is extremely low for the industry as a whole. Especially impressive are the storm effects (nearly rivaling those in the much-pricier major-studio film "The Perfect Storm"). And to his credit, filmmaker Mitch Davis has filled out his cast with appealing fresh faces. As Groberg, Gorham has charm, though his too-good-to-be-true portrayal makes the character a bit bland. He's well-matched with Hathaway, who has to make their relationship= =20 seem believable without much screen time together. The biggest surprise is Folau, a charismatic newcomer whose presence would be welcome again. "The Other Side of Heaven" is rated PG for violence (forces of nature), brief mild vulgarity (a flatulence gag) and brief gore. Running time: 114 minutes. =A9 2001 Deseret News Publishing Company _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Contacting Authors (was: Curious Letter from Horizon) Date: 17 Dec 2001 14:12:35 -0600 Thanks for you help on this. BTW, why do you think it's unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some editorial help? That is not meant to be an argumentative question. I'm curious about your perspective on the issue Richard -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] Contacting Authors (resend) Date: 17 Dec 2001 14:14:48 -0600 [MOD: Apologies for not including the "From" line in my first resend of this message.] Thanks for you help on this. BTW, why do you think it's unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some editorial help? That is not meant to be an argumentative question. I'm curious about your perspective on the issue Richard -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Preston Hunter" Subject: [AML] Blair Treu, LDS Filmmaker Date: 28 Nov 2001 23:10:56 -0600 Blair Treu is a featured speaker at the upcoming "International Young LDS Film Festival." His address is titled: "From BYU to Hollywood: Experiences of an LDS Feature Filmmaker." It occurred to me that many on the AML List may not be familiar with Treu's work, so I thought I would pass on something I wrote a while back: Blair Treu's films are characterized by a distinctive passion and charm that have earned this director critical praise and numerous awards. Treu graduated from Brigham Young University in 1985 with a Bachelors of Fine Arts degree in theater. While at BYU, Treu won multiple Final Cut awards at the university's prestigious student film festival. According to the university's theater department alumni magazine, Audience, Treu "then went to work for the late Frank Wells, president of The Walt Disney Company. After leaving Disney, Blair directed dozens of award-winning short films." Treu's work at this time included industrial video, such as a project for Rocky Mountain Helicopters, based in Provo. Much of Treu's work has been directing the most challenging genre in Hollywood: family films and programming for young people. Treu has a knack for creating films that everyone can enjoy, without feeling that their intelligence is being insulted, their time wasted, or their sense of human decency assaulted. And they're genuinely funny, touching and entertaining films, as well. Treu's feature film debut as a director was Leucadia's Just Like Dad (1995). Shot entirely in Salt Lake City, this direct-to-video film was written by Wayne Allan Rice, who also wrote Only You and Suicide Kings, and produced The Paper Brigade; Lost & Found and Dude, Where's My Car?, among other projects. Ben Diskin (Kindergarten Cop, "Hey, Arnold!") stars as "Charlie," a boy embarrased by his somewhat nebbish father. Charlie's sympathetic dad is played by Wallace Shawn ("Grand Nagus Zek" from "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine", and a character actor from dozens of films, including The Curse of the Jade Scorpion, Toy Story, All Dogs Go to Heaven 2 and The Princess Bride). Other cast members include Frank Gerrish ("Ralph" in Brigham City), Michael Flynn, Duane Stephens, Christy Summerhays, Elisabeth Lund and Nick Murdock. When Charlie meets Joe, a handsome, athletic and kind man without kids, he somehow convinces Joe to "stand in" for his father at a school picnic. Everything goes as planned at the picnic, but as Charlie attempts to extend this scheme, complications occur. Charlie ends up realizing there is nobody he admires more than his own plain-seeming but very admirable father. In 1995, Treu won the coveted Crystal Heart Award at the Heartland Film Festival for Just Like Dad. Held yearly in Indianapolis, Indiana, the festival "was founded in 1991 to positively effect change in the film industry, awarding cash prizes and the Crystal Heart Award to independent filmmakers whose entries best combine production and artistic quality while meeting the Festival's statement of purpose: 'to recognize and honor filmmakers whose work explores the human journey by artistically expressing hope and respect for the positive values of life.' " In 1996, Treu's next film was also for Leucadia: Wish Upon a Star. This film was also shot in Salt Lake (in West Valley). This is a light-hearted family comedy. The lead characters are Alexia and Hayley, two sisters who seem to have little in common and rarely get along. Alexia is a fashion-driven airhead while Hayley is into science, math, and could be considered a nerd. One night Hayley sees a comet, and on a whim she wishes she could trade places with her sister. The next morning, her wish has come true and the expected hilarity ensues. It's not an original plot device, but it's done well here, and this is an enjoyable straight-to-video film. Wish Upon a Star was written by Los Angeles writer and screenwriter Jessica Barondes. (Barondes also wrote Lucy, a young adult novel that is part of the "Sweet 16" book series.) Wish Upon a Star stars Katherine Heigl (from "Roswell") and Danielle Harris (from "Roseanne") as the soul-switching sisters. M. Scott Wilkinson, in one of his biggest film roles, plays their father. Other cast members include Ivey Lloyd, Charles Metten, and Jacque Gray ("Sister Fronk" from God's Army). In 1997, Treu received his second Crystal Heart Award for Wish Upon a Star. Wish Upon a Star has been released on DVD and includes a commentary track by Blair Treu and the screenwriter. (Because it includes a commentary track, this may be the best item to check out for people who are particularly interested in this director's work and his insights.) Treu directed a third feature film for Leucadia in Salt Lake City: The Paper Brigade (1996). Written by Denice K. Rice, the film stars Kyle Howard as "Gunther Wheeler," a tough 14-year-old from New York City who finds himself an unhappy "fish out of water" when his family moves to the small town of Pleasant Valley. Things start looking up when he meets and is smitten by a beautiful local girl named Allison (Kylee Cochran). In order to impress her he decides to take her to a rock concert, but in order to do that, he has to earn money for the tickets. So he takes on a temporary job as a substitute paper boy. Michael Flynn (The Testaments of One Fold and One Shepherd) and Suzanne Barnes play Gunther's parents. Other cast members include Frank Gerrish, Mikey Peterson, Ethan Glazer, and Matthew Ness. For about three years between 1997 and 1999 Treu worked in Southern California as a television director. He primarily worked on episodes of "Power Rangers," the Saban Entertainment science fiction action series import from Japan. "Power Rangers Turbo" (1997), "Power Rangers In Space" (1998) and "Power Rangers Lost Galaxy" (1999) are yearly incarnations of essentially the same kids-oriented TV series. Most of the "Power Rangers" episodes that Treu directed were written by Judd Lynn. An example of Treu's "Power Rangers" work can be found in the 90-minute video movie "Power Rangers: Lost Galaxy: The Return of the Magna Defender." This direct-to-video film was a sort of sequel to the 1999 episode "Magna Defender", which first aired on April 3, 1999 and was directed by Koichi Sakamoto. Synopsis: "The Rangers, onboard the space colony Terra Venture, must keep the powerful Lights of Orion out of the hands of the evil Scorpious, and must contend with the former hero Magna Defender, who may be friend or foe." In 1999 Treu directed episodes of "Chicken Soup for the Soul", a PAX television series based on the immensely popular series of books created by Jack Canfield and Mark Victor Hansen. Treu's next feature length film was for the Disney Channel: Phantom of the Megaplex (2000). This film was written by screenwriter Stu Krieger, whose other credits include Disney's The Poof Point, two Don Bluth animated features -- A Troll in Central Park and The Land Before Time -- and other films. Grossbart/Barnett Productions produced the film in association with the Disney Channel. According to a Disney press release, the plot of Phantom of the Megaplex "follows one night in the life of 16-year-old Peter Riley, a teen-ager proud of his job at the local 26-screen megaplex. Tonight, the monstrous theater will play host to its first premiere gala, and everything is perfect until a string of peculiar occurrences awakens the myth of the Phantom. Peter finds himself in the middle of the melee, eventually unmasking the marauder and returning the theater to normal." Veteran actor Mickey Rooney is the film's best known cast member, but he is surrounded by other talented actors. Under Treu's direction, three of the movie's young cast members were nominated for Young Artist awards: Jacob Smith ("Best Performance in a TV Movie (Comedy or Drama) - Young Actor Age 10 or Under"), Taylor Handley ("Best Performance in a TV Movie (Comedy) - Leading Young Actor") and Caitlin Wachs ("Best Performance in a TV Movie (Comedy) - Supporting Young Actress"). Treu made another film shown on the Disney Channel: The Brainiacs.com (2000). This one was produced by PorchLight Entertainment, which produces the "Adventures from the Book of Virtues" television series. The plot has Michael Angarano's young character using his considerable intellect and the Internet to purchase his dad's toy company. Other cast members include Kevin Kilner, Alexandra Paul, Rich Little, Dom DeLuise, and Florence Stanley. In 2001 Treu won a third Crystal Heart Award for his dramatic feature film Secret Keeper. The screenplay for this film was written by Jessica Barondes, the writer of Treu's Wish Upon a Star. Secret Keeper also marks yet another collaboration between Treu and cinematographer Brian Sullivan. Their previous pictures together include Just Like Dad, Wish Upon a Star and The Paper Brigade. Secret Keeper stars Evan Rachel Wood (Simone), Michael Angarano ("Chance Arno" on the Utah-filmed TV series "Cover Me"), and David Gallagher ("Simon Camden" on the "7th Heaven" TV series). Other cast members include Vivica A. Fox (Two Can Play That Game), Rick Macy (Brigham City; Testaments), Paul Kiernan, Tayva Patch (Brigham City; Testaments), Caitlin Meyer, Haley McCormick (No More Baths), RuDee Lipscomb, and Erica Angarano. Secret Keeper was produced by Leucadia's Don Schain and distributed by Columbia TriStar. -- Preston Hunter www.adherents.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andrew Hall" Subject: [AML] DAVIS, _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Desert News review) Date: 17 Dec 2001 02:08:52 +0000 Friday, December 14, 2001 'Heaven' lacks depth of real story By Jeff Vice Deseret News movie critic THE OTHER SIDE OF HEAVEN =97** 1/2 =97 Christopher Gorham, Anne Hathaway, Joe Folau, Miriama Smith, Nathaniel Lees, Whetu Fala, Al Fitisemanu; rated PG (violence, brief vulgarity, brief gore); Megaplex 17 at Jordan Commons. "In the Eye of the Storm," the real-life account of the experiences of LDS General Authority John H. Groberg when he was a teenager serving a church mission to the Kingdom of Tonga, would make a great film. "The Other Side of Heaven," a good-looking but rather superficial adaptation of Elder Groberg's novel, is not that film. Not that it's terrible, mind you. In fact, the film's pleas for racial tolerance, compassion and service without expectation of reward are messages we need in these trying times. And during this weak cinematic year, a live-action movie you can actually take the whole family to is a welcome sight. But compared to what "The Other Side of Heaven" could have been =97 should have been =97 this drama is definitely something of a disappointment. We have probably come to expect little depth in most films, but considering the promising source material here, this one should do more than simply skim the surface. Television actor Christopher Gorham ("Popular") stars as the teenage Groberg, who is attending Brigham Young University in 1953 when he receives his mission call. Obviously, he's excited, although it means he must leave behind his true love, Jean Sabin (Anne Hathaway, from "The Princess Diaries"). His exuberance will soon serve him well, however, as the naive missionary-to-be has no idea what's really waiting for him in Tonga =97 starting with the journey there, which takes him nearly three very trying months. And when he finally does arrive, there's nobody waiting there to aid him, except for Feki (Joe Folau), a local who becomes his mission companion. Despite Feki's help, Elder Groberg has a lot of obstacles in his path, not the least of which is a language barrier =97 few of the Tongans speak English. And, of course, they're extremely skeptical about the odd newcomer in their midst. However, the elder quickly proves his worth. First, he does some intensive study to learn the language. Then when a tropical storm threatens to destroy the island, he's there to offer aid and comfort. He must also stay true to Jean, who's busy fighting off suitors of her own. And their long-distance commitment could be in real trouble when it appears that his mission could be extended. Admittedly, this is a handsomely mounted production that belies its $8 million budget =97 which may be large by independent- film standards, but which is extremely low for the industry as a whole. Especially impressive are the storm effects (nearly rivaling those in the much-pricier major-studio film "The Perfect Storm"). And to his credit, filmmaker Mitch Davis has filled out his cast with appealing fresh faces. As Groberg, Gorham has charm, though his too-good-to-be-true portrayal makes the character a bit bland. He's well-matched with Hathaway, who has to make their relationship= =20 seem believable without much screen time together. The biggest surprise is Folau, a charismatic newcomer whose presence would be welcome again. "The Other Side of Heaven" is rated PG for violence (forces of nature), brief mild vulgarity (a flatulence gag) and brief gore. Running time: 114 minutes. =A9 2001 Deseret News Publishing Company _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: [AML] Novels and Stuff Date: 15 Dec 2001 23:08:45 -0500 Actually, right after I pressed the send key, I thought that _One More River to Cross_ is probably more biography than novel. But Lund's characters aren't even real people. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard Johnson Subject: [AML] Novels and History Date: 15 Dec 2001 23:01:33 -0500 I just went to a wedding at the Orlando temple and while there had one of my relatively infrequent visits to an LDS book store. It is quite a nice store, divided, like most stores into categories- - Inspiration --Self Help-- etc. I looked at the section of novels and fiction where I picked up the latest Dean Hughes book, then wandered over to the History section which was topped with one entire shelf of hard cover copies of all of the _Work and the Glory_ series, with a second shelf of soft cover versions and "book on tape" versions. Beneath that were three copies of Margaret Young"s historical novel _One More River to Cross_, then came Hugh Nibley, Truman Madsen, a couple of _FARMS_ things, etc. I questioned the young lady at the counter, expressing some doubt that these books should be placed in church history. I believe a made some comment about people trying to find the Steed home in Nauvoo. Her reply was "Of course they would not find it there". I pressed her on the reason they were shelved in the History section and her reply was "Well, It's not like they were novels." I assured here that, even with the research he did, that Lund would consider them novels. Her reply was "Well, the aren't, and I have a customer to take care of." I walked away somewhat saddened. Margaret, I considered your book a novel (well researched and important but ultimately a novel. Certainly I thing TWATG as novels. I am not sure what more to say, but I think its a little scary. Richard B. Johnson Husband, Father, Grandfather, Puppeteer, Playwright, Writer, Director, Actor, Thingmaker, Mormon, Person, Fool I sometimes think that the last persona is the most important http://www2.gasou.edu/commarts/puppet/ Georgia Southern University Puppet Theatre -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "robert lauer" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit (was: Critiques and Writer's Dreams) Date: 15 Dec 2001 16:18:32 -0500 Harlow S. Clark wrote: >But, do we really want to think of our potential audience as having been >deceived by Satan? Sadly enough, I think that many Church members (artists among them) DO this. But I wonder if the truth of the matter is that many LDS artists either are indeed NOT as good as the artists "of the world," or if perhaps, they ARE as good, but they're simply ignorant about such things as agents, networking, distribution--the BUSINESS of producing, publishing, etc. Perhaps we (like all artists) FEEL very passionately about what we're doing. But whereas the "worldly" artist, when her/his work is rejected, feels that SHE/HE personally is being rejected personally, the Mormon artist, when rejected, deals with those same feeling but imagining that the GOSPEL is being rejected. The "worldly" artist pegs cultural Philistines as the culprits; the LDS artist pegs Satan and his cohorts. >I have often found non-Mormon audiences more receptive to my stories, and >the spirituality in them, than Mormon audiences. This has always been my experience. My first LDS play DIGGER was handled with kid gloves by the LDS/BYU artistic community. It was praised on one hand and given the 1982 Mayhew Award. As the Mayhew Award winner, it was to be produced on BYU's main stage the following year. (Up until that time, this had been the case.)But at the last moment, the play was dropped from the season because it was felt it might offend some Church members. This didn't surprise me. In fact, what DID surprise me was that BYU gave it an award and that individual faculty members praised my work--privately. One good professor even called me to his office and suggested that I transfer to another university because I had talent and (this makes my point)NON-MORMONS would probably be more supportive of my writing......ON MORMON TOPICS!!! DIGGER was produced that year as a Graduate Student production. And while this was going on, a secular theatre--The Generic Theatre in Norfolk, Virginia--was reading the play and considering it for production the following season as their annual new play selection. (They ended up not producing it, but not because it dealt with Mormonism.) Back in the early 1990's, a Utah-based publisher of LDS plays and musicals contacted me while I was living in New York City, requesting a copy of DIGGER; he had heard about it and had an eye towards handling the property. After reading it, he wrote me back saying that the play could never be produced by a Ward or Stake. "Who could possibly produce it?" he asked me. I wrote the play (which deals with Joseph Smith's courtship with Emma and his evolution from a frontier village seer/peep stone gazer into a prophet) as a piece of Americana. (Some people are Anglo-philes; I'm an early Americana-phile.) It never occurred to this particular LDS plat publisher that since Mormonism is America's most successful "homegrown" religion (if not it's ONLY homegrown religion), Americans in general might find the play somewhat interesting. (The Church is never mentioned in the script--since it hadn't been founded yet. The word "Mormon" doesn't appear in it, since Joseph had yet to be given the plates.In short, if one didn't know that Joseph Smith founded the LDS Church, you'd never know you were seeing a play dealing with the social roots of Mormonism.) In 1987, I finished my second LDS play THE BEEHIVE STATE. The reaction by all of my LDS friends at the time who read the script were negative. In 1988, it was produced by the Olde Theatre Company (Portsmouth, Virginia). The audience reactions were overwhelmingly positive. So were the reactions of the area critics. The play was a comedy/drama centered around post-Manifesto polygamy in a Provo, Utah family--the central character being the husband's first wife--a woman in late middle age. One critic said that this character's evolution in dealing with her faith was "one of the most moving and important issues to be dealt with in any area theatrical production this year." SUNSTONE published the play in 1989, and to this day, I have not had a single member of the Church mention the play to me. I'm not saying that either of my plays are "great theatre." They were early efforts and I think they are lacking in many respects. But when I see my--for lack of a better word--competition in the area of LDS playwriting during the 1980's, I'm a more than a little confused. My two LDS plays are in my writer's portfolio; I've submit them to theatres and production companies whenever I've applied for jobs or gone out for writing commissions. And most of the time, I've gotten the jobs. In the case of EVERY one of these writing jobs, the artistic director or producer doing the hiring has commented first and foremost on either DIGGER or BEEHIVE STATE--comment positively, that is. And so it is that I, a self-described Mormon writer, have written two Mormon plays that non-Mormons have tended to appreciate and find interesting and entertaining, but which Mormons have completely rejected--or even worse--ignored. One more thing: Remember that awful (or so I thought) TV movie from 1995 AVENGING ANGEL about Brigham Young's fictional Danite body-guard? The New York Times began their negative review of the film by stating how much dramatic potential the "little know story of the Mormons" has. The review ended lamenting--and I paraphrase--"some day some one is going to discover the story of the Mormons and make a great film. Unfortunately AVENGING ANGELS is not that film." I'll end beating the same dead horse that I always end up smacking around: the "world" is a lot more open-minded and ready for Mormon art than many of us even imagine. And I'm not talking of art that tries to pass itself off as "Christian" or "Evangelical" in nature--that is propaganda in which the artist is trying to convince the world to bestow upon the Church the coveted (Why?!)label of "Christian." Perhaps too often we LDS artists are tempted to walk out into the ring waving our hands over our heads and shouting, "Please like me! Please! You see, Mormons are people just like you! Mormons are Christians, too!" Apologia can never be the foundation of high art. Apologia comes from a place of self-perceived weakness and inferiority. Art comes from a place of values being celebrated--not values being merely explained or defended. How much better off we might be if we just threw out the Church vs. the world paradigm and immersed ourselves in creating works that embrace our unique beliefs, customs and cultures; works built on the foundational concept that we ARE a peculiar people--DIFFERENT from others--and that we're perfectly okay--even happy--about it. ROB. LAUER _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 15 Dec 2001 19:31:39 -0700 It has been done but not always well. Les Liaisons Dangereuses by Choderlos de Laclos is a good example. It's epistolary and the characters are all pretty contemptible, though it's questionable whether Laclos despised them as much as he pretended. He certainly does claim to hold them all in contempt but that might have been politics talking. The book is a 'classic,' though I can't stand it myself. On the other hand I'm a big Jane Austen fan and I don't like her epistolary stuff either. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 15 Dec 2001 13:25:33 -0500 Richard, I don't understand this view at all. Of course contacting Horizon would get him in trouble. And it seems to me that he should be in trouble. I think it's very bad business for someone to hijack professional communication to promote a personal agenda. And to do it in such a manner--with scriptural references or what have you--in any other business scheme it would mark it as a scam in my book. If someone was trying to sell you something else using the same tactics would you view their efforts with the same leniancy? You say he's clumsy but well meaning. Where do his good intentions lie? With the author? I don't think so. At least not from what Jana related. He is preying on the emotions of a would-be author. If this friend of his wants business he should go about it in a more legitimate matter. If Horizon thought it was ok to refer authors to this editor they could say so themselves. Since the employee feels the need to do it in such a shady manner he must know that it is not something he should really be doing. If I was 'the powers that be" as Horizon I would fire this person without a qualm. [Tracie Laulusa] ----- Original Message ----- Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Amy Chamberlain" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 19:48:00 -0700 Well, the story that came immediately to my mind is by Don Marshall, in his collection of short stories called _The Rummage Sale_. You're probably familiar with it. The story itself stars a young woman, desperate to marry and leave her somewhat hum-drum life, and consists of her letters to a missionary and his letters back. The characters themselves are really pretty laughable without meaning to be. Can't remember the name of the story, but I'm sure someone out there can. Amy -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: RE: [AML] Slogging Through... Date: 14 Dec 2001 18:50:01 -0700 At 05:42 PM 12/10/01, you wrote: >Think of the Scriptures - who hasn't had to slog >through the Isaiah portion of the Book of Mormon in 2 Nephi I've gotten so that that part actually makes sense to me. It's Chapter 5 of Jacob that kills me--isn't that the endless discussion of the tame and wild olive trees? But an LDS writer named Terry made that the chapter that converted an evangelist's son to the Church. Terry's series--Out of Darkness, Into the Light, and--and--I forget the name of the third--was an interesting fictional approach to the subject of converting people. Speaking of the Isaiah part--surely everyone here has heard the story of the LDS soldier with his BoM in his uniform pocket? Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Re: Story Beginnings Date: 14 Dec 2001 11:13:59 -0700 This entire thread is something I've been struggling with recently. After reading one of my manuscripts, I had several people tell me that I started the action too quickly, before they got to care for the main character. They each advised me to basically back up and let them get to know her first. At first I tried that, but I ended up adding what amounted to three chapters of padding. I think I solved the problem with that particular story by some serious cutting and them juggling of other story elements and such. But now I'm stuck trying to figure out how to start my next novel, where a character must undergo a lot of turmoil and change because of a major turning point in her life. But can I start with the turning point itself? Don't I have to establish the status quo and the character before the change can occur? (Otherwise, how can the full trauma of the turning point be known to the reader?) How much time do I get to do to establish the background? A paragraph? A page? A couple of pages? A chapter? Or do I rely on clunky backflashes to show what life was like before the event? Jumping into the middle of a dramatic moment is always the pat advice, but somehow I think that works better for thrillers and other action-driven stories, rather than character-driven ones. Any ideas? Annette Lyon -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? (comp 2) Date: 14 Dec 2001 16:23:30 -0800 >>Richard wrote: "Again, please do NOT contact Horizon. It will only get >>Brent in trouble and he's a well-meaning, if clumsy, individual. Thanks." >>speaking of Brent Hendrickson. >Perhaps, Richard, if you really expect her not to contact Horizon, you >ought to offer to speak to Brent and let him know that his behavior is >unprofessional and could get easily get him fired. Something needs to >be done to correct the situation and speaking to Horizon is the obvious >course of action. If you don't want that to happen because of some >personal liking for Mr. Hendrickson, then take responsibility for it and >offer to speak to him yourself. >-Ethan Skarstedt I think Ethan and a couple of others have the right course here. Richard - You need to speak to your friend and tell him to not do this. Personally I probably would have pulled out the hammer first thing and called Horizon but this post from Ethan stilled my heat and made me think. If your friend wants to do this extra curricular reading he needs to clear it with the proper authorities and not do this on his own (I would guess for some kind of referral fee?). Unprofessional behavior no matter how well meaning should never be allowed to continue. Richard - Just as a side light...I would print some of this string and show him how close he has come to getting fired or at the very least reprimanded and put on probation. Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:22:03 -0700 With this kind of writing, you can sometimes detect the real author projecting information through the narrating character but not having the narrating character recognize the information for what it is--in other words, the narrator is a clueless sieve for the author's agenda. Yes, some people do fail to recognize the details of their lives as clear patterns of stupidity or cruelty or whatever (my ex-wife comes to mind), but unless handled extremely well the narrating character can become the author's puppet rather than a real person. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:35:30 -0800 (PST) --- "Eric D. Snider" wrote: > I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a > long, > long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom > the > author clearly has nothing but contempt? > Evelyn Waugh, of course, who wrote the great misanthropic satires "The Loved One", "A Handful of Dust", and "Vile Bodies." The perspectives in these novels shift between omniscient narrators and hateful first-person narrators. A woman once asked Waugh "How can you write such monstrous things about people and call yourself a Christian?" He replied, "Madam, if it was not for my faith I would scarcely be human at all." Also Tom Wolfe. His books are full of healthy, life-affirming contempt, especially "The Bonfire of the Vanities" and the non-fiction masterpiece "Radical Chic." He is gifted at hilariously entering the minds of thoroughly obnoxious people. ===== R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:11:51 -0800 What is the date of this particular talk by Dyer? Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ethan Skarstedt" Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 15:15:45 -0700 Eric D. Snider:=20 "Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the=20 protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the=20 author clearly has nothing but contempt?" I would be leery of a story where the author's contempt for the protagonist causes the readers to have contempt for the protagonist as well. I'm fine with reading about villains I have contempt for but not about such protagonists. I can't get interested in them. Now, satire on the other hand, is a different kettle of fish. A truly vicious and bitingly insightful satire is something in which contempt for the protagonist is a good thing. I would buy a work like that by Eric on spec. "Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on=20 this sort of thing?" Dumb and Dumber's humor worked for me but then, I had sympathy for the characters. (and more empathy than I generally like to admit) =20 -Ethan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:35:37 -0700 Eric writes: >Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the >protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the >author clearly has nothing but contempt? >Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on >this sort of thing? A few suggestions: You might try a strange little book by Steve Brewer called "Lonely Street." It's one in a series of books about a rather clumsy detective named Bubba Mabry. In this episode, Bubba is hired to be a bodyguard for a local "celebrity." (Turns out the celebrity is Elvis himself. It's pretty funny). I think Brewer is constantly making fun of his "hero" Bubba, but I'm not sure he harbors any real "contempt" for him. It strikes me as the same type of satirical mockery done in "Waiting for Guffman," where, as ridiculous as these people are, you still end up somewhat enamored by them. And in the same genre, another interesting narrator/author conflict shows up in Agatha Christie's _Murder of Roger Ackroyd_, where....well, I won't spoil it for you, but trust me, it's brilliant. Just email me personally if you want a real synopsis without reading the book. (I'd feel like I was giving away the plot to "The Sixth Sense" if I explained exactly how the book is relevant to your question, and I don't want to spoil it for anyone). You also might be interested in an essay by Peter Rabinowitz, "Truth in Fiction: A Critical Examination of Audiences," published in _Critical Inquiry_ 4 (1977) pp. 121-141. It's not as fun to read as the aforementioned suggestions, but it does investigate the theoretical implications of the kind of narrative voice you are crafting. Best of luck. I look forward to reading it. --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:01:28 -0700 AIs it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? The first thing that pops into my mind is a poem: Robert Browning's "Soliloquiy in a Spanish Cloister." The first-person narrator is excoriating another person whom he detests, but is unaware that with every word he gives away his own moral corruption. Browning was good at that. Normally, though, I don't read long works whose protagonist is disgusting. I want to read about people with whom I can sympathize. I want the central character to be someone I can root for. I don't why people want to go to movies about criminals. (So you probably give Ocean's 11 a high rating.) barbara hume -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 14 Dec 2001 13:57:17 -0700 On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 11:40:49AM -0700, Brown wrote: > Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. -- Terry L Jeffress | Man does not live by words alone, despite the South Jordan, UT | fact that he sometimes has to eat them. | -- Adlai Stevenson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Skeleton Story Beginnings Date: 17 Dec 2001 09:01:30 -0700 Unfortunately, there is an image in Gravity's Rainbow that continues to stay with me and disgust me as much as a porno tv program I once flicked through quickly, and a scene from Rosemary's Baby. I don't think about these horrible things always, but I just wish I had never cluttered my brain with them. Marilyn Brown -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Wilson Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 15 Dec 2001 19:25:24 -0700 There is a big difference between the Church of Jesus Christ and ethnicity or race or culture. There is a Mormon culture, which only vaguely resembles the actual teachings of the Church, and in that context it would be easier to overcome cultural boundaries. If one actually wishes to include Church teachings specifically and have characters that are converted rather than cultural Mormons then the difficulty is much, much greater. In Ocean's Eleven there are two characters called the "Mormon Twins" and they're con-men and thieves. The fact is, Utah is well known for confidence schemes. It is one of the testing ground con men use for new schemes. Obviously the characters in the movie aren't really LDS, but it's a sign that things are changing. Instead of literature that is intelligible only to cultural Mormons or preaching disguised as literature (which is perfectly legitimate in my opinion) the best way to gain acceptance is to simply have a "mainstream" style of story with a Mormon character as a contrast. Pick a genre, avoid the nasty stuff, and add a Mormon character that can fit the story. That way it might get published if it's merely good instead of great. If you look back there aren't very many "preachy" books that have been wildly successful; there aren't even very many classics of that kind. Most of the time great writers have to disguise their preachings to get the message out at all. Look at Sir Walter Scott in Ivanhoe. Everything is sterotyped except Rebecca. She's the modern eye view of the Medieval world. It's the first anti-anti-Semitic literature that was popular. Without being aware one can't help but sympathize with Rebecca more than any other character because she's more like the modern reader than any of the other characters. She's the liberal (old sense) ideal--compassionate, gentle, kind, generous, virtuous and noble. She's even tolerant, unlike every other character in the book. If Sir Walter had just written "it is wrong to despise or hate the Jews," in his time and climate he would not be remembered as he is; instead he planted a seed that eventually bore fruit. How much fruit is difficult to know, but literature does have an effect on people. Whether or not millions of people stopped hating the Jews because of him, he made the attempt and it was a noble one. I think that is a good enough ideal, and that it is more important to influence for good than to try and explain all the cultural vagaries of Mormons. It is just as likely to lose the moral of the story while trying to figure out why so many teenagers in Utah think drinking beer is more sinful than adultery--unless that is the moral of the story. James Wilson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kathy_f@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 15:58:54 -0700 On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 "Eric D. Snider" writes: > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for > whom the author clearly has nothing but contempt? As a reader, if I start a book and the character is someone I feel nothing but contempt for, I would throw the book across the room or into the circular file. I've done it before and I'll continue doing it. I don't have time to waste on fiction that leaves my heart out of the story, or leads me to feel anger, contempt or disgust toward the main character. I strive to remove these kinds of emotions from my heart on a daily basis--I cannot imagine a piece of fiction so well written as to be worth indulging in feelings I am constantly seeking to repent of in real life. The only book I can think of with a character even the author had to have contempt for would be Albert Camus' book, _The Stranger_. I don't know if Camus *had* contempt for his character. I know I sure did. If there was a single work of fiction in the entire world I truly, venomously despised, this would be it. A story not worth the paper it was printed on. And _Waiting for Godot_ runs a close second, IMO. Kathy Fowkes Mesa, AZ ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 13:56:34 -0700 Eric D. Snider wrote: > I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a > long, long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > > Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the > protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom > the author clearly has nothing but contempt? Andre Gide does it in his _Symphonie Pastorale_. The story of the rape of a young girl by a priest, told from the viewpoint of the priest. Masterful work in that you think at first you are seeing the story of an old man falling in love with a young girl and it is entirely from the priest's POV. All his actions are, therefore, noble. His "love" is pure. The girl is a willing angel. Not too far into the book, however, and you become aware of what has actually happened, despite the main POVs best efforts to hide his crime. Thom Duncan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "downing" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 15 Dec 2001 12:34:11 -0600 I, too, had an odd experience with Horizon and Cornerstone. Something to do with a missing manuscript. Not important. But when I was unable to get straight answers from the company, I contacted Larry Brady. At one time, he had been a reader for Cornerstone/Horizon and had sent me a letter offering to edit a manuscript. I was pleased with how straightforward and helpful Mr. Brady was. I trusted him to give me the straight scoop on what was going on and, believe me, he did. You might try contacting Mr. Brady. (By the way, I did not have Mr. Brady edit anything. He received no compensation from me, yet gave me a fair amount of his time. Nice guy.) Lisa Downig -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Melissa Proffitt Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 14 Dec 2001 14:58:05 -0700 On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 18:56:02 , Eric D. Snider wrote: >I am working on a bit of narrative fiction, which I have not done in a = long,=20 >long time. The question I put before the panel is this: > >Is it possible to have a successful work of fiction in which the=20 >protagonist, through whose eyes the story is told, is someone for whom = the=20 >author clearly has nothing but contempt? >I don't want to go into details, because I'm insanely secretive and=20 >paranoid, but my story is a series of journal entries -- first-person = very=20 >limited POV -- written by someone whom I find to be a laughable person. = Her=20 >being laughable is integral to the story: I want readers to laugh at = this=20 >person, and the fact that she never realizes how clueless she is just = part=20 >of the joke. I don't know how successful this is. If it's a naive character--someone whose perceptions are obviously wrong--that's one thing, but the word "contempt" really makes me think twice about the author. What would be = the point of doing it? Vicarious laughter at a laughable person? I think it straddles the line between humor and derision. I think anything is = possible in stories, but I wonder how comfortable readers would feel about this = kind of character. Especially if the reader had some of the laughable character's flaws and foibles; by extension, the author is then laughing = at the reader as well. >Can this work? What examples can we think of where the main character is= =20 >nothing but an object of derision? I think of "Waiting for Guffman," = where=20 >the characters never learn, grow, or realize how wrong they are. That = one=20 >seems to work because it's satire -- which my story is, too, sort of -- = and=20 >because it's not very long. We don't need any emotional investment in = the=20 >characters, because the movie is so darned funny and isn't epic-length. I was thinking of "Seinfeld" myself, though I didn't get the sense that = the writers and actors and producers disliked the characters on that show. I agree about the length. I think a long work in which the characters = never change or grow might seem pointless. >Can anyone think of any other examples, or give any other suggestions on= =20 >this sort of thing? There are two YA novels by the British writer Louise Rennison called = _Angus, Thongs, and Full-Frontal Snogging_ and _On the Bright Side, I'm Now the Girlfriend of a Sex God_ that come close. These are told in diary format and are often compared to _Bridget Jones' Diary_ for all sorts of reasons (diary, British, etc). The main character is a fourteen-year-old girl = named Georgia who writes about her horrible but humorous life. The big secret = is that to discerning readers, Georgia isn't really the hero she believes herself to be. She does stupid things, complains about her best friend's lack of compassion (though she herself is profoundly self-obsessed) and isn't really a nice person. I think the key, though, is that Rennison's presentation makes Georgia laughable without making her the object of derision. I'm also reminded of "May the Good Lord Bless and Keep You," = one of my favorite stories, painful and funny at the same time. Again, the = risk really seems to me that if your reader identifies in any way with the much-derided protagonist, that will be an instant turn off. We don't = mind laughing at others, but we detest being laughed at. Melissa Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" (by way of Jonathan Langford ) Subject: [AML] Contacting Authors (was: Curious Letter from Horizon) Date: 17 Dec 2001 13:14:17 -0600 Thanks for you help on this. BTW, why do you think it's unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some editorial help? That is not meant to be an argumentative question. I'm curious about your perspective on the issue Richard -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Kathleen Dalton-Woodbury Subject: [AML] Re: [AML-Mag] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 15 Dec 2001 22:04:15 -0700 Aren't you describing one form of what is called an "unreliable narrator," Eric? There is a character that I see this way, though others may not: Elizabeth Peters' Amelia Peabody is certainly someone who "never realizes how clueless she is" as she goes about trying to solve the mysteries on which each novel is based. The fact that I see her this way has contributed to my unwillingness to continue reading her adventures, so I don't really know if others (who must continue to buy and read the books, since they continue to do well in the market) perceive her in this way or not. Anyway, that may help answer your question. This reader, at least, is not willing to spend time with such a character. I need to care about the characters I spend time with, and I can't seem to care very much about "one who knows not and knows not that [she] knows not." She's a fool that I am unable to suffer gladly. If you feel contempt for your character, how do you think you can get your readers to want to keep reading about her? (Of course, there is also the example of the woman in the BBC television series, KEEPING UP APPEARANCES, Harriet Bucket, I think her name is, who insists on pronouncing her last name as "Bouquet" and has all kinds of other pretensions. She's quite popular, because people like to laugh at her, I guess. Maybe I'm just not part of the audience for what you're trying to do.) Kathleen Dalton-Woodbury workshop@burgoyne.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 17 Dec 2001 12:28:18 -0800 [MOD: We've fairly thoroughly thrashed the particulars of this case, as they've been reported to us. I'd like to encourage any further discussion of this issue to focus on general principles/guidelines that apply to the author-publisher-editor relationship.] Richard, I would not see any problem in looking through the "discard pile" except for a few things: 1) He sent a hand written letter asking for the writer not to contact Horizon about this. Very questionable behavior implying there is something shady going on. 2) This implies his activity is not known by his employer/supervisor - grounds for dismissal? 3) It appears there may be some finders fee attached since the friend of his does this for a fee. Again, funneling work away from Horizon thus creating form of conflict of interests - grounds for dismissal. If this was being done with the full knowledge and consent of Horizon and this person's immediate supervisor there is no problem. But, there are too many signs pointing to the fact this was being done outside normal channels. For a person so concerned about establishing his ancestral identity as a member of the Church he should be conscious of any act of impropriety or in this case the very (even minor) appearance of evil. What you need to do is this: 1) Sit him down and talk to him like a Dutch Uncle. Take copies of the posts from the list with you to show him. 2) Rap his knuckles (gently if he is a close friend) and tell him to cease and desist. 3) If he would like to do this as a career path within Horizon have him talk to his supervisor and tell him/her what he would like to do (as a possible career path - he needs to make this clear). 4) If his supervisor sees no harm in this (the finders fee/editorial fee should be fully disclosed) then get a signed document from them, endorsed by Horizon, stating it is okay to proceed with this venture. If he does all this he is clean and has no possibility of being dismissed for cause which I'm sure he would be if he continued to proceed as he did. In the computer industry it is called moonlighting. Not only is it discouraged but is grounds for immediate termination. Jerry Tyner -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 17 Dec 2001 11:40:26 -0800 Jonathan, Sender: owner-aml-list@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: aml-list I could not agree more on this. There is a current commercial playing in Southern California right now which is associated with one of the local internet providers. It shows this pretty girl at a bar and it is at the end of a conversation she has had with this one guy. She gives him her phone number. The bar tender asks if he can get the number from the guy (not the girl - she isn't even asked) and another guy asks the same question of the guy who has the number. He looks at the two of them and then at her (she is horror struck) and then he says: "Five dollars each?" Both guys willingly pay for her number and she looks as if her most precious secret was given away. The commercial ends with the provider declaring they will not give out your information to anyone. This is the same with a book that is written. You trust the publisher will only let his/her reputable staff look at the manuscript and if they see promise will work on it there or make recommendations. Like the analogy you made below of someone reading a letter they see in your house you do not expect anyone who doesn't have the publishers permission to read your manuscript. To get a letter from someone you do not know with clandestine instructions just makes you lose faith in the publisher. If the publisher had written the letter the feeling would not have been of the same nature as seen on the list. Bottom line is everyone's reputation is on the line when it comes to writing, publishing, or editing. It all has to be on the up and up with no backdoors, no hidden agendas, and no clandestine proposals or faith in the process is broken and trust violated. That is a hard thing to recover from. Jerry Tyner -----Original Message----- Yes, I do think it's unprofessional [snip] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] re: Acceptance of Christian Lit Date: 17 Dec 2001 12:56:43 -0800 On Tue, 11 Dec 2001 17:38:06 -0700 "Todd Petersen" writes: > Writing from a Christian perspective is an albatross around > a writer's neck that few writers can cut loose. Yes, especially people like Robbie Branscum, Madeline L'Engle, Robert Cormier, Heinrich Boll, Reynolds Price, Anne Tyler, John Gardner, Nikos Kazantzakis, Flannery O'Connor, Robert Penn Warren, Jane Austen, Peter DeVries, J. F. Powers, Graham Greene, Frederick Buechner, Walter Wangerin, Jr., Mary Gordon, Francine du Plessix Gray, Jan Karon, Seamus Joyce, Garrison Keillor, Carson Wyler, Paul Horgan, Stephen King, Peter Straub, M. Scott Peck, Alan Paton, Orson Scotchguard, Samuel W. Taylor, John D. Fitzgerald, Lee Martin, Rodello Hunter, John Updike, Walker Percy, Virginia Sorensen, Dorothy Sayers, Robert Stone, James Carroll, Mario Puzo, Eudora Welty, Gene Wolfe, Ernest J. Gaines, Maya Angelou, and Timla--uh, Timla (what was his last name? Oh, what the Haye, it'll come to me)--a bunch of others, too. Yeah, I've always regretted that these talented writers couldn't get past that mean, nasty editor, Albert Ross. But when I get discouraged about all these writers and the evil mr. Ross standing between them and publication, I remember something Kenny Kemp said at the Mormon Writers conference. Someone had said, I think, that a Covenant author might sell 10,000 copies. Kenny said that would be an unnoticed blip on the radar of NY publishers. But he didn't mean that that number was insignificant, he meant that the culture we live in can absorb that kind of a sale so that people outside the culture aren't even aware of it. When he told the people at HarperCollins he had sold 10,000 copies they were astonished. "How did you do that?" Does this mean that if we talked up the sales potential of the Mormon market a little the evil missedher Ross might get off our necks? It might. I hear there's an ancient mariner who haunts wedding receptions trying to get his work published. I'm sure he could use an evil editor. Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Turk325@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:24:03 EST In a message dated 12/17/01 1:06:57 PM, jlang2@pressenter.com writes: << BTW, why do you think it's unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some editorial help? That is not meant to be an argumentative question. I'm curious about your perspective on the issue. >> I believe it would be unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some editorial help. Three reasons: 1. THEY DON'T BELONG TO YOU. You don't have permission to do this. (And, if you asked, they'd probably turn you down.) It's like looking through someone else's trash. It's unprofessional. It's unseemly. 2. The publisher discarded them because they weren't "good projects that could use some editorial help." If they were, the publisher would have provided the help. 3. You're imposing yourself into a situation of pride, self-image, and vulnerability. ("Hey. They don't like you, but I'll be your friend.") Too much opportunity for manipulation and damage. Yeah. It would be wrong. Kurt Weiland. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 17 Dec 2001 13:30:27 -0700 ---Original Message From: James Wilson > It has been done but not always well. Les Liaisons > Dangereuses by Choderlos de Laclos is a good example. It's > epistolary and the characters are all pretty contemptible, > though it's questionable whether Laclos despised them as much > as he pretended. He certainly does claim to hold them all in > contempt but that might have been politics talking. The book > is a 'classic,' though I can't stand it myself. On the other > hand I'm a big Jane Austen fan and I don't like her > epistolary stuff either. This is a good example because I've seen two movies using that book (which I haven't read) as a base--Dangerous Liaisons and Cruel Intentions. Of the two, I have more respect for Dangerous Liaisons. DL was better acted and had more believable characters in the extremities it portrays. But I didn't really like the movie at all. I mean, I left it going, "what a waste", which was probably the point, really. Cruel Intentions, on the other hand, was much more interesting to me and gave me a lot more hope (of all things, though technically, it shouldn't have). Cruel Intentions followed DL for the most part, but differed dramatically in actual growth of the main characters. By making the protagonists death accidental and changing the reaction of the victim, CI managed to have the main characters grow away from their self-obsession. The suicide in DL was pretty much more of the same from the protagonist--he hadn't changed at all and his selfish suicide was just a continuation of the same pattern of behaviors we had seen in the rest of the movie. CI made that death a sacrifice necessitated by his sin. That made a huge difference in the character. In other words, while I have contempt for pretty much everyone in both movies, the non-selfish death of the protagonist (and the apparent growth it displayed), was more moving for me in Cruel Intentions. It also helps that in CI, you get the feeling by that last long shot that the victim of the core wager had some interesting growth as well--I got the feeling that the victim was the important character instead of the other cruel woman. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ethan Skarstedt" Subject: RE: [AML] Novels and History Date: 17 Dec 2001 13:59:49 -0700 Anecdote: =20 I served a mission in SLC, Utah. While visiting an institute class as a missionary I witnessed the following exchange. (I only remember the gist, not the exact numbers or names) This happened in front of me. I was there. Teacher: So, when Joseph Smith was baptized into the church there were four people present, (I don't remember the names he gave or if there were really exactly four) Student: (swiftly raised hand) Brother Jones! Teacher: Yes? Student: Weren't there seven people there? Teacher: No, no, I'm pretty sure there were only four. (He refers to his notes again and names the four) Student: (in a condescending tone, deadly serious) Brother Jones, you're forgetting the Steeds, they were there too. Teacher: (mouth dropping open) Young lady, the Steeds are fictional. Student: Oh. I've read the first 2.5 of TWATG and I must hasten to add that I am impressed with the lengths to which Brother Lund went to try and prevent things like what I have just described. I guess, no matter how hard you try, you just can't keep up with that "one born every minute" statistic. -Ethan Skarstedt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 17 Dec 2001 14:07:53 -0700 Marilyn: Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. Terry: Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. Haven't read it yet, but there's also Michael Tunnel's YA novel about the LDS youth underground against Hitler. Can't remember the name off-hand. Annette Lyon -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: [AML] Festival of Faith & Writing Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:03:12 -0700 Festival of Faith & Writing Call for Papers Conference 2002 18 April to 20 April 2002 Hosted by the Department of English at Calvin College Join writers, publishers, editors, scholars, and readers for the biennial conference on writing and faith. We invite twenty-minute papers on the intersection of imaginative writing with religious conviction, experience, and community, in the work of recent Christian writers and writers from other faith traditions. (The conference will also include sessions on filmmaking, mystery fiction, children's literature, poetry, and musical songwriting.) We are eager, in particular, to receive papers on the following writers and topics: . Scott Cairns . Stephen Dunn . Yaffa Eliach . Ernest Gaines . Kaye Gibbons . Ron Hansen . Oscar Hijuelos . Jan Karon . Kathleen Norris . The "Oxford Christians" (Inklings session) . Popular Christian fiction Submitters are reminded that Festival audiences include a large number of enthusiastic but non-specialist readers. Submitters are urged, consequently, to "present" their thought and not merely to read papers, and to frame their conclusions in the common tongue. Deadline for submission of abstracts: 15 January 2001 Address all papers and inquiries to: Conference 2002 Department of English Calvin College Grand Rapids, MI 49546 e-mail: ffw@calvin.edu Registration: $140. Brochures will be sent in October of 2001 to those on our mailing list. To be placed on our mailing list, send your street address to ffw@calvin.edu. To ensure registration at the Festival, please submit registration form as soon as possible. Only presenters of papers accepted by the Festival will be guaranteed registration. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: [AML] Dyer Talk Date: 18 Dec 2001 09:36:25 -0700 "The following is a talk by Pres. Alvin R. Dyer at the missionary conference in Oslo, March 18, 1961. It is recommended that each missionary should read this message several times in order to get a better understanding of the purpose of the restored gospel." The above was taken directly from the document. [MOD: The following was pasted here from another post from Margaret.] I know that a Black friend of mine informed the Brethren back in 1993 that the talk was RE-circulating, and was told that the Missionary Department would be informed and mission presidents instructed to keep it out of their missionaries' hands. But nearly a decade has passed and the talk is still making the rounds. By the way, Dyer's talk was not by any means the first discourse to express the opinion that one race or another was "cursed" because of actons in the Pre-existance. We can trace the earliest speculations on that to Orson Hyde and Orson Pratt in the late 1840's. [Margaret Young] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] Novels and History Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:09:09 -0700 Although _Standing on the Promises_ is rather a hybrid, I would definitely classify it as historical fiction, because it takes liberties with the characters, relying on imagination to fill in the blanks when we don't know what actually happened. But obviously, we've been pretty careful in our research. But I would be surprised to find it included with Hugh Nibley's stuff on the bookshelves rather than with Dean Hughes's books. (Looks like I can be surprised now.) [MOD: I'm snipping part of this relating to the Dyer talk for a separate post on that thread.] [Margaret Young] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Markham Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 17 Dec 2001 17:15:16 -0500 harlowclark@juno.com wrote: > ...So here's a question for you teachers on the list, > When was the last time you taught a piece of MoLit in your class? ... Last year when I taught my sci-fi class, one of the books I ordered was between printings, "The Essential Ellison" by Morpheus. They were going to get it out before the semester, then a month later, then a week later. I had used the book before and the class had really liked Harlan (as part of the class evaluation sheets I ask them to rank the books and why. Ellison was far and away the most popular author. They also hated Ender's Game, btw) so I was reluctant to drop him from the reading list, as I had done with Card. I told the bookstore that they should keep trying to get the Ellison book up until the last month of the semester--that I could easily reschedule the reading order. The book never came and I was left with a good two weeks without a text to teach. I thought about showing a sci-fi film or two, but instead taught a "Mormon" novel. My own. I'd resolved never to do that because I think professors who teach their own books are basically money-grubbers. To resolve my ethical dilemma I gave the kids their books for free (remaindered copies). I prefaced the assignment with tons of disclaimers, that I don't put myself in the same league as the other authors, that the Ellison book never showed up and these were available or else I'd've never done this, etc. The classes seemed to go well, the kids seemed to really enjoy the book. The Mormon elements were not a big deal one way or the other. But then, what are they supposed to say with the author holding their final grade in his hand? So I took their enjoyment with a grain of salt. Then I got the student evaluations, submitted anonymously after final grades had been turned in. On every evaluation, my little "Jaxon Files" was their favorite book and the kids just gushed. Even the one student who said I was a terrible teacher and a worse person gave "JF" his/her (?) great praise. So this year I'm putting it down as a required text and will actually make them buy it. Morpheus has their edition of Ellison out now, so I'll get to go head-to-head with the Master. I'm dropping Heinlein and will keep Zamyatin and the anthology "Decades of Science Fiction." Tony Markham -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:21:40 -0700 Harlow Clark wrote: > On Dec. 11, Todd Peterson said, > > "The LDS tie in is this: LDS writers are going to have to be twice as > good as everyone else in order to make it in a national market with LDS > themed work. Twice as good. This is not something that we've talked > about much here. I think that sometimes we think that we need to be > equal with other writers, but that's not true at all. Writing from a > Christian perspective is an albatross around a writer's neck that few > writers can cut loose." > > Yes. We do need to talk about this. I've heard this statement several > times and I'm always struck at how it repeats verbatim a theme I come > across repeatedly in African- American culture. If you look at "twice as > good" in that context, it's clear that the unstated assumption is, "The > world is so bigoted that it's not going to appreciate us for who we are. > They're so bigoted we have to be twice as good as they are just to get > noticed. Do we really want to think of our potential audience as a bunch > of bigots? A couple of thoughts-- First, I think the argument is less that the audience is a bunch of bigots so much as the publishing establishment itself is biased against Mormons. I was going to argue that I didn't believe this was true, that I thought the reason for our limited success was too strong a self-consciousness about our own Mormonness in our fiction that tends to take over a story and turn it into a defense (or critique) of the institution instead of a story about people, and that such an institutional approach inherently limits the potential audience for a story. Then I saw the news story last night about the Cottonwood (Utah) High School choir being uninvited to perform at Carnegie Hall because they were from Utah, and must therefore be Mormon--a thing not to be tolerated by the concert organizers. I understand that the organizers were a fundamentalist Christian group, and that there is an ongoing rejection by that group of Mormons as qualifying to be called Christians. I understand that Carnegie Hall itself had little or nothing to do with the decision, that they just rented the hall to this group of concert organizers to do with as they pleased, and that the anti-Mormon bias is coming from a Midwestern Christian organization rather than the New York arts community itself. Then again, the issue seems to run afoul of well-established law against discrimination on the basis of race or creed (aka, religion), and I might expect that revered concert hall's management committee to question its client on their apparently illegal stance and its poor reflection on Carnegie Hall itself. Which they haven't done. Which begs the issue of how far up the line the bias actually goes. Which seems to suggest that there might in fact be an institutional bias against things Mormon in the New York arts community. Of course that argues a chicken-or-egg question. Is New York biased because they despise the religion itself, or does the bias come from the fact that the vast majority of overtly Mormon works have been poorly written, overly self-conscious, too limited in audience or scope, or just not artistically interesting enough? After seeing thousands of unpublishable stories, has New York learned to cringe whenever they see another Mormon piece, automatically rejecting anything that even smacks of overt Mormonism (as they do with most overtly defensive religious literature) whether it's good and publishable or not? Maybe Todd is right. Maybe we really do have to be twice as good to break in. Then again, that's true of every new author in the industry--to occupy a slot normally filled by a known, publishing pro a new writer has to be clearly better in pretty much every way, else why should an editor take a chance on an unknown name rather than going with the safe, established brand name? Establishing as a new author is always hard; establishing a new category of fiction is even harder. I'm not going to argue that bias against Mormons doesn't happen, because we know it does. So does bias against women, men, blacks, asians, hispanics, jews, moslems, christians, the obese, the loud, the smelly, the boorish, etc. etc. etc. And yet all of these people publish regularly, at least partially because there are clearly established markets for the works that they produce. Even the Mormon prophet was published by a New York house because they knew that with only a five percent sell-through to American Mormons they'd have a clear bestseller, and if they actually sold to anyone else they'd have a big seller. Easy decision. Then we look at the Mormon publishing industry and we don't see massive sales numbers. Apparently Mormons don't buy overtly Mormon stuff themselves; if we can't peddle our own stuff to our own community, how can we expect others to buy it who don't feel that same community? Most people don't care enough about Mormons to read anything just because it's about Mormons, be the story fer 'em or agin 'em. People need to be willing to read the stories for some other reason than the Mormon apologetics (or criticisms). So the first question seems to me to be how do we get Mormons to buy--and read--Mormon fiction? We know that the teen morality play sells well, but that it has limited appeal outside a fairly narrow age demographic. The Mormon historical has been limited by ordinary writing and either too much correlation or not enough, with a subtext that either defends or condemns the institution--usually with a great deal of vigor in either case. Much of our literary/academic fiction is similarly limited in that it focuses on critiques of the broad institution rather than stories of humans interacting in and around it. Even Mormon readers are cringing at our stories of self-conscious institutional critique; even we aren't interested in our own fiction. So how can we expect anyone else to be? I think this is the question Mormon writers should be focusing on, not the specter of institutional bias by New York publishers. As writers, how do we evolve our literature to reach a wider audience? How do we appeal to a broader range of Mormons? How do we change our focus to reach more Mormons, to get them to read more of our own stories in addition to the other stories that they read? How do we create an economically self-sufficient marketing category that New York publishers can buy into as a sound business decision? I was talking to my father over the weekend. He's a senior executive for a large multi-national corporation based in Chicago, and he is a voracious reader. There's always a book in his briefcase, and he covers the gamut from fiction to essay to history. But he has no interest at all in Mormon fiction. He read a couple of books almost twenty years ago and decided that Mormon fiction just didn't engage his interest. He thought about reading Lund's "The Work and the Glory" but ended up reading the Harry Potter series instead. It's not that he doesn't read, it's that there's nothing about Mormon fiction to draw him in. His one experience with it was unsatisfying, and he has no reason to believe that anything has changed in the last fifteen years. I think the same can be said for the general Mormon readership. As a people we actually read as much as anyone else, and more than many. So how do we engage the interest of our own community? One of our problems, I think, is that our best writers are so focused on becoming Shakespeares and Miltons that they've intimidated themselves right out of the game. That's a heavy expectation, and one that I'm not sure is fair. Those writers happened because they were the right voice for a particular time and place, because they built on an existing literary tradition that provided a foundation for their new and powerful voices. Maybe we need to rethink our good and worthy ambition a bit and eat that literary elephant one bite at a time instead of constantly trying to stuff the whole thing down at once. Not that we should be trying to do less with our fiction, but maybe that some of us should reattenuate our expectations of the marketplace and be willing to meet readers closer to where they live right now rather than trying to force a vision of high art down the throats of the unwilling (of course the flip side is also true--that we not worship our tiny, populist niche markets to the exclusion of new, difficult, or challenging works; that's just the opposite end of the elephant--decide for yourselves which end). We need to reach more and different readers with either more and different stories, or with stories that better reach across our differences to a core voice that resonates powerfully with many readers. I don't think it's been done yet. Yes, we've reached some pretty large niches, but I don't think anyone has told a story that reaches even a notable minority of Mormons yet, no less a simple majority. Until we can tell stories about ourselves to ourselves, I don't think we have much of a chance of a massive breakout novel that will reach beyond the bounds of Mormonism to a general audience. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] A Curious Letter from Horizon? Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:35:37 -0800 Jerry, et al. I appreciate your advice regarding Brent and Larry. I intend to send them a composite of your emails that will help them to understand what they are doing wrong and how they might repair the damage and do things right. I hope others who feel the same way about this conduct will help me with this and post some explanatory comments along with suggestions for how this might be done in a more professional manner. If you want to rant, that's fine too. I think these well-meaning but misguided folk need to understand just how it makes authors feel to do what they are doing. Thanks very much. Richard Hopkins -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 17 Dec 2001 17:20:54 -0600 I agree with Jonathan on all points. In this particular case, Horizon unfortunately *already* has a fairly lousy reputation to start with. Can they afford to make it worse by allowing this behavior to continue? It makes them look bad. Worse. Whatever. If the person in question had permission from Horizon, that would change my attitude somewhat towards the person's behavior, but it would additionally make me, as an author, leery of the professionalism of the company. (Have you all seen the Earthlink TV commercial where the guy in the bar gets the girl's phone number, two other guys ask for it, and he sells it to them for $5? Same idea.) Linda Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 17 Dec 2001 16:31:12 -0700 At 10:04 PM 12/15/01, you wrote: >There is a character that I see this way, though others may not: Elizabeth >Peters' Amelia Peabody is certainly someone who "never realizes how >clueless she is" as she goes about trying to solve the mysteries on which >each novel is based. > >The fact that I see her this way has contributed to my unwillingness to >continue reading her adventures, so I don't really know if others (who must >continue to buy and read the books, since they continue to do well in the >market) perceive her in this way or not. Amelia is clueless about many things, and she doesn't always recognize the contradictions between what she says and what she does. But she isn't despicable, and she and the other characters are interesting, and the stories are fun, and the good guys win. I love those books. (The scene in which Emerson bursts his bonds and, muscles rippling, hurls that spear completely through the child-killer--ah! The scene in which Emerson and Amelia await death in the burial chamber of the Black Pyramid and then hear, in the Stygian darkness, "Good evening, Mama. Good evening, Papa." Tee-hee!) I listen to them on tape, in order, quite often. I don't care beans about the mysteries--I just like to watch the characters. I especially like the way Ramses develops into an Indy Jones-type hero. (I think Ioan Gruffudd could play the adult Ramses---that would make a fun movie to watch.) I wouldn't like to read Crime and Punishment over and over, however, or spend much time with the narrator of "My Last Duchess." Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Thom Duncan Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors (was: Curious Letter from Horizon) Date: 17 Dec 2001 17:24:09 -0700 Jonathan Langford [actually, Richard Hopkins] wrote: > Thanks for you help on this. BTW, why do you think it's unprofessional to > look through a publisher's discards for good projects that could use some > editorial help? That is not meant to be an argumentative question. I'm > curious about your perspective on the issue I think it skirts the edge of ethical. Here's why: editing is not an exact science. I've been a professional editor/writer for some 20 years, and I've yet to see an article that couldn't be re-edited to make it, if not better, than at least different. I could take a perfectly well written story, edit it, and still have it emerge as a perfectly well-written story no better than the first. I could then tell the beginning writer all kinds of gobbledegook so as to sound as if I've done them a real service. Thom Duncan -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: [AML] Paris ANDERSON, _Recollections of Private Seth Jackson_ Date: 17 Dec 2001 16:41:56 -0700 I'm very happy to announce that my book, The Recollections of Private = Seth Jackson, Mormon Battalion, Company D, has just been accepted for = distribution by Granite Publishing and Distribution. That means it will = soon be in an LDS bookstore near you! (--I hope!) It is also availible = through LDSFICTION.NET. Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Story Beginnings Date: 17 Dec 2001 18:07:02 -0700 Annette Lyon wrote: > > Jumping into the > middle of a dramatic moment is always the pat advice, but somehow I think > that works better for thrillers and other action-driven stories, rather than > character-driven ones. Any ideas? I think that's a fair assessment. "Grabbing" beginnings don't have to be action-packed beginnings. They just have to have some kind of hook in them to make me want to read on. With a character story, that's likely to be something about the character. A "dramatic" moment doesn't have to be your _most_ dramatic moment. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "DCHuls" Subject: [AML] _Spy Game_ (was: Do We Have to Like Our Characters?) Date: 17 Dec 2001 19:02:04 -0600 [MOD: I'd rather not turn this into a swapping of opinions pro/con about this movie, which after all doesn't really qualify as "Mormon Lit." If anyone wants to comment further on this, can you make a tie-in either to the original question of sympathetic/non-sympathetic characters or to some other aspect of Mormon lit?] I have not seen Ocean's 11. I thought the original to be more of a comedy. This one sounds intense. I think many of us would go to see if the crooks can steal succesfully from the crooks who do succeed every day! [The Casinos being what they are.] However, saturday I broke a movie fast and went and saw "Spy Game" and I am still chuckling over what I perceive to be a great shot across the bow of the Government Security Agencies. I am doubtful if what took place in the finale could take place but I want to promise you that the writer(s) had a ball and I left with definite feelings about all the characters. I applaud the writers for being sure I, at least, took sides. Before the movie was half over I was wanting to go home and get my 9 mm and go help get the job done! I haven't felt that way since some of the Old Westerns that are now playing on AMC My female companion and I are both in our 60's and both either laughing or cheering like we used to 50 years ago when Roy Rogers or the Lone Ranger rushed in to save the day. I won't spoil it ,for you that have not seen it, I just say that the characterization and the casting was well done. I have not been a Brad Pitt fan, I am after this one! Redfords character whom I loathed in the beginning won me over at the end big time! Craig Huls -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 17 Dec 2001 18:29:23 -0700 robert lauer wrote: > How much better off we might be if we just threw out the Church vs. the > world paradigm and immersed ourselves in creating works that embrace our > unique beliefs, customs and cultures; works built on the foundational > concept that we ARE a peculiar people--DIFFERENT from others--and that we're > perfectly okay--even happy--about it. I'm with you, Robert! I approached my recently completed novel, which must remain unnamed, with this philosophy. When I presented it to my writers group (not WorLDSmiths), their reaction was, "Who's the audience for this book?" It was too edgy for Mormons, they figured, but too Mormon for non-Mormons. I just wrote it like I would write any other book, treating both the Mormonism and the foibles of the characters as I would plot and character elements of any kind in any book. I never thought about my audience--that's something I'd worry about later. It was just a story I wanted to write. Maybe it will be liked by Mormons after all, in spite of the edginess. Maybe it will be liked by Jack Mormons and ex-Mormons and Mormon watchers. Maybe it will be liked by a mainstream audience who are fascinated by a glimpse into an unfamiliar culture. Or maybe no one will like it because I didn't write it good enough. I do know that members of two writers groups have been more critical of the book from an audience or Gospel faithfulness standpoint than regular LDS readers, who have mostly liked it. (One relatively conservative member's comment: "I was scandalized, but I loved it.") Personally, I think fretting over how this or that audience will accept our work is dumb. If you have something to say, just write it. Like with Robert's plays, the audience it reaches may surprise you. But not if you don't write it, or worse yet, lobotomize it to fit some preconceived notion of an audience. (To paraphrase Robert Heinlein, lobotomize only at the request of an editor.) By the way, the most glowing critique of my first chapter came from a non-Mormon who knew very little of the LDS culture. He felt like he was reading a science fiction book with an alien culture, and it fascinated him. He was able to follow all the unexplained Mormon references with enough understanding to get the gist of what was going on. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Clark Draney" Subject: RE: [AML] Fw: MN Enoch Train Special Broadcast: KZION Press Release 28Nov01 US UT StG A2 Date: 17 Dec 2001 21:27:46 -0700 >Here's how dumb I am.....I did not realize the Enoch Train was a musical >group, and thought it was the name of the sea voyage. Color me red! >Debbie Enoch Train is actually the name of a ship that brought a company of saints from Liverpool(?) to New York in about 1857(?). The musical group take their name from the ship. Clark D. -------- "If I had more time, I would write a shorter story."--Mark Twain _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 17 Dec 2001 21:59:29 -0700 Kathy Fowkes writes: >As a reader, if I start a book and the character is someone I feel >nothing but contempt for, I would throw the book across the room or into >the circular file. I've done it before and I'll continue doing it. I >don't have time to waste on fiction that leaves my heart out of the >story, or leads me to feel anger, contempt or disgust toward the main >character. I strive to remove these kinds of emotions from my heart on a >daily basis--I cannot imagine a piece of fiction so well written as to be >worth indulging in feelings I am constantly seeking to repent of in real >life. Why just throw? Why not BURN the book? I'm joking of course, but this is not the first reference to "throwing a book across the room" I have read on this list, and I'm a little puzzled by it. Isn't there some merit to reading a book precisely because it DOESN'T already reinforce your belief system? --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Nan McCulloch" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 17 Dec 2001 22:07:58 -0700 _Madame Bovary_ by Gustave Flaubert is a perfect example that is done very well. Flaubert portrays the banality of French bourgeois life in the late 1800's. He takes us inside the head of his characters, most of whom have absolutely no redeeming qualities. The writing is fabulous. Nan McCulloch Draper, UT -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Contacting Authors (was: Curious Letter from Horizon) Date: 17 Dec 2001 23:27:59 -0700 ---Original Message From: Richard R. Hopkins > Thanks for you help on this. BTW, why do you think it's > unprofessional to look through a publisher's discards for > good projects that could use some editorial help? That is not > meant to be an argumentative question. I'm curious about your > perspective on the issue I'll answer this, though I'm not a publisher. I consider it unprofessional because none of the parties agreed to that use of the manuscripts. If nothing else, it would constitute a form of publishing. "Hi, I'm the publisher and while I don't like your manuscript myself, well, I've decided to pass it around to some friends of mine." Even if they don't ask you for money, they've still violated a trust and a creative enough lawyer could very well nail a copyright infringement onto that. As the copyright holder, the author determines what can happen to the manuscript. One of those rights is distribution. At least, that's how I'd come at the situation. If the author doesn't include a SASE for the return, I'd just as soon it were destroyed. I'm not sure anything else can ethically, and possibly legally, be done with it. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Morgan Adair" Subject: RE: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 17 Dec 2001 15:35:25 -0700 >>> jerry.tyner@qlogic.com 12/14/01 03:11PM >>> > >What is the date of this particular talk by Dyer? Here's the BYU Library catalog entry for the talk: BX 8630 .A1a no.194a Dyer, Alvin R. (Alvin Rulon), 1903-1977. For what pupose? A talk given to the missionaries of the Norwegian Mission at Oslo, Norway on March 18, 1961. Revised with additional clarification and documentation, 1976. [Salt Lake City, s.n., 1976]. 16 leaves. Xerox copy. Mormon doctrine. Race--(Theology). MBA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tyler Moulton" Subject: Re: [AML] Dyer's Talk Date: 18 Dec 2001 08:19:58 -0700 I'm not certain of the details, but my (usually faulty) memory says it was = given at a mission zone conference in Oslo, Norway in 1964. Please feel = free to correct my memory if anyone has better information. I haven't seen a copy of the talk since my own mission, but it was passed = around as part of the underground gnosis (along with Skousen's talk tape = about the meaning of the atonement). Tyler Moulton >>> "Jerry Tyner" 12/14 3:11 PM >>> What is the date of this particular talk by Dyer? Jerry Tyner=20 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Mormon Lit Date: 18 Dec 2001 09:53:10 -0700 I think Robert wrote something very profound. "Apologia can never be the foundation of high art. Apologia comes from a place of self-perceived weakness and inferiority. Art comes from a place of values being celebrated--not values being merely explained or defended." Very good, Robert! May I ask you where you now live? Marilyn Brown -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 18 Dec 2001 11:52:46 -0700 I certainly agree that this under-the-table letter was unethical and sleazy. It is wearying to deal with people with this point of view. However, don't dismiss the idea of a freelance editor who can improve your work :). True, it's a for-money proposition, but I've done it for years and my clients and I agree that it's been a very positive thing. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] Alan Gerald CHERRY, _It's You and Me Lord_ (Review) Date: 18 Dec 2001 14:53:53 -0800 "Don't worry Sarge, it's just an angel." A review of _It's You and Me Lord_, by Alan Gerald Cherry, Trilogy Arts, 1970, 64 p. Part I - Bussing Wodens Day Nov. 7, 2001 Went to Salt Lake for the Qual-Safe study group. On the way back, when I got on the 811 southbound, I noticed the driver's nametag, Alan. "Are you Alan Cherry?" "Yes." "You came to visit my Sunday School class a long time ago. I read part of your book and enjoyed it. I like the opening." Wonderful piece of serendipity, getting on Alan Cherry's bus. I went and sat down and read for a few minutes. That visit to our class would have been more than 25 years ago, maybe around 1974. He was an entertainer, funny and engaging. I don't remember what he said--maybe some fat girl jokes--but his personal warmth was more memorable, and when a copy of his book came through DI, I bought it. He was a minor celebrity in the early 70s, but I was always a little ashamed because I got the sense that the culture had latched onto him for his skin color, a way of saying, 'Yes, Blacks are welcome in the Church, despite that silly priesthood thing.' (No, that doesn't sound right. Alan Cherry is a person, someone who came to the Gospel from an intense search for thruth, and that paragraph makes him sound like a rhetorical function. I carry a deep wound over the priesthood issue, indeed over the whole question of race in the United States and in my religious culture. It's hard, looking back on the 60s and early 70s, not to feel that the occasional black church member functioned rhetorically within the culture. I remember a story Myron Horne told in an Institute class. He was walking across the UW campus one day in the early 70s and there was a crowd in front of the student union (why does the name of that building always escape me--I can remember Padelford Hall (that is the one that snakes around like the Great Wall of China, isn't it?) easily enough) and a student was standing on a second story ledge with a bullhorn urging everyone to march on the Mormon Institute building. Bro. Horne defused the situation by shouting, "Jump, Jump," and soon the crowd took up the chant. That kind of pressure on the Church made the few black members highly visible, and someone highly visible can hardly escape becoming an icon, a rhetorical function. That pains me. I remember a comment someone made (maybe in the Seattle 5th ward, maybe not) about a Relief Society sister introducing her as "My black sister." "But I don't want to be your black sister," she said. "I want to be your sister.") About the time we got to the turn off to the J-V outlet mall I got up the courage to go up and talk to him more. "Did you contribute to a sociology book of some sort?" "I don't remember." "I saw your name in a book, some kind of a study of African American Mormons." "I really don't remember." "I'll check the card catalog." I asked him if he was writing anything now. "I have a project I've been working on for 20 years and it's just about to bear fruit." Sounds interesting. "When I wrote, _It's You and Me, Lord!_ I had only been a member of the Church two years, and I didn't have the vocabulary to say what I wanted to say." He said that the Gospel gave him vocabulary to ask questions he had wanted to, but not known how to form. For example, We condemn people owning other people, but, "How often have you heard slavery condemned as a form of laziness?" Scripture condemns laziness, "The idler shall not eat the bread of the laborer," and here we have a whole economy built on people profiting off the labor of other people. Note the tense--have, not had--Cherry said, "Slavery was not an aberration. It's the normal pattern." (Dave Wolverton feels the same way: Our culture is set up to use the best attributes of one person--intelligence, wit, stamina, farsight--to make another person wealthy. Gaborn, the Earth-King in _The Runelords_, calls it "The shameful economy." "I will not participate in the shameful economy," he says, but ends up participating after he loses his Earth powers.) Cherry knows how to ask uncomfortable questions. He finds a connection between slavery/exploitation and deference to authority or hierarchy. He said the visiting Authority is likely to be the first person served at, say, a ward banquet. "Why? Did he set up the tables and chairs? Why not serve the teenagers first, who did." (In my ward the leaders are the ones you'll find behind the table, serving. Still, our rituals and traditions tend to separate authorities from their families. I remember the many times our neighbor would introduce herself in testimony meeting as the bishop's wife and say how the family had learned to rely upon the Savior because their bishop was never around. We have a new bishop now, but her husband still sits on the stand, since he's in the steak presidency (though he's an accountant, not a restauranteur).) The bus got to Smith's in American Fork, where I connect with the 850, the State St. bus, but, thanks to UTA's idiotic schedule the 811 arrives about two minutes after the 850 so I was looking at a half hour wait. I contemplated staying on the bus and talking with Cherry as he drove down the freeway and out to University Mall in Orem, then catching a northbound 850, but decided not to, and gave him my card. Lots to think about waiting for the 850. Cherry's question gave an ironic twist to President Kimball's (note the title in lieu of a first name) comment, "It's not me they love, it's the position I hold," meaning that people's love for him is not some kind of hero-worship, it's reverence for the calling of prophet. Or was it another prophet who made that comment? It's designed to be a generic comment, and I imagine whoever said it was well aware that our respect for a calling, a position, can turn into lusting after callings in general. That's part of the comment's rhetorical function, to remind us that the Lord can fill any position with any person, that a calling doesn't convey some special stature, but rather shows a willingness to serve. Still, if we defer to people only because of their callings, and not because of love for them as individuals, doesn't that suggest we value callings more than individuals? I'd like to discuss this all some time with Alan Cherry. Part II Rilke's Eyes Thors Day, Nov. 8, 2001 Went up to Salt Lake (West Jordan, really, but anything past the fast-disappearing-after-10,000-years-of-sitting-there-looking-lovely Point of the Mountain is Salt Lake.) Took _It's You and Me Lord_ to read. Of course, the 811 got to the Trax just as the train was pulling out and I had to wait 15 minutes for another and hope I could catch the connecting bus at 72nd South at the stoplight--but it was gone by the time I got there. Wondered if I could walk/run to Redwood Rd. on the nice new curving sidewalk before the southbound to 78th got there. I don't remember if I got to Redwood Rd in time or not (I'm writing this Dec. 12), but I got to the library ok. But only Lyle, the director of training, was there. Russ, the head of the company, was supposed to be doing the training. We went to Lyle's house and called him. Russ had been unaware of the meeting. Qual-Safe has been unable to get any contracts. Bad time to start a business. Got on an inbound bus. Stopped at SL Community College--someone had told me they needed reading teachers out at the prison. Personnel didn't know anything about it. More waiting for the next bus. More time to read. Somewhere in all this waiting and bussing and reading I remembered why I put the book down the first time I started reading it. "It all started because I was fat." In the army, at the post where Alan Cherry was stationed, there wasn't anything to do but eat. He finally decided to lose weight, and as he did he felt a growing personal power, which led him to a search for truth, but not just partial truth. >>>>> As I read each [philosopher's] works I posed one question, "What do you know about absolute truth?" There never seemed to be an affirmative answer. I didn't want only the portions they had to offer. I wanted the whole, and I couldn't afford to be led off the main stream into a tributary. I wanted to go straight to the truth. (25) <<<<< Which means there was no time for the army either. Cherry tried to get out but didn't know how to go about it and ended up in the stockade awaiting court martial. That's where I stopped reading the first time. I could tell something horrible was about to happen, and I wanted to have a little space around it, not read it on the bus as I was traveling around Chief Sealth's metathesized namesake. So I read it 10 years later on a bus driving all over a dry lake bed. The episode turned out better than I thought it would. I noticed something else about the book. It's very intense. For a 64 page book it's not easy to read in one day. Reminds me of Rilke's _Letters to a Young Poet_ which Stan Hall loaned me for a week in the aforementioned once heavily forested city. (I'm charmed by the idea of a member of the stake (made of good Norwegian wood--Ravi Shankar said George Harrison's sitar playing sounded nothing like Indian sitar playing) presidency (Dennis once said that all the guys he went to grad school with were stake presidents and bishops now because they hadn't come back to Utah) saying, "You haven't read _Letters to a Young Poet_ yet? Take this for a week." (Fascinating--dentist semi-retires early so he can study poetry writing, have to ask him for something for Irreantum--maybe his poem for Donna (killed herself by cancer when the state split up her family). Anyway, I couldn't finish _Letters to a Young Poet_ in a week. Too intense. Stephen Mitchell, the translator, tells about seeing a photograph of Rilke and having to turn away from it because the eyes were too intense. I suppose the intensity of _It's You and Me Lord_ comes from the deep need to say what you don't know how to say, don't even know what you need to say. Finally got downtown. Filled out an application at KSL (writer, or ass't producer of some sort) and ran over to the Trax station. There's a memorial there, a plaque, for the ancient Indian village they uncovered when putting the Trax in. Too painful to look at. I hate how we destroy our ancient treasures to facilitate (hey, Wolverton's word) our modern culture. Destroying an ancient village to put in rails--it haunts me. As the train was pulling out I realized I had left my coat at KSL. Got off at the next stop (which meant I would have to wait for the next 811 in Sandy) and ran back to get it. Finally got down to Sandy. Alan Cherry wasn't driving the 811 that night. Saturn Day Nov. 10, 2001 Went to the PG Library (A big-town library would add some charm to our small town) and looked Alan Cherry up in BYU Library's catalog. 202 entries besides _It's You and Me Lord_. That's where I'd seen his name, 202 interview for BYU's Charles Redd Center for Western Studies' LDS Afro-American Oral History Project, and LDS Polynesian American Oral History Project. Includes an interview with Catherine Stokes, the Chicago Leaf-a-Ciety president who spoke at BYU 10th anniversary symposium of the priesthood revelation in 1988. I wasn't there, but Bp. London (went to his house for a TR interview and was reading the titles of some books in my poorly pronounced Finnish and Kaisa said something like, "You wouldn't understand those, they're Finnish." "Oh, I've read Tuntematon Sotilas and Seitsaman Veljestaa, in English translations, and parts of the Kal--" "Oh, brother, *Clark.* You're Dennis's brother! We were in library science school together.") played part of the video one day in a special Sunny Schoodle class designed to foster better awareness of race issues. (We also had a sister congregation, The Bright and Morning Star Baptist Church, and my homely teaching companion was a liaison to the gay community, and the contingent of gay Mormons hiding out on Capitol Hill.) I found Catherine Stokes' talk moving, and was moved later when I read Lavina Fielding Anderson's (she was part of that group of grad students that included Dennis and Stan Hall and Gary and Kaisa London and Dean ("The University 2nd Ward was the most left-wing in the Church. We used to sing, 'Choose the Left'") Hughes) comment that Catherine changed her life when she said she had made a gift of her skin color to God, consecrated her differences to help build the Kingdom. Son Day, Nov ___ 2001 I was clearing some boxes ("I don't know how you can even fit in that room," Donna says) away from my bookshelves in the corner so I could shift books around and shelve some rather than having them piled on top of others, and found another copy of _It's You and Me Lord_, bought May 9, '86 at the DI on 179th and Aurora for a dime. Fourth printing with $3.25 inside the dustjacket. I would have been working there at the time--cleaning buildings by night and running past Seattle Center at 1:14 a.m. to catch 1:15 bus a couple blocks away then staggering a mile home, (missed that last bus a few times, walked twelve miles once from downtown, slept more than once in the newspaper recycle bin at the Queen Anne Safeway, and one February night curled up on the banks of Green Lake beneath a pine tree in my trench coat)--then, whenever I woke up walking the mile or so from 15th Ave NE to DI on Aurora. I got the other copy (the one I read) at the same place for 80 cents on 10/17/90. It was a second printing for $2.95. I love the story of Trilogy Arts. A woman, her husband and artist friend go up in the mountains one day, spread her poems and his drawings out and arrange them. The woman and her husband sell their refrigerator to print the book and take a few copies to the local college bookstore, which sells them all immediately. They make so much money from the book, then books, that they start a publishing company--all in a culture that doesn't read poetry, and a smaller culture that doesn't even read the poetry that doesn't get read in the larger non-poetry-reading culture. This is not the only time I've rejoiced to find a book at DI, then gotten home and found a copy I got from DI before, like Gary Zukav's _Dancing Wu Li Masters_. Haven't read it, but I love the sound. Alan Cherry is a dancer. "Have you got your woo for the night, Clark?" Ty Little asked my father nearly 70 years ago. Shocked my grandmother, but it was just their slang for _date_. I suppose this book is a way of wooing. "You can always tell a Lee," my father-in-law used to say (he was my grandfather's age and died about 10 years before I met Donna). "But you can't tell 'em much." Masters. >>>>> For three hundred years we had been here, and I, along with a lot of my other black contemporaries, had wondered about Christianity. Was it some hoax; was it a farce? It didn't do what you expected it to do. When you really thought about it the very same religions that we embrace today we received from our overlords. How could a man with a whip in one hand give you the Bible with the other? Especially when you read in those same pages admonitions for every man to love his brother as himself. I knew that I had discovered a truth with a built-in hurdle [priesthood]. I could see how by reason alone it would be impossible for many people to see any value in what I had done. But whatever the future was bound to bring me I was intent on not remaining silent, but with a loud voice sharing what I had found. I knew that this was something of great value that everyone needed to get a hold of. (44-5) <<<<< I love that loud sharing voice, and I hope that twenty year project bears fruit soon, and that it tastes good, as good as that wonderful comforting sentence that ends the 2nd paragraph on page 61: "Until the priesthood bearers are pure and finer vessels, it seems impossible to anticipate any stopping of wars, any stopping of hatred, any cessation of hostilities and petty grievances that grip our nation." Harlow Soderborg Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 18 Dec 2001 09:52:33 -0700 Nellie seems to have contempt for Heathcliffe in Bronte's _Wuthering Heights_, but the reader imagines something beyod the borders Nellie provides. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Laura KALPAKIAN Query Date: 18 Dec 2001 11:38:01 -0700 What do people know about an author named Laura Kalpakian? I just ordered a used copy of her book _These Latter Days_. Here's the book blurb: Ruth's entire life testifies to the contrary. Born a good Mormon in genteel Salt Lake City, Ruth feels religiously compelled to marry Samuel Douglass, a man she scarcely knows. She follows him into the Idaho wilderness of the 1890s. Bearing her children unwillingly, Ruth grapples with frontier life while her husband descends into madness, receiving revelations from God. In a desperate bid for freedom, Ruth and her children flee to the desert town of St. Elmo, California. There, she builds a life and lives a lie: the Widow Douglass. Her courage elicits the admiration of the cigar-smoking Doctor Lucius Tipton. Scientist, atheist, a man with a breadth of intellect and a depth of heart, Lucius has frequently defied St. Elmo's pieties, and does so again, falling in love with Ruth. As their affections deepen, Lucius enters into the lives of Ruth's contentious brood: six children whose destinies take them in very different directions, some to tragedy. A complex novel of revelation and rebellion, These Latter Days explores the ways in which families root us, ground us, and compel us to seek freedom. About the Author These Latter Days is the first of Laura Kalpakian's St. Elmo novels, which include Graced Land and Caveat. Winner of a National Endowment for the Arts Award and two Pacific Northwest Booksellers' Awards for Excellence, Kalpakian is a California native. I'm curious how she handles Mormon themes and characters and if any of her other books involve any Mormon elements. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 18 Dec 2001 12:38:46 -0700 The biggest problem I see with freelance editor obtaining mauscripts by combing through the slush piles of another company to whom the manuscript was submitted is that said company has a responcibility to the author, who submitted, to keep the manuscript safely and dispose of it properly. If anything were to happen to that manuscript before it is returned to the author or destroyed the company would be responcible and accountable. The company is also responsible for any illegal or unethical action taken by an employee WHILE that employee is "on the clock." The reason I find that curious letter to be so disturbing is not only does it smell like fraud it also tarnishes he reputation of a good, honest (I think) publisher. Paris Anderson -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: Re: [AML] Paris ANDERSON, _Recollections of Private Seth Jackson_ Date: 18 Dec 2001 11:44:45 -0800 Congratulations! Good news indeed! On 17 Dec 2001 at 16:41, Paris Anderson wrote: > I'm very happy to announce that my book, The Recollections of Private > = Seth Jackson, Mormon Battalion, Company D, has just been accepted > for = distribution by Granite Publishing and Distribution. That means > it will = soon be in an LDS bookstore near you! (--I hope!) It is > also availible = through LDSFICTION.NET. > > Paris Anderson > > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > > ----- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kathy_f@juno.com Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 18 Dec 2001 14:27:44 -0700 On Mon, 17 Dec 2001 21:59:29 -0700 rwilliams writes: John, I've been pondering how to reply to your question. I've come to the conclusion I don't understand how the question relates to my statement. I said essentially that I don't find any value in reading a book that leaves me feeling contempt and disgust for the protagonist, when each day I seek to subdue and keep out of my heart those very emotions towards others and myself in real life. If one of my daily goals is to remove such negative and destructive feelings from my heart, why would I choose to read a book whose author deliberately intended to bring those feelings into my heart? It would be a conflict of interest for me to read such a book. Now, what I'm stuck on is how this method of evaluating what is worth my time reading relates to your question: "Isn't there some merit to reading a book precisely because it DOESN'T already reinforce your belief system?" The kind of book Brother Snider described in his post, one that has a contemptible protaganist for whom he already has disgust, does not challenge my belief system, as I understand the nature of the type of book described. Perhaps I don't understand what you mean by the phrase "doesn't already reinforce your belief system." I read a lot that doesn't reinforce my belief system. What I won't read is anything that would inpinge on my integrity or will pollute a heart I'm striving to make pure with the help of the atonement of Jesus Christ. For me, it's like avoiding a rattlesnake in the Arizona desert. I see no challenge in toying with a rattlesnake any more than I see a challenge in reading the kind of material I understand Snider was referring to. I've worked too hard, strived too long to get clean and free from anger, hatred, contempt for others and myself and other similar destructive emotions to indulge in these for a mere book. It's a daily, constant struggle to stay in a place of love for my nieghbor and myself as God has said we should seek to be. I fail frequently enough as it is (in fact I'm wrestling with feelings of deep anger and contempt for a relative right this very minute, and I'm basically still pinned to the mat by them). I have no desire whatsoever to make it even harder by reading material that takes me in exactly the opposite direction of my goals. I'm also open to the fact that I don't fully understand the kind of book Snider was talking about. I had forgotten about the type of narration referred to as an "unreliable narrator," as someone mentioned (forgive me for not remembering who said it -- Barbara maybe?), and with all the titles mentioned that I've never heard of it is highly likely I'm not clear on the style of novel meant. I have read a number of books with an unreliable narrator and found many of them to be quite interesting and worthwhile reading, but I don't recall ever feeling contempt for the protagonist. I'm just getting too old and have too many children to care for to waste what little time I have left on that which is of no value to me, and reading a novel for whose protagonist I feel nothing but contempt and disgust fits that category. Kathy Fowkes ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 18 Dec 2001 15:11:38 -0700 John Williams wrote: > Why just throw? Why not BURN the book? I'm joking of course, but this is not > the first reference to "throwing a book across the room" I have read on this > list, and I'm a little puzzled by it. Isn't there some merit to reading a > book precisely because it DOESN'T already reinforce your belief system? Why NOT burn the book? If I own it (implying that the author has received a fair royalty for that copy), don't I have the right to throw, burn, submerse, bury, toss from a high window, stuff down a garbage disposal, feed to the neighbor's goat, fold, spindle, or otherwise mutilate my copy? Don't I have a right to make a personal evaluation about the book and choose to reject it as failing to meet the demands I have for literature? Don't I have a right to talk about my reaction on a list like this one and share my disappointment and the reasons for it--and maybe even go so far as to recommend that others not read it for the reasons specified? On the flip side--am I required to embrace and accept all published works, merely because they're published? Are the author's words inviolable? Am I merely an empty vessel to be filled with whatever the author chooses to pour into me, undiscerning and undefended? Of course there's merit to reading a book that doesn't reinforce one's own belief system, but the fact that a book contains challenging material doesn't make it immune to judgment and rejection. Insulting presentation is, in my opinion, an excellent reason to incinerate (or launch) a book--be the insulting presentation a result of poor craft, condescending approach, or dishonest presentation. If the author treats me like an idiot rather than a partner, I will tend to walk--or possibly even run--away from both the work and the author. I agree that a great many excellent books are rejected for what I consider to be silly reasons. I think a lot of readers do shelter themselves and reject valuable works because those works make them think or question or doubt the safe havens they've constructed for themselves. Many of these readers are afraid to question their own assumptions and are precisely the people who should read challenging works, who should learn to have an active, probing faith, not a passive, defensive one. And yet, people have the right to choose for themselves--even when the choice may not be the best one. Even when their reasons don't make sense to me. What's good and praiseworthy for one reader may be vile poison to another. Moral and esthetic relativism still lives; even the gospel is packaged for different audiences. I love works that challenge my assumptions. I like to be made to think, to wonder, to ponder an issue that I had thought to be settled in my own mind. I also like affirming works that illustrate the ways that my mindset successfully interprets and navigates a complex world. And I like works that bring something completely new to me, places or concepts or people that I have no referent for. I also reject many works as unsatisfying for a lot of reasons other than philosophical incompatibility. If an author clearly despises his/her own main character, creating a skewed, sneering, ugly, or dismissive worldview, then I as a reader am forced to decide 1) whether I appreciate the author's craft or skill in presenting this disagreeable worldview; 2) whether I see the author's presentation of that worldview as ironic or satirical and thus requiring a different mode of interpretation; 3) whether I find food for thought or other value in that presentation regardless of the presentation itself; 4) whether I am entertained or engaged (or even mobidly fascinated) by it; and 5) whether I want to continue reading based on my evaluations of 1-4. I'm currently 160 pages into a 360 page book that generated a strong buzz in the Mormon publishing community when it was published in 1999. It contains worldviews that are not mine and situations that I find disturbing. I do not accept the characters' opinions or conclusions, and I certainly don't accept their choices and actions as either good or right. The book presents an alien mindset that explicitly does not reinforce my current belief system. And while I will read the remainder of the book before offering a review on this list, my current inclination is to reject the book as failing to meet my expectations of quality literature. But my rejection is not on the basis of philosophy or worldview or subject matter. For me the book fails at a basic presentational level. I find each and every paragraph to be well-written and well-realized and self-consistent, but (so far, at least) I find the narrative style to be unnecessarily disjointed and the entire presentation to be so self-conscious and overly self-analytical that it feels artificially packaged, forced into a shape designed not to reveal and defend a different mindset, but rather to simply attack any mindset but its own. The author appears to be telling me what I believe (and getting it mostly wrong) rather than sharing with me what he believes. A weak strawman created only to make opposing viewpoints seem silly. This may be to a purpose, so I will finish the book. It may be illustrative of the challenges this social minority faces in being constantly pressured to be something they aren't, to profess beliefs they don't have. Or maybe it's just a narrow, dismissive presentation that can't allow for any interpretation than its own. If I decide the former, I will review the book glowingly; if the latter, I will probably criticize the book as a well-written but poorly crafted bore focused at a narrow audience that doesn't include (or even allow for) me, and that tries to use a hot social issue as a shield against criticism of its craft. It's this last thing that frustrates me the most. Whether I agree with the author or the characters or the situations is irrelevant as long as the author gives me a compelling, interesting insight into a world that is not my own. Right now I'm disappointed with how the author presents that insight, and that makes me want to flush the book--not because I disagree with the worldview, but because I find the vehicle so hard to navigate that the worldview is subsumed by too much authorial interference. I can take a book that disagrees with me (and generally prefer them), but I can't take a book that insults me as a reader or that bores me. And I don't think anyone else should be forced to, either. Having an author treat me like a child while he tries to force foul-tasting medicine down my throat "for my own good" is a personal violation, and a good reason for me to reject that author's work. It's one of the dangers of writing a POV character you completely despise. You run the risk of creating a weak strawman instead of a compelling character, and that undermines how the reader perceives the honesty of the rest of the work. While I haven't burned any books that I'm aware of (I'd rather trade them in on something else to read), I have flung more than one across the room (usually because I really *want* to like it, but the author has failed me one too many times), and I have failed to finish quite a few--some of them highly recommended by people I trust and praised by people I consider my moral and intellectual superiors. That's my right, and my responsibility to myself as a reader. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: LSWeber@aol.com Subject: Re: [AML] Contacting Authors Date: 18 Dec 2001 18:04:46 EST In a message dated 12/18/2001 2:11:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, Jacob@Proffitt.com writes: > I'll answer this, though I'm not a publisher. I consider it > unprofessional because none of the parties agreed to that use of the > manuscripts. If nothing else, it would constitute a form of publishing. > "Hi, I'm the publisher and while I don't like your manuscript myself, > well, I've decided to pass it around to some friends of mine." No one has mentioned that once a manuscript is rejected, the manuscript should be sent back to the author. That's why SASE's are required for most submissions. Why does Horizon leave these rejected manuscripts in a slush pile? Lloyd Weber (long time lurker) -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: [AML] re: Acceptance of Christian Lit Date: 18 Dec 2001 17:15:17 -0700 Harlow's list, I imagine is supposed to make one say, wait there are tons of religious writers out there. He's mentioned about 50 drawn from the last 150 years or so. My point is this: march up to WW Norton and say, I'm a Christian writer and see what happens. Many of the writers Harlow mentioned were writers first, and their Christianity followed them into the room through the back door. -- Todd Robert Petersen -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Preston" Subject: [AML] Re: Jaxon Files Date: 18 Dec 2001 21:29:43 -0600 >Tony Markham wrote: >So this year I'm putting it down as a required text and will actually make >them buy it. Morpheus has their edition of Ellison out now, so I'll get to go head-to-head >with the Master. I'm dropping Heinlein and will keep Zamyatin and the >anthology "Decades of Science Fiction." I don't know what kind of heretic drops Heinlein (one of the cannonical "Big Three") in favor of Zamyatin... But that aside, I've only heard good things about _The Jaxon Files_ and I'm wondering why I don't see it on shelves? Is it only available from Amazon.com? Preston Hunter www.adherents.com ---------- -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: luannstaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 18 Dec 2001 20:40:29 -0700 Brothers in Valor by Michael O. Tunnell Annette Lyon wrote: > Marilyn: Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. > > Terry: Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both > his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, > _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. > > Haven't read it yet, but there's also Michael Tunnel's YA novel about the > LDS youth underground against Hitler. Can't remember the name off-hand. > > Annette Lyon > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 19 Dec 2001 10:14:23 -0700 I specifically excepted sci fi, children's novels, and youth novels! (If this is becoming a game, we need to get the rules straight). Grin. Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, December 17, 2001 2:07 PM > Marilyn: Mainstream stuff doesn't. Name me one. > > Terry: Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both > his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, > _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. > > > Haven't read it yet, but there's also Michael Tunnel's YA novel about the > LDS youth underground against Hitler. Can't remember the name off-hand. > > Annette Lyon > > > > > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Lord of the Ring tickets Date: 19 Dec 2001 11:41:03 -0700 [MOD: Please contact Chris directly with any responses at Chris.Bigelow@UnicityNetwork.com] I bought 7 tickets to the Lord of the Rings at the Provo Towne Centre (Utah) for Friday, Dec. 21, 11:40 a.m. Unfortunately, that turned out to be an error and I can't use the tickets. Does anyone want them? My total cost was $36.75 ($5.25 each), and I'm looking to cut my losses as best I can. I will deliver them in Utah County or let you pick them up. My preference is to sell them as one batch. However, if you don't want the whole batch and yet want to go at this time, let me know and a group of us could meet at the mall. (It's one barcode ticket for the whole group, not separate tickets.) Chris Bigelow chris.bigelow@unicitynetwork.com 801-714-1326 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: harlowclark@juno.com Subject: [AML] Paul BAILEY Date: 19 Dec 2001 12:09:56 -0800 On Mon, 01 Oct 2001 19:12:44 Linda Adams (Re: [AML] Paul BAILEY, _For Time and All Eternity_) asked, > Has anyone ever heard of a fiction work by the title _For Time and > All Eternity,_ by Paul Bailey? I "rescued" this 400-page volume > from the public library's 25-cent book sale. I got my copy at the St. Vincent De Paul thrift shop in Seattle, 12/11/90 for 60 cents. > However, I have no intention of reading it myself unless I'm > thoroughly convinced otherwise by List members that it's > one not to miss. I haven't read it yet, but I probably will, despite Laurel Thatcher Ulrich's comment on it in her article "Fictional Sisters" in _Mormon Sisters: Women in Early Utah_ edited by Claudia L. Bushman. Jana Remy ran the first paragraphs of the piece on AML-List in her 02 Jul 1996 Prose Sampler column. Here's the first two sentences: >>>>> Twentieth century novelists have shown considerable interest in nineteenth century Saints. In the twenty-five years between Vardis Fisher's _Children of God_ (1939) and Paul Bailey's _For Time and All Eternity_ (1964), twenty-two unmistakably "Mormon" novels were published by firms like Doubleday and Harpers and reviewed in periodicals like the "New York Times" and "Saturday Review". <<<<< Mormon Sisters was reissued in 1997 by Utah State University Press. (I just found a copy on one of my shelves when I was pulling out my copy of Duane Crowther's Life Everlasting for another post. I'd forgot I bought a copy of Mormon Sisters, 2nd printing from Olympus Publishing in SLC--showing the worst in perfect binding, from Seatle DI, 6/21/91 for 50 cents.) Ulrich has an annotated bibliography at the end of the essay: "Although Bailey's Belles know how to fight and curse, they are otherwise indistinguishable from the standard stereotypes" (263). I like looking in the Mormon section of libraries, 289.3 (non-Christian religions), so I found one of his books, _The Armies of God_, in the Whitman County Library in Colfax Warshington, a good place to stop and use the facilities. ("You always go off looking at the books.") Sam Taylor has some interesting things about one-time U.S. President of Vice Schuyler Colfax in _The Kingdom or Nothing: The Life of John Taylor, Militant Mormon_, so whenever we would come down the hill into Colfax on our way home from Orofino ID, to Skedaddle I'd say, "Welcome to Colfax. Home of Schuyler Colfax, former vice presley dent of the You Knighted Snakes, notoriously and virulently anti-Mormon." I didn't say it once and Donna asked, wasn't I going to say it? A comment on the dustjacket inside front flap intrigued me, "But when the holy warriors are truly bound to principles of peace and non-violence, the ethical contradictions of their militancy are bound to be deep and long-lasting," and Viola (Donna's aunt), here it is in the PG Library. I've had a half-finished post on Bailey in my Drafts folder since Fri, 25 Jun 1999 when Levi Peterson wrote: >My brother Charles Peterson, a Mormon historian, has just read >Paul Bailey's Polygamy Was Better Than Monotony: One Man's >Memories of Mormon Pioneer Life in Utah. He is impressed with this >autobiographical account and is suddenly very interested in Bailey. Paul Dayton Bailey was one of the Mormon Lost Generation. I haven't read any of his stuff, but have _Polygamy Was Better Than Monotony_ on my shelves, awaiting a good read. He has been an inspiration to me since I read Sam Taylor's review of it, "You Can't Tell a Book By Its Cover" (_Dialogue_ 8:1 (1973) 105-6. Taylor mentions "an aspect of Paul Bailey's life which he barely hints at. He wanted to be a writer, and so throughout his adult life he has arisen at four in the morning, to satisfy his creative impulse at the typewriter before going to a full day's work, successively as typographer, as newspaper reporter, as editor, and as the publisher of Westernlore Press. That is how hard he worked at the craft of writing, and his mastery of it shows in every line" (105). > He asked me some questions, which I send on the members of the > aml-list in hopes others will have better answer than I have. He wants > to know whether there is some critic or biographer who has > specialized in Bailey. I don't recall seeing any Bailey criticism except Ulrich's comment and Taylor's review, but you could look in a source like Contemporary Literary Criticism. There are some reviews of Bailey's work in the BYU Library catalog, including one by Fawn Brodie. > He wants to know how Bailey has generally been received > and whether he is considered to have a high literary reputation. Taylor admired him a great deal. > He would like to know whether Bailey is viewed dimly by the official > church. Taylor says, "His _Jacob Hamblin, Buckskin Apostle_ was banned in Utah because it had a chapter on Mountain Meadows. Later when the shock wore off, it was a selection of the L.D.S. Book Club. Then that book stopped selling when the Brethren disapproved of _For Time and All Eternity_. He quotes from a letter Bailey sent him: >>>>> As a writer, the fact that I am steeped in Mormon lore has been more a hindrance than help to me. I have never been able to purge from my stubborn mind a conviction that the Mormon tale is one of the most unique and interesting dramas in the annals of America. It has been my soaring wings; it has been my cement coffin. . . . I am convinced that this wonderful tapestry has been only superficially scrutinized, and that many books in depth are yet to come. I am equally convinced that, when they are written, it will be well if their authors are not born in the heritage. <<<<< "Problem is [Taylor says] "only those so born can tell the story in depth." Taylor would reply to our current thread about Mormon acceptance in National Market by saying that a lot of what we try to put on the national market isn't told in depth, but out of a desire to make ourselves look good, and that's not what people want to know us, not the public face we put out to convince people we really aren't that bad. There's a sad letter from Bailey in the 20th Anniversary volume of Dialogue, Summer 1987 issue (so he would have been 80 or 81, born 1906--don't know if he's still alive), p. 4-5, under the headline, "Mutual Endeavor:" >>>>> Thank you for your invitation to return to the fold as a subscriber. I'm a warm friend of Dialogue and also appreciate all the fine things you are doing in the Mormon literary field. As you probably know, the forty books I wrote and published in the past years, many of them concerning the same audience, qualify me to the same interest and endeavor. I hope you realize the important role you play in our mutual world. Thank you for inviting me to again join you in the field of our common heritage. Unfortunately for me, total blindness has forced the verdict. For forty years I managed with one eye to carry on a career of journalism and editing many books concerning the American West. This last year I lost the sight of the remaining good eye. Total blindness is hard for me to accept. But from it there can be no reprieve. No longer can I see my beautiful world. As an author no longer can I write, read, or share in the literary world. I must therefore leave it to you. God bless you in your endeavors. And thank you again for inviting me aboard. Paul Bailey Claremont, California P.S. This note was scribbled in the world of total darkness. I hope you can read it. <<<<< Here's a partial list of his books from BYU Library catalog. The catalog doesn't give the publisher unless you click on the book, so this doesn't include publishers. An unnatural history of Death Valley : with reflections on the valley's varmints, virgins, vandals, and visionaries, 1978 Holy smoke : a dissertation on the Utah war, 1978 Those kings and queens of old Hawaii : a mele to their memory, 1975 Polygamy was better than monotony : to my grandfathers and their plural wives, 1973 Concentration camp U.S.A, 1972 City in the sun : the Japanese concentration camp at Poston, Arizona, 1971 Ghost dance Messiah, 1970 The armies of God, 1968 Jacob Hamblin, buckskin apostle, 1966 The claws of the hawk : the incredible life of Walker the Ute, 1966 For time and all eternity, 1964 Wovoka, the Indian messiah, 1957 Walkara, Hawk of the Mountains, 1954 Sam Brannan and the California Mormons, 1953 Song everlasting, 1946 Deliver me from Eva, 1946 The gay saint, a novel, 1944 For this my glory; a story of a Mormon life, 1943 Sam Brannan and the California Mormons, 1943 Type-high, a novel, 1937 Grandpa was a polygamist : a candid remembrance, 1960 Harlow S. Clark ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Internet: Discussion Lists and Forums: Kent Larsen 10Dec01 US NY NYC I4 Date: 12 Dec 2001 08:30:18 -0500 Discussion Lists and Forums NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- With popular services like Yahoo!groups making discussion lists easy to set up and run, the number of forums for LDS Church members to talk with one another is rising dramatically. This week we list a number of the lists and discussion forums that have appeared recently, or that have come to our notice. Significantly, all but three of the 10 are on Yahoo!groups, and, more significantly, a few of them are not in English. The most surprising of those lists is the CommunidadSUD list, a Spanish-language list that counts more than 3,000 members, but a relatively low volume of messages. The list's general-purpose conversation runs the gamut, from inspirational messages to simple queries, to the bane of discussion lists -- messages about how to get on or off the list. Newly Listed Mormon Websites: BOM-Geography http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bom-geography/ Yahoo-groups email/web discussion list for the geography of the Book of Mormon. List does not discuss the historicity of the Book of Mormon, instead assuming that it is a historical record. List discusses various theories for where Book of Mormon events occurred. Cleaning_Challenged http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cleaning_Challenged/ Yahoo!Groups discussion list for those that find cleaning difficult. Seeks to discover ways to make cleaning easier. List maintains LDS standards. Cooking_Challenged http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cooking_Challenged/ Discussion list for LDS Church members to discuss cooking and how to make cooking easier. Meant for those who have a hard time with cooking. List maintains LDS standards. ComunidadSUD http://mx.groups.yahoo.com/group/ComunidadSUD/ Large general interest Spanish-language discussion list for LDS Church members. Includes several thousand members who get occasional inspiring, friendly and fun messages. LDS_ADD-ADHD http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LDS_ADD-ADHD/ Relatively old list for LDS Church members who have Attention Deficit Disorder or Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. List members discuss their struggles and share ideas for how to live with the disorder. LDS Friend Discussion Board http://www.ldsfriend.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi Russian-language general interest message-board for LDS Church members. Includes three forums frequented by church members in Russia. LDS_Kids_Recipes http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LDS_Kids_Recipes/ LDS-oriented list for sharing recipes that kids can make themselves with little or no help. PCOS-LDS http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PCOS-LDS Support discussion list for LDS women suffering from Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome. Suite 101: LDS Women http://www.suite101.com/welcome.cfm/lds_women Site for LDS women using about.com-like Suite101.com. Includes links to Internet sites on LDS women and general LDS sites, articles about women's issues and discussion boards. While not as heavily promoted as about.com, suite101.com is nicer, not as heavily coded and its subjects are better organized. Zion's Lighthouse Message Board http://pub26.ezboard.com/bpacumenispages Message-board style discussion site meant for "Academians, Apologists, and Skeptics." Includes discussions of LDS Doctrine, History, Culture and even comparative religion. Like many public message boards, Zion's Lighthouse is frequented by a wide range of viewpoints, including many anti-Mormons. However, this board does have a lot of traffic, thousands of messages each month. >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] Laura KALPAKIAN Query Date: 19 Dec 2001 12:07:12 -0800 (PST) --- Christopher Bigelow wrote: > What do people know about an author named Laura Kalpakian? I just > ordered a > used copy of her book _These Latter Days_. > >From a description of her papers (Google rules!) that are archived in the U. of Miami [see http://www.library.miami.edu/archives/papers/kalpak.html ]: "Kalpakian also reveals the connections between her family background and her fiction. Her father and his ancestors who were Mormons inspired These Latter Days a story set among a mormon clan in the American west." Kalpakian is currently serving as an instructor in the U. of Washington's writing program: http://www.outreach.washington.edu/extinfo/certprog/wrp/wrp_ins.asp I thought that I had recognized her name but had no idea where----turns out she is the author who wrote _Cosette_ a sequel to Le Miz. From what I remember, it was not very well received. ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] AML-List Holiday Plans Date: 20 Dec 2001 15:40:58 -0600 Folks, Since I will be in River Falls, Wisconsin this Christmas (River Falls--home of AML-List? well, at least home of the AML-List moderator), I plan to keep the List up and running at a slow pace over the holidays. No posts on Christmas Eve or Christmas, light (10-12 maximum) posts Wednesday-Friday and Monday the 31st. No posts Tuesday, Jan. 1. Back to full service on the 2nd. Hopefully, this will allow timely notices and some moderate level of discussion while not piling up the in-boxes of those who will be away from their email during this time. Jonathan Langford AML-List Moderator -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Picht Subject: Re: [AML] Dahl Date: 10 Dec 2001 15:10:05 -0600 rwilliams wrote: > I'm sorry, perhaps I'm just not following your argument. How do you know that > in Dahl's portrayal of Charlie and James that he is _pretending_ to be nice, > but in "Pig" he is _sincerely_ "nasty"? (The argument implying that Dahl is > basically incapable of any human warmth: i.e. he MUST have been pretending). First I must point out that I never met Roald Dahl and will never have the pleasure, since he's thoroughly dead. I don't and can't know for certain that he wasn't a warm and loving man, even though his family says that wasn't the case, but can only infer things about him from his writing and from comments from those who knew him personally. Second, my own feeling (perhaps counterfactual) is that it's easier for a nasty person to pretend convincingly sometimes to be nice than for a nice person to convincingly be falsely nasty. Dahl is so good so often at nasty that I'm quite sure his nastiness is sincere. Let me also point out that I don't use "nasty" pejoratively. I _love_ mean and nasty. I think Dahl is _delightful_. (I also laughed at the death of little Nell - my heart isn't stone.) Nasty doesn't mean hateful. I think there was hate in his heart (some lurks even in mine, and I'm the kindest of men), but I don't think he was capable only of spilling bile. I have no doubt he was capable of warmth - the care he gave to his wife during her illness touched me greatly (though after she recovered he went off with a mistress - I was disappointed) - but only that that was the thing that mostly strongly characterized his life or his writing. So, were the books or were the stories the real Roald Dahl? Yes. That is, both. But even in the books there's a certain chill of nastiness. It even came through in the movie (it was criticized by many parents for being "dark;" I hated it because it wasn't dark enough - it wasn't the hilariously vicious book that so entranced me as a child). Some bad and potentially dangerous things happen to Charlie's fellow ticket winners, and they _deserve_ it. They end up damaged goods (Violet ends up blue, Mike ends up a piece of human wire - Augustus ends up tall and svelt, though). The Oompa-loompas invite us to join their delight in it all. Willy Wonka is a cheerful, self-absorbed and sociopathic lover of kids. He is _not_ a warm man. > I'm not going to say that Dahl was absolutely incapable of hatred, but, as long > as we're generalizing, I'll be the one arguing FOR Dahl. Aren't I already for Dahl? > I'm much more inclined to read Dahl's texts as ironic--wonderfully ironic--in > their so-called "nasty" moments (I mean, this guy is FUNNY). Yes, yes, he's funny and ironic. But where people only flit on the verge of disaster in _CATCF_, they die cruelly in deserved and undeserved (but mostly deserved) ways in the stories. Dahl doesn't play nice with his stories' victims - he savages them, and I think he hates them. Or worse, perhaps he's just indifferent to them. Again, I like Dahl, I've read most of what he's written, there's enough warmth there to keep me interested (if he were only mean, I wouldn't read him - I'm not a sadist, after all), his humor can be affectionate. But that's not the real Dahl - that is, it's not all there is. His books have nice smiling faces backed by sharp steel teeth. And sometimes the bitterness can be so corrosive I have to put him away. If Rowling manages the wit without the bile, she's probably a fun read for everyone. Dahl, for the most part, _isn't_ for children. Jim Picht -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: Re: [AML] Paul BAILEY Date: 19 Dec 2001 15:07:17 -0800 They show up about once a month at DI. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Christian Lit Date: 19 Dec 2001 17:47:03 -0700 >Harlow's list, I imagine is supposed to make one say, wait there are >tons of religious writers out there. He's mentioned about 50 drawn from >the last 150 years or so. My point is this: march up to WW Norton and >say, I'm a Christian writer and see what happens. > >Many of the writers Harlow mentioned were writers first, and their >Christianity followed them into the room through the back door. You say that like it's a bad thing. Like they were ashamed of their Christianity. I doubt they were. Knowing some of the writers on the list I can assure you they weren't. They were good writers and committed Christians and in writing about things they cared about they ended up writing about religious themes. Not all the time perhaps but in some cases yes, all the time. I suspect WW Norton wouldn't be all open arms and candy kisses to someone who marched up and said simply, "I'm a writer." Nothing wrong with being a writer first. In fact, when you're writing it kind-of helps. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 19 Dec 2001 18:18:27 -0700 > If one of my daily goals is to remove >such negative and destructive feelings from my heart, why would I choose >to read a book whose author deliberately intended to bring those feelings >into my heart? It would be a conflict of interest for me to read such a >book. Unless, of course, the author is using satire (which I'm almost positive Eric would be). Maybe we're talking more about a method of reading than a specific type of text. There are a lot of narrators who--if you took them at face value--would seem quite inflammatory, like, say, Swift's narrator in "A Modest Proposal." If, for example, I really believed the Swift's intentions were to promote cannibalism as an appropriate solution to overcrowding, then, yes, I would probably find myself "throwing the book across the room." So when I say "belief system," I mean the whole set of practices that dictate the way one perceives the world, something I think satire implicitly challenges. I guess what I am trying to say is that--generally speaking--I am against the whole idea of "bookthrowing" (not because I think books are so precious, but because I think there is some value in those authors that deliberately try to get us to think differently about something). Kathy, I understand you probably see some value in this too, and my response was intended only to encourage you to at least give Eric a chance. I recognize that we are all cursed (and blessed) with a 24-hour time limit on each day, a restriction that naturally leads us to want only the "best" books. But, in the final analysis, what matters more is HOW you read, not what you read. --John Williams -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 19 Dec 2001 20:41:43 -0800 I take it the thread has been primarily about the adult fiction market as there is some inroads in other genres such as Sci-fi with Card's books. I took a stroll through the children's sections of a couple of book stores while out and about the last couple of days, very interesting themes. I glanced to see if I could find anything by Dean Hughes or Carol Lynch Williams in the YA section, but no luck. Hughes used to do YA novels that at least the public library where I worked would add to their collection-I remember often reshelving the title, "Nutty Can't Miss". In the picture book section the one LDS author's books I saw was Richard Evans'. He has two titles out right now called "The Spyglass" and "The Tower". I'm kind of assuming he was able to get these out there on the strength of "The Christmas Box" sales. They did not have them out in any kind of display, but they did last year at holiday time. The basic competition in pic books seemed to be the titles out by John Lithgow and Maria Shriver and his books are at least as good as theirs. The main displays of childrens's books was between seasonal stuff like "The Grinch",(of course) and anything "Harry Potter" or "Lord of the Rings". In fact in looking in the children's section that's what's mostly out right now-fantasy. For the children, basic fairy tales and the current movie stuff. In YA, "Harry", "Lord of the Rings", "Dracula", "Which Witch", "The Secret of Platform 13" and several novels based on TV shows- "Buffy", "Angel", "Charmed" and "Roswell" come to mind. I didn't see any "Goosebumps" or "Babysitter's Club" included in the display, so they may have thankfully run their course. The only LDS artist I know of who has done a national market book is Robert Barrett. He was the illustrator for a children's version of "The Story of the Other Wiseman" that was out a number of years ago. I haven't seen it for awhile. Slim pickins' to say the least. I think the time is right for more LDS authors to break out in the national market, especially in the children's lit area. Whether the story be general or not I think there's room out there. In children's books there is something of an agreement of age appropriate themes for young children that LDS authors would be able to do to appeal to a more general audience. But I also think owing to what the country has been going through someone could also tell the story or stories of the early church and the pioneers that could engage a national audience, as we're a part of the fabric of the american story as well. There is one book that comes to mind that was written with a young LDS protagonist by a non-LDS author-Patricia Beatty titled, "I Want My Sunday Mister!" I don't think the book is in print, however it might still be in local libraries. I don't believe she ever used another Mormon character in her books, but I could be wrong. The only title I saw of hers at the store was "Charley Skedaddle". Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Subject: [AML] Mike BINGHAM, _101 Missionary Stories..._ (Review) Date: 20 Dec 2001 09:07:13 -0800 101 MISSIONARY STORIES YOU WON'T FIND IN THE ENSIGN By Mike Bingham with a glossary by Robert Kirby 1998, White Horse Books, Salt Lake City Softcover, 96 pages $7.95 ISBN 1-892936-02-X The title is true, the names have been changed to protect the guilty. Although you will NOT find these stories in the Ensign you needn't worry about this being an alternative book that will "corrupt the youth of Zion". What it is is a compilation of anecdotal stories that richly illustrates the goofy stunts missionaries pull on each other and the odd things that can happen in a missionary's life, most of them humorous. Each story is no more than a paragraph or two with title and number. Example: #1. Jeremiah: Prophet or Amphibian? Bingham admits in the foreword of the book that he has changed the names and missions of those involved and he has depended on the assumption that those who shared their stories with him were being honest, but-"If there are errors, they are the errors of men..." and some artistic license may have been taken in the telling of the story (stories)". At least one of these stories-#60. Chip Off the Old Block, he admits may be apocryphal, but the guy who told it to him "swore it was true" concerns a supposed encounter two missionaries had with a priest in the Vatican who greeted them with, "Hello Sons of the Devil." To which they reply, "Hello Father." It's funny, but the same story is attributed to J. Golden Kimball and a Baptist Minister in another book put out by the same publisher. When I pointed this out to Mr. Bingham in an e-mail, (which he lists at the back of the book for people to send in more stories), he replied by sending me a couple more anecdotes that will be put in the upcoming follow-up book. These complaints aside, it's a cute and funny book that doesn't pretend to be anything else. It includes a irreverent and informative glossary of missionary terms by Robert Kirby at the back of the book. Example: Golden-Non-member who will in all likelihood, join the church. "Those dirty flippers who threw rocks at us yesterday aren't Golden." There is also a story that is about Kirby, without the name change, that he related in his Irreantum interview about the dog he had on his mission that he and his companion used for door contacting. (#96). At least one General Authority is named in the hijinks, Elder Bruce R. McConkie-#15 Wait for Me One Hour and I would really like to know who the Apostle's son is in #14 who cried, "I'm going to tell my Dad!" after being the brunt of a practical joke involving a garbage truck. Most of these stories are G rated, some PG, but if someone is looking for a gift for a younger sibling to give an older brother or sister who has served a mission, this is a good one. It is inexpensive and will bring knowing nods and chuckles. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Dahl Date: 20 Dec 2001 15:18:44 -0700 Jim Picht wrote: <<>> Mmmmm, mean, nasty bitterness. [Head tilting backward, throat filling with drool, skin turning yellow] Argghhhhhh . . . <<>> The _Willa Wonka_ movie is up for remake, and someone attached to the project called the Gene Wilder version something like "some Hollywood producers bad acid trip." Especially post-9/11, I hope they don't try to sweeten it and make it as pale as the newer Tom & Jerry was compared to the old. Down with earnestness, upliftingness, etc. Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: [AML] Mormon Authors/Ill. of Nat. Children's Lit Date: 20 Dec 2001 11:51:22 -0700 Kathy Tyner wrote: > Slim pickins' to say the least. I think the time is right for more > LDS authors to break out in the national market, especially in the > children's lit area. Actually, pickin's ain't slim at all--not in the area of children's and YA fiction. There are many, many LDS writers/illustrators of children's and YA books publishing in the national market. Earlier this year I posted a list, compiled by Rick Walton, of those working in the picture book genre (there are numerous others publishing middle-grade and YA stuff). Here, for your general information, is that list again. I think you'll be impressed. LDS PICTURE BOOK AUTHORS AND ILLUSTRATORS PUBLISHING IN THE NATIONAL MARKET (Since the purpose of this list is to show what LDS picture book authors and illustrators are doing on the national market, I have not included books published for the LDS market. Some of these authors and illustrators have produced books other than picture books. I have not included those books in this list.) Andersen, Bethanne (illustrator) --Bluebird Summer, Deborah Hopkinson (Greenwillow, 2001) --Kindle Me a Riddle: A Pioneer Story, by Roberta Karim (Greenwillow, 1999) --A Prayer for the Earth: The Story of Naamah, Noah's Wife, Sandy Eisenberg Sasso (Jewish Lights, 1996) Bagley, Pat (author/illustrator) --Peek-A-Boo Magic (Aspen, 1995) (author) --Showdown at Slickrock, il. Guy Francis (Aspen, 1996) (illustrator) Bowen, Anne --I Loved You Before You Were Born, il. Greg Shed (HarperCollins, 2001) Buehner, Caralyn --The Escape of Marvin the Ape, il. Mark Buehner (Dial, 1992) --Fanny's Dream, il. Mark Buehner (Dial, 1996) --I Did It, I'm Sorry, il. Mark Buehner (Dial, 1998) --I Want to Say I Love You, il. Jacqueline Rogers (Phyllis Fogelman Books, 2001) --It's a Spoon, Not a Shovel, il. Mark Buehner (Dial, 1995) --A Job For Wittilda, il. Mark Buehner (Dial, 1993) Buehner, Mark (illustrator) --The Adventures of Taxi Dog, by Debra and Sal Barracca (Dial, 1990) --The Escape of Marvin the Ape, by Caralyn Buehner (Dial, 1992) --Fanny's Dream, by Caralyn Buehner (Dial, 1996) --Harvey Potter's Balloon Farm, by Jerdine Nolen (Lothrop Lee & Shepard, 1994) --I Am the Cat, by Alice Schertle (Lothrop, 1999) --I Did It, I'm Sorry, by Caralyn Buehner (Dial, 1998) --It's a Spoon, Not a Shovel, by Caralyn Buehner (Dial, 1995) --A Job For Wittilda, by Caralyn Buehner (Dial, 1993) --Maxi, the Hero, by Debra and Sal Barracca (Dial, 1995) --My Life With a Wave, by Catherine Cowan and Octavio Paz (Lothrop Lee & Shepard, 1997) --My Monster Mama Loves Me So, by Laura Leuck (Lothrop, 1999) --No More Water in the Tub, by Tedd Arnold (Puffin, 1998) Cannon, A. E. (Ann Edwards) --I Know What You Do When I Go to School, il. Jennifer Mazzucco (Gibbs Smith, 1996) Covey, Traci O'Very --Mapped Out: The Search for Snookums, by Carol Baicker-McKee (Gibbs Smith, 1997) Duncan, Robert (illustrator) --Amber on the Mountain, by Tony Johnston (Dial, 1994) Evans, Lezlie --Can You Count Ten Toes?: Count to 10 in 10 Different Languages, Denis Roche (Houghton Mifflin, 1999) --If I Were the Wind, Victoria Lisi (Ideals Childrens Books, 1997) --Rain Song, il. Cynthia Jabar (Houghton Mifflin, 1995) --Snow Dance, il. Cynthia Jabar (Houghton Mifflin, 1997) --Sometimes I Feel Like a Storm Cloud, il. Marsha Gray Carrington (Mondo Pub, 1999) Evans, Richard Paul --The Christmas Candle, il. Jacob Collins (Simon & Schuster, 1998) --The Dance, il. Jonathan Linton (Simon & Schuster, 1999) --The Spyglass: A Story of Faith, il. Jonathan Linton (Simon & Schuster, 2000) Foster, Karen (author/illustrator) --Good Night My Little Chicks/Buenas noches mis pollitos (First Story Press, 1997) Francis, Guy (illustrator) --Showdown at Slickrock, by Pat Bagley (Aspen, 1996) Garns, Allen (illustrator) --Astronauts Are Sleeping, by Natalie Standiford (Bradford, 1996) --The Gift Stone, by Robyn Harbert Eversole (Knopf, 1998) --When I Go Camping With Grandma, by Marion Dane Bauer (Bridgewater, 1995) --Winter Fox, by Jennifer Brutschy (Knopf, 1993) Glenn, Sharlee --Gracie and Roo, il. Dan Andreasen (Putnam, 2004) Graham, Mark (illustrator) --Alicia's Tutu, by Robin Pulver (Dial, 1997) --Baby Talk, by Fred Hiatt (Margaret McElderry, 1999) --Charlie Anderson, by Barbara Abercrombie (Aladdin, 1995) --Come Meet Muffin!, by Joyce Carol Oates (Ecco, 1998) --The Dream Jar, by Bonnie Pryor (Morrow, 1996) --Father, We Thank You, by Ralph Waldo Emerson (Seastar, 2001) --Greenbrook Farm, by Bonnie Pryor (Simon & Schuster, 1991) --Home By Five, by Ruth Wallace-Brodeur (McElderry, 1992) --If I Were Queen of the World, by Fred Hiatt (McElderry, 1997) --Lottie's Dream, by Bonnie Pryor (Simon & Schuster, 1992) --Lucy Comes to Stay, by Rosemary Wells (Dial, 1994) --Merry Birthday, Nora Noel, by Ann Dixon (Eerdmans, 1996) --Michael and the Cats, by Barbara Abercrombie (McElderry, 1993) --Miss Opal's Auction, by Susan Vizurraga (Henry Holt, 2000) --Murphy and Kate, by Ellen Howard (Simon & Schuster, 1995) --My Father's Hands, by Joanne Ryder (William Morrow, 1994) --Sarah's Sleepover, by Bobbie Rodriguez (Viking, 2000) --Shadows Are About, by Ann Whitford Paul (Scholastic, 1992) --Waiting for Noel: An Advent Story, by Ann Dixon (Eerdmans, 2000) --Where's the Baby?, by Tom Paxton (Morrow, 1993) --Wilderness Cat, by Natalie Kinsey-Warnock (Cobblehill, 1992) Hawkes, Kevin (illustrator) --And to Think That We Thought That We'd Never Be Friends, by Mary Ann Hoberman (Crown, 1999) --Boogie Bones, by Elizabeth Loredo (Putnam, 1997) --By the Light of the Halloween Moon, by Caroline Stutson (Puffin, 1993) --Cowpokes, by Caroline Stutson (Lothrop, 1999) --Dreamland, by Roni Schotter (Orchard, 1996) --The Enormous Snore, by M. L. Miller (Putnam, 1995) --Handel, Who Knew What He Liked, by Matthew T. Anderson (Candlewick, 2001) --Imagine That: Poems of Never Was, by Jack Prelutsky (Knopf, 1998) --Jason's Bears, by Marion Dane Bauer (Hyperion, 2000) --Lady Bugatti, by Joyce Maxner (Puffin, 1991) --The Librarian Who Measured the Earth, by Kathryn Lasky (Little Brown, 1994) --Marven of the Great North Woods, by Kathryn Lasky (Harcourt Brace, 1997) --My Friend the Piano, by Catherine Cowan (Lothrop, 1998) --My Little Sister Ate 1 Hare, by Bill Grossman (Crown, 1996) --Nose, by Nicolai Gogol, retold by Catherine Cowan (Lothrop, 1994) --Painting the Wind, by Michelle Dionetti (Little Brown, 1996) --The Poombah of Badoombah, by Dee Lillegard (Putnam, 1998) --Timothy Tunny Swallowed a Bunny, by Bill Grossman (Laura Geringer, 2001) --The Turnip, by Walter De La Mare (David R. Godine, 1992) --Weslandia, by Paul Fleischman (Candlewick, 1999) (author/illustrator) --Then the Troll Heard the Squeak (Puffin, 1991) --His Royal Buckliness (Lothrop, 1992) Henriod, Lorraine --Grandma's Wheelchair (Albert Whitman, 1982) Hepworth, Cathi (author/illustrator) --Antics!: An Alphabetical Anthology (Putnam, 1992) (illustrator) --Bug Off!" A Swarm of Insect Words, Ed. Nancy Paulsen, (Putnam, 1998) --Hattie Baked a Wedding Cake, by Toby Speed (Putnam, 1994) --While You Are Asleep, by Gwynne L. Isaacs (Walker, 1991) Hong, Lily Toy (Author/Illustrator) --The Empress and the Silkworm (Albert Whitman, 1995) --How the Ox Star Fell From Heaven (Albert Whitman, 1991) --Two of Everything (Albert Whitman, 1993) --ILLUSTRATOR --Mr. Sun and Mr. Sea, by Andrea Butler (Goodyear, 1994) Post, Howard --The Magic Boots, by Scott Emerson (Gibbs-Smith, 1994) --Under the Moon and Stars, by Scott Emerson (Gibbs-Smith, 1995) Hull, Richard (Illustrator) --The Alphabet From Z To A (With Much Confusion on the Way), by Judith Viorst (Atheneum, 1994) --The Cat & The Fiddle & More, by Jim Aylesworth (Atheneum, 1992) --Jellyfish to Insects, by William Hemsley (Gloucester, 1991) --My Sister's Rusty Bike, by Jim Aylesworth (Atheneum, 1996) Jacobs, Jim --Babri, il. Fahimeh Amiri (Gibbs Smith, 1994) Kosaka, Fumi (illustrator) --Bubbles, Bubbles, by Kathi Appelt (HarperCollins, 2001) --Let's Count the Raindrops and Other Weather Poems (Viking, 2001) --Ordinary Mary, by Emily Pearson (Gibbs Smith, 2001) Leavitt, Mel --Grena and the Magic Pomegranate, il. Beth Wright (Carolrhoda, 1994) --Snow Story, il. JoEllen McAllister Stammen (Simon & Schuster, 1995) Madsen, Ross Martin --Perrywinkle and the Book of Magic Spells, il. Dirk Zimmer (Dial, 1986) --Perrywinkle's Magic Match, il. Dirk Zimmer (Dial, 1997) --Stewart Stork, il. Megan Halsey (Dial, 1993) Meidell, Sherry (illustrator) --ABC's of Uniforms and Outfits, by Barbara Williams (Winston-Derek, 1991) --Emma Jo's Song, by Faye Gibbons (Boyds Mills, 2001) Newbold, Greg (illustrator) --Winter Lullaby, by Barbara Seuling (Harcourt, 1998) --Spring Song, by Barbara Seuling (Harcourt, 2001) --The Touch of the Master's Hand, by Myra Brooks Welch (Aspen, 1997) Olson, Julie (illustrator) --Hip, Hip Hooray for Annie McCrae, by Brad Wilcox (Gibbs Smith, 2001) Pearson, Emily --Ordinary Mary, il. by Fumi Kosaka, (Gibbs Smith, 2001) Slangerup, Erik Jon --Dirt Boy, il. John Manders (Whitman, 2000) Soentpiet, Chris (illustrator) --Coolies, by Yin (Philomel, 2001) --Dear Santa, Please Come to the 19th Floor, by Yin (Philomel, 2001) --Jin Woo, by Eve Bunting (Clarion, 2001) --The Last Dragon, by Susan Miho Nunes (Houghton Mifflin, 1997) --Molly Bannaky, by Alice McGill (Houghton Mifflin, 1999) --Momma, Where Are You From?, by Marie Bradby (Orchard, 2000) --More Than Anything Else, by Marie Bradby (Orchard, 1995) --Peacebound Trains, by Haemi Balgassi (Clarion, 1996) --A Sign, by George Ella Lyon (Orchard 1998) --The Silence in the Mountains, by Liz Rosenberg (Orchard, 1999) --Silver Packages: An Appalachian Christmas Story, by Cynthia Rylant (Orchard, 1997) --So Far From the Sea, by Eve Bunting (Clarion, 1998) --Something Beautiful, by Sharon Dennis Wyeth (Doubleday, 1998) --Where Is Grandpa?, by T. A. Barron (Philomel, 2000) (author/illustrator) --Around Town (Lothrop, 1994) Strickland, Michael --Haircuts at Sleepy Sam's, by Keaf Holliday (Boyds Mills, 1998) Terry, Will (illustrator) --Pizza Pat, by Rita Gelman (Random House, 1999) Tunnell, Michael O. --Beauty and the Beastly Children, il. John Emil Cymerman (Tambourine, 1993) --Chinook, il. Barry Root (Tambourine, 1993) --Halloween Pie, il. Kevin O'Malley (Lothrop, 1999) --The Joke's On You George, il. Kathy Osborne (Tambourine, 1993) --Mailing May, il. Ted Rand (Greenwillow, 1997) Walton, Rick --The Bear Came Over to My House, il. James Warhola (Putnam, 2001) --Bullfrog Pops!, il. Chris McAllister (Gibbs Smith, 1999) --Bunny Day, il. Paige Miglio (HarperCollins, 2002) --Cars At Play, w/Ann Walton, il. James Croft (Putnam, 2002) --How Can You Dance?, il. Ana Lopez-Escriva (Putnam, 2001) --How Many How Many How Many, il. Cynthia Jabar (Candlewick, 1993) --Little Dogs Say "Rough", il. Henry Cole (Putnam, 2000) --My Two Hands, My Two Feet, il. Julia Gorton (Putnam, 2000) --Noah's Square Dance, il. Thor Wickstrom (Lothrop Lee & Shepard, 1995) --Once There Was a Bull...frog, il. Greg Hally (Gibbs Smith, 1995) --One More Bunny, il. Paige Miglio (Lothrop, 2000) --Pig Pigger Piggest, il. Jimmy Holder (Gibbs Smith, 1997) --So Many Bunnies, il. Paige Miglio (Lothrop, Lee & Shepard, 1998) --That's My Dog!, il. Julia Gorton (Putnam, 2001) --That's What You Get, il. Jimmy Holder (Gibbs Smith, 2000) --What to Do When a Bug Climbs In Your Mouth and Other Poems to Drive You Buggy, il. Nancy Carlson (Lothrop Lee & Shepard, 1995) --Why the Banana Split, il. Jimmy Holder (Gibbs Smith, 1998) --You Don't Always Get What You Hope For, il. Heidi Stetson (Gibbs Smith, 1996) Wilcox, Brad --Hip, Hip Hooray for Annie McCrae, il. Julie Olson (Gibbs Smith, 2001) Williams, Barbara --ABC's of Uniforms and Outfits, il. Sherry Meidell (Winston-Derek, 1991) --Albert's Toothache, il. Kay Chorao (Dutton, 1988) --Chester Chipmunk's Thanksgiving, il. Kay Chorao (Dutton, 1978) --Donna Jean's Disaster, il. Margot Apple (Albert Whitman, 1986) --Gary and the Very Terrible Monster, il. Lois Axelman (Children's Press, 1973) --Guess Who's Coming to My Tea Party?, il. Yuri Salzman (Holt, 1979) --Hello, Dandelions, photos by the author (Holt, 1979) --The Horrible, Impossible Witch Child, il. Carol Nicklaus (Avon, 1982) --If He's My Brother, il. Tomie De Paola (Harvey House, 1976) --Jeremy Isn't Hungry, il. Martha Alexander (Dutton, 1989) --Kevin's Grandma, il Kay Chorao (Dutton, 1991) --Never Hit a Porcupine, il. Anne Rockwell (Dutton, 1977) --So What If I'm a Sore Loser, il. Linda Strauss Edwards (Harcourt, 1981) --Someday, Said Mitchell, il. Kay Chorao (Dutton, 1976) --A Valentine for Cousin Archie, il. Kay Chorao (Dutton, 1980) --We Can Jump, il. Mary P. Maloney and Stan Fleming (Children's Press, 1974) --Whatever Happened to Beverly Bigler's Birthday?, il. Emily Arnold McCully (Harcourt, 1978) -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rwilliams Subject: RE: [AML] Dahl Date: 20 Dec 2001 16:18:23 -0700 James writes: >Let me also point out that I don't use "nasty" pejoratively. I _love_ mean and nasty. I think Dahl is _delightful_. (I also laughed at the death of little Nell -my heart isn't stone.) Nasty doesn't mean hateful. Okay. I thought you were using it pejoratively. Sorry I misunderstood. I'm not sure why I took that from your post (though I seem to recall a phrase a while back about "unquenchable inner core of bitterness and hatred"--there are so many people posting here at times that I forget who wrote what. So I apologize if I misrepresented your argument.) >Dahl, for the most part, _isn't_ for children. I'd say it probably depends on the kid, doesn't it? I mean, I couldn't get enough of him when I was a kid (I read the "Roald Dahl Omnibus" in 7th grade and thought it was delightful). --John Williams > >Jim Picht > > > > > >-- >AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Tyner" Subject: RE: [AML] Fw: MN The Other Side of Heaven: From Book to Movie to Paperback: Deseret Book Press Release 1Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 20 Dec 2001 15:45:23 -0800 I have not seen a schedule yet for the movie's California release. Any idea when that will be? Jerry Tyner -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: Re: [AML] Do We Have to Like Our Characters? Date: 20 Dec 2001 21:21:27 -0500 There are many books I will not read if I can't get past the horrible language and so forth. But, I have found many books worth reading that you (generic you, I don't know the specific you well enough to make that kind of statement.) might reject out of hand because they are not your idea of uplifting. Sometimes I read a character doing or saying something not very nice, very Christian or what have you. And I think--Oh my God (quite literally). That is me and it isn't a pretty picture. I think I understand what you are saying though. And I don't think from your further comments below that you read as narrowly as your first response may have implied. But there are those who don't read anything they don't consider "uplifting". And much that I consider uplifting, they don't. For instance, at Enrichment night a friend was quizzing me about recent reads. The book I just finished is Cry the Beloved Country. Another sister asked, "Is it depressing. Because I just can't read anything that's depressing." And I had to say--yes there are parts that are depressing, even though I wouldn't label the over all mood depressing. So they won't read it. And they'll miss, what for me was, a life changing book. It does not, however, fall into the category being discussed. The only book that came to mind for me was CS Lewis' Screwtape Letters. Does that fit the "the author had contempt for the main character" description? Someone else mentioned Amelia Peabody. I don't think she fits. I think Elizabeth Peters likes Amelia Peabody. In fact, she's very likable--even if clueless about some things. I think Inspector Monk in one of Anne Perry's series might come close. We know that he finds much of what he learns about his pre-memory loss self despicable. Even his present self is a little hard to take at times. But I don't think Anne Perry detests him, even if she does pity him. Well, so much for my late night rambling. Merry Christmas to all. Tracie Laulusa ----- Original Message ----- I've been pondering how to reply to your question. I've come to the conclusion I don't understand how the question relates to my statement. [snip] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Update: The Other Side of Heaven #1 Family Film in America: Excel Entertainment Press Release 18Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 01:12:13 -0500 Update: The Other Side of Heaven #1 Family Film in America SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Sold out showings in two theaters along the Wasatch Front made "The Other Side of Heaven" the top-grossing family film per screen in the country this weekend. With a per screen average of $29,176, the limited release film beat out nationally-released films like Tom Cruise's "Vanilla Sky" which did $9,117 per screen. The only film to beat "The Other Side of Heaven" in per screen averages was the R-rated comedy "The Royal Tenenbaums," starring an Oscar-winning ensemble cast that includes Gene Hackman, Anjelica Huston, Danny Glover and Gwyneth Paltrow. That movie was released in 5 theaters in Los Angeles and New York for a per screen average of $50,813, making "The Other Side of Heaven" the highest-grossing unrestricted film per screen in the nation. The Other Side of Heaven Opens Across Utah on December 21st ### Source: The Other Side of Heaven #1 Family Film in America Excel Entertainment Press Release 18Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ Send join and remove commands to: majordomo@MormonsToday.com Put appropriate commands in body of the message: To join: subscribe mormon-news To leave: unsubscribe mormon-news To join digest: subscribe mormon-news-digest -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN New video about the Willie and Martin handcart companies: Allen Leigh 15Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 02:58:01 -0500 New video about the Willie and Martin handcart companies WEST JORDAN, UTAH -- The West Jordan Utah Stake has produced a play, The Mormon Trail, about the Willie and Martin handcart companies of 1856. The two companies left Iowa City late in the summer (July) and didn't reach Salt Lake City until November. Early storms and freezing weather caused great suffering and death among the pioneers. In the midst of these trials, the Saints held true to their testimonies and looked to God for help. Help came in the form of Saints helping each other, angels from God helping push the carts and comfort the Saints, and supply wagons arriving from Salt Lake. Members of the two companies are featured in the play, including Francis and Ann Elizabeth Webster, Elizabeth and Aaron Jackson, Jens and Elsie Nielson, Levi Savage, Ephraim Hanks, Harvey Cluff, and the four men who carried the Saints across the ice-filled Sweetwater. Members of the West Jordan Utah Stake spent thousands of man hours over three years in producing the play. The play was produced as a "teaching play," using the trials of the pioneers as object lessons to help us realize that we can overcome our trials by applying Gospel principles to our lives. The video can be purchased for the cost of duplication and shipping by going to http://www.webster-family.org/ . That site has a number of pictures from the play. Source: Allen Leigh 15Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Call for Papers - 2002 Sunstone West Symposium: Sunstone News Release 12Dec01 US CA LA N4 Date: 21 Dec 2001 03:53:40 -0500 Call for Papers - 2002 Sunstone West Symposium 19-20 April, Pasadena, California PASADENA, CALIFORNIA -- The 2002 Sunstone West Symposium will be held April 19th and 20th in Pasadena, California. Organizers are now looking for papers, proposals, volunteers and support. SYMPOSIUM PURPOSE. The Sunstone Symposium is dedicated to the idea that the truths of the gospel of Jesus Christ are better understood and, as a consequence, better lived when they are freely and frankly explored within the society of the Saints. We recognize that the search for things that are, have been, and are to be is a sifting process in which much chaff will have to be inspected and threshed before wheat can be harvested. We welcome the honest ponderings of Latter-day Saints and their friends and expect that everyone will approach all issues, no matter how difficult, with intelligence and good will. FAITH. Hear the words that inspire Christian living by exploring gospel truths, sharing spiritual journeys, and untying knotty challenges. COMMUNITY. Meet new friends whose thoughts and experiences parallel yours (or, better yet, if they don't). Sunstone symposiums provide a forum for meeting scholars, sharing with others of similar interests, and joining in hallway conversations. KNOWLEDGE. Learn new strategies to be an intelligent Christian disciple in the (post)modern age, and gain insights in understanding your own journey. FUN. Wrestle with new, stimulating, and lively viewpoints. Savor well-crafted sermons. Match famous scholars' names with faces. Laugh in the humor sessions. Indulge in late-night discussions you never have time for elsewhere. Buy the latest books. Wonder at the blooming diversity among God's people. CALL FOR PROPOSALS. Sunstone seeks to celebrate and explore Mormon experience, issues, and art through diverse approaches and from many perspectives. From scholarly paper to artistic expression, we strive for excellence in thought and quality in presentation. FORMATS. Sessions may be scholarly papers, panel discussions, interviews, personal essays, sermons, dramatic performances, literary readings, debates, comic routines, art displays, or musical presentations. Given Sunstone West's proximity to Hollywood and the entertainment industry, we are especially interested this year in having several sessions explore religion in film, the perspectives of Mormons involved in the entertainment industry, and the portrayal of faith on the small or big screen. PROPOSALS SHOULD INCLUDE. Session title; a seventy- five word abstract; presenters' names, vitas, backgrounds, and contact information; a detailed summary of the topic's relevance and importance to Mormon studies; description of any audio or visual equipment needs. If possible, include a complete preliminary draft. DEADLINE. Submit proposals by 6 February 2002. Proposals submitted after the deadline will be considered on a time/space-available basis. SUBMIT PROPOSALS TO: Kirstin Wald 7877 Airport Blvd. Los Angeles, CA 90045 or, kwald@mindspring.com (310) 568-0088 (h) (310) 645-1364 (fax) LOCATION: Pasadena Hilton 168 South Los Robles Pasadena, CA 91101 The hotel is a fifteen-minute drive from the Burbank Airport and a forty-five-minute drive from LAX or Ontario Airport. RESERVATIONS. Call 1-800-HILTONS, 626- 577-1000, or visit www.pasadena.hilton.com . A block of rooms has been reserved for Sunstone participants; ask for the Sunstone room rates when you make your reservations. WEB PAGE. Sunstone West 2002 has a web site that will be updated as more information becomes available. Check it out: www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/7207/sunstonewest2002.html . EMAIL. If you have questions or comments, please direct them to SunstoneWest2002@hotmail.com. CALL FOR VOLUNTEERS. We welcome all who would like to assist in putting Sunstone West together. Please contact co-chairs Lee Poulsen wlp@radar-sci.jpl.nasa.gov or Mary Ellen Robertson mary.e.robertson@jpl.nasa.gov if you can volunteer. Source: Call for Papers - 2002 Sunstone West Symposium Sunstone News Release 12Dec01 N4 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Tabernacle Choir Receives National Media Attention: LDS Church News Release 14Dec01 US UT SLC A1 Date: 21 Dec 2001 02:55:11 -0500 Tabernacle Choir Receives National Media Attention CBS' Touched by an Angel, 60 Minutes II and PBS Showcase Choir SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- The Tabernacle Choir will appear on several national television programs this Christmas season including CBS' "Touched by an Angel," CBS' "60 Minutes II" and a PBS Christmas Eve special. Performing one of its most popular songs, "Battle Hymn of the Republic," the Choir makes an appearance on CBS' "Touched by an Angel" during a special Sunday evening episode. The Christmas special, "A Winter Carol," depicts a family dealing with the aftermath of the September 11th terrorist attack. The episode airs 16 December at 7 p.m. MST and features music from the Choir's new album, "The Sound of Glory." A few days later, "60 Minutes II" will air a segment featuring interviews with members of the Choir at home and in their workplaces. The segment focuses on the volunteer nature of service in the Choir and includes a brief history of the Choir and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Produced by Alan Weisman, a 60 Minutes veteran, the piece also includes an interview with Angela Lansbury, guest artist for the Choir's recent annual Christmas concert. CBS' "60 Minutes II" will air Wednesday, 19 December, at 7 p.m. MST. On Christmas Eve, the Utah Symphony and Mormon Tabernacle Choir join together for a new PBS holiday special, "The Gift of Music," a 90-minute concert taped during a live performance under the direction of Keith Lockhart, conductor of the Utah Symphony. The concert features three soloists: Henriette Schellenberg (soprano), Robert Breault (tenor) and Robert Honeysucker (baritone). Salt Lake City's International Children's Choir also participates. In Utah, "The Gift of Music" will air at 8 p.m. MST on KUED, Channel 7. Check local listings in other areas. For those who missed the Choir's Christmas concert with the Orchestra at Temple Square and famed film, stage and TV star Angela Lansbury, KBYU, Channel 11, will rebroadcast the concert twice. "The Joy of Christmas" will air 22 December at 9 p.m. MST and again on 24 December at 8:30 p.m. MST. The Choir received national attention early this year performing at the inauguration of President George W. Bush. The Choir has sung at the inaugurations of U.S. Presidents George Bush (1989), Ronald Reagan (1981), Richard Nixon (1969) and Lyndon Johnson (1965). The Mormon Tabernacle Choir has received various recognitions, including a Grammy Award for "The Battle Hymn of the Republic," an Emmy Award for the television program "Christmas Sampler," the Peabody Award for its CBS production "Let Freedom Ring," and the Freedom Foundation Award for its Fourth of July broadcast in 1980. In February 2002, the Choir will be featured in the Opening Ceremonies of the Olympic Winter Games, at four Cultural Olympiad concerts, and in the Church's own cultural offering, "Light of the World." ### Source: Tabernacle Choir Receives National Media Attention LDS Church News Release 14Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/news/article/0,5422,116-7538,00.html >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN BYU professors teach morals of "Lord of the Rings": BYU Press Release 8Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 03:00:38 -0500 BYU professors teach morals of "Lord of the Rings" PROVO, Utah -- Two Brigham Young University English professors are studying up on hobbits and ringwraiths - and not just because a movie based on J. R. R. Tolkien's "Lord of the Rings" trilogy opens next week. They are busy preparing lectures on the morals of fantasy literature and how its roots stem from Christian beliefs for an honors class on Tolkien's works they begin teaching next month. The class will feature discussions on all the elements found in "Lord of the Rings" - wizards, elves, fairies, heroes, supernatural creatures - and remain true to the good versus evil theme, said Don Chapman, assistant professor of English. "Fantasy literature is undergirded by an understanding of medieval literature informed by a Christian belief, or a notion of providence - this is why people can relate so well to it." Professor Steven Walker, who wrote his doctoral dissertation at Harvard on Tolkien, will also teach the class. "I want to look at the ways fantasy intersects reality and impinges on actual life, then we can begin to figure out how Tolkien's fantasy manages to be so realistic," he said. "Overall, I really want to see if we can get at the morals of the story and wind up with a discussion of how fantasy might affect us in our later lives." Though he has taught Tolkien before, Walker is excited about the new element that the film adds. "I'm hyped about the possibilities for the Tolkien class," said Walker, who has been awarded teacher of the year in the English department 12 times. "We'll definitely incorporate discussion of the new film into the course, and I'm hoping we can have a fantasy film forum and extend beyond the 'Lord of the Rings' into 'Harry Potter' and other film fantasies." Chapman is also anticipating the course since this is his first time teaching strictly Tolkien. "As I read his work, I'm taken by how he creates a fantasy world so matter-of-factly," he said. "He creates an alternate world, and he does it in such a natural way that it makes complete sense to the reader. I hope the movie is able to show that, too." The students registered for the class represent a number of different majors. Rushton Jones, a senior majoring in English from Grand Rapids, Mich., is among those who have filled the 20 available spots. "I'm definitely looking forward to taking this class, especially from such great professors," said Jones. "I have had Dr. Walker before and he does such a good job of bringing out my best writing - he sees a student's potential and finds a way of bringing it out in them." "Tolkien laid the foundation for all fantasy writers and has a very interesting history," said Robert Malmstrom, a senior from Austin, Texas, majoring in biochemistry, another student who is registered for the class. "Many would be surprised to learn of his key role in C. S. Lewis' conversion to Christianity - and that had no small effect." -###- Source: BYU professors teach morals of "Lord of the Rings": BYU Press Release 8Dec01 US UT SLC A2 http://www.byu.edu/news/releases/Dec/tolkien.htm >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "R.W. Rasband" Subject: [AML] Magic and Christianity in Rowling and Tolkien Date: 21 Dec 2001 13:51:48 -0700 "National Review Online" has published an excellent review by Peter Wood on the relationship between magic and Christianity in the works of J.K. Rowling and J.R.R. Tolkien. His review is basically a defense of the use of magic as metaphor in their books against "some literal-minded Christians" who find such depictions offensively pagan. LDS readers, of course, should be especially interested in such discussions because of controversies about "magic" in their own culture; and the question of who decides what really is "Christian." It can be found at: http://www.nationalreview.com/weekend/culture/culture-wood122201.shtml R.W. Rasband Heber City, UT rrasband@hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Powerful Impressions From The Life of Jesus: Deseret Book Press Release 8Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 02:56:49 -0500 Powerful Impressions From The Life of Jesus SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- It is a powerful medium that allows the Spirit to "enter ev'ry timid heart." Just as a hymn can pierce the soul with sound convictions, and poetry can awaken the mind and quicken the spirit, so too can artwork invite quiet contemplation, even immersion, into the events depicted. Among the world's most renowned religious artists such as Greg Olsen and Morgan Weistling is Simon Dewey. Now, Deseret Book Company presents Dewey's newet works, "Beloved Savior" (Eagle Gate, $19.95), a sampling of the art that accomplishes all of these feats. In this remarkable keepsake book, you will find twenty breathtaking images that present an unparalleled tapestry of the Savior's life. Dewey mixes touching poems, prose, and scriptural thoughts with each painting and work to describe in words the feelings evoked and stories told by those images. "Beloved Savior" depicts the humble beginnings of Christ's birth, his profound sermon to the woman at the well, his ability to heal the sick, and his triumphant resurrection at the Garden Tomb. Thoughtful essays from the artist accompany each painting and describe the feeling, faith, and testimony that are unmistakably evident in these extraordinary works of art. Dewey offers 20 stunning images gathered together in "Beloved Savior," along side scriptural thoughts and the artist's impressions. Known for his sensitivity to his subjects, Dewey uses his detailed and delicate paintings to portray the love and compassion in the face of Christ, and the devotion in the eyes of his followers. Known world wide for his incredible paintings, Simon Dewey has worked for Scholastic and Pengiun book publishers and has done cover and poster work for RCA Columbia and Warner Home Video. His religious-themed artwork has established him as one of the world's premiere artists in this genre. Simon Dewey pursued his artistic dreams at the age of 17 while in his native London. He studied in England before launching his career. In 1999 he entered the world of published fine art and soon became one of the bestselling artists of LDS religious works. Source: Powerful Impressions From The Life of Jesus Deseret Book Press Release 8Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] Acceptance of Christian Lit Date: 21 Dec 2001 14:24:51 -0700 (MST) > Harlow's list, I imagine is supposed to make one say, wait there are > tons of religious writers out there. He's mentioned about 50 drawn from > the last 150 years or so. My point is this: march up to WW Norton and > say, I'm a Christian writer and see what happens. > > Many of the writers Harlow mentioned were writers first, and their > Christianity followed them into the room through the back door. > -- > Todd Robert Petersen Also think about this - they are often seen as strong writers *despite* their Christian leanings. For example, a new version of "The Chronilces of Narnia" is going to be released - edited to remove all that pesky christian symbolism. --Ivan Wolfe -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Film: Mulholland Drive's LDS Connection, The Other Side of Heaven Starts Strong: Mormon News Film Editor 19Dec01 US TX Dal A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 03:47:25 -0500 Mulholland Drive's LDS Connection, The Other Side of Heaven Starts Strong DALLAS, TEXAS -- The biggest story in LDS Film this week is the limited premier of Mitch Davis' long-awaited "The Other Side of Heaven." Opening to the public on Friday, December 14th in just two theaters (Jordon Commons in Sandy and Scera in Orem), the Tongan missionary biopic took in $55,765 in just three days. In Orem, "The Other Side of Heaven" began showing at the earliest possible time that was permitted: at one minute past midnight on the morning of December 14th. The theater was sold out with an enthusiastic crowd. The packed theaters in its opening weekend gave "The Other Side of Heaven" the 2nd highest per-screen ticket sales in the entire country, finishing only behind the heavily advertised film "The Royal Tenenbaums," which opened in 5 theaters. "The Royal Tenenbaums" boasts an all-star cast that includes Gene Hackman, Danny Glover, Anjelica Huston, Bill Murray, Gwyneth Paltrow, Ben Stiller, Owen Wilson and Alec Baldwin -- so the people behind "The Other Side of Heaven" should be pleased with a second place showing behind it. Also, part of the gap between the per-screen average for "Tenenbaums" ($50,813) and "Heaven" ($27,882) might be attributable to low Sunday revenues for "Heaven." The Scera Theater is closed on the Sabbath. There were no showings there on the Sunday, December 16th, one of only three days included in the calculation. "The Other Side of Heaven" is writer/director Mitch Davis' first theatrically released film. But the film's producers already have had a few successes at the box office. John Garbett was a producer of "Shrek", which has grossed over $267 million domestically. And Jerry Molen is the producer of films that have grossed over 1.7 BILLION in U.S. ticket sales. (Well, make that 1.7 billion PLUS $55,000 from this weekend's "Other Side of Heaven" showings.) Also: With $22 million in ticket sales, "Ocean's Eleven" dropped from first to second place this week, behind a new Tom Cruise/Russell Crowe picture. The "Mormon twins" in the new "Ocean's Eleven" are a nod to the Mormon character in the original Brat Pack version. "Behind Enemy Lines" continued to do well, in 5th place. "Out Cold" starring LDS actress A. J. Cook was in 11th place after 26 days in release. Also in the news: The influential New York Film Critics Circle Awards were announced this week, and the bizarre David Lynch film "Mulholland Drive" was chosen as the year's Best Film. The NY Film Critics picks are always considered strong indicators of the year's Oscar favorites. Although "Mulholland Drive" is widely considered a pure Lynch-fest, it was actually the result of collaboration between Lynch and Mormon writer/film producer Joyce Eliason. Eliason is credited as the film's producer, but she was also the original co-writer of the TV pilot which was re-worked into this film. If the film receives any Oscar nods, it may help boosts the lackluster box office performance of this strongly R-rated auteur flick. Next week: "The Other Side of Heaven" opens up all in theaters all over Utah. Also coming: The premier of Peter Jackson's monumental "The Lord of the Rings." This is not a film by LDS filmmakers (interestingly enough, author J. R. R Tolkien was a devout and serious Catholic). But... what does the old BYU-produced Church video "The Emmett Smith Story" have to do with Peter Jackson's "Lord of the Rings"? The whole story, including comments from a rarely-seen Jackson interview -- next week. Weekend Box Office Report (U.S. Domestic Box Office Gross) Weekend of December 14, 2001 [If table below doesn't line up properly, try looking at them with a mono-spaced font, such as courier - Ed.] Natl Film Title Weekend Gross Rank LDS/Mormon Filmmaker or Actor Total Gross Screens Days ---- ------------------------------ ------- ----- ---- 2 Ocean's Eleven $22,076,664 3,075 10 LDS characters: Malloy twins 72,306,190 5 Behind Enemy Lines 5,414,981 2,792 17 David Veloz (screenwriter) 38,813,329 11 Out Cold 694,866 1,183 26 A. J. Cook (female lead) 13,245,127 33 Mulholland Drive 70,135 83 70 Joyce Eliason (producer/writer) 5,367,713 38 The Other Side of Heaven (NEW) 55,765 2 3 Mitch Davis (screenwriter/director) 55,765 John G. Groberg (author/character) Gerald Molen, John Garbett (producers) 45 Joy Ride 24,114 71 73 Paul Walker (2nd billed star) 21,933,431 60 China: The Panda Adventure 13,975 17 143 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 1,647,645 63 Galapagos 11,385 8 780 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 11,976,880 68 Cirque du Soleil: Journey of Man 9,840 7 591 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 12,938,153 73 Island of the Sharks 6,243 5 962 Alan Williams (composer) 10,554,048 75 All Access 5,653 4 255 Reed Smoot (cinematographer) 982,070 109 Mark Twain's America 3D 66 1 1263 Alan Williams (composer) 2,136,468 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN New Products: Missionary Stories, Tools, and Personal Testimonies: Kent Larsen 12Dec01 US NY NYC A4 Date: 21 Dec 2001 03:50:20 -0500 Missionary Stories, Tools, and Personal Testimonies NEW YORK, NEW YORK -- Among the new titles released by the major LDS publishers this season are a number that look at missionary work, provide tools for missionaries and inspiring materials for missionaries. Most interesting is a book from Cedar Fort by Frank Leach that shows how consistent efforts of many missionaries over years made a difference for his family and for a Wyoming town. Other books provide tools for missionaries, inspiring essays on belief, and the soundtrack for the new movie about Elder Groberg's missionary experiences. What may be the most popular of the books featured this week is "Why I Believe," Deseret Book's collection of essays on belief by prominent LDS Church members. Unlike previous collections, this one features many contributors who are not Utahns, and who have built reputations outside of Utah. Also likely to be popular is the soundtrack for "The Other Side of Heaven," the movie opening this weekend in select Utah theaters, about the missionary experiences of Elder John H. Groberg. The highly-touted film is the biggest LDS film since "God's Army" and the first recent film aimed at an LDS audience that is not by Richard Dutcher. New and recent products: Why I Believe Bookcraft Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Authors and Subject $19.95 Dozens of prominent LDS Church members tell why they believe. The contributors write inside, personal accounts of the reasons why they have faith in the LDS Church and how that faith has shaped his or her view of the world. Their stories are as diverse as their careers and life experiences. Contributors include author Stephen R. Covey, football star Steve Young, broadcaster Jane Clayson, performer Gladys Knight, former BYU football coach LaVell Edwards, businessman Bill Marriott, author Richard Paul Evans, businessman Mitt Romney, Senator Orrin Hatch, business guru Clayton Christensen, Philadelphia Eagles football coach Andy Reid, and others. Mission Accomplished by Frank Leach Cedar Fort Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Author and Subject $9.95 A convert tells how a succession of missionaries serving in a small Wyoming town slowly changed the lives of a family and of the town through their dedication and perseverance. While no individual missionary saw many baptisms, their consistent effort over many years made a tremendous difference. See: More about "Mission Accomplished" by Frank Leach at CedarFort.com The Missionary's Little Book of Teaching Tools by R. Dale Jeffery and V. Ruth Jeffery Covenant Communications Book; LDS Publisher; Non-fiction; Mormon Authors and Subject $9.95 Ideas missionaries can use to teach the principles and doctrines in the missionary lessons. These tools are also useful for those that have returned from their missions, helping them teach basic principles in family home evenings,firesides, church lessons and ward activities. The Other Side Of Heaven soundtrack by Kevin Kiner Excel Entertainment Music CD; LDS Publisher; Mormon Performer and Subject $15.98 The soundtrack for the new film about the missionary experiences of Elder John H. Groberg. The soundtrack captures the drama and adventure of the motion picture. See: More about "The Other Side Of Heaven soundtrack" by Kevin Kiner at Excel Entertainment >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 18 Dec 2001 10:04:42 -0700 [MOD: With Marilyn's permission, I've spliced together two messages of hers to create this one.] Terry Jeffress wrote: Brady Udall. W. W. Norton, a national publisher, has published both his short story collection, _Letting Loose the Hounds_, and his novel, _The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint_. To which Marilyn replies. Sorry, I don't buy it. I don't see the Mormons buying it either. Grin. [And in further explanation thereof...] The statement comes after an elaborate case I made for the FACT that there is no MORMON mainstream novel that is accepted in great glee by the Mormons and the nationial market at large. It is just proof that we are two different cultures. I had challenged Terry (or the group) to come up with one novel accepted by Mormons that made it on the national market. WORK AND THE GLORY? CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE? Not national. Maybe the closest is Margaret's ONE MORE RIVER TO CROSS because it has been accepted in some circles nationally by blacks? Even Brady Udall's Mormon RELATIVES are absolutely chagrined at his presentation of life which is so different from what they see and feel. I know this "embarrassment is a fact." He is a FABULOUS writer, but he is not MORMON in the cultural sense. My point was that Mormons must LEAVE the Mormon culture to be successful on the national market. And I'll stand by that supposition till the cows come home. NOT in children's literature or youth literature or sci fi. I'm talking about REAL experience. Anyway, chew on it. If you can come up with one that both the MORMONS and I will buy, I'll be happy to change my stance! Grin and cheers! Marilyn -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Light of the World: A Celebration of Life: LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 US UT SLC A1 Date: 21 Dec 2001 03:51:35 -0500 Light of the World: A Celebration of Life SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- Light of the World: A Celebration of Life is quite unlike anything that has ever been staged. From the moment guests enter the 21,000-seat Conference Center - the largest religious auditorium in the world - they will be immersed in a lively and colorful celebration of ethnic and cultural diversity from the four corners of the world. As guests enter the auditorium to take their seats for the main performance, they will be greeted by a rich orchestral and choral overture, as the house lights dim to half. In this spacious venue, PANI projection of NASA imagery will transform the Conference Center auditorium into a deep-space environment, surrounding guests with stars, swirling galaxies, nebulae and meteor fields on all sides. At the center, the huge domed stage will be obscured by an 80-foot-by-150-foot white sheer curtain, on which will be projected an impressionistic montage that chronicles the creative periods of Earth. While experiencing these images, guests will hear the words of prominent scientists, artists and humanitarians such as Annie Dillard, Albert Einstein and Dante. The audience will see an international cast of more than 1,500 performers celebrating the birth of children, the joy of childhood discovery, the realization of individual talents, the indomitable spirit of Mormon pioneers and the unparalleled spirit of Olympic competition which encompasses individual achievement and national honor. Complementing these stirring performances and true-life stories will be remarkable special effects that will showcase unique uses of sound, light and horizontal and vertical space, as cast members "fly" as high as 70 feet above the stage. Music is a universal language, and will be a unifying thread woven throughout Light of the World. The rich and melodic original score represents a collaborative effort of five award-winning composers who have donated their time and talents, anonymously, as a gift to the production. Solo vocalists and the world-renowned Mormon Tabernacle Choir will enrich the overall production with their musical talents and will help bring to life the collage of human stories that rejoice in the worldwide spirit of the nations. As a prologue to the performance, in the massive lobbies on three levels of the building, the 90-minute pre-show will treat guests to dance groups performing traditional dances including Croatian and Turkish Black Sea, Welsh clog, Hungarian bottle, English rapier, Native American hoop and Maori haka. Musical groups also will play instruments such as the Japanese koto, Bolivian panpipes, Celtic harp, lute, classical guitar and balalaika. Light of the World: A Celebration of Life captures the beauty of the human spirit that is universal to all mankind - the light within each of us which inspires acts, both great and small, of compassion, feats of bravery, and individual triumph. Light - The Central Message Light has intrigued John Featherstone for as long as he can remember. His earliest memories include using flashlights to light small box theaters he made at his home in England. "Light has always fascinated me - not just artificial light but also the wonders of natural light." Featherstone, a resident of Chicago, Ill., followed his passion to become a lighting designer, lighting concert tours for artists like Janet Jackson, the Pretenders and Van Halen. He has provided the lighting design for the NBA All Star Jam Session every year since 1993, and has lighted various attractions at Universal Studios and Walt Disney theme parks. It was a perfect fit, then, for producers of Light of the World to call on John's talent to illuminate a production in which light is the central message. "One of the key elements we're going to try to convey in this show is the light of Jesus Christ reaching down across the world. It is the same light that touches everyone, that lights up our souls and enhances the inner light that is already there," Featherstone said. Light of the World will feature over 5,000 lights. Most fixtures will be standard lights already in the Conference Center, but an additional 400 motorized lights will also be used. "One of the challenges of working in a space as large as the Conference Center," Featherstone says, "is that you need a lot of lighting fixtures to light a stage as big as we're going to be using." Featherstone's crew will examine each fixture individually and assign a position, intensity and color for every cue in the show. That information will then be input into a high-powered computer system that will control the lights during the production. "It will take us an hour to program a minute of show," Featherstone says. "That's why it's going to take us most of a month to program the production." The result will be light that steers the audience through a roller coaster of emotions through intensity, color and texture that can simulate various weather conditions as well as feelings of joy, anger and passion. "It's going to be a light that is very alive, very kinetic, very direct and uplifting in a way that it's going to reach out and touch the various members of the cast who represent the stories we're trying to tell." But Featherstone, who is not a member of the Church, emphasizes the lights should enhance the message of the program - not detract from it. He hopes the lights in Light of the World will show the light of Jesus Christ as well as the light within each individual. "One of the most flattering and humbling parts of being involved with this show is being given the awesome responsibility of representing the light of the transcendent," Featherstone says. "To me as a lighting designer, there is no greater honor I think you can have." Featherstone believes the combination of computer technology, video projections and lights will make Light of the World a cutting-edge show equal to any other major production in the world. "It's going to be every bit the size of show that one would see at the kind of spectaculars of the Academy Awards and the Grammys." Bringing "The World" to the Stage The 21,000-seat Conference Center auditorium, known for its worship services and concerts, will be transformed in February 2002 into a state-of-the-art theater staging a multimedia musical production on an unprecedented scale. "The Conference Center is going to be a marvelous place to experience live theater," says Randy Boothe, co-director of Light of the World. "It has a capability unlike any other theater to carry every member of the audience on an intimate, powerful journey they will long remember." The set design for the production uses both technical complexity and visual simplicity. Its central feature is a 130-foot dome that spans the entire length of the auditorium and serves as the stage. The dome, made expressly for the Conference Center, has a painted design that will correspond seamlessly to the aisles of the auditorium, all of which radiate from one central point. Performers will move between the stage and audience, coming down the aisles and up and over the dome. At one point in the program, the audience will see a hundred children dancing, running, skipping and jumping over the dome as they venture across the bridge between the production and reality. Boothe says, "In many ways, the set design will become a canvas on which the audience will view relationships and experiences not unlike their own." This unique set design draws upon universal images to enhance the experience of Light of the World - allowing directors to represent both the earth and the spirit of man in their full magnitude and grandeur. The immense space in the Conference Center will allow producers to project larger-than-life images, some even bigger than IMAX, onto various surfaces of the auditorium and the set. Performers will also use this vertical space in a dramatic way. Specially trained actors will soar through the 70 feet from the top of the grid to the floor of the Conference Center. The flying rigs give performers the capacity to travel from side to side, while moving up and down and rotating a full 360 degrees all at the same time - allowing the actors to travel the distance between earth and the heavens. The actors will fly and dance in the air in a way that uses both the technical precision of gymnastics and the finesse and aesthetics of dance. "At the height of this piece the universe comes into full motion. Figures will be flying and moving through the air," says children's choreographer Pat Debenham, "in a manner that allows not only the earth to become alive, but the space above it - the world above it - comes to life as well. All of the sudden, earth and sky come together." "Everything, from the size of the venue and set, to the themes of the Light of the World," adds set designer Mike Magelby, "begs a level of perspective we don't often experience." Music: The Language of the Spirit They are award winning, renowned and anonymous. The five Latter-day Saint composers commissioned to work as a team to create the score for Light of the World will never have their names on a marquee or receive credit for their accomplishments. They say their reward is being given the opportunity to compose music for an international audience during February 2002. For months they have been plunking out tunes, tweaking lyrics and exploring tempos, trying to get just the right sounds down on paper - sounds they hope will speak to a worldwide audience. "Above all, the music is going to carry the spirit of the show," says one. "I hope the music will transcend language barriers and bring the feeling of the production to the hearts of the audience." "The responsibility is staggering," says another. "But I don't care how many times we have to rewrite it to get it there. I just hope that when we're done it's right." To get it "right," the team has been meeting for hours each week, alternating home studios and nailing down concepts. Ideas, born as scribbles on white paper, are often short lived. During a typical session, a composer perches at the keyboard while another strums on his guitar. Three others hover over sheets of music - singing, humming and exploring new harmonies. Then, like musical chairs, the five switch roles and continue. They say it's hard work. Music composition requires constant rewriting and patient rehashing as it is - but the process is magnified fivefold when five artists, with their own styles and opinions, are added to the mix. But this challenge, the composers say, also has proved to be the strength of the group. "As we come together, especially as the songs start to take shape, we have each tried to focus on a different aspect or a different portion of each musical piece. We've been able to individually write about things we feel passionate about." Countless melodies have been tossed in the trash during this unique collaborative process, but the best ideas surface and stick, ultimately becoming pieces such as the Light of the World Anthem, which is sung by the world-renowned Tabernacle Choir accompanied by an 80-piece orchestra. These composers, accustomed to winning Emmys, and Pearl awards, will be silently sitting in the Conference Center during February 2002, watching as their words and music wash over visitors from all around the world. They will be looking for that intimate connection that sometimes only music can bring as it speaks to the hearts of those of other cultures, countries and experiences - and when they see it - they say that will be reward enough. Costuming "The World" Behind the massive stage in the Conference Center lies a small room filled with sewing machines, dozens of fabric bolts and thousands of pins. Crammed in this tiny room, costume designer Janet Swenson and her team of eight seamstresses work side by side, their efforts unknown to many. But come February 2002, visitors from all over the world will see the result as an international cast of more than 1,500 dazzles audiences in colorful costumes as they twirl, flip and even fly through the air in Light of the World. Because of the enormity of the Conference Center auditorium and the numerous performers, Swenson says "the costumes' bright colors and detailed patterns will be essential in communicating the program's message to a multicultural, multilingual audience." The key factor in creating the costumes for Light of the World was research. While most of her team has been involved with the project for only nine months, Swenson began the legwork over two years ago. "I have lots of research that I've gone through and colors and textiles and masks and headdresses," she explains. "Once you've done the research and you have it in your head, you just put it away and sit down and start your sketching and see if it all comes together." That's what happened when Swenson began work on the100 pioneer costumes for the production. The unique design of the pioneer dresses was modified several times before the final product was approved. Originally, the dresses were patterned after the pioneer dresses of the 1850s. But in order for the dresses to flow with the choreography, the pattern was altered from a straight skirt to a "circle skirt" with authentic bodices. Bands of dark material were incorporated into the dresses which, when worn with hats, will give the illusion of wagon wheels spinning as the dancers twirl across the stage. Each of the dresses includes a unique pioneer quilt pattern square with a name sewn into it, and a honeybee, representing the industry of the early pioneers. Visitors might just see a reflection of themselves and their native lands in the impressive "Parade of Nations" featuring over a hundred different countries. Swenson and her team canvassed Utah looking for international costumes, and what they couldn't find, they created, with an eye fixed on authenticity. While Swenson has worked for many years in the costume design industry and has outfitted performers in countless productions, she has never experienced anything quite like this before. "I'm sure this will be the biggest thing I ever do in my life, " she said. "You may as well enjoy the ride. That's the one thing that I tell myself every morning: Enjoy the ride!" Fact sheet The brain-storming sessions for Light of the World began almost three years ago, with a team of proven professionals. COSTUMING "The World" * Between 1,500 and 2,000 costumes will be created for Light of the World, including 450 new costumes for the Tabernacle Choir, 100 costumes for the pioneer sequence and approximately 300 international costumes for the "Parade of Nations." * Each of 50 pioneer dresses is decorated with an original handsewn pioneer quilt pattern. The dresses also feature dark bars down the skirts and on the edges which, when seen from above, give the impression of wagon wheels spinning. MUSIC: The Language of the Spirit * The score for Light of the World is being composed by a collaboration of five award-winning Latter-day Saint musicians. The five, who meet together in home studios, are anonymously volunteering their time and talents to compose the score. * Music for Light of the World will be prerecorded with the 80-piece Temple Square Orchestra and the Tabernacle Choir. Most of the show will be set to music - either songs or underscoring. SOUND * Each sound on the soundtrack must be synchronized with the lighting and scenery computer systems. Virtually all of the assemblage, manipulation, recording, editing and mixing is done by computer. LIGHT: The Central Message * Over 5,000 conventional lights already installed in the Conference Center will be used in Light of the World, in concert with 400 automated lights added for the show. High-powered computer systems control each light's intensity, color and beam characteristic during every minute of the show. * John Featherstone, a resident of Chicago, Ill., is the lighting designer for the production. His impressive resume includes lighting concert tours for prominent musical groups. He has also provided the lighting design for the NBA All Star Jam Session every year since 1993, and has lighted various attractions at Universal Studios and Walt Disney theme parks. * Together with his team of assistants and programmers, Featherstone can program one minute of Light of the World lighting in about an hour's time. Approximately one month will be spent programming, rehearsing and coordinating cues for the show. SET * Although an entire team of designers is working to create the set for Light of the World, two general designers - one located in Provo, Utah, and the other in Chicago - are heading the task. Because of the physical distance between designers, venue and directors, a private Web site has been established to allow designers can post ideas and discuss possibilities. In addition, a computerized rendition of the Conference Center was created to make communication and proper design of elements easier. * The set for Light of the World measures 130 feet wide and 100 feet deep - about one-third the size of a football field - and is being built at various locations in Utah. The set resembles the dome of a globe, and is specifically designed to encourage thought about relationships between people, the earth and heaven. VENUE * The Conference Center is the largest religious auditorium in the world, seating 21,000 in an auditorium large enough to house a Boeing 747 jet. However, no audience member is farther than 270 feet from the stage, providing every viewer of Light of the World with a spectacular view as the Center becomes a huge canvas with image projections larger than IMAX, light effects, flying performers and a 1,000-member cast. * Before Light of the World begins each night, the lobbies of the Conference Center will be filled with pre-show activities. International people representing their own culture and dressed in native costume will perform music and greet visitors. INTERNATIONAL CAST * In addition to the International Children's Choir, several Brigham Young University groups will be involved in the production, including Young Ambassadors, Living Legends, Folk Dancers, Dancer's Company and BYU Children's Dance. Production managers, desiring to do more than simply dress American performers in costume, are seeking out international people living in the Salt Lake area to appear in their native dress - children, young adults, middle-aged adults and seniors. FLYING * Branam Enterprises, Inc., a California-based company that has flown actors for music tours, television, and movies, will be brought in to fly actors up to 70 feet in the air above the Conference Center stage. Because performers will move up and down and rotate 360 degrees in midair, those involved in flying will generally have a background in dance or gymnastics. # # # Sources: Light of the World: A Celebration of Life LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/news/article/0,5422,116-7613,00.html Light of the World: Light -- The Central Message LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/media/newsrelease/extra/display/0,6025,317-1-474-2,00.htm l Light of the World: Bringing "The World" to the Stage LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/media/newsrelease/extra/display/0,6025,317-1-474-3,00.htm l Light of the World: Music -- The Language of the Spirit LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/media/newsrelease/extra/display/0,6025,317-1-474-4,00.htm l Light of the World: Costuming "The World" LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/media/newsrelease/extra/display/0,6025,317-1-474-5,00.htm l Light of the World: Fact Sheet LDS Church News Release 19Dec01 A1 http://www.lds.org/media/newsrelease/extra/display/0,6025,317-1-474-7,00.htm l >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN Women of Genesis Series Continues with "Rebekah": Deseret Book Press Release 20Dec01 US UT SLC A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 12:54:29 -0500 Women of Genesis Series Continues with "Rebekah" SALT LAKE CITY, UTAH -- New York Times bestselling author Orson Scott Card continues his look at the notable women from the Old Testament with "Rebekah: Women of Genesis" (Shadow Mountain, $22.95), the second book in his Women of Genesis series. Card uses his fertile imagination and uncanny insight into human nature to tell the story of a unique woman who is beautiful, smart and resourceful in an era when women had little power, and are scarce in the historical records of the period. As in the first novel in the series, "Sarah: Women of Genesis," card has created a riveting story exploring the relationships, the settings, and the stories of the Old Testament. In this volume, Rebekah leaves her father's house to marry Isaac, the studious young son of the storied Sarah and Abraham, only to find herself caught up in a series of painful rivalries, first between her husband and his brother Ishmael, and later between her sons Jacob and Esau. Through it all she finds her own relationship with God and does her best to serve His cause in the lives of those she loves. As in "Sarah," we find the title character learning of the motivations of her people, and how those motivations shaped the biblical account of the times. She is tested spiritually, physically, and emotionally, forced to lean on her faith to help her persevere during times of heartache and sorrow. Card's "Sarah" was embraced nationwide by Christian and Jewish audiences alike, who recognized the groundbreaking nature of his subject matter--discussing the women of the Old Testament, something seldom done before. Anticipation for this second novel in the series has been high since its introduction as a short reading excerpt at last May's Book Expo America in Chicago. About the Author Orson Scott Card is one of science fiction's most acclaimed and bestselling authors. "The West Coast Review of Books" has called him "one of the premier science fiction writers of our age." He is the first science fiction writer to receive both the Hugo and the Nebula awards in consecutive years. He is also a recipient of four Locus Awards, and a World Fantasy Award. He has authored more than 20 novels, including "Ender's Game," "Speaker for the Dead," the "Tales of Alvin Macker," "Enchantment," "Stone Tables," "Saints," and "Homebody." His novel "Sarah: Women of Genesis," was the first of a trilogy about women of the Bible. Mr. Card's works have been translated into many languages, including Catalan, Danish, Dutch, Finnish, French, German, Hebrew, Italian, Japanese, Polish, Portuguese, Romanian, Russian, Slovakian, Spanish, and Swedish. In addition to writing science fiction and fantasy novels, Mr. Card has written plays, short stories and nonfiction works, including two books on writing. Born in Riceland, Washington, he grew up in California, Arizona and Utah. He lived in Brazil for two years as an unpaid missionary for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. He received degrees from Brigham Young University and the University of Utah. He currently lives with his wife Kristine and family in Greensboro, North Carolina. Each of their children is named after a famous writer. Source: Women of Genesis Series Continues with "Rebekah" Deseret Book Press Release 20Dec01 A2 >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Fw: MN Film: Mulholland Drive's LDS Connection, The Other Side of Heaven Starts Strong: Mormon News Film Editor 19Dec01 US TX Dal A2 Date: 21 Dec 2001 15:25:57 -0700 One of the interesting things I see on your discussion of films is the repetition of the name REED SMOOT, who is our product here from BYU! And a good Mormon. (At least I haven't heard otherwise!) Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- > Mulholland Drive's LDS Connection, The Other Side of Heaven Starts Strong > [snip] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: luannstaheli Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 22 Dec 2001 14:25:44 -0700 Barnes & Noble in Orem had three copies of Carol Lynch William's Carolina Autumn on the YA sheleves this week. [LuAnn Staheli] jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net wrote: > I took a stroll through the children's sections of a couple of book stores > while out and about the last couple of days, very interesting themes. I > glanced to see if I could find anything by Dean Hughes or Carol Lynch > Williams in the YA section, but no luck. -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Magic and Christianity in Rowling and Tolkien (comp) Date: 26 Dec 2001 16:45:48 -0600 [MOD: This is a compilation post.] >From amyc@xmission.com Fri Dec 21 14:42:14 2001 A good article, but I have to point out one line where the author went seriously wrong: "The Lord of the Rings trilogy nonetheless turns the debris of Arthurian romance and English fairy tales into a compelling moral vision by reshaping those elements into an allegory of England's struggle against Hitler." Um, no. Tolkien HATED the "a" word. [Amy Chamberlain] >From dmichael@wwno.com Wed Dec 26 05:56:45 2001 "R.W. Rasband" wrote: > > "National Review Online" has published an excellent review by Peter Wood on > the relationship between magic and Christianity in the works of J.K. Rowling > and J.R.R. Tolkien. > http://www.nationalreview.com/weekend/culture/culture-wood122201.shtml Peter Wood wrote: > Tolkien, by contrast, plays out his magnificent imagining in > "Middle Earth," a place with no acknowledged connection to > our world. The Lord of the Rings trilogy nonetheless turns > the debris of Arthurian romance and English fairy tales into a > compelling moral vision by reshaping those elements into an > allegory of England's struggle against Hitler. JRR Tolkien is rolling over in his grave right now. Someone needs to tell columnist Peter Wood that his interpretation of LOTR being an allegory of WW2 is an old interpretation that was flatly denied by Tolkien. In fact, Tolkien despised allegory altogether. D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: [AML] De-Christianizing of C.S. Lewis? (was: Acceptance of Christian Date: 26 Dec 2001 16:52:49 -0600 Folks, Ivan Wolfe posted a reference to a rumor that _The Chronicles of Narnia_, by C.S. Lewis, was "going to be released - edited to remove all that pesky christian symbolism." I had hear that rumor also, but didn't know whether there was any substance to it. So I checked on the Internet, and found this statement, from the Q&A section of Into the Wardrobe, http://cslewis.drzeus.net Please Read: For those concerned about the rumor regarding the "republishing of the Narnia books without the Christian symbolism," please note that this is emphatically false. Here is an official statement from the publishers: "The goal of HarperCollins Publishers and the owners and managers of the C.S. Lewis Estate is to publish the works of C.S.Lewis to the broadest possible audience, and to leave any interpretation of the works to the reader. The works of C.S. Lewis will continue to be published by HarperCollins and Zondervan as written by the author, with no alteration. Zondervan's editorial standards and Christian mission has not changed in any way." Jonathan Langford AML-List Moderator -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: [AML] Becky PAGET, _Romancing the Nephites_ (Review) Date: 22 Dec 2001 16:04:47 -0800 Review ====== Becky Paget, "Romancing the Nephites" 1993, Covenant Communications, Inc. Paperback, $7.95 Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle Well, at last I know the whole story of Lehi's sons and Ishmael's daughters. I know their names, their frailties, their likes and dislikes. "Romancing the Nephites" takes us into the dark world of Nephite hormonal disorder. It's hard to think of any of them as particularly romantic, as little detail is given in the Book of Mormon. Instead, the details are left to our imaginations. Paget has taken the broad outline of the story and developed an unlikely love story, one that unites Arie'l, Ishmael's youngest daughter, with her cousin, and hero, Nephi. As the story develops, characters found nowhere in the Book of Mormon appear. This is okay; we are, after all, talking about fiction. One may take great liberties with history when one is developing a genre piece. But Paget's book just didn't come off as one building on an historical account. Instead, in my opinion, Paget, a good writer, weaves the sparse details of the Book of Mormon account into a love story with a life all its own. Imagine Nephi and Arie'l passing messages written in Egyptian engraved on a bone. Imagine Ishmael falling victim to an elaborate blackmail plot, an officer who wants Arie'l as his own, and is willing to press his future father-in-law into compliance. "Romancing the Nephites" comes off as a nice romance novel. Young readers will see in the characters behaviors that are well emulated. But it does, after all, go astray of the real story. But, as I say, maybe that's okay. Maybe that's what historical fiction is all about. ----- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: [AML] Must-Read Lists Date: 26 Dec 2001 18:47:51 -0500 I am putting together my "I want to read this in 2002" list. So I was wondering, what book(s) would you not want to have gone through life without reading? Fiction or non-fiction. Tracie Laulusa -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 26 Dec 2001 12:17:27 -0700 Marilyn Brown wrote: > Even Brady Udall's Mormon RELATIVES are absolutely chagrined at his > presentation of life which is so different from what they see and feel. I > know this "embarrassment is a fact." He is a FABULOUS writer, but he is not > MORMON in the cultural sense. Marilyn, I guess I'm not sure what you mean when you say that Brady is "not Mormon in the cultural sense." He is married to my cousin, and I believe he is as Mormon as any of us. Do you mean that his *writing* isn't Mormon? Sharlee Glenn Pleasant Grove, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 26 Dec 2001 12:38:10 -0700 Marilyn Brown wrote: . My point was that Mormons must LEAVE the > Mormon culture to be successful on the national market. And I'll stand by > that supposition till the cows come home. NOT in children's literature or > youth literature or sci fi. I'm talking about REAL experience. And does children's literature not involve REAL experience? Clarify, please. (Feeling feisty, Marilyn, but loving you still! :-) Seriously, (and this is a question for all of you) why do you think that LDS writers of children's/YA fiction have been so much more successful in the national market? (And, no, it's *not* because it's easier to get published in these genres. In fact, quite the opposite is true. Nevertheless, there are over 37 LDS writers and/or illustrators publishing picture books on the national market. And that number doesn't include our very successful writers of middle-grade and YA fiction--Carol Lynch Williams, Louise Plummer, A.E. Cannon, Michael Tunnell, etc.). So what's going on here? I think it's a fascinating question. I wish I knew the answer. Anyone? Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Darlene Young Subject: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _House on the Sound_ (Review) Date: 21 Dec 2001 15:28:15 -0800 (PST) _House on the Sound_ by Marilyn Brown. Salt Press, 2001. Hardcover: 235 pages. ISBN: 1-55517-584-8. Suggested Retail Price: $22.50 (US) Since this new war began, many of us have become more interested than ever before in people who are very different from us. We're reading the paper, watching news magazines and specials on how people in "all those -stan countries" live, learning with fascination about a mindset and lifestyle completely foreign to us. I think that it's a natural response to being at war for people to pay more attention to what's different--sometimes because of fear, and sometimes just because of an increased sensitivity and awareness. Marilyn Brown's new novel, _House on the Sound_, takes place during World War II, and it is about dealing with the Other--in many ways and on many levels. The subtitle is "Remembering Pearl Harbor." Obviously it is about how some Americans react to the Japanese during the time just before and after the Pearl Harbor attack. But this book is about other relationships as well--how two very different families relate to each other as neighbors, how people relate within those families, and how one young girl reacts to her first contact with evil. Generally and specifically, characters struggle, in a strange dance of attraction and repulsion, to understand and deal with what is different. The McKinsey family lives on Puget Sound and is intimately involved with the war because of Mr. McKinsey's work designing gun supports for American battleships. When he is not at work, Mr. McKinsey uses every spare minute to work on the house he is building for his family. (A house he hopes will be "sound," protecting his little family from the evils out there.) The narrator of the story is his ten-year-old daughter, Lindy. As the story begins, she catches sight of a beautiful young woman walking along the road and is immediately drawn to her, almost to the point of obsession. She soon discovers that the young woman, Sarah Barbar, lives near the new McKinsey home. Lindy's parents--and especially her grandfather--suspect that things are not all as they should be within the Barbar family and forbid her to go there to play with the younger Barbar children. (The Barbars are aptly named, being strange and somewhat outside of the cultural mores of the community.) Ironically, the Barbar family is simultaneously symbolic of the ominous nature of the Other _and_ the negative effects of avoiding all contact with the Other (they are obviously suffering from the negative effects of inbreeding). Over the course of the book Lindy defies her parents several times to go over to the Barbar home in hopes of catching sight of Sarah. The story of the McKinseys' involvement with the Barbars makes up the basic framework of the book. The subplots are variations on its theme of attraction/repulsion with the unfamiliar. An example of a subplot with this theme is Mr. McKinsey's search for a church to believe in. As he explores religion, we get different views of religion from his wife and from his father, Grandpa McKinsey. Because of my interest in Mormon Letters, I paid close attention to how Brown weaves the father's search for religion into the narrative. Since the story starts and revolves around Lindy's attraction to the Barbar family, Mr. McKinsey's religious struggles are so unobtrusive as to be hardly noticeable until towards the end when he finds what he is looking for and encourages his family to join the church with him. I like the subtle way his conversion takes place. In contrast, the mother's conversion, summed up in just one paragraph, is a little jolting: "So reluctantly she read the book the missionaries gave to her and surprised herself by discovering it was true." I much preferred the gradual and understated way that the first conversion was handled; saying matter-of-factly that "it was true" makes me wary of propaganda. The reactions of Americans to what's foreign--particularly, the Japanese--is an undercurrent throughout the book. The war-preparation scenes are vivid and believable as told through Lindy's point of view. I won't soon forget the scene of Lindy's parents taping tar paper to the windows, or of the entire McKinsey family gathering in a small closet under the stairs. (The closet functions as a symbolic microcosm of the larger world in which the characters struggle with the unfamiliar. It will later play a big part in another conflict involving the Barbar family.) I like the irony of a community highly suspicious of all Japanese and yet who are obviously consumers of Japanese products (one character has a Japanese robe; another has a Japanese jewelry box). In a way, this is a coming-of-age book because we see Lindy discover what kinds of evil can go on within a family and within a community. Near the beginning of the book Lindy climbs a tree with one of the Barbar girls and gets a broad view of the neighborhood and the woods. Her new aerial view is symbolic of the broadening of her experience with life and its darker elements, a broadening which comes about as a result of her acquaintance with the Barbars. By the end of the book she will leave her naivete behind as she discovers that even her hero, Sarah, is guilty as well as a victim. The biggest strength of this book is its vivid scenes told through the eyes of a child, and we discover the truth about things slowly in the way that a ten-year-old might. As I read, I was sometimes irritated to be distracted from the action by all of the physical descriptions, but perhaps these interruptions are intrusive on purpose; it seems realistic that a child might be distracted from the ominous nature of what is happening, for example, by noticing "ears as big as mug handles and as convoluted and scarred as mushrooms." The many physical details made the action hard to follow sometimes--leaving my brain feeling foggy--but the fogginess seemed to fit the mood of the book, as if mists from the sound were drifting across me as I tried to concentrate on the action. And perhaps I felt as vague about what was going on as a ten-year-old might. Unfortunately, the ten-year-old's point of view is not always convincing, however. I find it hard to believe that a ten-year-old would make some of the observations Lindy makes: "My mother was in control, almost as though she were defying the familial, the economic status of the world at war, " or "He devoured her with mild eyes." Occasionally the pacing and physical staging are a little sloppy, such as having a character who is already leaning back in her chair do it again in the next paragraph, or Lindy saying "I bumped into Elaine. I said I was sorry but she fell over" and "Regi emerged, frowsier than he was." The book could benefit from tighter editing throughout. Though I feel that the physical details are too plentiful, I must say that many times the descriptive language fairly sings. It reads in many places like poetry. I love such images as "my palms fell in whiskery dust" and "his body a black tower with buttress thighs." In addition to interesting language, there are many memorable, colorful scenes. I especially like the very beginning in which Lindy, who wants her father to stop the car so she can get a closer look at Sarah, pretends to be carsick and then vomit at the side of the road. There's also a beautiful scene in which Lindy and her grandmother watch a breathtaking white bird soar which reminds us of Sarah. And my favorite sentence: "He plastered the big piece of hair out of his eyes with soup." I was grinning with delight at some of the scenes and descriptions. It's refreshing to see a story about characters who just happen to be Mormon (by the end) dealing with the larger world and heavy issues that do not have to do with being Mormon. I think that it is through this kind of story that we are going to break into national markets. I'd like to see more of us try this kind of thing. Brown's work is a good example of one way it can be done. I'll be interested to see how _House on the Sound_ does among non-Mormon audiences (if, that is, it is marketed and distributed to such audiences). ===== Darlene Young __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 26 Dec 2001 15:50:07 -0700 Because we are a missionary church, we will never get our messages into the mainstream culture without tricking them into thinking we aren't trying to proselyte them--and I don't think we SHOULD be able to. The question that active Mormons can and should ask about authors like Brady Udall, Brian Evenson, and Neil LaBute is, Are they sneaking in any worthwhile Mormon theology or principles in their material? In addition to being intrinsic to the storytelling, perhaps their worldly, carnal, dark, violent (etc.) elements are like the "sugar" that helps the spoonful of Mormon medicine go down. (Or maybe some authors are just corrupt in some cases, without any redeeming Mormon medicine.) Frankly, if I were not a Mormon, I would never want to read something that assumed the Mormon church was true and presented all its cultural biases undigested by a solidly worldly sensibility and skepticism. Frankly, I don't even want to read that kind of literature as an active member. Fiction is a tool for expressing and exploring humanity, not a tool for institutional propaganda. Now what we need is for people to keep pushing more Mormon-informed stuff into the mainstream. I think we'll make gradual progress as time goes on and readers learn to trust us not to proselytize and we produce excellent work (no more excellent than anyone else). We need some solid "literary mainstream" (as opposed to genre) Mormon writers like Amy Tan, Margaret Atwood, Anne Tyler (it's interesting that all women are coming to mind--I could also say John Updike, Philip Roth, John Irving). They won't be able to include many--if any--explicitly Mormon elements, but they can suffuse the work with the saner parts of the Mormon sensibility, the parts that don't make intellectual, creative people want to spew. I like what Todd Peterson said at the most recent AML writers' conference: We use our Mormonism as a booster rocket to get us into the space of a story, but then that booster rocket falls off and is not visible to those observing the story in space. (This post is actually a bit hypocritical for me, because what I really want to happen is for explicitly Mormon stuff to stealth its way into the mainstream of contemporary literature, for starters my own or someone else's realistic account of the Mormon missionary experience.) Chris Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Salt Lake Trib Article on Utah's Rel. Divide Date: 26 Dec 2001 16:10:35 -0700 [MOD: In replying to this post, keep in mind that the point of connection for AML-List is in how Mormon culture and belief translate into Mormon letters--including artistic creation, consumption, and criticism. Clearly there's a large area of connection between literature and belief; we're on topic here so long as our conversation straddles that line, rather than straying into purely doctrinal and cultural arguments and critiques.] The recent Salt Lake Tribune special section on the religious divide in Utah made me do some thinking. Personally, I'm the kind of Mormon who enjoys my membership more when I'm living outside of Utah as an exotic minority. As a Utah resident--especially in Provo, arguably ground zero for tunnel-visioned cultural Mormonism--I find myself constantly chafing under the prevailing conformity and assumptions. In the Mormon worldview, it seems like everything is either "uplifting" or "inappropriate." Mormonism replaces the spicy jambalaya of the "world" with room-temperature oatmeal. Yes, jambalaya gives me heartburn and I know oatmeal is good for me, but still. While I was serving as a Mormon missionary, one of the most difficult objections was when people challenged our claim of being the world's only true church. As United Nations Secretary-General Kofi Annan said in his recent acceptance speech for the 2001 Nobel Peace Prize, "The idea that there is one people in possession of the truth, one answer to the world's ills or one solution to humanity's needs has done untold harm throughout history." That statement contains much insight, and I'm grateful Utah is relatively peaceful despite Mormonism's intensity along those lines. It hasn't always been smooth going for the Mormons, but somehow we've managed to move away from conflict and toward peace, rather than vice versa. However, as hard as Mormons work to build bridges, deep down we can never fully respect anyone who doesn't recognize the Mormon gospel as true and accept it as God's only official religion. If I squint my eyes and look past Mormonism's Christian paradoxes of humility and charity, the religion looks to me like spiritual Darwinism. In the Mormon view, only the spiritually fittest will be able to continue reproducing after mortality, which is the source of celestial joy. Unless a person gets in tune enough with the "Holy Spirit" to recognize that Mormonism holds the keys of the universe and then adheres to its principles, he or she will not survive in the eternal gene pool. I see that not as a negative model but as a coldly realistic way to understand Mormonism. The warmth of the Mormon position is that, considering our massive missionary and public relations efforts and our emphasis on universal Christian repentance, no one can accuse us of exclusivity. Mormons honestly want everyone to see the light, and our message is as consistent and widely available as the Big Mac (and the comparison doesn't end there--don't get me started on "special" sauce). Mormonism has proven that it is a religion, not an ethnicity, except perhaps in Utah. Far from wanting to keep people out of our temples, we desperately want them to come inside--but only after they have proven their commitment to becoming what we see as spiritually fit. If they don't avail themselves of that opportunity, the best we can do is hope they eventually will. More often, we tend to write them off as spiritually unfit. My own problem is that I can relate with both sides of the divide. The insipid, simplistic Mormon mindset drives me nuts, and I really hope God is not a Mormon. I keep a current temple recommend, but I don't consider mainstream Mormonism my cultural home. On the other hand, comparing the world's belief systems makes Mormonism look to me like a computer stacked up against a typewriter. And I don't trust people's attempts to translate their emotions and earthbound understanding into fact. Just because people don't like--for whatever reason--a faith claiming to be the world's truest religion and God's only official church doesn't prove that claim is false. Rather, it shows that such people have more faith and hope in human capacities and communities than inclination and means to find out for certain what God is up to. Christopher Bigelow -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cathy Wilson" Subject: Re: [AML] Salt Lake Trib Article on Utah's Rel. Divide Date: 27 Dec 2001 10:08:32 -0700 There was a charming column in the Trib following up this article but my early-morning fuzzy mind doesn't land on the author's name. It was titled something like "How to Make a Gentile Friend." It promised yet another follow-up on how nonMormons can deal with us. You realize, of course, that there are many, many religions that claim to be the "only true." I think we lose sight of this when we are encompassed by the Mormon culture. However, we had an interesting insight the other day: LDS theology, alone among other world religions, offers a way to include nonbelievers in heaven--temple work. Cathy (Gileadi) Wilson Editing Etc. 1400 West 2060 North Helper UT 84526 -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 27 Dec 2001 12:20:42 -0700 Yes, Sharlee. Although I haven't read Edgar Mint yet. The short stories weren't Mormon. But I will read Edgar Mint. If it is wonderful, (and speaks to Mormons) I wish the Mormons would buy it by the case loads. Love, Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- > > Marilyn, I guess I'm not sure what you mean when you say that Brady is "not > Mormon in the cultural sense." He is married to my cousin, and I believe he > is as Mormon as any of us. Do you mean that his *writing* isn't Mormon? > > Sharlee Glenn > Pleasant Grove, Utah -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: Re: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 27 Dec 2001 12:22:45 -0700 Actually, Sharlee, I'm finding out I'm probably a young people's author simply because I won't write in detail about "adult" subjects. Yet I don't think so in HOUSE ON THE SOUND. That's why it never sold. It's a young person's book with too much other stuff in it. Love, Marilyn -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Mormon Authors in Nat. Market Date: 27 Dec 2001 12:19:35 -0700 ---Original Message From: Sharlee Glenn > > Seriously, (and this is a question for all of you) why do you > think that LDS writers of children's/YA fiction have been so > much more successful in the national market? (And, no, it's > *not* because it's easier to get published in these genres. > In fact, quite the opposite is true. Nevertheless, there are > over 37 LDS writers and/or illustrators publishing picture > books on the national market. And that number doesn't > include our very successful writers of middle-grade and YA > fiction--Carol Lynch Williams, Louise Plummer, A.E. Cannon, > Michael Tunnell, etc.). > > So what's going on here? I think it's a fascinating > question. I wish I knew the answer. Anyone? Well, personally, if I were looking for reasons and accepting the facts as stated, I'd have to say that Mormons are very attuned to children and that accounts for the apparent disparity. We have more children per capita, but more than that, we devote more resources to children. We pay a lot of attention to them--in my view, more than average in the rest of the population. I don't know the actual statistics, but for example I'd venture to say that we probably have more women who stay home with their children and that'd be a factor, too. Frankly, it's much more likely that a person with artistic or creative talent will turn that talent to children's literature if they are LDS than if they aren't. Jacob Proffitt -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ivan Angus Wolfe Subject: Re: [AML] De-Christianizing of C.S. Lewis? Date: 27 Dec 2001 12:37:54 -0700 (MST) Johnathan L. wrote: > Ivan Wolfe posted a reference to a rumor that _The Chronicles of Na= rnia_, by=20 > C.S. Lewis,=20 sorry - I was misled by an article on www.cinescape.com - generally a= reliable source. However - here a few excerpts from websites that say the rumor was no= t totally untrue: http://ayelle.net/journal/september01.html 30 September 2001: I owe HarperCollins an apology, sort of=20 It seems there was a misunderstanding about Narnia. This was not my o= wn personal misunderstanding, FYI -- the source of the rumors was an article in t= he New York Times! But HarperCollins is not, in fact, rewriting C. S. Lewis's ori= ginal Chronicles of Narnia. What they are doing is performing a "marketing = makeover." HarperCollins hopes to make more money from Narnia by "distancing it = =66rom its Christian roots," and a memo to that effect was leaked, which was the= source for the N. Y. Times article titled "Marketing Narnia Without A Christian = Lion."=20 They're going to hire children's fantasy writers to write more books = in the world of Narnia, but with no religious overtones allowed this time. A= nd they're going to attempt to "tone down [Lewis's] image as a Christian apologi= st, in order to broaden his appeal."=20 here's another interesting site: http://home.ctcnet.net/pipermail/frederica-l/2001-June/000027.html The source of their distress was a Times article that reported, worki= ng from=20 a leaked memo, that HarperCollins was planning to perform a marketing= =20 makeover on "The Chronicles of Narnia," a series of children's novels= penned=20 by British author C.S. Lewis in the mid-20th century. Since the debut= of the=20 first volume, "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe," the series has= enjoyed=20 roaring success, to the tune of 65 million copies in 30 languages. Th= e news=20 story indicated that HarperCollins hoped to boost this success even f= urther=20 by separating Narnia from its religious roots. Much of the uproar was due to a misunderstanding; readers thought tha= t the=20 plan was to de-Christianize the stories. The misunderstanding was rea= sonable,=20 since the article was confusingly headlined "Marketing =E2=80=98Narni= a' Without A=20 Christian Lion." The publisher has continued to repeat a terse statem= ent that=20 "The works of C. S. Lewis will continue to be published ... as writte= n by the=20 author, with no alteration," but the alarming first impression has st= uck.=20 Some Narnia fans acknowledge the publisher's statement, but say they = simply=20 don't trust them, and don't think they will keep their word.=20 These websites have a lot more than what I quoted - but that's the gi= st of it. --Ivan Wolfe -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 27 Dec 2001 14:04:54 -0700 "The Other Side of Heaven." Written and directed by Mitch Davis. Eric D. Snider wrote an excellent review of this film that says pretty much everything I have to say about it, in a more concise package. I suggest you read his review to get a good feel for how well this film works both narratively and artistically. My words here are less a review than a personal take and slight expansion on some of what Eric said. When I saw this film, the word that came overwhelmingly to my mind to describe it was "nice." This is a nice film in many ways--it's inoffensive and plays kindly to its audience; it's well-filmed and competently presented; nothing too ugly happens, and the tensions are resolved quickly and to the main charater's advantage; it's sweet and gently heart-warming; it generates few strong feelings either of artistic or narrative acceptance or rejection; it's somewhat bland and unremarkable. I've heard some criticism of Christopher Gorham's performance, and I suppose he deserves some criticism. He did play a mild, inoffensive, and individually uninteresting character that I never had a reason to feel strongly about. He did fail to add life or energy to the role, but I would argue that he was given little in the script to add to. The story was bland--gently uplifting, but still generally soft--and that made the main character equally bland. So while Gorham may have failed to rescue a weak script I think he was starting with a sow's ear to begin with and I'm not sure how much responsibility he bears for failing to deliver a silk purse. Which is not to criticize Elder Groberg's experiences as bland or uninteresting, or even to question the talent of the director. This is a visually beautiful film that brings a sense of wonder and grandeur to its locations. I think the biggest problem here was not subject matter, but too much fidelity to the original written work. The memoir was not effectively adapted to the screen and a general audience. The audience for a written memoir tends to be people who come to the work with investment in the POV character or the core subject matter; they know who the author is and have both prior knowledge of--and experience with--that character. They already like him. They bought the book because they wanted to know more. It's not necessary to fill in much about who the author is because the buyer is already aware of him as a beloved general authority with a long track record of passionate service and love for the people of Samoa. The memoir is simply more from the life of a known celebrity. In a film intended for a general audience you have none of that. The script needs to fill you in, to create a character that's interesting in and of himself so that you you then care about the trials and struggles that follow. This film provided almost no character background, almost no setting in which to care about that character prior to packaging him as a missionary and sending him off to Samoa. Yes, there's an idealized, overly staged dance at BYU with a somewhat obnoxious and aggressive trumpet player getting jealous because his girlfriend is dancing with someone else, but that hardly sets up the life and mind of Elder Groberg as anyone but a somewhat obnoxious and aggressive trumpet player with a girlfriend and a rival. It's one tiny bit of characterization followed by few other bits of characterization. The situation carries power only if you're either a Mormon who cares about Elder Groberg, a personal friend who cares about Elder Groberg, or a person who cares deeply about Samoa and its people. Hints are given from time to time that indicate that the characters have deeper lives, but few of those moments are brought to the fore. The end result is a beautifully presented sketch of people I don't know in a situation that's interesting but not especially engaging. I think general audiences will find the film interesting but unmemorable. Mildly uplifting, but not intimately so. Indicative of a powerful experience, but not representative of that power. They will remember it as a nice film, then they will promptly forget it. I would recommend the film to Mormons--with a caveat. It's safe, it's well-filmed, and it will leave you with a sense of gentle uplift, a certain pride at what's possible in a world filled with honest people and Mormons. A good family home evening activity, and an excellent film to take a date to. Not an artistic triumph, but a beautifully realized landscape against which flat characters played. If this film were shown in the Visitor's Center I would call it a triumph and the next step in the evolution of Mormon public education films. It fits well alongside "Mr. Kruger's Christmas" and films of its kind, and is a superior cinematic production. But as a general audience film, I have to give it less praise. It is as good as most of what appears in any given year on the big screen; sadly, most films are utterly forgettable. This was a nice film. And that's about all I can say for it. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rose Green" Subject: [AML] Mormons in Children's Lit (was: Mormon Authors in Nat. Market) Date: 27 Dec 2001 17:03:29 -0600 >Seriously, (and this is a question for all of you) why do you think that >LDS writers of children's/YA fiction have been so much more successful in >the national market? Well, where else are they going to publish? The LDS publishers do very little in the way of children's books (yes, the volume has been rising in recent years, but still); somewhat more in YA. I certainly don't believe that adult literature is more "real" than juvenile. There is a difference, but I don't think that's it. Off the top of my head (I may revise this after I think about it awhile), juvenile lit tends towards more resolved endings, more hopeful endings (not always, but often), and often characters who go through turning point, growing-up experiences. It seems like there are exhorbitant numbers of adult books that go through hundreds of pages just to have nothing happen in the end. My library is full of them. (This would be referring to non-genre fiction.) Thing is, themes that deal with the gospel in some way (usually conversion stories) have that turning-point-in-life experience. Maybe there's a correlation. Thoughts? Rose Green _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linda Adams Subject: [AML] Linda ADAMS, Two Poems in _Meridian_ Date: 26 Dec 2001 16:22:42 -0600 Hi, Two poems of mine (which _Meridian Magazine_ accepted several months ago), "For My Lost One" and "Thoughts Heard by God During the Sacrament," have now been published online at: http://meridianmagazine.com/poetry/011107adams.html I'm surprised they chose the second one out of the batch I sent--it has more "bite" to it than I expected them to accept. Enjoy, if you like. :-) Linda ============= Linda Adams adamszoo@sprintmail.com http://home.sprintmail.com/~adamszoo -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 28 Dec 2001 12:49:19 -0700 I wrote: > It's not necessary to fill in much about who the > author is because the buyer is already aware of him as a beloved general > authority with a long track record of passionate service and love for the > people of Samoa. The memoir is simply more from the life of a known > celebrity. Of course it was the people of Tonga, not Samoa. Sorry. Scott Parkin (hiding head in shame and wondering if one can get a hangover from too much Christmas ham). -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 28 Dec 2001 09:21:53 -0700 I thought the film was nice to look at, but that's about it. It left me basically unmoved. It seemed to me that the director was never clear on what it was, exactly, he was trying to film: a love story? a missionary memoir? a coming-of-age tale? a travelogue? But the film's biggest flaw, in my opinion, was the fact that it continually tip-toed around anything overtly Mormon. I think this was a huge mistake. How can you make a powerful film about the experiences of a Mormon missionary and, at the same time, dilute (or completely avoid) the Mormon element? So many things just didn't ring true. For example, what on earth was that whole "bad air out; good air in" scene about? My husband and I saw the film at the Scera, surrounded by BYU students and their dates, a majority of them returned missionaries, I'm sure. During that particular scene I could hear this rush of whispers all around me: "Why doesn't he give the kid a blessing, for heaven's sake!?" My question exactly. (And when you read the actual book, you find out that he did. So why not include that in the film?) Richard Dutcher said that he made "God's Army" for Mormons, but he hoped that others would be interested. (Chaim Potok said the same thing about his novels, substituting "Jews" for "Mormons," of course.) I think that's one of the reasons that "God's Army" was a far superior film. If you want to get something right, you can't water it down. Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Sharlee Glenn" Subject: [AML] God in _Lord of the Rings_ Date: 28 Dec 2001 09:48:47 -0700 Okay, my husband and I saw _Lord of the Rings_ last night, and here's my big question: Where was God in this whole mythic struggle between good and evil? I have never read Tolkien, so my reactions here relate exclusively to the film. I was disturbed by the fact that, while there was a very obvious and potent source of evil (a clear "Satan figure"), there was no corresponding "God figure." Any goodness that emerged seemed to be of the purely human (or elfin, or hobbitan) sort. Is this true of the books as well? There were any number of Christ figures, willing to sacrifice themselves in order to save others (Gandalf, Sam, Frodo himself), but no discernible Source of goodness outside themselves. What say ye? Sharlee Glenn glennsj@inet-1.com [MOD: A personal note: I plan to compose a reply to this question based on my own Tolkien research over the weekend. Others, of course, can also reply with their own perspectives...] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Debra Brown" Subject: [AML] Fw: MN "Woman in the Wind" dance theatre at BYU Jan. 10-12: BYU Press Release 22Dec01 A2 Date: 24 Dec 2001 10:21:24 -0500 PROVO, UTAH -- "Woman in the Wind: The Drusilla Hendricks Story," a dance performance tale of quiet courage, will be performed Thursday through Saturday (Jan. 10-12) at 7:30 p.m. in Brigham Young University's Pardoe Theatre. Tickets for this event, sponsored by the BYU Department of Theatre and Media Arts and the Deseret Dance Theatre, are $10 for the general public and $2 off with BYU or student ID. Tickets can be purchased at the Fine Arts Ticket Office (801) 378-4322. A matinee will be performed Saturday (Jan. 12) at 2 p.m. Drusilla Hendricks was born in Tennessee in 1810. Dreaming of making a life for herself and her family, she later converted to Mormonism and went through all the attendant trials and persecutions of her times. The musical was written by Karla Hendricks Huntsman, Drusilla's great- great-granddaughter and an adjunct faculty member of the BYU Theatre and Media Arts Department, with music by Kathleen Newton and Machelle D.M. Thompson. The director and choreographer is Kim Smith Yandow, founding director of the Deseret Dance Theatre. "My brother wanted me to write a musical about Drusilla," Huntsman said. "The words, music and dance integrate to create her emotional and compelling story." "When people see it, I want them to think about their own ancestors and their own lives and connect with them," Huntsman said. The show describes Drusilla's trials and shows how she dealt with inspiration and persecution. Her husband, James, was shot in the neck at the Battle of Crooked River and was paralyzed from the neck down. She and her five children suffered illness, near-starvation, terror at the hands of mobsters and unbelievable hardship as they cared for her husband and made the trek to the valley of the Great Salt Lake. "What is interesting about her story are her dreams and visions and her courage in going forward," Huntsman said. Cast members include Karla Hendricks Huntsman as the narrator, Eryn Crawford Todd as Drusilla and Wesley Nelson as her husband, James. The ensemble cast includes Amy Andrus, Kathan Blair, Melissa Graehl, Jenny Mair, Laurinda Ogden, Craig Rollo, Steffanie Schutz, Marianne Thompson and Natassia Clark as young Drusilla. -###- Source: "Woman in the Wind" dance theatre at BYU Jan. 10-12 BYU Press Release 22Dec01 A2 http://www.byu.edu/news/releases/Dec/wind.htm >From Mormon-News: Mormon News and Events Forwarding is permitted as long as this footer is included Mormon News items may not be posted to the World Wide Web sites without permission. Please link to our pages instead. For more information see http://www.MormonsToday.com/ -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: [AML] Marilyn BROWN, _The Wine-dark Sea of Grass_ (Review) Date: 27 Dec 2001 13:21:11 -0700 Brown, Marilyn. _The Wine-dark Sea of Grass._ Salt Press, 2001. ISBN: 1-55517-529-5. Hardcover, 393 pp. $24.95. In _The Wine-dark Sea of Grass_, Marilyn Brown examines how the Mountain Meadows Massacre affected the lives of the Mormon settlers in rural southern Utah. The novel starts several months before the massacre and builds up tension well to demonstrate how the Mormon settlers worked themselves into a state where they could justify killing an entire party of pioneers traveling through Utah to California. We see the massacre and its aftermath through the eyes of the fictional Lorry family. Elizabeth, a foster daughter to the Lorry family, longs to marry John D. Lee and to join his already large polygamous family. Instead, her foster father, J.B., gets permission from the local church authorities to marry her. Elizabeth's longing for one thing but having to settle for another sets up a recurring motif. Since Elizabeth could not have witnessed much of the foundational events that preceded the massacre, Brown needed an additional viewpoint character. Through Jacob Lorry, J.B.'s teenage son, we see the massacre itself. In spite of the amount of time we spend watching through Jacob's eyes, he never develops into a well rounded character. For example, Brown gives Jacob two characteristic responses to his circumstances: inaction and insomnia. Whenever faced with a critical situation, Jacob cannot speak. He loses his ability to speak so much, that I began to wonder if he suffered from a biblical curse of dumbness. Following such critical events, Jacob cannot sleep. I don't think Jacob got any sleep during the first third of the narrative. At first Jacob imagines himself marrying Elizabeth, but Jacob (only fifteen) sits silently by while his father marries Elizabeth. Jacob then has romantic intentions toward Lee's daughter Anna Jane, but J.B. announces his intention to marry Anna Jane. Again, Jacob becomes speechless and cannot confront his father about the issue. (Jacob does get to marry Anna Jane when his father decides that he wants nothing to do with Lee or his family.) Although the chronology takes Elizabeth and Jacob from teenagers to middle-aged adults, the narrative never really develops their characters into plausible adults. Elizabeth continues to pine for Lee. Jacob becomes a mere camera through which we see events which Elizabeth would not have witnessed. In fact, several chapters that start from Jacob's point of view (which Brown carefully labeled for our benefit) shift unannounced into Elizabeth's point of view. These characters meander through their lives without any real direction or goals. We get an interesting glimpse at early southern Utah life, but nothing drives these characters. Jacob and Elizabeth follow Lee like lost puppies with no personal motivation. Eventually, the book winds up with the trial and execution of Lee. The trial takes place entirely off stage. Jacob and Elizabeth make the journey and witness the execution, which provides an unsatisfactory denouement that pales in comparison to the emotions and tension in the massacre scene 300 pages earlier. Brown does several things very well. Before the massacre, she built tension well and developed a situation that would explain how a group of religious settlers could bring themselves to justify murdering an entire wagon train. Brown also gives us an interesting view of polygamy. Through Elizabeth, we see how a woman might want to join an already large polygamous family. See sees Lee's wives and children doting on him, and she imagines that she would rather have one-eighteenth of a happy marriage than her bad marriage to J.B. Brown shows that like regular marriages, some polygamous families work and others don't -- not because of the institution itself, but because of the personalities of those involved in the marriage. With all the discussion of polygamy, I wondered why these characters seemed to never discuss spirituality. For a deeply religious people, Brown's characters never seemed inclined to pray or look to the spirit for guidance or comfort. On occasion, sick people get priesthood blessings, but the characters seem to rely upon the arm of flesh. Perhaps Brown wanted to show that those involved with the massacre lost their link to spirituality, but she never contrasted these people against those who do have a deep spirituality. Brown's choice to use entirely fictional characters limits the amount of interest we can have in the events surrounding their lives. We know that much more important events and people exist just on the periphery of Elizabeth and Jacob, but we only get faint glimpses of those characters and events. Instead of following the stories that seem to me interesting or historical, we have to follow the romantic and hormonal indecision of a couple of teenagers who seem developmentally stuck even as they move into middle age. _The Wine-dark Sea of Grass_ draws an interesting picture with some interesting foreground details, but it seems that those details float in front of an unfinished landscape that hints at even greater unrealized whole. -- Terry L Jeffress | Never listen to criticism from anyone unless they South Jordan, UT | can sign a check. -- Marion Zimmer Bradley -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Terry L Jeffress Subject: [AML] Judith FREEMAN, _Red Water_ (Review) Date: 27 Dec 2001 15:29:10 -0700 Freeman, Judith. _Red Water._ Pantheon Books, January 2001. ISBN: 0-375-42092-4, cloth, $24.00. In _Red Water_ Judith Freeman examines how the Mountain Meadows Massacre changed the lives of John D. Lee and his polygamous family. In the first section of _Red Water_, Freeman uses an omniscient narrator to describe Lee's execution and two of his boys carting his body home to burial in Panguitch, Utah. This opening section does little to engender interest in the story and does little but set up an ominous tone for the rest of the book told from the perspective of three of Lee's wives. The second and largest section comes from Emma Lee, John's eighteenth wife. This first person narrative switches between present and past tenses: present tense for an older Emma who waits for news about Lee's execution; past tense for Emma's memories of her life with Lee. Emma's narrative does not follow along chronologically, but you eventually get a full picture of Lee, how Emma came to marry him, and her life as a polygamous wife. Emma joined the Mormon church in England and got a loan from the Perpetual Emigration Fund to travel to Salt Lake City. Emma takes a job as a servant to repay her loan, and she meets Lee when he stays with her employer. Emma marries Lee (several months after the massacre occurs), and he takes her to his home in Harmony, Utah. Along the trip, Lee and Emma have sex every night, and Emma marvels at the sexual ecstasy that Lee gives her, but once they arrive in Harmony, Emma must share her husband with the other wives. None of Lee's previous wives become her friend, and she feels antagonistic toward a few of the wives. Lee sets Emma up in a small house of her own, and she quickly demonstrates her value to the family through hard work in the fields, animal husbandry, and cooking. Emma prepares all the meals for special occasions, such as a visit from Brigham Young. A few years later, Lee marries Ann, a thirteen-year-old girl, and moves her in with Emma. Emma and Ann become friends and during more prosperous times they house the farmhands that help work Lee's fields. Emma slowly begins to learn about the massacre. Like other new immigrants and even us today, she never seems to get a clear picture of the events and exactly who perpetrated them. She hears many rumors about Lee, but she rejects most of the rumors because they do not seem to fit her husband as she knows him. Eventually, Brigham Young asks Lee to establish a ferry across the Colorado River. The rumors suggest that Brigham wants to not only protect Lee, but to get Lee out of the public eye. Only Emma and her children accompany Lee to Lonely Dell, and from there she awaits the news of Lee's later execution. The third section switches to an omniscient narrator and tells the story of Ann as she chases some horse thieves. When Lee moved to Lonely Dell, Ann remained behind to have a baby. She promised to join Lee and Emma after the baby arrived, but instead she left the baby with her brother and disappeared. Freeman then fabricates a possible history for Ann. After working as a prostitute in several mining and railroad camps, she establishes a horse ranch. When a man and his son steal her prize mare, Ann follows them. The thieves make their way to southern Utah. Along the way, Ann hears of Lee's death and she often thinks of her life with him. Ann paints a much harsher picture of Lee. In contrast to Emma who felt an attraction toward Lee, Ann feels that Lee pursued her at thirteen- years-old and blackmailed her parents into letting Lee marry Ann. She also describes a Lee that believes in blood-sacrifice -- that by killing a Mormon persecutor, the spilt blood helps assuage God's anger against the sinner. The fourth and final section reproduces (fictional) excerpts from Rachel's diary. Rachel, Lee's second wife, set up a home in the desert of northern Arizona. Rachel considers herself the most loyal of all Lee's wives. After Lee's arrest, Rachel joined Lee in prison and remained with prison until his second trial. Rachel move to Arizona to escape persecution from those who hated her husband, but as more Mormon move into the area, she again comes under condemnation for her association with Lee. When the irrigation system fails and her crops begin to wither, none of the community come to her aid. Rachel represents the Mormon idea of enduring to the end. She does not get much pleasure from life, but she hopes that her suffering here on Earth will reserve a place for her in heaven. Of the three wives Freeman selected as main characters, Ann has the happiest life after Lee dies. The text makes Ann happy because her free spirit could not remain tied down to a religion or a single man. She needed more open space and freedom of expression to experience joy. But as the only woman to leave the Mormon church, Freeman sets up the implication that women cannot achieve ultimate happiness in a polygamous relationship. Interestingly, Freeman makes all her characters unreliable. Each of the wives think of themselves as having remained faithful to Lee and remember the others having affairs. I think Freeman wants to make each viewpoint character unreliable to point to the uncertain nature of her fictionalization. Freeman made some stylistic choices that distanced me from her characters. First, she never uses quotation marks for her character's spoken dialogue. She reserves quotation marks for the few documented historical facts, such as an excerpt from Lee's journal, for which she gives no source citations. Without quotation marks, the pages look like an intimidating history text and not an historical novel. The changes in point of view also bothered me. I don't mind switching from character to character, but switching from omniscient, to first person, to omniscient, to first person, made the sections feel like they belonged to different books rather than to a single book with a unified purpose. With her stylistic choices, I got the feeling that Freeman wanted to make some grand literary statement with _Red Water_, but I never got a real sense of what she wanted me to take away from her book. I got a good picture of the difficulties of life in the early southern Utah. And for anyone involved with the Mountain Meadows Massacre, and especially John D. Lee, life got a whole lot worse. Life seemed so hard, I kept wondering why we never heard about anyone committing suicide. Or, perhaps Freeman wanted us to see that any single characterization of Lee (or any of his wives) doesn't paint an accurate picture. I don't think she wanted to make a grand statement about Mormonism, polygamy, or even the massacre. So in the end, _Red Water_ presents an interesting, well written slice of early rural Utah life that did nothing special for me. -- Terry L Jeffress | It is a mistake to think that books have come to South Jordan, UT | stay. The human race did without them for | thousands of years and may decide to do without | them again. -- E. M. Forster -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: Re: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 28 Dec 2001 12:49:19 -0700 I wrote: > It's not necessary to fill in much about who the > author is because the buyer is already aware of him as a beloved general > authority with a long track record of passionate service and love for the > people of Samoa. The memoir is simply more from the life of a known > celebrity. Of course it was the people of Tonga, not Samoa. Sorry. Scott Parkin (hiding head in shame and wondering if one can get a hangover from too much Christmas ham). -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Parkin" Subject: [AML] Christianity in Fantasy (was: De-Christianizing of C.S. Lewis?) Date: 28 Dec 2001 12:44:23 -0700 Ivan Wolfe wrote: ===== However - here a few excerpts from websites that say the rumor was not totally untrue: http://ayelle.net/journal/september01.html 30 September 2001: I owe HarperCollins an apology, sort of It seems there was a misunderstanding about Narnia. This was not my own personal misunderstanding, FYI -- the source of the rumors was an article in the New York Times! But HarperCollins is not, in fact, rewriting C. S. Lewis's original Chronicles of Narnia. What they are doing is performing a "marketing makeover." HarperCollins hopes to make more money from Narnia by "distancing it from its Christian roots," and a memo to that effect was leaked, which was the source for the N. Y. Times article titled "Marketing Narnia Without A Christian Lion." ===== I had read in _Locus_ (the sf publishing industry news magazine) quite a while ago about the marketing campaign being changed to de-emphasize the evident Christianity in the Narnia series, and had understood that to include a new set of covers that removed the evident Christian symbols and that sort of thing rather than an actual rewrite of Lewis's text. I think such an effort is silly, but find nothing particularly alarming in it. Lewis is what he is, and wrote an excellent set of novels that contain such an evident Christian metaphor that I can't imagine why they wouldn't acknowledge the fact. A short digression... I didn't actually read _The Chronicals of Narnia_ until earlier this year, so while I knew of the Christian symbolism it was an abstract, factual sort of knowledge. I had come to know of the series when the first book (The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe) was read to me by my third and fourth grade teacher, and always planned to read it but never seemed to find time. Coming to the series as an adult I was absolutely stunned not only by the powerful Christian metaphor, but by the amount of Mormon doctrine that Lewis got right. The whole idea of people growing to become not only like Aslan, but to actually come to dwell with him as equals rather than subjects just about knocked me over. The series is, for me, a prototype of how one can tell a deeply religious story using the terms and settings of fantasy. For me, Mormons need to study Lewis at least as much as Rowling if they want to learn how to write a bestselling fantasy series (for kids and adults alike). I ended up having a discussion with an in-law over the Christmas break about whether Harry Potter deserved to be discussed in the same breath as Narnia. I argued that they each contained equivalent moral/ethical content and explored issues of specific interest to the audiences of their day, and that I thought Harry Potter contained a great deal more complexity than it's often given credit for. When the dust had settled on our discussion, what it came down to was that my brother in law thought the Christian metaphor of Narnia brought an additional level of literary value that he thought was missing in Harry Potter (he also hadn't read either the third or fourth HP books). I can't argue with him, but I do disagree. Narnia resonates with me as a Christian and a Mormon, so I feel a certain kinship with Lewis (who absolutely hated Mormons, btw) and his works. But Harry Potter addressed me more directly as a modern reader, and that kinship was no less powerful for me as an individual reader. (I read both series for the first time about four months ago.) What's the point? Nothing much, I guess. Just a recognition that Harry Potter has engaged a new generation in a way that Narnia did a generation (or two) ago. While I think Narnia has aged well, I think Harry Potter does address a modern audience more effectively in its own language and with its own issues. It could be argued that part of the massive appeal of Harry Potter is its complete separation from religious metaphor, and thus its general accessibility to any reader. I suspect this is what the publisher is thinking about when they say they want to remove the evident Christian imagery from the book covers--they feel that the story can be read without the religious subtext, and that this new generation can enjoy it as much as previous ones have. Again, I think it's a little silly, but I think a lot of what marketing folk do is silly so that's nothing new. Scott Parkin -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: Re: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 28 Dec 2001 15:03:55 -0700 Interesting comments from Sharlee. I enjoyed the film better the second time than the first, but I did indeed notice that Mormonism isn't mentioned AT ALL until the second half of the movie. Interesting choice. It seems to me an unwise one. Our family experience with anti-Mormons who assume all Mormons are trying to insinuate themselves and Mormon doctrine slyly into various endeavors tells me that Mitch Davis's choice to NOT mention Mormonism (and the various choices to promote the love story above and beyond the missionary story) will backfire in the fundamentalist Christian population. Nonetheless, I really did enjoy _The Other Side of Heaven_. Sharlee is again right that the movie is not as good as the book. I read a segment of the book (the boy who had fallen from the mango tree) to my creative writing class last semester. It is a moving, moving chapter. It is a moving segment in the film as well, but not nearly as moving as in the book. One thing our department chair said rings true--that hopefully the movie will make people want to read the book. As I understand it, Deseret Book has printed 50,000 paperback copies retitled _The Other Side of Heaven_ rather than _In The Eye of the Storm_. I do believe that John Groberg's book is one of the great missionary/devotional books written to date--in the top five. [Margaret Young] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: margaret young Subject: [AML] Other Side of Heaven Date: 28 Dec 2001 15:17:54 -0700 I've given my take on the movie already, but wanted to volunteer my husband's take--that he thought the movie contained one of the best lessons on chastity and fidelity he could imagine. I suspect that's one reason President Bateman was so keen on having BYU students see it. It's a good reason to have all young men and young women see it. But it is a "lesson" more than an experience. Still, isn't it great that a first-time director got the likes of Gerald Molen to produce? I say this sets all sorts of precedents and cause for hope for our LDS film makers. And all evidence indicates that the movie will be a financial success, right? I doubt it will succeed outside of the Mormon market, but it will do very well with Mormons, and that's wonderful! It will give Mitch Davis more power to do more work. This is an independent movie and is much better than what the Church produces with its correlation committees. I call this progress. We haven't seen a great Mormon movie yet, but Dutcher and Davis are paving a fine path. [Margaret Young] -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scot" Subject: [AML] Elizabeth TICE, _Inside the Mormon Mind_ (Query) Date: 28 Dec 2001 15:24:08 -0700 Does anyone know about this book or about the author, _Inside the Mormon Mind: The Social Psychology of Mormonism_ by Elizabeth T. Tice, PhD.? Scot Denhalter "Adam fell that men might be; men are that they might have books." -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ThomDuncan@prodigy.net Subject: Re: [AML] _The Other Side of Heaven_ (Movie Review) Date: 29 Dec 2001 11:09:57 -0700 On 28 Dec 2001 at 9:21, Sharlee Glenn wrote: > Richard Dutcher said that he made "God's Army" for Mormons, but he > hoped that others would be interested. (Chaim Potok said the same > thing about his novels, substituting "Jews" for "Mormons," of course.) > I think that's one of the reasons that "God's Army" was a far > superior film. If you want to get something right, you can't water it > down. That is one of the reasons it's a superior film. Another reason is that Dutcher (like Potok) is not afraid to explore the humanity as they reach for the divine. They haven't forgotten that, regardless of audience, you must have a story to tell that involves real, breathing people. And, though we Mormons seem adverse to admit that, real people (including real Mormons) aren't always absolutely certain they're doing the right thing, don't always make the right mistakes, are tempted to sin like everyone else (we're supposed to believe from _Heaven_ that the Groberg character was not tempted in the slightest to accept the chief's daughters -- I'm sorry, I don't buy it.) In good films and literature, characters have character arcs: they start from a given point and progress (or digress) to another point. In James Bond and adventure-type movies, characters don't need an arc, but you better have great action scenes to make up for it. In a quiet film like Heaven, Groberg doesn't change. He's the same faithfully missionary at the end as when he starts. Every Mormon film maker wishing to portray things religions in an effective manner needs to see Brother Sun, Sister Moon, about Francis of Assissi. Wonderful film. Blatantly Catholic (like Potok's books are blatantly Jewish) but spiritually moving nonetheless. Thom Duncan Playwrights Circle - an organization of professionals -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: William Morris Subject: Re: [AML] De-Christianizing of C.S. Lewis? Date: 29 Dec 2001 12:07:04 -0800 (PST) The clarification that Jonathan posted is correct, but my understanding is that HarperCollins put this up on their Web site in response to an outcry over some info. that came out about how they were going to approach the marketing of the Narnia series. In the wake of the runaway success of the Harry Potter series, HarperCollins realized that they had a valuable property that they could attract HP readers to. But in their infinite wisdom, the marketing gods decided that it would be wise to downplay the Christian elements in the series in order to reach a broader audience. >From the June 3 NY Times article that sparked much of the initial furor: "The publishing strategy surfaced in a HarperCollins memo. 'Obviously this is the biggie as far as the estate and our publishing interests are concerned,' wrote an executive from HarperSanFranciso, an imprint of HarperCollins involved in the Lewis publishing program. 'We'll need to be able to give emphatic assurances that no attempt will be made to correlate the stories to Christian imagery/theology.'" HarperCollins maintains that this was merely a memo, that it doesn't represent any final decision and was merely part of a larger discussion of how to market the Narnia books. There was also concern that any spin-off novels would be solidly secular, taking place in the Narnia universe but sidestepping that whole pesky Christian imagery that keeps cropping up in Lewis' works. Of course, I dare say that many readers Christian and non-Christian alike have read and enjoyed the Narnia tales without being aware of the Christian symbolism in them. But at the same time it is understandable that the Christian world feels a strong ownership of these books. What makes this a particularly interesting literary issue is that unlike his fellow Inkling J.R.R. Tolkien who, as has been mentioned in another thread expplicitly denied allegorical interpretations of the _Lord of the Rings_, Lewis stressed the importance of the Narnia books as Christian allegory. The question that HarperCollins' marketing strategy brings up is how responsible the publisher is to respecting the intentions of the author in how the book is presented to the reading public. What is the higher goal---reaching secular readers or staying true to the author's goal in writing the book? ~~William Morris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Brown" Subject: [AML] Definitions of YA Lit (was: Mormons in Children's Lit) Date: 30 Dec 2001 08:15:43 -0700 .Rose Green wrote: I certainly don't believe that adult literature is more "real" than juvenile Will someone knowledgeable define YA literature for us? I never marketed my work as YA literature because it had subtle nuances of sexual energy, etc., that I thought were more suitable for adults. I think that's what I meant by "real." Yet my "resolutions" are simpler as Rose mentions happens in YA. I think one of my serious problems is that my writing is neither adult nor YA, Mormon nor national. It's on a bridge, and the bridge is beginning to sway in the wind. Marilyn Brown ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2001 4:03 PM Market) > >Seriously, (and this is a question for all of you) why do you think that > >LDS writers of children's/YA fiction have been so much more successful in > >the national market? > > Well, where else are they going to publish? The LDS publishers do very > little in the way of children's books (yes, the volume has been rising in > recent years, but still); somewhat more in YA. I certainly don't believe > that adult literature is more "real" than juvenile. There is a difference, > but I don't think that's it. Off the top of my head (I may revise this > after I think about it awhile), juvenile lit tends towards more resolved > endings, more hopeful endings (not always, but often), and often characters > who go through turning point, growing-up experiences. It seems like there > are exhorbitant numbers of adult books that go through hundreds of pages > just to have nothing happen in the end. My library is full of them. (This > would be referring to non-genre fiction.) Thing is, themes that deal with > the gospel in some way (usually conversion stories) have that > turning-point-in-life experience. Maybe there's a correlation. Thoughts? > > Rose Green > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com > > > > > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > > -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jonathan Langford Subject: Re: [AML] Must-Read Lists (comp 1) Date: 31 Dec 2001 10:21:13 -0600 [MOD: This is a compilation post.] >From skperry@mac.com Thu Dec 27 09:59:57 2001 on 12/26/01 4:47 PM, Tracie Laulusa at tlaulusa@core.com wrote: > So I was > wondering, what book(s) would you not want to have gone through life without > reading? "How Green Was My Valley" Richard Llewelyn [Steve Perry] ============================================ >From RichardDutcher@aol.com Thu Dec 27 10:10:19 2001 Here are a few must-reads: 1. The Grapes of Wrath by John Steinbeck 2. Anna Karenina by Leo Tolstoy 3. 1984 by George Orwell 4. My Name is Asher Lev by Chaim Potok 5. Lonesome Dove by Larry McMurtry 6. The Shining by Stephen King Richard Dutcher =========================================== >From ftsrc@uaf.edu Thu Dec 27 15:43:30 2001 May I suggest you read at least one book by Daniel Quinn if you haven't yet? He's written such titles as Ishmael, The Story of B, My Ishmael, Providence, and Beyond Civilization. His books are a real ride, and very potentially life-changing. His book My Ishmael started a revolution in the way I see life and teaching. Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska ============================================ >From bronsonjscott@juno.com Sat Dec 29 11:11:48 2001 On Wed, 26 Dec 2001 18:47:51 -0500 "Tracie Laulusa" writes: > I am putting together my "I want to read this in 2002" list. So I > was wondering, what book(s) would you not want to have > gone through life without reading? Fiction or non-fiction. Non-fiction Of Wolves and Men -- Barry Lopez Arctic Dreams -- Barry Lopez The Song of the Dodo -- David Quammen Natural Acts -- David Quammen The Owl Papers -- Jonathan Evan Maslow Brave Companions -- David McCullough A Storyteller in Zion -- Orson Scott Card Christ and the Inner Life -- Truman Madsen The Highest in Us -- Truman Madsen Eternal Man -- Truman Madsen Approaching Zion -- Hugh Nibly The Right Stuff -- Fiction Speaker For the Dead -- Orson Scott Card Saints -- Orson Scott Card Spartina -- John Casey A Prayer For Owen Meany -- John Irving The Human Comedy -- William Saroyan Lord Jim -- Joseph Conrad White Jacket -- Herman Melville East of Eden -- John Steinbeck Path of the Crushed Heart (Serpent Catch & Path of the Hero) -- Dave Wolverton Neverness -- David Zindell McTeague -- Frank Norris Inherit the Stars -- James P. Hogan Points of Departure -- Pat Murphy The Mind Parasites -- Colin Wilson The Backslider -- Levi Peterson Paradise Vue -- Katherine Kidd A Wrinkle in Time -- Madeline L'Engle Little House in the Big Woods & On the Prarie -- Island of the Blue Dolpin -- Scott O'dell I'm sure there are more but I have work to do. scott bronson ===================================== >From jltyner@postoffice.pacbell.net Sun Dec 30 19:28:44 2001 What books would I not want to go through life without having read? What a question! What to read for 2002? Here's a few. Well, let's start with the beginning-one of my very first memories is hearing my mother reading "The Tale of Peter Rabbit", one of my favorites. "The Cat in the Hat", "Nana Upstairs, Nana Downstairs" and the "Amelia Bedelia" stories. If you want visually beautiful picture books get anything by or illustrated by K.Y. Craft. In picture books done by LDS authors I suggest you put on your 2002 list "One in a Billion" by Sharlee Glenn, "So Many Bunnies" and "The Bear Came Over to My House" by Rick Walton, "Daughter of a King" by Rachel Nunes and "Fanny's Dream" by Caralyn Buehner and illustrated by Mark Buehner. In YA/Middle Reader I suggest "Say you are my Sister" by Laurel Brady and "My Angelica" by Carol Lynch Williams. I also recommend anything by Zilpha Keatley Snyder,(she once came to my third grade school group and said my short story was good, therefore anything she writes is brilliant). If you want to go into the fantasy genre by all means read "The Wizard of Oz", "The Chronicles of Narnia" the works by J.R.R. Tolkien, "A Wrinkle in Time" and a newer series by T.A. Barron called "The Lost Years of Merlin". I might also suggest some hard to find titles that are possibly still on library shelves, "Fog Magic" by Julia Sauer and "The Ghost of Dibble Hollow", "The Wicked, Wicked Ladies in the Haunted House" (The name is dumb, but the story is good). The author's names escape me at present. I also like nearly anything by Beverly Cleary, her old book "Fifteen" let me know it was okay what I was feeling as a teen. Her books always spoke to me much more so than Judy Blume's even though I read some of hers as well. In biography, I would suggest "The Diary of Anne Frank" and "Three Against Hitler", I wept reading both. I understand there is a version for a younger audience of "Three Against Hitler" but I think young teens are capable of handling this book. As long as my list is so far, I suggest this is a MUST READ. A fictional diary based on the history of the Mormon Battalion is Paris Anderson's book,"The Recollections of Private Seth Jackson, Company D, Mormon Battalion, Book 1 from Council Bluffs to Santa Fe", well done. As far as adult fiction goes, I'm real lackluster on recommendations. Everyone is raving about "The Miracle Life of Edgar Mint" by Brady Udall, but you'll have to judge for yourself. Another one that looks good is "Danny's Corner" by Neil K. Warner. If you like mysteries try the Anne Perry novels, they're worth working through. Sci/Fi is my husband's domain, but he loves Orson Scott Card. If you are looking in the Self-help/Self-improvement area I suggest "Feelings Buried Alive Never Die..." by Karol K. Truman and "The Touch of Healing" by Alice Burmeister with Tom Monte. And course part of the MUST READ should be the Old Testament with "Old Testament Supplement Study Materials, Holy Land and Jewish Insights" by Daniel Rona and any other church books others on the list may recommend. That's just scratching the surface. Good luck choosing and may you have many a good day or night curled up with a good book. Kathy Tyner, Orange County, CA -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature