From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #929 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Friday, December 20 2002 Volume 01 : Number 929 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:38:28 -0700 From: "ali ssa" Subject: Re: [AML] CALL, _Mormonville_ (Deseret News) I recently read Jeff Call's novel MORMONVILLE. I was intrigued by the=20 title, thinking it must reflect a simple book. I was pleasantly surprised= =20 to find myself mistaken. The novel examines the LDS concept of conversion= =20 in several forms, reiterating our religious belief that we are always in a= =20 new state of conversion. It was interesting to me the way that I found=20 myself examining my own religious motives after reading this book. The idea= =20 of having someone completely unfamiliar =96 and thus unbiased =96 with LDS= =20 culture come in and =93investigate=94 was engaging to me and I was quickly= drawn=20 into the plot thanks to the short introduction. I found the idea that=20 someone would be willing to spend millions of dollars to find a scandal in= =20 the Mormon church seemed highly unlikely. But when I considered that Joseph= =20 Smith was persecuted so heavily and he was just a harmless young man, I=20 realized anything is possible. Call provides enough details to make the=20 idea work. Fortunately, the reader is (or at least I am) soon much more=20 interested in what the LDS culture looks like to an =93outsider.=94 While= it=20 may be a little longer than many more popular LDS books, it's worth the=20 length! I appreciate that Call takes the time to make situations more=20 believable and some outcomes are predictable because we know that is how=20 life goes sometimes. I look forward to reading something else from this=20 sports journalist/novelist. Alissa Schertz - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 07:23:18 -0500 From: "Tracie Laulusa" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies I, for one, am all for teaching children that there is a difference = between being an adult and being a child. The youth have been = counseled, nay commanded, not to have sex. (Unless they are married, I = assume, at a very young age.) Obviously, you would not use your logic = below to extend that to adults. Though that may be as bad an analogy, = as we would say that the adults should be married, too. How about voting. Children are not allowed to vote. And I think that = most people would agree that it makes sense that they need to be taught = some things (most of which they probably aren't), and have some life = experience (the most beneficial of which they probably aren't getting), = before they can take part in the political process that determines who = gets to muck up the white house next. We shelter children all the time from topics that they are not mature = enough to handle. That does not mean that adults shouldn't handle them. = =20 I have read probably a dozen books about Cambodia and various aspects of = conflict there. Three of my seven children are probably able to handle = the subject matter, though I know one would choose not to do so. The = other four are just not old enough to be subjected to *all* that was = contained there, though there are portions that I shared with them. = While it was not appropriate for them, it was very appropriate for me. = In fact, it was life changing for me, spiritually powerful for me, and = taught me some things about how we act as human beings that have made me = a better person. =20 I totally agree with your third point, especially since you said "But I = think we each know what is inappropriate for certain ages, and what will = make us personally uncomfortable." The key there, that many on the = "don't watch R-rated movies" side of the argument seem unable to allow. = Each person can decide. I do not have a problem with one person = deciding they would like to let a handful of people they don't even know = decide what is or is not appropriate, as long as they do not make = comments that imply that those who do not choose to use that same = standard are disobedient, spiritually immature, or in some other way = inferior. Personally, the most offensive movies I have watched are rated G. Tracie Laulusa - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 08:27:47 -0600 From: "Lisa Olsen Tait" Subject: Re: [AML] Richard SNOWCROFT, _Ordeal of Dudley Dean_ (Review) Seeing the author's > name, I wondered, could this be THE Richard Scowcroft? > Indeed it was. Who is THE Richard Scowcroft? You're not thinking of Richard Cracroft, are you? Or is Richard Scowcroft related to the Brent Scowcroft of national security fame (who is supposedly LDS)? - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 06:58:17 -0800 (PST) From: Mary Aagard Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies om> Sender: owner-aml-list@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: aml-list Christopher Bigelow wrote: Here's an= uncannily apropos item from today's Deseret News: BYU bars use of R-rated movies=20 By Jeffrey P. Haney Deseret News staff writer Here's a reply: I graduated from BYU's media arts program in June of 2002. I had a great= experience there, mostly because of the senstivity and commitment of the= professors. BYU really isn't a production school, a lot of people might= debate me on this, but if a student was serious about filmmaking, she would= go to a more production minded program. BYU doesn't have the connections= or freedom to create like NYU, USC, or UCLA does. BYU's true resource is= its professors. BYU is a training ground for future scholars in the media= arts. There are some excellent professors teaching there, men and women= who really know their stuff about film art. Partly because of their= influence, I'm choosing a career as a film studies librarian. At BYU I was= able to learn all of the tenets of film art. I was taught about film= theory and contemporary film scholarship. I was exposed to national= cinemas, genre filmmaking, and documentary expressions. =20 And I learned most of this by watching very few "rated R" movies in class,= but, though we didn't watch many R-rated shows (and we did, and we watched= clips from R-rated shows), they were sure discussed because they exist and= many movies that are given this rating are the most respected and discussed= films in current film theory/studies. One of my professors said that a= student could choose to avoid R-rated films but it was essential to know= about that film, its creation, philosophy, why it is important to the time= it was created. For example, _The Godfather_ , It holds a huge place in= film history and to be completely ignorant of its existence because of its= "rating" is unthinkable for a film scholar. And the truth is, if someone= wants to be a film scholar, an expert on film, she is going to have to see= the R-rated stuff. If that idea displeases the person, she shouldn't be a= film scholar. (it's like any artist or "expert". You can't ignore the= history involved in the art's creation and you can't ignore the current= trends. You don't have to take part, but you do need to make yourself= aware of them.) =20 There were students in class that left when R-rated clips were shown. The= professor would warn the class, elaborate on what was about to be viewed= and the students could choose to stay and watch. It didn't seem to be a= big deal. I witnessed bigger struggles in literature classes concering= these issues than I did in the film classes. =20 We kind of saw this policy coming. It had been talked about, the old= policies on film viewings in class had been passed around and we kind of= knew that it was coming. I'm glad to see that the professor still has some= kind of power in choosing what his or her classes sees: (a quote from the= article)=20 "BYU spokeswoman Carri P. Jenkins said, to her knowledge, faculty won't be= disciplined if they don't adhere to the guidelines. The selection of= visual and literary materials "will depend on the wisdom of the faculty,"= said Jenkins." Film students seem to know what they are getting into in terms of the= "rated-R" debate when they start studying media arts. Many English and= literature students seem to be caught unaware that anything unseemly ever= happened in literature when their professors present works of fiction to= them. [Mary Aagard] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 09:40:42 -0700 From: "Eric D. Snider" Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies Eric Samuelsen: >Imagine, if you will, an R-rated movie in which there is no nudity >or even the tiniest suggestion of sexual activity. In addition, >there only is a small amount of harsh language, but no use of the F >word, and no more than four or five milder profanities or >vulgarities. There are no scenes in this movie in which violence is >depicted. Although violence is suggested, you never actually see it >occur; the entire focus is on the aftermath and therefore the >consequences of violence. So, it's rated R, but it has no sex, no >nudity, hardly any bad language and no on-screen violence. It's also >a movie of extraordinary craftsmanship and skill, superbly filmed, >written and acted. And yet it's rated R, and properly so. > >The movie to which I refer is The Ring. Sorry, Eric, but "The Ring" is rated PG-13. Eric D. Snider - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 08:56:43 -0800 From: "Jeff Needle" Subject: Re: [AML] Deseret Book Ad Campaign I get just about everything in the mail from Deseret Book, and haven't seen any such letter. It may be a Utah phenomenon. Which is curious, since there are, there REALLY are, some of us outsize the Zion Curtain who read LDS books and patronize Deseret Book. Some of us even write reviews. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 10:11:39 -0700 From: "Eric Russell" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies In The Miracle of Forgiveness President Kimball says pretty plainly that women should not wear shorts outside the home. We don't hear that too often anymore. On a more serious note, (meaning this one's one I think is actually important and should be taught more) President Kimball also said that young married couples should not put off having children until they have finished their education or are financially stable. This commandment is broken on a regular basis, even at BYU where we're all supposedly "pro-family". The point is, the church currently has no official position on women wearing shorts, adults seeing r-rated movies, or putting off having children (it's between the couple and the Lord) and yet some of these are OK according to Mormon culture and some are not. Why? Because Mormon culture said so. Despite the lack of any official church position, Mormon culture itself has made R movies taboo and the other things OK. Why would Mormon culture taboo certain movies? I honestly believe it's because it allows us to pretend like we're good people when we're not. For example, I know many Mormons who own million dollar houses with luxurious cars (meaning money real Christians would spend elsewhere than on themselves) yet apparently think they're "pure" and "righteous" because they don't have any movies in their mansions that have naughty words in them. The Mormon mantra seems to say, "Do whatever you want. Spend all your extra money on yourself. Spend all your free time on yourself. In fact, eat drink and be merry, as long as you avoid the 'bad' art." The Sugar Beet hit it right on when they announced that the "Nephite pride cycle apparently doesn't apply to Utah Mormons." I'm thinking the tabooing of certain movies, music and books has actually inhibited spiritual progress more than it has promoted it. It has shifted the right/wrong dichotomy away from inherent practical ethics and towards artificially established standards. In a story similar to one discussed earlier this year, I recently heard an EFY councilor talk about how he had convinced some of his more rebellious kids to break over 200 of their CD's and thought it was a spiritual breakthrough. I wanted to say, So what? If the music is actually influencing their bad behavior then that's great. But most likely, changing their music isn't going to change their actions. What really needs changing is their hearts and their attitudes. I think that may be the fundamental problem. We think our righteousness is based on what we see, read or hear, when it's really based on who we are and what we do. Eric Russell _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:30:28 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies The critics I always read before seeing any movie: First, I live in Provo and read the Deseret News. Their film critic is = Jeff Vice. I frequently disagree with Jeff, but he provides some useful = information. Second, I quite like Eric Snider's column in the Provo Herald. It's = available on-line at www.ericdsnider.com=20 Third, I like the Salon critics, especially Stephanie Zacharek and Charles = Taylor. Both are very much Pauline Kael disciples. Knowing that, I tend = to either agree with them, or know why I don't agree with them. Check out = www.salon.com=20 Fourth, I always read Roger Ebert. He can be found at www.suntimes.com/ind= ex/ebert.html I sorta grew up on Ebert, and I think he's a decent = populist critic. Finally, we usually check out www.familystyle.com for fairly comprehensive = lists of what's in a film in terms of sex, violence and so on. =20 Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 12:42:12 -0800 (PST) From: David Dayton Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies www.screenit.com provides a pretty objective overview of potentially offensive material in a film as well as a contextual analysis of said content. there are 12 categories ranging from sex/nudity to blood/gore. the site is run by a couple in the D.C. area that is not affiliated with any religious group or financial interest. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:42:00 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] Re: R-Rated Movies Rebecca Talley provided us with a list of quotations from general = authorities about R rated movies. This is not the first time we've had = such a list on AML and there were no new ones on there. =20 A coupla quick points: I know lots of people, including my brother and his family and my = sister-in-law and her family, who do not see R-rated movies, for the same = reasons Rebecca articulated. I honestly respect them for having made that = choice. I have not, and would never try to persuade them to do otherwise. = I am comfortable with the choices I've made. I go out of my way to see = films that are virtuous, lovely, of good report and praiseworthy. That = includes a great many R-rated films. I am comfortable with having made = the decisions I've made, and see no reason to re-visit those decisions. = =20 If you tell me, however, that no R-rated movies could ever be valuable or = good or spiritually uplifting, or virtuous, lovely, or praiseworthy, then = I have to simply say that you're wrong. It just isn't true. The rating = system has nothing to do with spirituality, or morality, or potential = satanic influences. With the warmest regard in the world for Bishop = Peterson, or for President Benson, all R-rated films are not full of = filth, are not spiritually degrading, and are not without value. They're = full of value, some of them. Of course, some are awful, that goes without = saying as well. =20 I especially like Elder Simpson's comments. I take the time to do as he = suggests. I read reviews, a lot of 'em. They're easy to find, and it's = fun. I make choices regarding what I'll see. The MPAA is not and will = not be in the loop regarding those choices. Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:45:00 -0700 From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies I'm one of those people who lived in Europe with a different rating system. When our family returned to the US, I discovered I had seen several movies that were R here, but were rated much more mildly there. In fact, my dad rented a video for FHE that was the equivalent of G there, but we found out later it was R in the states! True story. Every culture has things that it is more sensitive to, I suppose. That said, I don't go to see R-rated movies. This is not because I have given up my agency. I actually agree with many of the arguments about why the rating system is useless. But the fact stands that we don't see R-rated movies. The reason is largely because of my husband. He knows that if he saw this or that film (ones that are worth seeing), he could easily justify seeing others that are trash. That's just his personalty, and he knows it. So he doesn't see any of them. On the other hand, we keep a watchful eye out for any movie we'd like to see that comes on TV, including Schindler's List, Saving Private Ryan, Shakespeare in Love, and most recently, The Matrix. For anyone getting ready to repond by pointing out all the holes in our logic, don't bother. We are both fully aware of them. But it's a system we feel comfortable with, holes and all, and I doubt we'll change it any time soon. Annette Lyon - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:46:26 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies Lots of people have told me that The Ring is rated PG-13, which kinda = negates the whole point of my post. Ah well. In my defense, let me say = the following: I never pay attention to the ratings of films. When I saw The Ring, I did = pay attention, because we were having this thread. As I walked into the = theatre, I looked up at the marquee and it said it was rated R. I swear = on my mother's ironing board that this really happened. =20 Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 11:30:02 -0900 From: Stephen Carter Subject: [AML] Free Books on Friday (My Christmas Present to AML) Come listen to a sad tale. My 2000 books have been nestling in the attic behaving themselves for two years. But suddenly, my parents noticed a crack forming in the ceiling just about where my books lie. They have given me the ultimatum. Since I now live in Alaska I cannot bring all my books up with me. The only thing I want for my books is a loving home. So I am extending an invitation to all of you who are within driving distance of Spanish Fork, UT, to come on Friday December 20 to go through my beautiful stacks and refind the treasures I have collected for the last six years. All of these books are free. The only thing I want in return is the promise that you will love the books and read them. Or that you will give them to someone who will love them. Just think of all the Christmas presents you won't have to buy. There are some real gems in my collection. I have two sets of Harvard Classics (don't know how I got two), the Nobel Prize series, a B.H. ROberts HIstory of the Church, some cute old LDS nonfiction like The Negro and THe Church, WOman and the Priesthood, Gospel Values, etc, a collection of philosophy (mostly British and Continental), tons and tons (almost literally) of literature from all time periods, and at least three shelves of poetry. It really is amazing how much great stuff is in here. I collected it all from DI over the past six years, and I only bought the best (both in content and condition). My parents' house is at 428 South Nebo Drive in SPanish Fork. Directions: Get off on the Price/Manti highway exit (just before the SPanish FOrk Exit, just after the WalMart exit, or vice versa if you're coming from the south) and turn right at the third traffic light (it's at the top of the hill next to a Tesoro station). Turn left at the first stop sign (it's the only way you can turn). Go past the stop sign next to the tan school, and then turn right at the next intersection. Turn left immediately, my house is the second house on the right. It is a two story house (the only one on the street), it has white pillars on the porch. Feel free to come at any time Friday. I'll be there. I'm afraid there won't be much rhyme or reason to how things are ordered. POetry will be in one general section, as will philosophy and literature, but other than that, it's your treasure hunt. Everything left will go to one of our fine used book stores or thrift stores in the Provo area. Call me (Stephen Carter Jr.) if you have any questions. 798-8735 or 798-0505. Hey, this would make a great date. Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:53:29 -0700 From: "Eric Russell" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies At www.screenit.com you can find detailed explanations of everything and anything potentially offensive to anyone in any movie that has come out over the last few years. Eric Russell _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:15:52 -0500 From: Subject: Re: [AML] Onion Skewers Orson Scott Card That was strange to read. I happen to live in Raleigh, NC, and there really is a Barnes & Noble at the Crabtree Valley Mall, which is only a few miles from my house. I guess the writers at The Onion really do their research, or at least steal from real press releases. (Card does come around to local bookstores fairly frequently, though I don't remember him coming to that particular Barnes & Noble.) Roberto Gomez - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:52:54 -0700 From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies To me the council not to watch R rated movies lost a lot of credibility when I saw the movie "Glory." To me it was very uplifting, and it demand that I reconsider some ugly attitudes I had (hope they're gone now). Why would the Prophets want me to avoid that movie? There was no sex in it. No nudity and no obscene language. There was plenty of violence, but I know they don't object to that. If they wanted me to avoid excessive violence they wouldn't have sent my father to Argentina. (wait a minute . . . that sounds bitter.) Paris Anderson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 14:40:43 -0700 From: "Elizabeth Walters" Subject: Re: [AML] Re: R-Rated Movies "The ratings for movies are not concrete. What would have been rated R twenty years ago is now PG-13. How can we continue to rate anything with a constantly changing scale? " The only problem I have with this point is that the PG-13 rating is less than 20 years old. It didn't exist before 1984 and didn't really find its place in the rating system until the very early 90's. Anyone who has watched R rated movies in the last 30 years knows this so-called fact isn't quite accurate. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 14:48:06 -0700 From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies Rebecca says: >I don't think we, as adults, are any more capable of >erasing impure images from our minds than the young >men to which President Benson addressed his remarks. Perhaps not but we ought to be more capable of deciding not to act on those images. I maintain that, as adults, we ought to be, and if we're not, perhaps we need to get counseling on impulse management. >Our minds, just as theirs, will never be the same. If >we've been counseled to "run" from such material, why >don't we? Why roll around in the mud? Why pay money >and encourage filmmakers to produce such films? Why >not lift the bar and demand movies that rise above >what is usually available? Why not produce profound, >thought-provoking movies that don't wallow in the filth, but >rather inspire us? We are doing the latter and will probably do more of it. I personally know of two LDS films in pre pre-production, The Best Two Years of My Life and Saturday's Warrior. >Maybe I'm too idealistic, and maybe my views are too >far removed from this list, but I just can't feel good >about watching or reading something that I have to >sift through junk to find something of value. . What do you do when you read the Scriptures? Don't you find you have to sift through the junk (the erotic poetry of Song of Solomon, for instance) to get the stuff of value? That's what being a thinking adult is all about, imo. We can't expect children or even young adults to have the sophistication of thought required to not act upon images or even thoughts that might come into their mind. But we should expect adults to. I'll be frank here. If I acted upon every wayward thought that came into my mind, I probably would have committed adultery nigh unto several hundred times in my lifetime. But, amazingly, I have never done so. Though I haven't yet learned how to control my thoughts, I have learned how to control how I act on them. No series of film nudity has yet or ever will "make" me commit adultery. I can listen to the "F" word from now until doomsday but you'll never hear me say it in polite company. I can watch Joey Pants get decapitated on the Sopranos but I'm likely to go to my grave having never copied acts of forceful cranial-neck separation. Thom Duncan - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 14:54:31 -0700 From: "Thom Duncan" Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies >Personally, the most offensive movies I have watched are rated G. I always bring up Disney's "Million Dollar Duck" in any conversation where someone implies that G rated movies are inoffensive. A complete and utter waste of celluloid to have made it and of one's brain power to have watched it. Thom - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 15:03:48 -0800 From: "gae lyn henderson" Subject: Re: [AML] R-Rated Movies Rebecca Talley says: >I think these quotes are quite clear on the subject of >R-Rated movies and such. > >Maybe I'm too idealistic, and maybe my views are too >far removed from this list, but I just can't feel good >about watching or reading something that I have to >sift through junk to find something of value. > I believe that Rebecca's views are exactly what any idealistic and attention-paying young person must adopt in the Mormon church. I spent a great deal of my life defending this kind of idealism as does Rebecca with all the general authority quotations to back me up. Now I've decided I was wrong, not just about r-rated movies, but about much else that I've been trained to believe. I think the whole problem is an authoritative system that tells us that obedience is the first virtue. Current lessons stress this virtue repeatedly and frequently. Obedience to authority disallows our freedom to question, to struggle with contradictory evidence, to listen to opposing opinion. I suspect that most people reading this will jump to defend the fact that we are taught over and over again to study and exercise free agency. I know that I defended that position for years! But now as I face reality--how often can I raise my hand in a meeting and offer a contradictory opinion? Only at the risk of being labeled apostate, which is exactly where people who think outside the box end up. The authoritative system can even cause us to flatly reject the scholarly work of researchers who are only presenting the truth as they find it because it might contradict the received ideas that we have been given. The authoritative pronouncements to avoid R-rated movies teach a sheep-like mentality that keeps us safe above all else from becoming fully adult decision makers and exercising the free agency that supposedly is the foundation of the religious belief system itself. I still rarely see an R-rated movie because I have been well trained. I cringe at the kind of self-determination that some on this list evince. I want to keep my kids safe and away from EVIL. But guess what? All my attempts to do so have only caused problems. My former literalism and idealism have been the undoing of my personal relationships as well. Gae Lyn Henderson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:04:23 +1100 From: "Covell, Jason" Subject: RE: [AML] R-Rated Movies I'm going to throw another little spin into the mix on the R-rated movies question. And this from a non-US, Australian perspective. My purpose is to illustrate the kind of contortions you can get yourself into through a certain kind of literalism. In Australia, we indeed have R-rated films. We also have (in increasing order of provocativeness) G, PG, M, and MA ratings, which are all rated below R in degree of sex/violence/adult themed content. And also X-rated films, but I'm not going to worry about them too much. What have been interesting to me are the discussions of particular movies, ones which people have held up as being of worth and significance, despite their R-rating. Braveheart, Schindler's List and Saving Private Ryan come to mind. As an Australian, I'm thrown into an interesting dilemma, because these films _aren't_ rated R here! They are all M or MA (M stands for "Mature audience", recommended for 15 and over, and MA is similar, but requires an adult to accompany children under 15 - similar, although not identical, to the US R rating). What should I do as an Australian I want to follow the prophet's counsel (however that may be construed)? Should I adapt the R-rated movie counsel for local conditions, and consult the local rating before deciding whether to see a film? (That would rule out very few movies, by the way - the only major release film to get an R rating recently was Hannibal, and that was only after an appeal from an earlier lesser rating.) Or should I ignore the Australian rating system and instead look up the US rating for each film, on the basis that the prophet was attaching a special significance to the MPAA above all other country's ratings agencies? I hope I'm not alone in finding the last mentioned option rather absurd. But the former option raise other absurdities - that films unsuitable for US Church members are quite potentially quite OK for Australian Church members. My wife has proud Scottish roots too (also proud African-American roots!), and I would be quite happy to show my children Braveheart when they are in their teens and ready for it. I expect they'll wage war on me afterwards for being a cowardly son of almost entirely English ancestry, but I can take that. And I can do so safe in the knowledge that I won't be showing them an R-rated film, so no awkward explanations about following or not following the prophet's counsel. Jason Covell ************************************************************************** This message is intended for the named addressee(s) only. It may be confidential. If you receive this message in error please notify us immediately by return mail and delete the message (and any attachments). 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