From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V2 #102 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Tuesday, July 15 2003 Volume 02 : Number 102 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 15:42:17 -0700 From: "Susan Malmrose" Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT >> >among his social circle bi's are generally regarded as gays who haven't yet fully accepted their >homosexuality or are not ready to let go of the heterosexual world, Hence the phrase, "Bi now, gay later." - --Jennifer Breinholt [MOD: I think this may be the worst single pun I have ever witnessed on AML-List...] >> But a common one in gay circles--aka as being "on the plan," at least according to my brother. Susan M - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 21:34:47 -0600 From: "Jacob Proffitt" Subject: RE: [AML] Ken Sanders July Book Sale I'm happy to see it. I'd hate for this kind of thing to become terribly common, but as a small percentage of traffic, I have no trouble. Might be good to create a subject line tag for this kind of thing, though. (Sale) like (Review), maybe? Or better, (Commerce) to flag something that is inherently commercial. Jacob - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 07:51:40 -0600 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT "Thom Duncan, from the Web" wrote: > > If we prefer the name Church of Jesus Christ of Latter- > day Saints, or LDS, over Mormon But I personally don't prefer them. > We should allow minority groups to names > themselves whatever they think is appopriate and we > should, in the interest of fairness and tolerance, use > their terms over our own. Only if their favorite term is reasonable. I refuse to use "African-American" over "black." Why use seven syllables when one will do? Three initials are reasonable (like LDS), or something that spells a pronounceable word, but four or more unrepeated consonants gets too hard to deal with. It just becomes alphabet soup. If they wanted to use GLB, I could stand that. Why throw in transsexual anyway? A transsexual is nothing more than a gay or lesbian who feels so strongly about their sexual orientation that they make a permanent physical commitment to the lifestyle. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 10:37:45 -0400 From: Samuel Brown Subject: [AML] Re: (Des News) Krakauer's Book Creates LDS Flap Does anyone have the text of the church's response to the book? Has anyone told Krakauer what "reductionist" means? I'm excited to read the new book, simply because it's fascinating to learn about the real life instances of the creatures Flannery O'Connor imagined into existence. Based on his account of the 1996 Everest debacle, I'm not expecting any great insight or sophistication, but I do expect an excellent story, one of Krakauer's talents. And I have a suspicion that in spite of Krakauer's lack of scholarly talent/skill, many of the points on the church's list of errors are going to be more controversial than they would like to hope. I'd love a copy if someone has access. there's an excerpt in this month's GQ (don't ask; I was bored at a checkout stand on vacation), for those wanting a taste of the story. Looks like it comes out in another week or so. Thanks. - -- Samuel Brown, MD Massachusetts General Hospital - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 14:52:45 -0700 From: "Rex Goode" Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT Thom's asssertion: "I think members of the gay community can call themselves whatever they want.. Rex's reply: Who are "they?" Last time I looked, there was no governing body--no "official" committee. That not only goes for those who would categorize themselves under the GLBT banner but any other minority. I took a cultural diversity class recently. A latino woman was brought in to talk about the differences in counseling cliens of latin descent. Her definitions of words like Mexican, Chicano, and Latino were different than what the textbook said, which was different than what the professor had said, and different than the latino students in the class said. The latino students' definitions also differed from each other. For any minority, I don't think there is a "they." Rex - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 12:13:03 +1000 From: "Jason Covell" Subject: [AML] Online Poll: LDS Romantic Movie Coupling Hey, AML folks, I just found what is probably the silliest online poll I've seen for a long while - it's hosted by the www.ldsfilm.com website (which is actually a pretty good site). Basically, there are a dozen or so proposed romantic couplings LDS actors/performers, and you get to choose the one you'd like to see the most: examples include Steve Young with Gladys Knight, and Wilford Brimley with Marie Osmond. Go on everyone, swamp the thing! Make your vote count! (for something, I don't know) There's a link at the top of the www.ldsfilm.com site, or go direct to: http://members.hostedscripts.com/poll.cgi?user=pdhunter&poll=19 Jason Covell PS: I voted for Richard Dutcher and A.J. Cook. But don't let my sick imagination sway you. Anything with Richard is fine by me. ******************************************************************************************************* This e-mail, and any files transmitted, is intended for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is addressed and must not be resent by the recipient unless the permission of the originator is first obtained. It may contain confidential or privileged information and, if you are not the intended recipient, you must immediately destroy the original transmission and its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the originator of the message. Any views expressed in this e-mail do not represent the views of the Sydney Catchment Authority unless otherwise stated. ******************************************************************************************************* - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 16:58:27 -0700 From: "Susan Malmrose" Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT > > If we prefer the name Church of Jesus Christ of Latter- > > day Saints, or LDS, over Mormon > > But I personally don't prefer them. I like to call myself a Latter-Day Saint, not a Mormon. Mormon to me includes a lot of cultural things that I'm really not very into. > If they wanted to use GLB, I could stand that. Why throw in transsexual > anyway? A transsexual is nothing more than a gay or lesbian who feels so > strongly about their sexual orientation that they make a permanent > physical commitment to the lifestyle. > D. Michael Martindale Are you being serious with that comment? I don't have any first hand knowledge but I suspect there's a lot more to it than that. Susan M - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 17:58:58 -0600 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] (Des News) Krakauer's Book Creates LDS Flap Here's the Church response: http://www.lds.org/newsroom/mistakes/0,15331,3885-1,00.html It's pretty well written, but to me it focuses more on a handful of specific complaints than on debunking the book's overall approach. Chris Bigelow - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 18:34:56 -0600 From: Margaret Young Subject: RE: [AML] GLBT AMEN TO REX!!! I agree that "for any minority, there is no 'they'." I have become keenly aware of the words "those people" too. I find my back straightening and my suspicions perking up the instant I hear that particular phrase--whether it applies to blacks, whites, Hispanics, gays, feminists and even "so called" intellectuals. ________________ Margaret Young 1027 JKHB English Department Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602-6280 Tel: 801-422-4705 Fax: 801-422-0221 - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 20:17:31 -0700 From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: re: [AML] GLBT Eugene Woodbury writes: I cringe every time I hear a Utah reporter do the politically necessary thing (is it like the White House press office and if you tick off the church spokesman he won't give you the next sit-down interview with a famous GA?), take a deep breath and bore through the whole ChurchofJesusChristofLatterdaySaints appellation. The prosody is atrocious. [snip] ******************************************************************* We could shorten the name The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to simply "Christ's Church" ("Mormon" works great too!). Two syllables. Less than the six syllables in Seventh-Day Adventists; the five syllables in Confucianism, Presbyterian and Jehovah's Witness; the four in Greek Orthodox, Judaism, and Hinduism; or the three in Protestant, Catholic, Methodist, or agnostic and atheist. Two syllables wins out (or ties with Bahai and Shinto). Then again, "gay" is only one syllable. Maybe we could even out the score with something like "Marms" (for Mormons), or "Christ's". Hmm. Travis Manning - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 02:22:10 GMT From: "Jeffrey Needle" Subject: [AML] HARDY, _The Book of Mormon - A Readers Edition_ (Review) Review Title: The Book of Mormon - A Reader's Edition Author: Grant Hardy, Editor Publisher: University of Illinois Press Year Published: August 2003 Number of Pages: 710 Binding: Hardback ISBN: 0-252-02797-3 Price: $39.95 Reviewed by Jeffrey Needle I recently had occasion to re-read my review of Givens' "By the Hand of Mormon," revisiting the issue of major publishers releasing serious academic works on the Book of Mormon. Such works, produced outside of the Mormon academic community, are relatively rare. Consequently, the appearance of a new volume is most welcome. And whereas I did not think Givens accomplished what he set out to do with his book, I think Grant has done admirably well. "The Book of Mormon - A Reader's Edition" is a reprinting of the 1920 text of the Book of Mormon. This particular text, although not used currently by the Church, is the last one released into the public domain, and thus available for publication by others. Opening the book, I found an interesting and helpful volume, designed for the new reader, filled with guidance and direction for both new and seasoned readers. A 23-page introduction gives the reader a brief summary of the story, an account of how the book was translated, the religious significance of the message contained in its pages, and an explanation of how to interpret the footnotes and other typographical conventions. Hardy has created an entirely new set of chapter and section headings, added to the official chapter headings as found in Church editions, explaining to the reader the content of the text and the flow of the story. Unique to his headings are a series of subscripts that help the reader distinguish between the various players who share a name. Nephi(1) is thus distinguishable from Nephi(2). Hardy also introduces interesting elements to the Isaiah segments in 1 and 2 Nephi. For example, he heads up 2 Nephi 26:14-19 as: "The Lehites in the Last Days (Midrash on Isaiah 29:3-5)" with a footnote: "Note that the italicized phrases in verses 14-19 reproduce Isaiah 29:3-5. Most of Isaiah 29, in order, is interspersed in 2 Nephi 26:14-27:35." In other headings, the Isaiah cite is merely referenced. I did not detect how he differentiated between a citation and a midrash, and he gives no explanation of what "midrash" is. I thought this was an unfortunate omission. The text itself is laid out in a single column, in a very readable type size. I opened randomly to several passages, and found the presentation to be pleasing and fluid, a real plus for beginning readers. The appendices constitute the balance of the book, and contain a wealth of information. I was pleasantly surprised to see the variety and extent of these helps. Appendix 1 is titled "Testimonies of Joseph Smith and Other Witnesses." It contains the familiar text of the story told by Joseph Smith with regard to the plates and the translation, but adds further testimonies by Mary Fielding and Emma Smith, giving a wider view of the process and a more gender-balanced presentation than is normally found. Appendix 2 is a "Chronology of the Translation." It begins with the initial appearances of Moroni to the young prophet, takes us through the rigorous process of translating and delivering it to the printer, past the death of Joseph Smith and through the various modifications to the text and the layout, and ends with the 1992 release of several "unofficial editions" of the Book of Mormon, including volume 5 of the Encyclopedia Of Mormonism. Appendix 3 is titled "The Lost Manuscript: Two Documents." It tells the story of the lost 116 pages and the reason why Joseph did not re-translate the plates in question. Appendix 4 concerns "Book of Mormon Plates and Records." It summarizes the various sets of plates that comprise the collection known as the Book of Mormon. Appendix 5 is a lengthy discussion of Book of Mormon poetry, focusing on chiasmus and other poetic forms. Appendix 6 will be of real interest to students of the Book of Mormon. Titled "Significant Changes in the Text," it lists the "50 most significant variants and editions of the Book of Mormon." It compares various printings and editions and shows, interestingly, how the 1982 edition restores changes made in earlier editions. Readers of the 1920 text, the basis for this book, will be guided to the variants as they appear in the currently approved text. Appendix 7 is a catch-all titled "Charts and Maps." They include: Record-keepers of the Book of Mormon (who kept the plates), a graphic showing how all the plates come together, a nice chronology of the narrative of the Book of Mormon, a chart of the leaders of the Nephites and the Lamanites, family trees of the key families in the book, a chart of the Jaredite kings, and maps suggesting a geography for the Book of Mormon. Appendix 8 is an extensive glossary of the names of the characters in the Book of Mormon. Students will really appreciate this handy reference guide. Hardy finishes the volume with a list of suggested reading, for those wishing to explore the subject further. In my opinion, Hardy accomplishes his goal very well. He has set out to give us an accessible, and reasonable, presentation of the Book of Mormon, with sufficient aid for the new reader to help him through the text. In his introduction, he acknowledges that the Book of Mormon can be an intimidating read when approached for the first time. His ingenious and well-placed section headings are a big boost, and he is to be commended for this effort. And, frankly, it was refreshing to see a real study of the Book of Mormon without trying to draw endless moral lessons from the text. I was very happy to see a values-neutral study of the text, honoring the book itself and needing no further application. I suppose I'm in the minority, but I find so many of the Book of Mormon manuals to be tiresome and bloated by a moral agenda. The $40 price tag will no doubt discourage some from purchasing this volume. But those who work with the Book of Mormon on a regular basis should consider this book for their libraries. - ----------------------------------- Jeff Needle jeff.needle@general.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2003 19:59:32 -0700 From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: re: [AML] GLBT Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2003 15:20:45 -0600 From: "Jennifer Vaughn" Subject: RE: [AML] GLBT >among his social circle bi's are generally regarded as gays who haven't = yet fully accepted their >homosexuality or are not ready to let go of = the heterosexual world, Hence the phrase, "Bi now, gay later." - - --Jennifer Breinholt [MOD: I think this may be the worst single pun I have ever witnessed on AML-List...] *************************************** Jennifer, Any relation to Peter Breinholt of folksy music fame? Maybe Peter could write the lyrics [making the Mormon literary connection here] and compose the music for such a topic as being GLBT (no offense to Preston Hunter and others). I think Peter could treat the topic fairly and artistically. Travis Manning - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:41:10 -0500 From: "Thom Duncan, from the Web" Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT - --- Original Message --- >Thom's asssertion: "I think members of the gay community can call themselves >whatever they want.. > >Rex's reply: Who are "they?" Last time I looked, there was no governing body--no >"official" committee. That not only goes for those who would categorize >themselves under the GLBT banner but any other minority. The Gay Community does have its semi-official spokespesons, just as the blacks do. Those are the folks who, like it or not, get to name the community as a whole. Those are the folks I'm talking about. I realize they don't represent the entire community. >I took a cultural diversity class recently. A latino woman was brought in to >talk about the differences in counseling cliens of latin descent. Her >definitions of words like Mexican, Chicano, and Latino were different than what >the textbook said, which was different than what the professor had said, and >different than the latino students in the class said. The latino students' >definitions also differed from each other. > >For any minority, I don't think there is a "they." Speaking as a former journalist, this is a they and you'd better refer to those "theys" the way they want to be referred to. Thom - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 08:57:46 -0600 From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT At 07:51 AM 7/10/03 -0600, you wrote: >Only if their favorite term is reasonable. I refuse to use >"African-American" over "black." Why use seven syllables when one will >do? I read of a guy who refers to his dog and cat as "canine-american" and "feline-american." barbara hume - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:01:04 -0600 From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT At 02:52 PM 7/9/03 -0700, you wrote: >I took a cultural diversity class recently. A latino woman was brought in to >talk about the differences in counseling cliens of latin descent. Her >definitions of words like Mexican, Chicano, and Latino were different than >what >the textbook said, which was different than what the professor had said, and >different than the latino students in the class said. The latino students' >definitions also differed from each other. I recently met an interesting older woman who said she had always referred to herself as "Mexican" until she realized that not only was she not born in Mexico, but her parents were not born in Mexico. In fact, her family has been bilingual Americans for several generations. That didn't stop ignorant kids from tormenting her son as a "Mexican" as though that were some sort of crime. barbara hume - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:25:47 -0600 From: Clark Draney Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT At 07:51 AM 7/10/2003 -0600, D. Michael wrote: >Only if their favorite term is reasonable. I refuse to use >"African-American" over "black." Why use seven syllables when one will >do? I haven't been following this thread much, but D. Michael's refusal has brought me out of lurkdom again. Since you aren't "black" or "African-American" you don't get to choose, do you? (And, btw, neither are any of them "black.") Reasonableness doesn't really enter the discussion if you are talking about respecting the identity of a particular group. >Three initials are reasonable (like LDS), or something that spells a >pronounceable word, but four or more unrepeated consonants gets too hard >to deal with. It just becomes alphabet soup. "Hard to deal with" is precisely the issue, it seems to me. We are not only grappling with complex names, but with complex identity issues as well. The mind-set that refuses to accept a difficult acronym merely because it makes you uncomfortable or because it doesn't roll off your tongue nicely seems to be part of the problem. More than GLBT (or black, or African-American) all these people are PEOPLE. The only reason to identify them otherwise is to mark their difference. There are reasons to do so occasionally, of course, but most of the time they are just folks (no matter how much we may disagree with some of their actions). Clark D. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 09:15:44 -0600 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] League of Utah Writers Conference - -----Original Message----- From: Carolyn Campbell [mailto:carolync@sisna.com] GREAT CONFERENCE COMING!!! Barbara Taylor Bradford has accepted our invitation to be the keynote speaker for the 2003 League Of Utah Writers Roundup on September 12 and 13. Ms. Bradford's credits include A Woman Of Substance and 14 New York Times bestsellers. She has sold fifty-nine million copies worldwide in 88 countries and 38 languages. Seven of her books have been made into TV movies. We are also thrilled to announce that we will have two editors from national publishing houses available for one-on-one consultations. They are Alicia Brooks from St. Martin's Press and Elizabeth Nagle from Little Brown and Company. Alicia's expertise is both fiction and non-fiction and Elizabeth is a non-fiction editor. Our literary agent who is available for consulations in Cricket Pechstein. Please check out our website at luwrite.com for more information, or call Dorothy to register at 964-0861. More info is also available from Carolyn at 943-6571 or Kathy at 561-5296. It's going to be a great conference! - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:21:14 -0700 From: "jana" Subject: [AML] Tips for Writing Technical Articles This forwarded message is from my brother. I was wondering if those of = you out there who write for money (these days my writing is either for = free or for grades), could give him some advice.=20 Thanks!, Jana Remy - ----------------=20 Jana, I have been offered to write technical journal articles for a = publication and I was wondering if you have any advice to give about = rules of the game that I should be aware of from a writers standpoint. = The offer is only verbal at this point. I don't have a contract yet. = They normally do $250 for a 2500 word article. I don't even know if = that is a good rate or not for technical journals of programming = examples. Any advice you could lend about dealing with editors and deadlines and = negotiations would be appreciated. ~john - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 13:25:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Mary Aagard Subject: Re: [AML] GLBT - --- "D. Michael Martindale" wrote: > Only if their favorite term is reasonable. I refuse > to use > "African-American" over "black." Why use seven > syllables when one will > do? > > Three initials are reasonable (like LDS), or > something that spells a > pronounceable word, but four or more unrepeated > consonants gets too hard > to deal with. It just becomes alphabet soup. > > If they wanted to use GLB, I could stand that. Why > throw in transsexual > anyway? A transsexual is nothing more than a gay or > lesbian who feels so > strongly about their sexual orientation that they > make a permanent > physical commitment to the lifestyle. > That is a terribly reductive way of describing transsexuals. And if you're so keen on labels that aren't tongue twisters with too many syllables, why "D. Michael?" Why not "D" or "Mike" or "El?" Mary Aagard __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2003 18:14:50 -0600 From: "Suzanne Brady" Subject: [AML] Re: Tips for Writing Technical Articles Jana, for your brother-- The Editorial Eye for July 2003 has an excellent article entitled "What Freeland Writers Need to Know about Editors." It says, in part, "All an editor wants to know is whether this person will deliver as promised. Will this person provide a well-written manuscript on deadline? . . . Editors place high value on the ability of a freelance to follow direction. . . . Freelancing success isn't complicated or elusive. It's governed by two fundamentals of business: remembering who the customer is, and providing value." The Web address is www.eeicommunications.com/eye/ Email is eye@eeicommunications.com Suzanne Brady - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V2 #102 ******************************