From: owner-beehive-beemers-digest@lists.xmission.com (beehive-beemers-digest) To: beehive-beemers-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: beehive-beemers-digest V1 #125 Reply-To: $SENDER Sender: owner-beehive-beemers-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-beehive-beemers-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk beehive-beemers-digest Wednesday, September 24 2003 Volume 01 : Number 125 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 23:41:42 EDT From: Swan555@aol.com Subject: Re: BB: Think about it first ? ha ha - --part1_b7.3668f4ea.2c9bd4f6_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jeff: I have been out of the action earlier today, but I brought up a motion at the last meeting which was voted on in the affirmative, that a waiver be signed by each and every participant who is also a member of the beehive beemers. DeVern made some valid points in his letter and besides, most rides to a breakfast meeting are not organized and people tend to get there on their own. DeVern can certainly tell you that when he has done the Iron Butt he has signed a waiver and there is a waiver for the 1088 as well. Crit - --part1_b7.3668f4ea.2c9bd4f6_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jeff: I have been out of the action earlier today, but= I brought up a motion at the last meeting which was voted on in the affirma= tive, that a waiver be signed by each and every participant who is also a me= mber of the beehive beemers. DeVern made some valid points in his letter and= besides, most rides to a breakfast meeting are not organized and people ten= d to get there on their own. DeVern can certainly tell you that when he has=20= done the Iron Butt he has signed a waiver and there is a waiver for the 1088= as well.
Crit - --part1_b7.3668f4ea.2c9bd4f6_boundary-- **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 10:36:31 EDT From: IRONHORSMC@aol.com Subject: BB: 13th Annual Park City Oil Bath Ride To All Members, Utah British Bike Club's 13th Annual Park City Oil Bath Ride Saturday Sept. 27, 2002 Meet at CHEZ BETTY RESTAURANT 9:30 AM Left at JAN'S MOUNTAIN OUTFITTERS on the corner of Deer Valley Drive and Park Ave Coffee & Doughnuts provided by CHEZ BETTY RESTAURANT & IRONHORSE M/C This year the ride will take us to Hanna once again, for a wonderful country style Buffet Lunch at the HANNA CAFE Questions, Comments. Tom Kullen 435 649-7169 utahnorton@sisna.com **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:28:35 -0600 From: Jeb Berg Subject: BB: RE: 24 hours Stop and go back and read DeVern's note ending Welcome to America. Just beacuse we had a meeting and voted to not be responsible does in fact not mean a thing, period end of report. If someone decides to sue the club they can for what ever reason they want and we have to pay $$$$ to defend it. - -----Original Message----- From: rick hepner [SMTP:hrixter@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 6:14 PM To: beehive-beemers@xmission.com Subject: BB: 24 hours DeVern & Andy, you both make good points. if I'm not mistaken, at last week's breakfast meeting a motion to require a waiver for participating in this event was made, seconded, and approved by a vote of the members. if that's correct, get out your pens. requiring a waiver for ALL club events sounds absurd, but it might come to that. it wouldn't hurt to have this matter carefully examined by a legal professional - we are not a deep-pockets target. Rick Hepner _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with MSN Messenger 6.0 -- download now! http://www.msnmessenger-download.com/tracking/reach_general **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 22:18:00 -0600 From: Thane Beckstrand Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours At 09:28 PM 9/20/03 -0600, Jeb Berg wrote: >Stop and go back and read DeVern's note ending Welcome to America. Just >beacuse we had a meeting and voted to not be responsible does in fact not >mean a thing, period end of report. If someone decides to sue the club they >can for what ever reason they want and we have to pay $$$$ to defend it. Everyone can relax; the Saddlesore is NOT a club sponsored or sanctioned event. It is an event of personal challenge conforming to IBA guidelines as found on their web site. The fact that certain members of the club have expressed interest in such an event should not be construed as a club endorsement encouraging or requiring participation. Thane **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 06:52:53 -0700 From: "Dan Fazzini Jr." Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours Then why did the "club" make a motion, AND was allowed to vote on the release issue, which I think was a good idea, but if this was to NOT be a club event, then the voting should have been blocked by someone. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Thane Beckstrand Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 9:18 PM To: Jeb Berg; 'rick hepner'; beehive-beemers@xmission.com Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours At 09:28 PM 9/20/03 -0600, Jeb Berg wrote: >Stop and go back and read DeVern's note ending Welcome to America. Just >beacuse we had a meeting and voted to not be responsible does in fact >not mean a thing, period end of report. If someone decides to sue the >club they can for what ever reason they want and we have to pay $$$$ to >defend it. Everyone can relax; the Saddlesore is NOT a club sponsored or sanctioned event. It is an event of personal challenge conforming to IBA guidelines as found on their web site. The fact that certain members of the club have expressed interest in such an event should not be construed as a club endorsement encouraging or requiring participation. Thane **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:04:34 EDT From: Swan555@aol.com Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours - --part1_146.19517dcc.2c9f1802_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it was published in the club newstletter and it has used the club email forwarding system of dessimination of information, etc. That is why I brought up the motion to have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its isn't failsafe, but it would add an additional burden of proof to show that the club was responsible when the idea of this ride was first broached, I suggested not doing it through the club email system, etc. and all of this would have been avoided. Crit - --part1_146.19517dcc.2c9f1802_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it was p= ublished in the club newstletter and it has used the club email forwarding s= ystem of dessimination of information, etc. That is why I brought up the mot= ion to have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its isn't failsafe, but it w= ould add an additional burden of proof to show that the club was responsible= when the idea of this ride was first broached, I suggested not doing it thr= ough the club email system, etc. and all of this would have been avoided. Crit - --part1_146.19517dcc.2c9f1802_boundary-- **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 10:53:36 -0600 From: Thane Beckstrand Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours At 06:52 AM 9/21/03 -0700, you wrote: >Then why did the "club" make a motion, AND was allowed to vote on the >release issue, which I think was a good idea, but if this was to NOT be >a club event, then the voting should have been blocked by someone. Dan... I was not at the meeting raising the issue, but it appears that the original intent was to make it a club event. After talking with Jeff yesterday and in light of the concerns voiced by some, he, Gavin, and I felt it would be more realistic and less controversial to let this event go forward as an individual activity with the routes and dates to be determined by those interested in participating. Perhaps the club needs to develop a policy statement to the effect that the club officers will propose activities in which the individual member can then decide whether he will participate or not at his own discretion and risk. I know that's how it's been done in practice, but perhaps it should be formalized to avoid future misunderstandings, dissension, and liability. Your questions were entirely appropriate and I'm sorry I didn't provide the above in my earlier post. Thane **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 19:42:10 -0600 From: "Bob Mabey" Subject: FW: BB: RE: 24 hours - -----Original Message----- From: Bob Mabey [mailto:rdmabey@sisna.com] Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2003 7:01 PM To: 'Thane Beckstrand' Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours Guys! Isn't there an old saying about "...a tempest in a tea pot"? If someone sues, they'll go after the deep pockets - BMW Motorcycles and the dealer that sold the bike, the tech that worked on it last, etc. The worst that could happen to the club would be forty or fifty k in legal fees to get us dropped from the lawsuit. We could just raise the dues a few bucks for ten or twenty years if that were to happen. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Thane Beckstrand Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2003 10:54 AM To: Dan Fazzini Jr. Cc: beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com; David R. Hartwig; jtstokes@yahoo.com Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours At 06:52 AM 9/21/03 -0700, you wrote: >Then why did the "club" make a motion, AND was allowed to vote on the >release issue, which I think was a good idea, but if this was to NOT be >a club event, then the voting should have been blocked by someone. Dan... I was not at the meeting raising the issue, but it appears that the original intent was to make it a club event. After talking with Jeff yesterday and in light of the concerns voiced by some, he, Gavin, and I felt it would be more realistic and less controversial to let this event go forward as an individual activity with the routes and dates to be determined by those interested in participating. Perhaps the club needs to develop a policy statement to the effect that the club officers will propose activities in which the individual member can then decide whether he will participate or not at his own discretion and risk. I know that's how it's been done in practice, but perhaps it should be formalized to avoid future misunderstandings, dissension, and liability. Your questions were entirely appropriate and I'm sorry I didn't provide the above in my earlier post. Thane **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 19:10:50 -0700 From: "Dan Fazzini Jr." Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours As I assume the club is a registered non-profit, the way I understand it is the most the "club" could be liable for is for it's assets, period. Although through a stretch they could go after individual officers if the were civilly responsible for setting something in motion, like they could probably do anyway if the club wasn't involved. As we do bring to or announce to the membership a host of other activities which motorcycle riders might be interested, but don't make them "club" events, under normal circumstances (of course what is normal), this shouldn't be a problem, although, we don't generally make motions on other non-club events either. All of this may bring a good point about investigating the possibly obtaining some sort of G/L insurance which does protect us against such suits in the future, especially as our annual rally is getting rather large. Dan **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 22:16:12 -0600 From: Gavin Wallace Subject: Fwd: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours - --=====================_276748763==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Jeff will be sending an email to the membership that the event has been cancelled. Any further correspondence with individuals interested in participating in the Saddle Sore 1000 will be done privately and not through the BB email list or newsletter. - -Gavin >From: Swan555@aol.com >Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:04:34 EDT >Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours >To: danjr@fazzini.org, beehive-beemers@xmission.com >X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6015 >X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=8.0 > tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME > version=2.55 >X-Spam-Level: * >X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) >Sender: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com >Reply-To: Swan555@aol.com >X-Virus-Scanned: by phobos.aros.net with amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) > >Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it was published in the club >newstletter and it has used the club email forwarding system of >dessimination of information, etc. That is why I brought up the motion to >have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its isn't failsafe, but it would >add an additional burden of proof to show that the club was responsible >when the idea of this ride was first broached, I suggested not doing it >through the club email system, etc. and all of this would have been avoided. >Crit - --=====================_276748763==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Jeff will be sending an email to the membership that the event has been cancelled.  Any further correspondence with individuals interested in participating in the Saddle Sore 1000 will be done privately and not through the BB email list or newsletter. 

- -Gavin

From: Swan555@aol.com
Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:04:34 EDT
Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours
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Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it was published in the club newstletter and it has used the club email forwarding system of dessimination of information, etc. That is why I brought up the motion to have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its isn't failsafe, but it would add an additional burden of proof to show that the club was responsible when the idea of this ride was first broached, I suggested not doing it through the club email system, etc. and all of this would have been avoided.
Crit

- --=====================_276748763==.ALT-- **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 23:12:58 -0600 From: "DeVern Gerber" Subject: Re: FW: BB: RE: 24 hours Only 40 or 50K?? Shoot, let's just have everyone donate their first- born motorcycle and we'll pay it off in no time! :^) DeVern On 21 Sep 2003 at 19:42, Bob Mabey wrote: > Guys! Isn't there an old saying about "...a tempest in a tea pot"? If > someone sues, they'll go after the deep pockets - BMW Motorcycles and > the dealer that sold the bike, the tech that worked on it last, etc. > The worst that could happen to the club would be forty or fifty k in > legal fees to get us dropped from the lawsuit. We could just raise the > dues a few bucks for ten or twenty years if that were to happen. > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 08:58:02 -0600 From: jebberg@xmission.com Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours In order to answer questions likie this, one needs only attend the meeting. Quoting "Dan Fazzini Jr." : > Then why did the "club" make a motion, AND was allowed to vote on the > release issue, which I think was a good idea, but if this was to NOT be > a club event, then the voting should have been blocked by someone. > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Thane > Beckstrand > Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 9:18 PM > To: Jeb Berg; 'rick hepner'; beehive-beemers@xmission.com > Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours > > > At 09:28 PM 9/20/03 -0600, Jeb Berg wrote: > >Stop and go back and read DeVern's note ending Welcome to America. Just > > >beacuse we had a meeting and voted to not be responsible does in fact > >not mean a thing, period end of report. If someone decides to sue the > >club they can for what ever reason they want and we have to pay $$$$ to > > >defend it. > > Everyone can relax; the Saddlesore is NOT a club sponsored or sanctioned > > event. It is an event of personal challenge conforming to IBA > guidelines > as found on their web site. The fact that certain members of the club > have > expressed interest in such an event should not be construed as a club > endorsement encouraging or requiring participation. > > Thane > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 09:03:18 -0600 From: "Dan Fazzini Jr." Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours Well, excuse me, I was on a bike trip in Oregon at the time! - -----Original Message----- From: jebberg@xmission.com [mailto:jebberg@xmission.com] Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 8:58 AM To: Dan Fazzini Jr. Cc: Beehive Beemers Subject: RE: BB: RE: 24 hours In order to answer questions likie this, one needs only attend the meeting. Quoting "Dan Fazzini Jr." : > Then why did the "club" make a motion, AND was allowed to vote on the > release issue, which I think was a good idea, but if this was to NOT > be a club event, then the voting should have been blocked by someone. > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Thane > Beckstrand > Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 9:18 PM > To: Jeb Berg; 'rick hepner'; beehive-beemers@xmission.com > Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours > > > At 09:28 PM 9/20/03 -0600, Jeb Berg wrote: > >Stop and go back and read DeVern's note ending Welcome to America. > >Just > > >beacuse we had a meeting and voted to not be responsible does in fact > >not mean a thing, period end of report. If someone decides to sue the > >club they can for what ever reason they want and we have to pay $$$$ to > > >defend it. > > Everyone can relax; the Saddlesore is NOT a club sponsored or > sanctioned > > event. It is an event of personal challenge conforming to IBA > guidelines as found on their web site. The fact that certain members > of the club have > expressed interest in such an event should not be construed as a club > endorsement encouraging or requiring participation. > > Thane > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 09:34:13 -0600 From: jebberg@xmission.com Subject: BB: 24 hours Gavin and Jeff - I was not and am not interested in this ride but felt that it was a good oppurtunity for some who were so inclined. At no point did I envision this as having become an underwritten Beehive Beemers event. When I read this note this morning I thought, outstandingly well written note! And I thank you guys. Now hopefully that ends the speculation and controversey and we can get back to enjoying the sport of motorcycling (That is what this is about or did I miss something?) To me, the messages are clear from this long drawn out list of BS over the last days, and taking into account previous diatribes of the past coming from this list: 1. Don't try anything new. 2. Never call for a vote on any motions brought up at a club meeting until the motion has been studied by all members, especially those who never attend any club meetings, as well as a legal staff (to assure that the club never has any cash. This will of course make the filing of a legal suit against a bankrupt club moot. 3. Any discussion concerning any activity involving actually getting on a motorcycle and riding needs to be done in the parking lot after the meeting without any board members in ear shot, out of fear of a lawsuit. 4. Don't write any Stinger articles about upcoming events involving the riding of motorcycles because some lawyer out there might figure out that the Beehive Beemers Motorcycle Club of Utah is in fact a motorcycle club and that its members partake in the sport of riding motorcycles. Perhaps it is time to drop the club membership. Thanks Disenchanted (aka. Jeb Berg) Quoting Gavin Wallace : > Jeff will be sending an email to the membership that the event has been > cancelled. Any further correspondence with individuals interested in > participating in the Saddle Sore 1000 will be done privately and not > through the BB email list or newsletter. > > -Gavin > > >From: Swan555@aol.com > >Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:04:34 EDT > >Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours > >To: danjr@fazzini.org, beehive-beemers@xmission.com > >X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6015 > >X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=8.0 > > tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME > > version=2.55 > >X-Spam-Level: * > >X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) > >Sender: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com > >Reply-To: Swan555@aol.com > >X-Virus-Scanned: by phobos.aros.net with amavisd-milter > (http://amavis.org/) > > > >Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it was published in the > club > >newstletter and it has used the club email forwarding system of > >dessimination of information, etc. That is why I brought up the motion > to > >have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its isn't failsafe, but it > would > >add an additional burden of proof to show that the club was responsible > > >when the idea of this ride was first broached, I suggested not doing it > > >through the club email system, etc. and all of this would have been > avoided. > >Crit > > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 10:07:36 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jeff S." Subject: Re: BB: 24 hours BBers, I completely second Jebs comments in his posting this morning. By proposing this event my intention was to offer a wider range of riding opportunities to meet the needs of a growing club with diverse interests. I did use the club email list to discuss the event and did speak of it at club meetings. I had always assumed that the legal issues were covered as I have organized many rides in the last two years as VP with no demands for a waiver. Are traditional club rides exempt? I will leave it to those with a legal education to tell me where we stand on the liability issue. So it is with deep disappointment that I must cancel this event set for Oct 4th. For those still interested in pursuing this event on their own, with no club involvement, I would encourage them to visit www.ironbutt.com for more information. Sincerely Jeff Stokes Vice-Pres Beehive Beemers MC - --- jebberg@xmission.com wrote: > Gavin and Jeff - I was not and am not interested in > this ride but felt > that it was a good oppurtunity for some who were so > inclined. At no point > did I envision this as having become an underwritten > Beehive Beemers > event. When I read this note this morning I thought, > outstandingly well > written note! And I thank you guys. Now hopefully > that ends the > speculation and controversey and we can get back to > enjoying the sport of > motorcycling (That is what this is about or did I > miss something?) > > To me, the messages are clear from this long drawn > out list of BS over the > last days, and taking into account previous > diatribes of the past coming > from this list: > > 1. Don't try anything new. > 2. Never call for a vote on any motions brought up > at a club meeting until > the motion has been studied by all members, > especially those who never > attend any club meetings, as well as a legal staff > (to assure that the > club never has any cash. This will of course make > the filing of a legal > suit against a bankrupt club moot. > 3. Any discussion concerning any activity involving > actually getting on a > motorcycle and riding needs to be done in the > parking lot after the > meeting without any board members in ear shot, out > of fear of a lawsuit. > 4. Don't write any Stinger articles about upcoming > events involving the > riding of motorcycles because some lawyer out there > might figure out that > the Beehive Beemers Motorcycle Club of Utah is in > fact a motorcycle club > and that its members partake in the sport of riding > motorcycles. > > Perhaps it is time to drop the club membership. > > Thanks > > Disenchanted > > (aka. Jeb Berg) > > Quoting Gavin Wallace : > > > Jeff will be sending an email to the membership > that the event has been > > cancelled. Any further correspondence with > individuals interested in > > participating in the Saddle Sore 1000 will be done > privately and not > > through the BB email list or newsletter. > > > > -Gavin > > > > >From: Swan555@aol.com > > >Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:04:34 EDT > > >Subject: Re: BB: RE: 24 hours > > >To: danjr@fazzini.org, > beehive-beemers@xmission.com > > >X-Mailer: 8.0 for Windows sub 6015 > > >X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=8.0 > > > tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME > > > version=2.55 > > >X-Spam-Level: * > > >X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.55 > (1.174.2.19-2003-05-19-exp) > > >Sender: owner-beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com > > >Reply-To: Swan555@aol.com > > >X-Virus-Scanned: by phobos.aros.net with > amavisd-milter > > (http://amavis.org/) > > > > > >Thane: The Problem with your scenairo is that it > was published in the > > club > > >newstletter and it has used the club email > forwarding system of > > >dessimination of information, etc. That is why I > brought up the motion > > to > > >have a waiver signed, as Jeb pointed out its > isn't failsafe, but it > > would > > >add an additional burden of proof to show that > the club was responsible > > > > >when the idea of this ride was first broached, I > suggested not doing it > > > > >through the club email system, etc. and all of > this would have been > > avoided. > > >Crit > > > > > > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 18:59:11 -0600 From: Thane Beckstrand Subject: Re: BB: 24 hours At 09:34 AM 9/22/03 -0600, jebberg@xmission.com wrote: >Gavin and Jeff - I was not and am not interested in this ride but felt >that it was a good oppurtunity for some who were so inclined. At no point >did I envision this as having become an underwritten Beehive Beemers >event. When I read this note this morning I thought, outstandingly well >written note! And I thank you guys. Now hopefully that ends the >speculation and controversey and we can get back to enjoying the sport of >motorcycling (That is what this is about or did I miss something?) > >To me, the messages are clear from this long drawn out list of BS over the >last days, and taking into account previous diatribes of the past coming >from this list: > >1. Don't try anything new. >2. Never call for a vote on any motions brought up at a club meeting until >the motion has been studied by all members, especially those who never >attend any club meetings, as well as a legal staff (to assure that the >club never has any cash. This will of course make the filing of a legal >suit against a bankrupt club moot. >3. Any discussion concerning any activity involving actually getting on a >motorcycle and riding needs to be done in the parking lot after the >meeting without any board members in ear shot, out of fear of a lawsuit. >4. Don't write any Stinger articles about upcoming events involving the >riding of motorcycles because some lawyer out there might figure out that >the Beehive Beemers Motorcycle Club of Utah is in fact a motorcycle club >and that its members partake in the sport of riding motorcycles. > >Perhaps it is time to drop the club membership. > >Thanks > >Disenchanted > >(aka. Jeb Berg) Jeb... I like what you said. I hope you'll stick around and repeat it once in awhile. I've always felt that a motorcycle club is about riding, and I applaud the efforts of the current administration in coming up with creative suggestion along those lines. Those that don't want to do it are certainly free to express their opinions, and those that do are certainly free to ignore them. I, for one, have been looking forward to doing the SS1001 as proposed by Jeff, and, weather permitting, I plan on doing it 10/4. Regards, Thane **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 09:32:29 -0600 From: Thane Beckstrand Subject: Fwd: Re: BB: 24 hours >X-Authentication-Warning: texas.pop3now.com: nobody set sender to >bklarge@concentric.net using -f >From: bklarge@concentric.net >To: K1Thane@softcom.net >Cc: >Subject: Re: BB: 24 hours >Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 02:46:35 -0600 >X-pstn-levels: (C:92.2131 M:97.3254 P: 0.0031 R:95.9108 S:35.0853 ) >X-pstn-settings: 1 (0.1500:112.5000) Pmcr >X-pstn-addresses: from [57/2] >X-pstn-disposition: quarantine > >Following all of this bs with much amusement now for about 10 days. When >I joined the club 15 or so years ago had someone wanted to undertake such >an event he would have just called a few friends that he felt shared an >interest and gone for it. Now all the talk of lawyers and such shit. I am >sorry but I doubt the club treasury is an inviting target, even for the >most desperate of the ambulance chasers. jmho while roflmao in Europe for >still another week Big John > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 10:29:12 -0600 From: Carlson William Civ OO-ALC/LGVTN Subject: RE: Re: BB: 24 hours Behive Beemers, Can someone out there take me off the Beehive email list. I don't want to listen to or have this nonsense on my PC anymore. William F. Carlson OO-ALC/LGVTN 1F-4, E3 T.O. Mgr DSN 777-6774 - -----Original Message----- From: Thane Beckstrand [mailto:K1Thane@softcom.net] Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 9:32 AM To: beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com Subject: Fwd: Re: BB: 24 hours >X-Authentication-Warning: texas.pop3now.com: nobody set sender to >bklarge@concentric.net using -f >From: bklarge@concentric.net >To: K1Thane@softcom.net >Cc: >Subject: Re: BB: 24 hours >Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 02:46:35 -0600 >X-pstn-levels: (C:92.2131 M:97.3254 P: 0.0031 R:95.9108 S:35.0853 ) >X-pstn-settings: 1 (0.1500:112.5000) Pmcr >X-pstn-addresses: from [57/2] >X-pstn-disposition: quarantine > >Following all of this bs with much amusement now for about 10 days. When >I joined the club 15 or so years ago had someone wanted to undertake such >an event he would have just called a few friends that he felt shared an >interest and gone for it. Now all the talk of lawyers and such shit. I am >sorry but I doubt the club treasury is an inviting target, even for the >most desperate of the ambulance chasers. jmho while roflmao in Europe for >still another week Big John > **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2003 11:05:34 -0700 (PDT) From: DNA Subject: RE: Re: BB: 24 hours - --- Carlson William Civ OO-ALC/LGVTN wrote: > Behive Beemers, > > Can someone out there take me off the Beehive email > list. I don't want to > listen to or have this nonsense on my PC anymore. > > William F. Carlson > OO-ALC/LGVTN > 1F-4, E3 T.O. Mgr > DSN 777-6774 > > Fallow the instructions at this url please. http://www.beehive-beemers.org/mail_list.php > -----Original Message----- > From: Thane Beckstrand [mailto:K1Thane@softcom.net] > Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2003 9:32 AM > To: beehive-beemers@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Fwd: Re: BB: 24 hours > > > > >X-Authentication-Warning: texas.pop3now.com: nobody > set sender to > >bklarge@concentric.net using -f > >From: bklarge@concentric.net > >To: K1Thane@softcom.net > >Cc: > >Subject: Re: BB: 24 hours > >Date: Tue, 23 Sep 2003 02:46:35 -0600 > >X-pstn-levels: (C:92.2131 M:97.3254 P: 0.0031 > R:95.9108 S:35.0853 ) > >X-pstn-settings: 1 (0.1500:112.5000) Pmcr > >X-pstn-addresses: from > [57/2] > >X-pstn-disposition: quarantine > > > >Following all of this bs with much amusement now > for about 10 days. When > >I joined the club 15 or so years ago had someone > wanted to undertake such > >an event he would have just called a few friends > that he felt shared an > >interest and gone for it. Now all the talk of > lawyers and such shit. I am > >sorry but I doubt the club treasury is an inviting > target, even for the > >most desperate of the ambulance chasers. jmho while > roflmao in Europe for > >still another week Big John > > > > > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** > > **************************************************************** > The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List > http://www.beehive-beemers.org > **************************************************************** __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com **************************************************************** The Beehive Beemers Internet Mailing List http://www.beehive-beemers.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------ End of beehive-beemers-digest V1 #125 *************************************