From: owner-buffy-digest@xmission.com (buffy-digest) To: buffy-digest@xmission.com Subject: buffy-digest V1 #400 Reply-To: buffy@xmission.com Sender: owner-buffy-digest@xmission.com Errors-To: owner-buffy-digest@xmission.com Precedence: bulk buffy-digest Wednesday, October 29 1997 Volume 01 : Number 400 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 15:21:48 -0800 From: Nazarian@ORIX.COM Subject: Re: BUFFY: Xena slowly makes her way onto BtVS! > > Can Xena and company's crossover appearances be far behind? Not far if, > we keep on expressing public approval of crossover appearances by casts > of both Xena: Warrior Princess and Buffy. Even as a die hard fan, a crossover, imo, would be ridiculous... I'd like to think that Xena did her crossover by making Girls Just Want to Have Fun- the vampire ep. miss hayse - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 14:20:46 -0800 From: Lisa Rose Subject: Re: BUFFY: Halloween episode At 02:54 PM 10/29/97 -0500, James Bjorkman wrote: >Incidentally, I'm quite flattered that (so far) I've only been attacked >for a couple of minor interpretations in a long and internally consistent >analysis, and that there seems to be some kind of contrary consensus >(which is perfectly valid) only re Willow. OK, how about Xander? You argue that he was symbolically castrated by the arrival of toughgirl Buffy and only in her abeyance can he be fully realized as a feminist stereotype of a male brute (is that a fair interpretation?). But IMO, he and Jesse were castrated and belittled by the cruel scorn of Cordy (a woman you admire) and her elite clique long before Buffy arrived in Sunnydale. If anything, Buffy's arrival, which triggered his becoming a demon fighter, gave him a new aura of power that Cordy is now coming to appreciate. Sure, hanging around the Slayer has its downside. She humiliates him by scaring off the bully harassing him at the coke machine (while he was defending her honor, no less). But this is not just a gender issue, it's an issue of fighting one's own battles. He would have been humiliated if an older brother or some other male student had helped him as well. And just to further the idea that Buffy's influence on his life is a complicated one, he benefits in some ways by her temporary "disappearance" as well. He is able to achieve closure with the bully (even if Janus hadn't reduced him to a macho stereotype, those two weren't going to resolve their little problem by talking it out). And he racks up more points with Cordelia. But (as you hinted) this also comes at the expense of his greater awareness and intelligence. I don't think this adds up to the supposedly feminist dichotomous construct of a zero-sum game between Buffy and Xander (ie, her feminist loss is his brutish gain and visa-versa). Her presence in his life adds and detracts from it, and her absence does the same. Personally, I don't see a clear and consistent feminist ethos or dogma in any of that. Lisa - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 14:38:14 -0800 (PST) From: Sonja Marie Subject: BUFFY: Website Update - New GASPers Hi all, I have added more New GASPers to the GASPer Home Page at: http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/7728/gaspers.html They are denoted by "NEW" There are also pictures of Anthony as "Dr. Frank-N-Furter" From a stage production of "Rocky Horror Show"!!!!!! If you wish to join the GASPers aka the official Keepers of Giles' stuff, please email me PRIVATELY and I'll send you the info. Sonja Marie - The White Rose @--'->-- http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/sonja.html Co-Pres. of the Jeff Fahey IFC - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/fahey.html Paul Wylie Fan Pages - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/pwylie/pwylie.html Owner of the Jeff Fahey, Paul Wylie, Anthony S. Head & Buffy-Beta Lists Pres. of Giles Appreciation Society Panters -GASP!- Keeper of Giles Coats&Ties "Hi, Sonja, it's uh, Tony Head.." Anthony Stewart Head (Giles-BTVS) to Me! - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 17:54:39 -0500 (EST) From: Amanda Subject: Re: BUFFY: Halloween > BTW, it's always so funny seeing Angel in a different garb than his usual > jacket and white shirt, but in this episode, when we first see him at the > Bronze, I swear, I thought he was wearing a pajama top! The light blue Actually, for the first time it didn't bother me that he was in a different kind of clothing. The first time was jarring but this time it looked kind of natural. I wouldn't rant and rave the way some of us (and me) did when he wore those J Crew duds at the begiining of this season. PoizonIvy: Vampire Kisser Keeper of Xander's Wardrobe Keeper of Buffy, Willow, and Xander's Talent Show Togas Keeper of Ampata's Mummy Seal Proud NOSer WL(SP)/Spikette Member of the DC/East Coast Buffy Crew FOK! - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 18:13:02 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Huff Subject: Re: BUFFY: Halloween episode > issue, it's an issue of fighting one's own battles. He would > have been humiliated if an older brother or some other male > student had helped him as well. Yes, but not nearly to the same degree. It's been 20 years since I graduated, but from what I hear high schools are still in many ways bastions of old social mores. Being helped would be OK. Having someone do it for you is bad. Having _Buffy_ ... diminuitive, social-outcast Buffy ... do the whole thing would be remembered until graduation. Robert Huff - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 15:10:00 -0800 From: "Mennell, Mathes H Lt." Subject: Re: BUFFY: Xena slowly makes her way onto BtVS! >>...........Xena and Buffy No. < Subject: BUFFY: The Vampire Chronicles For anyone interested, as my tribute to Halloween, I've constructed a site dedicated to researching the various historical and mythological references made in the show that translate into real life. It's entitled "Buffy: The Vampire Chronicles," and is available at http://members.tripod.com/~Greyson/Buffy/ I'm looking for people to contribute articles now, so all you researchers break out your mythology books and start typing. The guidelines for submissions are listed on the page. The reward for getting an article published? Why, your own self-satisfaction, of course. What, that's not enough? Okay, everyone who has an article posted gets a graphic for their homepage and an addition to their .sig line here. What are appropriate articles? The discussion on the historical occurences of Moloch would be a good one. I'm working on a piece on St. Vigius. Things along those lines. I'm also working on some lists that everyone can help with. I'm building a list of texts mentioned or shown on the show (and whether they really exist) and a list of occult entities (types and specific names) on the show and their current status. Feel free to stop by and give the site a look, and I encourage everyone to start working on articles. I also welcome feedback on the site. P.S. - Please don't get irritated at the java prompt that comes up. My internet company is testing new methods of displaying its adds, and although we've told them this one is stupid, they haven't changed it yet. Greyson Keeper of Buffy's Dresser Drawer of Weapons Keeper of Willow's Aspirin Assistant Professor: The Buffy Research Team Greyson@tripod.net - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 18:13:00 -0500 From: John Nestoriak Subject: Re: BUFFY: Xena slowly makes her way onto BtVS! Mike Kim wrote: > And there we go! Xena gets her first official mention on BtVS. A FIRST > OFFICIAL acknowledgement and courtesy recognition of the Xena: Warrior > Princess series, its popularity and its desirable connection to Buffy. > Can Xena and company's crossover appearances be far behind? Actually I think it sort of makes a cross-over less likely (I don't really want it so good for me :). My logic is that Xena was referenced as a TV character in the Buffyverse. Ok it wasn't explicit but the throwaway line like that seems to indicate that Xena is a fictional character in the Buffyverse and not a real person. I think its for this reason that most TV shows avoid talking about TV. If someone is a fictional character in the Buffyverse it'd be ridiculous to have them appear as a "real person" in the same universe. - -- John Nestoriak * "It's the non-relationship drink Software Engineer * of choice. It's not a date, it's The Telephone Connection * a caffeinated beverage." jnestoriak@telecnnct.com * - Willow on Coffee - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 16:17:50 -0800 From: Nazarian@ORIX.COM Subject: BUFFY: sarah interview- NEW http://www.mrshowbiz.com/interviews/378_1.html - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 18:28:38 -0500 (EST) From: cn2759@coastalnet.com (JW) Subject: BUFFY: Halloween Ep (spoilers) Below contains comments on the Buffy's Halloween episode. Its a little delayed because of an unfortunate list bump. Contains Spoiler Material Last Warning The opening was neat with Spike using a camcorder to spy on Buffy, He is not your Father's Vampire. Another Vamp with solid fighting skills. What happens between RB and this episode since Buffy and Angel have a date. So after a round of slayage Buffy didn't look good enough to be seen in public, "yeah, in the Bizzaro world". I think the make up people will have to do a much better job than last night for us to buy that. She was still a knock-out. I know there are lots of Dru fans, but I wish that Buffy would just stake her. "do you love my insides", She's just freaking me out! After watching Puppet Show for the first time I hoped we might see Snyder press are fearless threesome into another job, and he did. "throwing eggs, keying cars, bobbing for apples", bobbing for apples?, get off that outlaw train. Sweet to see Xander try and stand up for Buffy, just to get embarassed, its a guy thing. "Boy's are so fragile" LOL. You would think Buffy learned her lesson in RB but there she is trying to lie and trick Giles again. Loved the Nervous look on Willow's face during the whole Diary stealing scene. Funny, Cordelia still doesn't figure out that Angel is a vampire, "Care Bear with fangs". Cordy's line about "I'm the slayer" sounded a bit goofy, even if it did hurt Buffy. Loved the idea about the costumes coming to life, neat idea. I would think the writer got headaches trying to decide what costume to put on who. SMG was funny playing the ditzy noble woman, then she could just turn it around and make you afraid for her. "Are you feeble in some way"lol. I was real disappointed that we didn't see Cordelia become a cat. It was nice to Xander in the Gung-ho role, cheering as he beat up pirate-boy. Was afraid we wouldn't get to see Willow under her Sheet, WOW! Willow you go girl. Giles's reaction to her when she comes out of the wall was great, and "ghost of what" LOL. Secrets of Giles's past. "The Ripper" what does that mean? After decking Frat boy in RB you know he's tough. Its just that most directors and writers have used him as comic relief. But he is a watcher, and the feeling about BVS watcher's are that they are a group trained for the supernatural. It is logical to assume that Giles was tops among the watchers, thus given the honor and responsibility of becoming mentor to the Slayer. He's always talking about hand-to - -hand combat and tactics. His kicking Ethan reminded me a little of Buffy's Cross torture in WSWB. I guess we can look forward to future appearences by Ethan. And more secrets of Giles's past. Where was Angel in the fight with Spike, he just gets taken and held. I thought he was suppose to be so tough. I think its offical that Spike's a wuss, he's runs away from Buffy after the fight. Sure she's helpless, and he'll kill her, but first sign of trouble and he runs. Wished Buffy had pressed her advantage and taken him out, (Yes I know he has to stay around) to bad the pole was metal and not wood. Liked that Willow decided to dump the sheet and go with what she had on after returning to her body. Do something with Oz or kill him. I felt sorry for Xander when told Cordy " give it up Cordy nobody's coming between them two, I know". It was obvious he still loves Buffy, but has accepted that she will never love him. I liked this episode a lot, lots of action, comedy, and plot twists. The premise was I thought very original. The fact that Halloween is suppose to be a quiet night was great, its the complete opposite of what you would expect to find. "that whacky Joss, that's why we love him, he just keeps you guessing". Interesting the look into Giles's past. So he's called the "Ripper", Could he be the "Jack the Ripper". I don't think its likely but who knows. Its of course a easy take on his name Rupert. Was Ethan a former watcher who starting toying with the "dark side" and Giles' had to stop. Perhaps Giles was involved in evil with Ethan only to then betray him or at least change sides, much like Angel's past. I guess we will have to wait and see, what Joss gives us. I'm going to guess that both Giles and Ethan were Jr. Watchers (for lack of a better term), and Ethan toyed with some evil things, and Giles pretended to join him only to betray him. But in earning his trust, Giles did some questionable things. Why did Willow retain her memory? I guess she did because she became a ghost of herself, while the others were playing roles of different people. How could the vamp enter Buffy's house? Guess, He was a changed student, so the normal rules didn't apply. Hold the phone, Cordy, in IMG was dating Devon, then in RB the frat boy, know she's back with Devon, only to be drooling all over Angel. Cordy, you Bitca you. Kudos to the whole cast, particularly SMG, ASH, Nick and Alyson for super performances. BL, "She couldn't have come dressed as Xena".ROTLOL. JW GASP: Keeper of "The Ripper" nickname "Babe, I can live with that" - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 15:40:00 -0800 From: "Mennell, Mathes H Lt." Subject: Re: BUFFY: Halloween episode >>Being helped would be OK. Having someone do it for you is bad. Having _Buffy_ ... diminuitive, social-outcast Buffy ... do the whole thing would be remembered until graduation. True, but the Cro-magnon man will feel much worse than X will, he got wailed by that same outcast. - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 18:56:51 -0500 (EST) From: Monet Subject: BUFFY: The Courage Factor I read some of the posts about who's braver than who in the show. Yeah, I agree Xander is pretty dang brave under his oaffish facade, but really and truly, ALL of the characters have courage that equals out to each other. Sure Xander and Willow are brave because they put their lives on the line for the Slayer, knowing they have none of her supernatural poweress to protect them. I mean, Xander has done brave things to help Buffy or Willow, even Cordelia. But we can't say he braver than Buffy herself because Buffy fights for her friends AND all of Sunnydale, people she has never met and people who don't care about her. I think she is the Chosen One because courage has always been in her, not created jsut because she has these Slayer powers. She's had to deal with it and came out okay. And Xander and Willow (and Giles, too) are courageous in their own sense, sticking by her side, giving her support when she was in shambles, forgiving her for what she did--things friends are made of. They also are another source of courage because they do things everyday people wouldn't do and still have a funny quip to say at the end. To laugh in the face of danger is a courageous thing on its own and they ALL have the ability. So whether Slayer or not, I think they are all the bravest people in Sunnydale. G :) ==================================================================== "This being Sunnydale and all, I guess we can rule out something good." -Willow (Buffy, the Vampire Slayer) ==================================================================== monet@arches.uga.edu - - ------------------------------ End of buffy-digest V1 #400 ***************************