From: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com (buffy-digest) To: buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: buffy-digest V2 #52 Reply-To: buffy@xmission.com Sender: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk buffy-digest Wednesday, January 21 1998 Volume 02 : Number 052 In this issue: Re: BUFFY: Lotsa new Buffy viewers BUFFY: Surprise/Innocence Re: BUFFY: Willow and Xander, huh? BUFFY: Ratings for Innocence!!! BUFFY: SNL? BUFFY: my thoughts on the 2 parter Re: BUFFY: Too many thoughts (all about Innocence! SPOILERS) Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring BUFFY: Re: buffy-digest V2 #51 BUFFY: quotes Re: BUFFY: Too many thoughts (all about Innocence! SPOILERS) BUFFY: emotional BUFFY: BAD Angel! BAD! BAD! No biscuit! BUFFY: ASH chat transcript (sort of) BUFFY: THE DAVID (ANGEL) INTERVIEW ON AOL BUFFY: Re: BUFFY Re: BUFFY: What about Jenny? BUFFY: Oz's car Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring Subject: BUFFY: How Can Angel Be Good Again?.... Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring BUFFY: Re: BUFFY Angel + Buffy? BUFFY: Surprise/Innocence Re: BUFFY: Party of Fiends See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the buffy or buffy-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 21:55:33 -0500 From: Dethking Subject: Re: BUFFY: Lotsa new Buffy viewers Yes!!!! I noticed that a lot...I heard people talking about BtVS that I have never heard talking about it before. I wanted to join in the conversation but i couldn't becasue I didn;t know them. But I agree...seems like the move helped the show in a very big way!! - -Gregg Dethking@hunterdon.csnet.net At 09:47 PM 1/21/98 -0500, you wrote: >Just wondering if anyone else noticed more people talking about BtVS >today than before. A lot of kids in school would start talking about >Dawson's Creek, then end up on BtVS....looks like the move was one of >the better things for the show.... > Brian > net_jedi@geocities.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 21:53:08 From: Theodore Jay Miller Subject: BUFFY: Surprise/Innocence At 05:13 PM 1/21/98 EST, jillium5 wrote: >I think we'll see the evil angel for a while it will create tension. And I think >what's going to happen once he gets his soul back is he will be so guilty >for all that he did and said to buffy he won't be able to face her. It will take >a long time for their relationship to heal. How about a total irony plotline: Angel eventually gets his soul restored, and wants Buffy back. However, because of the whole evil Angel period, Buffy is no longer interested in Angel; she's realized she wants a nice ordinary guy, Xander, rather than the dark mysterious Angel. Xander, however, is no longer interested in Buffy; after his relationship with Cordelia crashed and burned, he realized who he truly loved: Willow. Willow, however, is no longer interested in Xander, since she's totally in love with Oz. At 03:09 PM 1/21/98 -0800, Lisa Rose wrote: >Another weird Buffy & Dru parallel (besides their mutual >attraction to Angel), are we to believe they both have >roughly the same birthday?! And another parallel: after What's My Line 2, each was nursing her vampire boyfriend back to health (Buffy/Angel in "Ted", and Dru/Spike with the whole wheelchair bit) Theodore Jay Miller tedjmill@mindspring.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 21:32:28 EST From: BBallGrrl4 Subject: Re: BUFFY: Willow and Xander, huh? In a message dated 98-01-21 19:03:47 EST, you write: << Needless to say I was very upset. How did she do it? I got alot of the info from a friend who loves Buffy too, but I guess she left it out. >> Willow, very angry and distressed at seeing Xander and Cordy make out, goes off on him by saying he should be ashamed that he is with Cordelia, whom they both were supposed to hate.(Xander was the treasurer of their little "we hate Cordy fan club") Anyways, Xander tells her that they were just kissing and it meant nothing and Willow replies, "No, it just means you'd rather be with someone you hate than be with me." ~Caroline - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 21:45:06 EST From: RayneFire Subject: BUFFY: Ratings for Innocence!!! WB Hits Record With Tuesday Slate By Tom Bierbaum NEW YORK (Variety) - The WB network has launched its Tuesday lineup in a big way, with the highest nightlong rating in its history. Buffy the Vampire Slayer bit into a 5.2 rating, 8 share -- the best single- program rating ever for WB -- and Dawson's Creek followed with a 4.8-7, which matched the third-best WB rating ever. For the night, WB averaged a record 5.0-8, breaking the old mark of 4.4-7 equaled the night before, Jan. 19, and first achieved Oct. 9, 1996, when the Big Three preempted regular programming for the vice presidential debate. Tuesday also brought WB records in teens and the adult, men and women demos in the 18-34 and 18-49 categories. With a huge promotional push behind it, big things were expected of the new WB Tuesday schedule, and some industry speculation has the lineup actually falling short of WB projections, but a weblet spokesman said the new lineup's 5.0 rating shattered the guarantee made to advertisers of a 3.8 rating. Buffy played the key role in the two consecutive nights of WB records. The netlet made successful use of a two-part Buffy to woo viewers in record numbers from the show's old Monday timeslot to its new home on Tuesday, where WB is trying to establish a fourth night of primetime programming. Dawson's failed to hold the entire Buffy lead-in, a surprising development given the buzz surrounding the teen soap, perhaps the most eagerly anticipated new show in the history of either WB or UPN. Still, Dawson's managed an awesome 11.3-36 with its target audience, female teens. That tops, for example, results for last week's episodes of Beverly Hills, 90210 and Party of Five, which scored, respectively, a 9.8-32 and 8.8-31 among female teens. WB clobbered UPN's special anti-WB-tailored Tuesday competition, Real Vampires - -- Exposed! (2.1-3) and Alien Abduction (2.3-4) and also beat out CBS in a variety of important demos, including teens and adults, men and women in the 18-34 and 18-49 breakouts. The hot Tuesday start suggests WB could accomplish something virtually never seen before: add a night of programming to a schedule without dragging down the network's overall ratings. Keys now will be to hold that Tuesday lineup's inevitable post-premiere falloff to a minimum and hope the new Monday series Three, which replaces Buffy on that night, can hold most of the audience Buffy has staked out for WB. The Tuesday households race went to NBC and its 11.0-18, but ABC slipped ahead in adults 18-49 with a 6.8-18. WB's 18-49 average was a 2.9-8, which eclipsed the previous night's record 2.8-7. Each household rating point represents an estimated 980,000 homes, or 1% of the country's TV homes. Each adults 18-49 rating point reps 1.23 million viewers, 1% of the U.S. total. A share is the same sort of percentage, except it's measured against only the homes or viewers watching TV during the timeslot involved. Reuters/Variety 20:21 01-21-98 Copyright 1998 Reuters Limited. All rights reserved. Republication or redistribution of Reuters content, including by framing or similiar means, is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Reuters. Reuters shall not be liable for any errors or delays in the content, or for any actions taken in reliance thereon. All active hyperlinks have been inserted by AOL. - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:12:20 +1100 From: "jamiec" Subject: BUFFY: SNL? Can anyone tell me what SNL stands for? Jamie jamiec@felglow.com.au - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 21:10:24 -0600 From: jennifer hanlon Subject: BUFFY: my thoughts on the 2 parter I've seen a few thoughts not addressed unless I was scrolling too fast! 1) Love Angelus! I do miss Angel, but what future did he have with Buffy? I think sooner or later, the relationship would have ended (as do many high school loves). And I was getting tired of him saving/helping Buffy so often. Hey, she's the slayer, she's tough, and she's got enough slayerettes!! 2) As for Angelus dissin' on Buffy - he ain't Angel anymore! The soul has left the building. I realize Buffy is hurting, but except for Angel being a vamp, her experience isn't much different from many young people who lose their virginity to someone who says "i love you" but ends up leaving before you wake up. 3) As for the curse - I think it is quite fitting the Angel would become Angelus again sooner or later. Now that his soul is gone and the demon has reclaimed the body, think about the eternal agony for Angel's soul. He has to live (in heaven or wherever you believe souls go) forever watching/knowing that his body is tormenting his love. Talk about eternal darnation!! imho, jclive GASPer Keeper of Giles' Inability to make smooth transitions in conversations - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 19:21:37 PST From: "Black Fire" Subject: Re: BUFFY: Too many thoughts (all about Innocence! SPOILERS) >See, here's a major point: from her point of view, and from her clan's, >it would be a bad thing for Angel to be happy. They want him to suffer. >Therefore, the original people decided, "Hey, if he gets to start >_liking_ this curse, he'll be happy, we'll be thwarted, and that ain't >our point here." So, they said, "When (If) he ever gets content, the >curse will begone, and the remaining people (from the clan) will deal >with it then" It's a good argument. However, I fail to see where the clan would actually WANT the bad Angel to be turned loose on the world. They could have made the curse permanent. So he eventually decides that having his soul back isn't such a bad thing. Vengeance thing be damned, wouldn't a happy Angel be better than a monster? The Black Fire ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 19:24:25 PST From: "Black Fire" Subject: Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring >Won't happen, she gave the ring back to him, after the whole "I'll call >you, don't call me" scene She did? I thought she still had it after that scene. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 20:00:32 -0500 From: "Zelda (K)ordelia Lee" Subject: BUFFY: Re: buffy-digest V2 #51 > "Oh cool, his van is like they have in > England, with the wheel on the right side." Yet now the wheel is > *definitely* on the regular side. So was I dreaming while watching > Halloween a few gazillion times? As Giles is so fond of reminding us: "Well, it *is* the Hellmouth!" (neeneeneenoo neeneeneenoo neeneeneenoo...) - -- ZK (next week on Buffy: Oz's steering wheel goes berserk and attempts to take over Sunnydale Used Cars) zklee@huskynet.com The (K)lara Barton of Highla-L (Retired) Keeper of the Stick To Put Under Rockers So They Go Kathump Kathump Member, Slightly Dowdy Overweight Leather-Clad Wanton Computer Babes With Math Degrees - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:56:25 EST From: Jillium5 Subject: BUFFY: quotes I can't wait to get the quotes for this episode, i live for them Thank you Quote Person, keep up the good work - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:07:35 -0600 (CST) From: Theda Bara Subject: Re: BUFFY: Too many thoughts (all about Innocence! SPOILERS) On Wed, 21 Jan 1998 lrous@juno.com wrote: > I don't see any reason for Giles to be mad at Jenny. I didn't think that he was - they told Jenny to get out more I think for her own safety. Theda Bara vampirew@acs.stritch.edu - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 20:13:02 PST From: "Gary Brain ShawPayton" Subject: BUFFY: emotional The show was so emotional. I cried, you know. I am a man, but I admit that. Anyways, poor Buffy, she lost her love, and she looked so poor in the scene where her moms lit her birthday cake. I feel so sorry for her. I cried along with her too. WEST COAST REPRESENT! Gary Brain ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 20:43:12 -0500 From: "Zelda (K)ordelia Lee" Subject: BUFFY: BAD Angel! BAD! BAD! No biscuit! > >I don't like traditional "woman has sex and must be punished" > >storylines. > An alternate interpretation might be a "woman with abusive boyfriend" > storyline. a guy who seemed nice, but abusive to her JW seems to take a snippet of "teen angst" - the things that we fear the most in "the best years of our lives" . He then turns it sideways, gives it a little twist - not too much, and stretches it slightly, until it slides over the edge and becomes horror, without losing its original identity as a snippet of teen angst. Nightmares was a beautiful example. Who *hasn't* had the "can't find the classroom; haven't gone to class since the first day and the big test is today" dream? And they continue for *years* after you get out of school, for some people. This one, to me, is a reflection that for a girl to have sex is not acceptable, and risky. The worst possible thing (apart from STD's and pregnancy) that can happen, is that the boy essentially writes that it happened on the wall the next day for everyone to see, and makes fun of her behind her back, or even to her face. I didn't see it as politics - JW wasn't taking a stand one way or another. He was stretching that snippet of "teen angst". >(and he had a drinking problem, so to speak). LOL! - -- ZK (subject line heartlessly plagerized from Joanne. I liked it.) zklee@huskynet.com The (K)lara Barton of Highla-L (Retired) Keeper of the Stick To Put Under Rockers So They Go Kathump Kathump Member, Slightly Dowdy Overweight Leather-Clad Wanton Computer Babes With Math Degrees - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 23:19:17 -0500 (EST) From: Betsy Vera Subject: BUFFY: ASH chat transcript (sort of) I've made a sort of transcript out of a rough cut-and-paste of the ASH chat on www.realhollywood.com on January 21, 1998. The Real Audio transcript will be available on the 22nd, I hope, at http://www.universalstudios.com/unichat.30/newchat/transcripts/ To listen to the real audio transcript, you'll need Real Audio Player 4.0 or greater. You can download that from www.real.com (or something like that). My rough transcript is at http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bentley/ash-chat.html. (Thanks, kt, for double-checking it me for). (If the above doesn't make sense, e-mail me. I'm very tired tonight). Cheers, Betsy -- bentley@umich.edu - NEW URL: http://bentley.simplenet.com "Just one more comment: Dru is a NatPacker! Ahahahahaha!!!!" - Lizbet - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:58:00 EST From: NICOLEDEN Subject: BUFFY: THE DAVID (ANGEL) INTERVIEW ON AOL THIS WAS THE INTERVIEW WITH DAVID OTHERWISE KNOWN AS ANGEL READ ON IF YOU CARE TO SEE WHAT HE HAD TO SAY! Question: David, I think you are a really great actor. When did you start acting? EADavid B: My father was in tv and I was always around tv sets. I saw Yul Brenner when I was 7 in The King and I and that really moved me and I knew then I wanted to be an actor. Question: I think Alyson Hannigan is so cool. What's it like working with her? And also, why does Willow always get in trouble in all the episodes? EADavid B: Allison is great. She is just as fun on the set as she is off the set. She is adorable. She loves fuzzy sweaters, its like her thing. She is full of life, she's always jumping around doing goofy things. Question: How old are you? EADavid B: I'm 18! EADavid B: No I'm 27 Question: Hi David. My name is Carrie. How's Bertha Blue doing? EADavid B: Bertha Blue? She's doin' great. She's having a blast. She's a really unique dog. One ear goes up and one ear goes down. Question: What is your idea of a dream girl for you? EADavid B: Intelligence is a key factor. Someone I can have a great conversation with. It's more about the inside than the outside. Question: do you like playing good angel or evil angel? EADavid B: I really enjoy playing his evil side. Not considerably long, but I don't know. I'm just enjoying playing him now. Question: Just read that Buffy does most of her own kicks, how about in the scene when you are fighting her, did you do any of yours? EADavid B: Oh yeah, I can get my leg up there! No, I have a great stunt guy. I do some stunts, but I only do about 15% of the stunts. Question: What's your favorite episode of BTVS? EADavid B: I like the Halloween episode that we just did. Angel was just looking in, confused. Everyone became their costumes. Question: Mr. Boreanaz - Is it difficult to detach yourself from the scenes in which Sarah breaks down in desperation during the final part? EADavid B: Yeah, it's hard. That's something that's difficult to do. It takes a lot of energy out of you. There were some tears. But you have to understand that you're doing a job. I guess I was doing a good job, so I'd have to say yes. Question: Can you tell us anything about what will happen to you or Angel? EADavid B: I can't give away all the good secrets. Question: How long were you aware that Angel was going to lose his soul?> EADavid B: I had a sense that he was going to be evil, so I had some insight into it. It takes eight days to shoot one episode, because you have to mix in all the special effects. And with all the make-up, and the locations, it's very consumming. Question: Hi David, I love the way you portray Angel. What do you like most about your character on "Buffy?" EADavid B: There are a lot of things I like about him. I'm liking his wardrobe more now that he's evil. I like his mysteriousness. He was trapped for a while, but now he's free. Question: was that you getting kicked in the groin last night or do you have a stunt double for that? EADavid B: That was very painful. Question: Now that you have been good and evil, what other sides of his personality do you want to bring out? EADavid B: I think his goofy side. It would great to see his whacky side.It would be fun to get into his personality a little bit more. To follow his life on the lighter side would be interesting. Question: Are you surprised by your sudden appearance as a sex symbol? EADavid B: That's kind of funny and wierd. My parents made me, so thank you so much for making me a sex symbol. Good egg. Good sperm. I kind of laugh at that stuff. It's more about the work for me. Question: what kind of music do you like? EADavid B: I like all kinds of music except techno music. I can't deal with the monotony. I love classic rock. I love the Stones, the Dead, Fleetwood Mac, and Pink Floyd. And I really like the blues too. Muddy Waters. I love rap and there is some good country. But you have to go to a country bar to really experience it. Question: Who is your idol? Is there anyone you have ever looked up to that got you into the business? EADavid B: It would have to be my father since he was in the entertainment business. EADavid B: He's the person I idolize. Not only because of his work, but because of how kind he is. It's challenging to be kind every day. My father is really important to me. Question: How do I get an autograph? EADavid B: You can get an autograph if you write the WB studio. And I do respond to my fan mail. I really appreciate my fans. They make the show happen. We love that the show has a cult following. Question: David, have you had any job offers since starting Buffy? EADavid B: I've had some interests, some people calling. It's getting interesting. Question: Will Buffy and Angel get back together? EADavid B: I never know. That could happen.But you just never know. You gotta watch. EAMC Host: David, thank you for joining us tonight here on the Entertainment Asylum I guess the only way we are going to find out what will happen with Angel and Buffy is to watch the show EADavid B: Thank you. I had a wonderful time. I'll try to become internet savvy in the future! WELL THATS IT HOPE YOU LIKE THE INTERVIEW NICOLE (THE NEXT SLAYER) - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 23:08:39 EST From: TIGGERGW Subject: BUFFY: Re: BUFFY Ok, here's my two cents....I've rewound and watched this episode 5 times and i don't get the fact that if Spike and Dru can have a loving relationship and still be vampires, then why cant buffy and Angel still be together, but the exception being he's an evil Angel....doesn't mean that he can't still love her...and if he doesn't still love her, then why did he say "to kill her you have to love her"...if he doesn't love her anymore, then he can't kill her....just my opinion... - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 20:24:58 -0800 From: Lisa Rose Subject: Re: BUFFY: What about Jenny? Re: Did Jenny betray Buffy (or anyone else)? At 11:51 AM 1/21/98 -0500, sah wrote: >I agree, this wasn't really a betrayal. In a way, I can understand Giles >being upset with her (it's a neat reversal of their earlier situation). >But I still maintain she didn't do anything wrong except possibly show poor >judgement. I'm of the camp that they have every right to be very upset with her, and to let her know it right now, but that she is ultimately still an honorable person, worthy of their trust again, down the road, after they've worked it through it and forgiven her. >Someone pointed out earlier that Jenny betrayed them by not revealing her >secret. Well, Buffy and Giles and the Slayerettes have secrets too, that >they have to keep from people very important to them. I'm thinking of >Joyce in particular. Yeah, but the Slayerettes seem to dole out secrets on a "need to know" basis. For whatever reason, they've figured Joyce shouldn't know right now, perhaps for her own good. Jenny, on the other hand, deliberately infiltrated Buffy & Co. with an agenda to harm Buffy & Angel's relationship (and she didn't know she was doing it to prevent a monster from being unleashed either). She was an agent, a plant. The people she was keeping secrets from were also the targets of her activities, and supposedly her friends too. That's a bit different from the others. At this point Giles might fear that she only feigned affection for him to get at Buffy (although I suspect her feelings for him were real). And the other Slayerettes might feel she was their pal only to position herself to hurt one of them. She wasn't dragged in by circumstances like the others, even though she pretended she was. She sought the gang out, with a hidden agenda. There's a trust issue there. >Also, Giles was pretty reluctant to talk about the >situation with Ethan when it first cropped up, and certainly never >mentioned it until it came to a head. I don't think he ever mentioned >that he knew Ethan, but I could be wrong about that. But he may have been trying to convince himself that it was the past, private, irrelevant, didn't concern the others; he could handle it himself. There is no way Jenny could argue that her plans for Buffy and Angel weren't of direct concern to them. >All I'm saying is that Jenny didn't do anything in these episodes that >all the other characters haven't done as well. Given the context, I really think her actions have different implications than those of the others. >IMO Jenny is *not* responsible for what happened to Angel Yeah, agreed. In fact, I think if she'd known what was going to happen, she'd have gone to Buffy with a warning, regardless of her family's desires. She was very conflicted about her family's goal, and about what it required her to do to these people she was probably coming to care about, imho. Your mileage may vary, Lisa - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 23:12:55 EST From: SnOwBaLL30 Subject: BUFFY: Oz's car > "Oh cool, his van is like they have in > England, with the wheel on the right side." Yet now the wheel is > *definitely* on the regular side. So was I dreaming while watching > Halloween a few gazillion times? I think it was a different van...teh one in halloweeen was all psychedelic...it was all painted colorful..this one was just blue. - -Diane - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:42:39 -0600 (CST) From: Theda Bara Subject: Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring On Wed, 21 Jan 1998, Black Fire wrote: > >Won't happen, she gave the ring back to him, after the whole "I'll call > >you, don't call me" scene > She did? I thought she still had it after that scene. There were scenes in between the "I'll call you" scene and when she left the ring there. Theda Bara vampirew@acs.stritch.edu - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 21:14:34 -0500 From: "Zelda (K)ordelia Lee" Subject: Subject: BUFFY: How Can Angel Be Good Again?.... > > how would he go about doing this so that Buffy and > Co, will actually forgive Angel for what he did while being evil again Realistically, so far he hasn't done anything any worse than that *other* show's main character when he had is "Dark - um - time" . He killed a guy. He humiliated and attacked a woman. He threatened his closest friend and humiliated her. Experience with that *other* show is that we, the viewers, forgive him because he wasn't himself when he did it, but he's never quite the same. Buffy will eventually forgive him, but gradually, and cautiously. It will never be the same. Unless, of course, he gets staked at the end of the season. > (NOTE: I'm still not sure why they forgave him in the first place after > finding out what he did in the past, Probably because he was sorry for it, did it while under dark influence, and it didn't touch them personally. (ohboyohboy, are we gonna have the Statue of Limitations discussion?!?) :: getting out leather wristcuffs and blue woad :: > > Any other ideas? > I have a feeling that Jenny will redeem herself by researching and finding a "cure", or curse, to restore his soul. Someone theorized that the "real" Angel is somewhere, aware and tortured. The dream where he was standing in the sunlight and told Buffy what to look for would back that idea up. The "real" Angel isn't a vampire; he can stand in the sun. - -- ZK zklee@huskynet.com The (K)lara Barton of Highla-L (Retired) Keeper of the Stick To Put Under Rockers So They Go Kathump Kathump Member, Slightly Dowdy Overweight Leather-Clad Wanton Computer Babes With Math Degrees - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 20:24:09 +0000 From: vxdarlaxv@juno.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: Two Parter - The ring what was the rest of it ? the hands ? the crown ? and there was one last thing i'm forgetting ... ^w^ Darla ^w^ Keeper of Darla's Lust for Angelus !~ If you would like to join the DawsonsCreekMailingList ~! !~ Email me Privately at VxDarlaxV@Juno.com ~! >that ring he gave Buffy. "the heart signifies love, and >when its facing towards you, it means you belong to someone". - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:46:00 -0600 From: "S." Subject: BUFFY: Re: BUFFY Angel + Buffy? TIGGERGW wrote: > i don't get the fact that if Spike and Dru can have a loving > relationship and still be vampires, then why cant buffy and Angel > still be together, but the exception being he's an evil > Angel.... You just answered your own question in a way. First though Dru and Spike don't have what I call a loving relationship. Lustful, maybe. Co-dependent perhaps. But not loving. Being a demon has many downsides so I guess it's nice to just have someone around. Now as far as Angel goes, he's dead (more or less). Angelus (SP?) lives. And he's mucho p.o.'ed at Buffy for making him feel human. So he's not looking to do the whole dinner and a movie thing anytime soon. Plus Buffy's not a vamp and she's got that whole destiny as the Slayer deal hanging over her head. Plus, he didn't call when he said he would and nothing makes a woman angrier than that.... :) > doesn't mean that he can't still love her...and if he doesn't still love her, then why did he say "to kill her you have to love her" Someone else had a question on this one and this is my theory. First, he has no soul and therefore can't feel. Also, the statement above meant "to kill her you have to (have) love(d) her." Merely a grammatical thing. As in he had this in mind the whole time (keep in mind this is his demon talking not his soul). Brought to you by my own humble opinion. S. ...if he doesn't love her anymore, then he can't kill > her....just my opinion... > > - - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 22:54:32 -0600 (CST) From: Theda Bara Subject: BUFFY: Surprise/Innocence I've been a fan of the show for some time and I must admit that I am very impressed with what has been done currently with the storyline. As much as we want to have Angel and Buffy live happily ever after and that love knows no bounds, logically we have to admit that vampire and slayer just isn't a combination that can work. I was worried that Angel would end up dead still loving Buffy as sort of a typical Hollywood end to a relationship that is doomed, but I like this better. I even was slightly suspicious since we had that episode with all the dirt on what he did to Drusilla. I think having him trying to attack everything Buffy loves will give the show some real excitement and tension. It will also keep her regular routine from getting boring by throwing a monkey wrench in things. I, too, think that Dru is the gypsy girl. I only watched it once (and was exhausted then at that), but didn't Jenny/Jana's uncle say something about killing this woman's kinmen and driving her mad? While Dru may be holding onto a full six-pack, I don't think that she has the little plastic thingee to hold it together. I don't know about that thought of her being a former slayer, but it would definately make things interesting - I imagine someone who kills vamps for a living would get awfully loony if she became one. I do not think that Angel and Buffy can ever get back together unless he actually becomes human again, which isn't exactly impossible since Jenny was trying to get her uncle to do that. He didn't say it couldn't be done, he just said it shouldn't be done. There must be someone in the world who could do it. However, if that happens and he does become human, I predict that he will again be changed into a vampire. From there, I suppose anything could happen again. I was very impressed with the portrayal of teen sexuality. When Angel turns into a jerk, I felt so terrible for Buffy, but I like how she is self-confident enough in the end to take control of the situation. The line "Give me time" was absolutely chilling. I thought the episode was wonderful and can't wait to see the new chemistry between Buffy and Angel, and all the other messy love shapes. Theda Bara vampirew@acs.stritch.edu - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 20:21:48 +0000 From: vxdarlaxv@juno.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: Party of Fiends ::growls:: this is why i have always hated the slayer ! she influenced Angel to kill Darla ! who happens to be my all time fav character ! its bad enough she had to be dead but couldn't Joss have left the bones behind that way there would be somekinda chance she would come back ... but no .. Angel just had to kill her for the Slayer ::rolls over in her grave:: ::grins evilishly:: i have to say i like the new and improved Angelus .. he is much more tempting and evil .. (( yea yea i know liking bad guys is not healthy but i can't help it )) :: smiles :: you can bet i was laughing when Angelus was treating her like an insignificant nothing ... >Angel frantically searches for his old partner in crime and former supernatural >squeeze, Darla, the "Belle of Budapest." Then he halts in horror, >remembering to his dismay that he killed her. Doh! If Darla were still >around, Angelus would have a romantic diversion away from Drusilla. Mmmm nice thought .. yes it would be unusual if Angel slept with Buffy just to become a vampire .. but i can't see him doing it was Angel .. Angelus would but Angel loved Buffy .. ::mutters:: i don't see why ... but he does ... anyways ... no i don't think he planned it ... ::gagging:: poor angel if he did plan it .. he must have been sick to the stomach having to sleep with Buffy ... >Did Angel know about the curse and how it could be lifted? If he did, do you think he >just slept with Buffy just to be a vampire again? Just a thought... ^w^ Darla ^w^ Keeper of Darla's Lust for Angelus !~ If you would like to join the DawsonsCreekMailingList ~! !~ Email me Privately at VxDarlaxV@Juno.com ~! - - ------------------------------ End of buffy-digest V2 #52 ************************** To subscribe to buffy or buffy-digest, send the command subscribe buffy-digest or subscribe buffy to majordomo@xmission.com. You will need to go through a confirmation process, and the listowners have to manually approve your subscription request, so it may take some time. Back issues of this digest can be found at: ftp://ftp.xmission.com/pub/lists/buffy/archive/ For help, contact Jill Kirby (jtkirby@mcs.com) or sah (romana@mindspring.com)