From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: Yes, Thetford 135/235 *DOES* fit (at least s Date: 01 Sep 1999 08:26:42 CST Bill. when you get your Thetford figured out would you post the results or email me. My M15 is also a 1981 model and I'd like to replace the john also. BTW: I have the Dilly trailer also and it seems to be a well built, sturdy piece of equipment. Regards Randy W M15#194 ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Scott, Thanks so much for the Thetford measurements. Your boat is a lot newer than my #184, built in August '81. It looks like real close thing, depending on the angles. There is always the judicious use of a heat gun, as Jerry suggests. Hopefully, I can get together with Tod and test fit his 135, at least. Once I get a potty and a Honda 2/4 stroke, I will have a modernized, up-to-spec M-15. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: KGRwheeler@aol.com Subject: M_Boats: change in isp Date: 01 Sep 1999 22:18:03 EDT Anyone know what I have to do to receive montgomery emails at my new email address and cancel the old email address. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: change in isp Date: 01 Sep 1999 18:20:17 -0500 Welcome to the montgomery_boats mailing list! Please save this message for future reference. Thank you. If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, send the following command in email to : unsubscribe Or you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe montgomery_boats or from another account, besides rland@win.bright.net: unsubscribe montgomery_boats rland@win.bright.net If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. Here's the general information for the list you've subscribed to, in case you don't already have it: [Last updated on: Thu Dec 11 11:51:48 1997] Welcome to the Montgomery Sailboat Owner's Mailing List! Please consider saving this message for future reference. Why not post a short note telling us about yourself and your boat and where you sail? We all hope you enjoy the group. Feel free to ask questions, offer advise, or just chat with other members. Our list is small, but friendly. To post to the list, mail to: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com To subscribe or unsubscribe, send mail to: majordomo@lists.xmission.com with either subscribe montgomery_boats or unsubscribe montgomery_boats in the body of the message. The list is archived monthly. The archives are named montgomery_boats.YYMM, where YY is the year (look out - 2K disaster waiting to happen!) and MM is the month. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John Fleming Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 02 Sep 1999 00:09:27 -0700 Peter Jacobs wrote: > > John Fleming wrote, in part: > >....Also Peter, thanks for your web page with the sea shanties and the associated > > midi files. My kid love them. Do you a Midi file for Barrett's Privateers? > > Stan Rogers is one of our family favorites. > > Hi John, That must be on my Trailer Sailor Web Sites link. I didn't even > know there were sea shantys on it! What was the URL for the best midi > files? The whole list of shanties web page is at http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/2625/5shanty.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John Fleming Subject: Re: M_Boats: Stan Rogers? Date: 02 Sep 1999 00:40:58 -0700 htmills@bright.net wrote: > > count me as a fan too, with "From Fresh Water", > "Turnaround", and "Fogarty's Cove" > > I've read somewhere that "Between the Breaks, Live" > is his best album, but I don't have that one. Yep, we've got that one, and Fogarty's Cove, and Northwest Passage, and "For the Family". I was introduced to the pleasures of Stan Rogers by my wife. Who knows where she learned about him, although she's originally from Michigan. The albums are hard to find now. Maybe we could exchange tapes? When we go sailing on our M-17, both for the drive to the lake, and on the water, we play Stan's music. It really seems to fit. > > Tod > > P.S. Gordon Lightfoot fan too! Check out that web page of sea shanties. There's the words and a MIDI file for the Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald. I got my little boy to read along as we sung. He doesn't realize it, but it's just another scheme of mine to get him to like reading, by showing him how much richer the experience is when you can read the words. http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Trails/2625/5shanty.html Regards, John Fleming M-17: "Star Cross'd" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 02 Sep 1999 20:49:38 -0400 Steve, You wrote: "On Sojornen's trailer, we have an extensible tongue that has a quick release pin . . ." I have considered drilling holes in the side frames so I could run a single pin clear through. There is always some tension on the threaded bolts making them difficult to remove. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: M_Boats: RE: 1981 boats Date: 02 Sep 1999 20:54:47 -0400 Randy, Yours is the only other Dilly trailer I have heard mentioned. And and my boat came from Lake Conroe! Maybe local (TX) dealer had the Dillys customized for the M15. Storm Petrel was the Houston Boat Show model in 1982 - I bought her from the original owner who lived in Tomball. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: 1981 boats Date: 03 Sep 1999 08:28:58 CST Bill, interesting info, btw: you & boat looked good in the video ( Puget Sound get together ) your boat has the brown/tan sails correct- Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Randy, Yours is the only other Dilly trailer I have heard mentioned. And and my boat came from Lake Conroe! Maybe local (TX) dealer had the Dillys customized for the M15. Storm Petrel was the Houston Boat Show model in 1982 - I bought her from the original owner who lived in Tomball. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 01 Sep 1999 22:41:04 -0500 Dear M-boaters, I hate to write this, but I'm thinking of selling my M-17. The reason is because I found out that it needs a little more work on the bottom than I thought it would. This wouldn't ordinarily be a problem, but I'm having some tendinitis trouble and so I can't do any sanding, etc. It's one of those things that would be a few days or so of yucky work for a handy boat owner, but costs a lot to have hired out (fiberglass guy estimated 20-40 hours). It looks as though the best way for me to get on the water may be to sell the 17 (at a reduced price) and get a another type of boat for around the same price that's sail-able now. I'm seriously exploring this as an option, and wanted to post this to our group before I "go public." If anyone's interested, please feel free to e-mail me. Thanks, Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: M_Boats: a possibility? Date: 02 Sep 1999 00:37:21 -0500 Dear M-boaters, I have thought of one possibility: Is there anyone with a 15 (that doesn't need sanding) who's been thinking of switching to a 17? Maybe we could work out a trade... Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: Re: M_Boats: a possibility? Date: 03 Sep 1999 13:32:51 +0100 Hi Rachel, Sorry to hear of your boat troubles. I was going to suggest an M15 for you- not that there aren't ones around that need lots of TLC, but it's a smaller, lighter boat that you might be able to handle easier as well. Fran M15 #236 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: M_Boats: Big Bear sail Date: 03 Sep 1999 13:37:57 +0100 It looks like I'll have to cancel any Big Bear sail for this fall. We've decided to put our place up there on the market. I would like to suggest a fall sail at Mission Bay in San Diego, if any are interested. Any ideas? Fran M15 #236 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: RE: 1981 boats Date: 03 Sep 1999 20:11:43 -0400 Randy, You're half right. My boat has the tanbark sails, but the rondevous was in the Potomac and Chesapeake, not Puget Sound, unfortunately, but the East Coast version. I was uncomfortable with how the sails looked on that trip. Except for a short trial run with very little wind, the trip was the first time the sails had been used. I didn't have the full length battens installed correctly, and lost two during a very breezy inaugration on a too-small bay. Then I had main halyard problems. And with all the sailing I have done, reefing was pretty new to me. All in all, the sails didn't look very good. But I'm learning, and the sails look and work better each time out. Thanks for the compliment anyway. The sails themselves are pretty - it's the sailor! Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 03 Sep 1999 20:21:23 -0400 Rachel, (I started to spell it Rachael, my daughter's name.) We sure would hate to see you seel the boat before your first sail, with all you have invested (emotionally and financially). If I lived close enough, I would volunteer to round up some other M-list denizens to tackle the fibreglass work. With several willing souls, one weekend could do it. I suspect they might work for beer, as would I. It would be a sanding party!! Stored out of the water, the work should last for years. Anyone? Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of _sailing_ my M-17 Date: 03 Sep 1999 21:09:11 PDT What all did they say it needed?....The only thing I can thing that it = could be would be blisters..... Sanding party at Rachel's?....Free Beer? :-) Gee, Bill. If you drive, I'll come along too (and share gas money). My = truck has nearly 170,000 highway miles on it and I just put almost $1000 into = it. You could pick me up on the way. I have an air file (but my compresser isn't= portable) and drill for sanding. Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of _sailing_ my M-17 Date: 03 Sep 1999 21:17:45 EDT In a message dated 09/03/1999 17:37:13 US Mountain Standard Time, htmills@bright.net writes: << Sanding party at Rachel's?....Free Beer? :-) >> I've heard that Jerry M. "Will work for beer"............hehehehe...... Lenny ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Robert Eeg Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 03 Sep 1999 19:21:49 +0000 Rachel I am interested in what "they" said you need to do to the bottom of your M_17. I suspect that your being taken advantage of because you might be considered a 'helpless women' that will shell out a couple of thousand bucks for a 'neccessary' repair job. Email more details. Don't panic. lets see what the problem is. Take care Bob rland@win.bright.net wrote: > Dear M-boaters, > > I hate to write this, but I'm thinking of selling my M-17. The reason > is because I found out that it needs a little more work on the bottom > than I thought it would. This wouldn't ordinarily be a problem, but I'm > having some tendinitis trouble and so I can't do any sanding, etc. > > It's one of those things that would be a few days or so of yucky work > for a handy boat owner, but costs a lot to have hired out (fiberglass > guy estimated 20-40 hours). It looks as though the best way for me to > get on the water may be to sell the 17 (at a reduced price) and get a > another type of boat for around the same price that's sail-able now. > > I'm seriously exploring this as an option, and wanted to post this to > our group before I "go public." If anyone's interested, please feel > free to e-mail me. > > Thanks, Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sandyal55@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Big Bear sail Date: 03 Sep 1999 19:21:15 EDT Fran; Are you planning on going to Minney's (Costa Mesa) yard sale in Oct? it's in the middle of the month, not sure which weekend yet. Lot's of good boaty stuff. Sandy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 03 Sep 1999 23:59:01 EDT In a message dated 09/03/1999 7:23:22 PM US Mountain Standard Time, bobeeg@earthlink.net writes: << he bottom of your M_17. I suspect that your being taken advantage of because you might be considered a 'helpless women' that will shell out a couple of thousand bucks for a 'neccessary' repair job. Email more details. Don't panic. lets see what the problem is. Take care Bob >> YEAH BOB,,,,,,!!!!!!!!!! That's tellin' 'em. Us "M" boat folks appreciate your support..........BIG THANKS... Lenny M-23#003 Sea Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: M_Boats: Thanks for your kind thoughts Date: 02 Sep 1999 03:51:03 -0500 Dear M-boaters, I came home this afternoon and couldn't believe all the nice, supportive messages in my mailbox. I don't think there's anyone on this list that I wouldn't love to meet in person. It must be something about those M-boats :-). Funny you all should mention beer to a Wisconsin resident... BTW, Fran - did you go for "Windblown"? (or did you just get tired of all our suggestions...:-)) Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: bownez@juno.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 04 Sep 1999 08:46:31 -0500 Hi Rachel and listers, Well, it distresses me that you're thinking of moving your M17 before you have sailed her. I thought the excitement I saw in your eyes while you were at the helm of my M17 would hook you permanently. I probably mentioned that I had to do the bottom of my M17 after I bought her three years ago. The blisters appeared as small pock marks, just below the boot stripe. None were deep or contained any moisture. The worst part is sanding the fiberglass. I used an orbital sander and sanding block to get inside the lapstrake ridges. Of course, lying on a creeper under the jacked up boat provided some of the challenge as well. Bottom painting is easy once the prep work was done. I used a roller modified to half of its length to roll along the strakes. Paint timing is critical as well as the hull temperature. I used 8 coats of Interprotect 2000 followed by two coats of Micron CSC. The bottom looks great and I feel the light blistering is sealed forever. You didn't describe how blistered your hull is, I'm curious. Your boat is newer than mine. If you're going to have a beer sanding party with Montgomery people, count me in. Don't forget the brats! Keep us posted. Michael "Bones" Bowden M17 #92 PS , I recieved the complete Pintle-Gudgeon-Pivot rod set from Bob for my kick-up rudder project. More to be posted later. ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 04 Sep 1999 21:11:45 -0400 Bill, I had a trailer tongue extension made for my Trailrite trailer. The back end of the extension fits into a "U" fitting on the underside of the trailer - made by my welder. Then he welded a 2" ball on the square tube that mates with the normal trailer coupling, and is locked in place with the coupler, just as it would be if you had hooked the trailer up to your car. The other end of the extension has another coupler that is attached to the ball on the car. This system, now that we've played with it for a few times, works very well, and I am totally happy with the launching and retrieving solution. Works great We have just come back from Moosehead Lake, Maine, where we have had some spectacular sailing. The original idea was to keep the boat at the dock where our cabin was located, but since the lake level was so low, there was no place for the Montgomery behind the seawall. Next idea was to keep the rigged boat at the launch area and just launch and retrieve every day. This worked out very well, and gave us practice in launching and retrieving. Now we're old pros! To comment on the previous messages regarding the difficulty of retrieving an M-15, I can only say that I backed down the launch ramp with the trailer until the trailer fenders were under water, and the bunk boards were almost under water too. Then I would pull the bow of the M-15 on the trailer (I have Fulton guides at the aft end of the trailer), and the M-15 bow would be within about 18" of the bow stop. I then hook up the winch strap to the stemhead fitting, and a few turns of the winch handle later, the bow is nestled against the bow stop. A bit of pushing or rocking may be needed to make sure the boat is centered on the rollers. Now it's back into the car: put it in gear and slowly pull the boat up the ramp. The ramp angle at Moosehead Lake was fairly gentle, say 15 degrees, and so I had the trailer in the water and could just unhook the winch strap and give the bow a push and the M-15 was floating. My wife held it at the dock while I drove back to the parking place, and parked the car and trailer. This is the first time we've been to Moosehead Lake, and for an M-15, or M-17 it is an ideal sailing area. Lots of islands, clean water; good winds; no PWCs; and the motor boats that were there were primarily fishing boats with small outboards. No Cigarettes with 700 HP disturbing the beauty and silence of the lake. The only drawback to Moosehead Lake is that it is so far away - but I guess if you want peace and quiet, then you'll have to drive that far to get it. Connie M-15 #400 LEPPO ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Joe Kidd" Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 05 Sep 1999 17:04:48 -0700 Connie, >I had a trailer tongue extension made for my Trailrite trailer. The back end of the extension fits into a "U" fitting on the underside of >the trailer - made by my welder. Then he welded a 2" ball on the square tube that mates with the normal trailer coupling, and is locked in place with the coupler, just as it would be if you had hooked the trailer up to your car. The other end of the extension has another coupler that is attached to the ball on the car. I have seen your kind of trailer tongue extension described before and have considered it for my trailer. However, my TrailRite trailer has a V-shaped metal support/skid welded to the underside of the frame a few inches behind the trailer hitch. The support would block an extension under the front of the trailer. Did you remove the V-support on your trailer to make room for the tubular extension? What are the dimensions/specifications of your tongue extension tube? > >We have just come back from Moosehead Lake, Maine, where we have had some spectacular sailing. Tell us more about your adventures on Mooshead Lake. Joe Kidd M-15 #207 "Poco A Poco" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: RE: 1981 boats Date: 06 Sep 1999 08:23:51 CST thanks for the correction, I was probably wishing I was on Puget Sound rather than Texas this time of year. Regards, Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Randy, You're half right. My boat has the tanbark sails, but the rondevous was in the Potomac and Chesapeake, not Puget Sound, unfortunately, but the East Coast version. I was uncomfortable with how the sails looked on that trip. Except for a short trial run with very little wind, the trip was the first time the sails had been used. I didn't have the full length battens installed correctly, and lost two during a very breezy inaugration on a too-small bay. Then I had main halyard problems. And with all the sailing I have done, reefing was pretty new to me. All in all, the sails didn't look very good. But I'm learning, and the sails look and work better each time out. Thanks for the compliment anyway. The sails themselves are pretty - it's the sailor! Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "rdawson" Subject: M_Boats: Sacramento sailing Date: 06 Sep 1999 10:20:18 -0700 Been working overtime for 2 weeks, straight thru a weekend with nice wind. Now I have 3 days off over Labor Day and NOT A WHISPER! Usually sail at Folsom Lake just cause it's close but was told that if I trailer about 1-1/2 hours to Rio Vista, there's "always" a good breeze on the delta. Well, the family took a drive there yesterday and it too was "flat". Anyone else on the list sail around here? On the Delta? Ever sail on the river near Sacramento? (or is it too narrow?). There is a sailing club in Stockton that seems to sail boats up to 30' on the deep water channel. The must tack every 45 seconds to go west. rdawson M15 #469 Patricia Z Sacramento ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 06 Sep 1999 22:16:24 -0400 Joe, It's dark and rainy outside so, tomorrow I'll go and make some measurements of the trailer tongue extension and send it to you. No, my Trailrite trailer didn't have a "V" shaped skid under the trailer tongue, but that should be no problem. Your welder can cut that off and then you can put the extension on just as I did. Moosehead Lake is way up thar in Maine. From our house in Connecticut it was a 390 mile haul to Rockwood, which is on the West side of the lake, about half way up the length of Moosehead Lake. The lake has a number of islands and bays. There is very little traffic, just a few outboard powered fishing boats that are generally trolling for salmon or lake trout. No PWCs: no 700 HP Cigarettes bellowing from miles away: just peace; quiet; and great sailing (and a bit too much sun). We went out two evenings in a row trying to see some moose, but had no luck. It must have been their night off! However, moose are everywhere, and the roads are full of warning signs. You definitely don't want to hit a moose. First, they weight about 1200 lbs; and second; with their long legs, if you run into one the body of the moose will hit your windshield, as the hood of your car goes under it's belly. Not a healthy situation for you or the moose. Katrina and I parked the rigged M-15 at the launch ramp parking lot, and launched it every morning. With the tongue extension, it was very easy backing down the ramp; launching the boat; and then parking the rig back in the parking lot. We sailed for about five hours each day: winds about 10 to 15 kts: blue sky; pine tree covered shores; clean water; what more could you want? A thoroughly delightful sailing area. Our original idea was to keep the boat at the small dock that the owner of the cabin we rented, had, but when we investigate the dock we found that the lake level was about 2 feet lower than normal, and so, we would have a hard time sliding in there. That was why we decided to park the rigged boat at the ramp and just launch and retrieve every day. Worked out very well. Modifications made to LEPPO this year: - Added Seth's forestay tensioner - makes life simple when rigging the boat. -Got a ball release pin for the head stay fitting so I don't have to play with rings. -Cut out the starboard locker liner to gain access to the storage space under the locker Liner rests on supports so I have the use of the shallow locker, and have access to the remaining area as well. -Cut a carpet sample to fit the cabin sole. Nice comfy feeling! -Rigged "proper" lines for clew outhaul; and jiffy reefing; as well as for jib down-haul. 3/16" line. Trailer mods; -tongue extension -Goodyear car tires -all new electrical wiring to high mounted stop/brake lights on the Fulton guides. -Painted trailer white for better visibility in muddy waters -Added Bearing Buddies -Replaced Fulton tongue jack wheel with a larger swiveling wheel - big improvement. -Made new longer chocks as safety item when backing down a ramp. Trailering idea: -When trailering the boat I used to leave the shrouds in the cockpit. Didn't like the idea of marring up the fiberglass. -New idea: coil up the shrouds; put a piece of plastic bag around them and hold them together with duct tape (the plastic bag keeps the adhesive from the duct tape from sticking to the shroud.) Then I put another piece of plastic bag around the mast and hang the shrouds from the mast, again using duct tape. Shrouds don't hit anything: nothing rubs or scratches, and when you arrive at your destination, just cut the duct tape and rig the boat. Works very well. Just remember to keep some plastic strips and a roll of duct tape handy for the return trip! Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Joe Kidd" Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 06 Sep 1999 22:20:26 -0700 Connie, I'll look forward to receiving more details regarding your trailer tongue extension. Upon further investigation -- and since there will be very little stress on the extension -- it might be possible to weld a bracket six inches behind the coupler that would be strong enough to hold the steel channel snuggly enough to launch. At any rate, I am lucky enough to have a handy neighbor who loves to tinker. He restores antique cars and has a complete machine shop -- welders, lathes, drills, etc. -- and I'm sure we can engineer something that will work. When I was a kid I was in a car that hit a mule. I suspect that might be similar to hitting a moose. The mule came through the windshield. Would I love to sail "Poco" some place like Mooshead Lake. (Keep dreaming, Joe... Someday...) The best we have around here is Lake Don Pedro, which is usually filled with fishing boats and/or jet skies. It is large enough to sail for hours without turning around, however. Thanks for including the list of changes to LEPPO. You've been busy. I followed your discussion of many of those project on the M-net. What kind of larger wheel did you install on the tongue jack? My driveway is gravel and that little steel wheel always digs in and makes pushing the rig difficult. I think I did you one better in securing the shrouds and lines for travel. I got a long canvas bag with a drawstring closure. It was made to hold a big canvas beach umbrella. The bag is 44-inches long by 8-inches in diameter. It slides over the end of the mast (when it is on the mast carrier) and extends back far enough to enclose all of the wires, lines, halyards, fittings, etc. A quick tug on the drawstring and a couple of bungee sail gaskets and everything is ready for the road in short order. No plastic or duct tape... Joe Kidd M-15 #207 "Poco A Poco" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 07 Sep 1999 16:05:15 +0100 Connie, Where in Maine is Moosehead Lake? I've been to Maine a few times and if it weren't for the cold winters, I'd live there. Glad you enjoyed it. Fran M15 #236 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: I'm thinking of selling my M-17 Date: 07 Sep 1999 21:52:33 -0400 Rachel, If you have gelcoat blisters on your hull, don't be too concerned. You can probably sail for many years before it may be a more serious problem. Go launch you M17 and have fun. The blisters aren't going to make holes and let you sink in the middle of nowhere. They are mainly cosmetic - ugly but relatively harmless. Enjoy your boat and worry about the cosmetics later. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 07 Sep 1999 21:46:18 -0400 Fran, Moosehead Lake is "way" up there in Maine. If you have a Maine map, follow the Maine Turnpike from Portland to Augusta, to Waterville. Then go due North about 100 miles and you'll hit Moosehead Lake. It is about 40 miles below the Canadian border. When we got there the wind was blowing 25 - 30 Knots - whitecaps everywhere - and we said we didn't have to do that: been there done that! So we waited for Monday. Monday: more of the same, so we jumped in the car and drove to Quebec (about 120 miles) and spent an afternoon in a delightful city. Totally European: narrow alleys; cobblestone streets; lots of good restaurants; the St. Laurence flowing by: Got to go visit again and spend a few days exploring. Tuesday, Petrus, the God of Weather, turned the fan down to LOW, and we then had three absolutely perfect sailing days. The Lake was empty except for a few outboard powered fishing boats trolling for lake trout or salmon. We saw one other sailboat on the lake. Clean water: lovely sailing area; the scent of pine trees; idyllic! The only negative in the equation is that Moosehead Lake is 390 miles from Glastonbury, CT where we live: a fur piece down the road! Two evenings we went out to recommended places to see moose, but nary a moose was to be seen. Best regards, Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Azphip@aol.com Subject: M_Boats: M17 for sale. Date: 08 Sep 1999 00:07:52 EDT Health forces sale of of 1976 M17 in excellent condition. - Hull # 210 - Yellow hull with racing rig (tall mast) - 6 sails (Main, 170 Genoa, 150 Genoa, Working Jib, Storm Jib, and Spinnaker). - New Porta-Potti never used. - 1976 Seagull engine with shop manual (recently restored) - Interior and Exterior cushions - 1976 Trailrite trailer with tongue extension and new bearings, tires, and chrome wheels This is a two owner boat looking for a great home. $4,500 o.b.o. Boat located in Phoenix, Arizona Contact: azp3@aol.com or azphip@aol.com for further information (will send photo via email) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 wants to stay in the water Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:29:32 -0400 Joe, The trailer tongue extension is made of a piece of 2" x 2" square steel tubing 8 feet long. 38" from the aft end a 2" ball is welded to the tube, which mates with the coupler on the trailer. The aft end of the extension is held in a "U" shaped fitting that is welded under the forward cross member on the Trailrite trailer. That is the piece that is welded to the square tube holding the trailer coupler. The front end of the tube has a 2" coupler welded to it. I don't have a skid under the tongue of the trailer, as you describe, but your welder friend should have no problem cutting the skid off so that the extension can slide in there; or if you still want a skid, then it could be welded to the side of the front tube. I hold the extension tongue on the trailer using a "U" bolt with wing nuts. I want to put some rubber pads under it so that it doesn't rattle and bounce, but that is next week's job. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:07:14 +0100 Connie, Thanks for your descriptive account of your trip. Sounded good! Glad the wind calmed enough for some pleasant sailing. The lake is quite a ways up in Maine, but coupling it with a trip to Quebec was a smart idea. Fran M15 #236 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: M_Boats: minneys Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:31:30 +0100 Sandy, I'd be interested in the October sale @ minneys. Maybe find a storm sail for the 15, or whatever.Please let me know the dates and location. Thanks much, Fran ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: minneys Date: 08 Sep 1999 23:36:25 EDT In a message dated 09/08/1999 8:30:34 PM US Mountain Standard Time, dlebowitz@sprintmail.com writes: << Sandy, I'd be interested in the October sale @ minneys. Maybe find a storm sail for the 15, or whatever.Please let me know the dates and location. Thanks much, Fran >> O-O-O-O-O....Sandy.....If we go we get to meet Fran.......... Lenny : ) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: Re: M_Boats: minneys Date: 08 Sep 1999 21:00:45 +0100 <> O-O-O-O-O....Sandy.....If we go we get to meet Fran.......... Lenny : ) Dear Lenny, I didn't realize I've achieved such celebrity. Needless to say I'm flattered, but won't let this go to my head. It would be a pleasure to meet you too; I enjoy your humor. Fran ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John Fleming Subject: M_Boats: Star Cross'd is back in the water! Date: 09 Sep 1999 00:00:36 -0700 We finally got Star Cross'd back in the water this Labor Day weekend. After the new mast, and the electrical rework, and all the deck beddings, and three bags full sir of other stuff, it's finally a real sail boat again. We trailered it out to Oxnard CA where our friends live, and had two great days of sailing. The high points: 1. The seas were calm and the winds light and steady, even though it was gloomy overcast with six miles visibility (a solid marine layer all day). Our friends were insanely jealous that the first time we showed up, we had the best sailing days all summer. Usually, they say, the stretch of water between Oxnard/Ventura and the Channel Islands is boisterous, with short steep swells, and gusty winds. 2. Our friends have a 1984 Laguna 26, another good quality out-of-production boat. There's more room in there (and more headroom) than a new Catalina 27, and it's a very sturdy and well-designed boat. The only thing I didn't like was the shallow cockpit. We like our deep cockpit and high coamings, especially with the little ones scampering about. I'd be a nervous nellie in a Laguna with little ones in that cockpit with it's shallow footwell and low coamings. It's all a tradeoff, they have a reasonable sleeping space under their cockpit. We were able to keep up with them (more or less), sometimes falling behind, sometimes getting ahead. The M-17 seemed to be faster in the stronger winds, and if sailed carefully, could point slightly higher. With a smaller boat, there's no downside. If you fall behind, you say "of course, it's the small boat", if you keep up or pass them, "it's the skipper that made the difference". 3. The kids were happy, they saw dolphins and seals. It was their first time on the ocean. Both of them got that glazed look every now and then, so I had to encourage them to come in the cockpit and look around, watch the other boats and the land and the oil platforms, to keep the oozie-woozies away. 4. The completely-rebuilt electrical/electronics worked like a champ, only one non-critical bug. The VHF worked, the AM/FM worked, everything worked first time I turned it on. The low points: 1. We forgot/didn't know that we had to bring a hose to rinse off the boat and trailer and engine. We drove it over to our friends' house to do that. It was our first time on salt water, and it's more complicated than we were used to, that transition from sailing boat to trailing boat. 2. I pulled one of the internal halyards back up into the mast. Arrgh! It will be quite tedious to fish it/tease it back out of the exit sheave. I have to take the mast completely off the boat, and ... oh, never mind, I don't even want to think about it. 3. We blew a trailer tire on the trip home. Somewhere between Oxnard and out past San Bernadino, the tread all blew off and we were riding on bare ply's. But the pressure held. That trip through LA was rough, the deserts are much smoother. Since it was dark, we didn't notice it until we stopped for gas. Once again Star Cross'd lived up to her name, I think. Was it bad luck the tire disintegrated, or good luck that it didn't blow out while we were careening down some ridiculous LA freeway? I cringe and shudder to even think about it. That does it! I'm going to get full tire covers for all the tires, not just the spare. A few more weekends of work, and it's back to Roosevelt Lake for the opening of the Arizona sailing season, starting in a month or so. That's it for now. Happy sailing, John Fleming M-17: "Star Cross'd" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Star Cross'd is back in the water! Date: 09 Sep 1999 09:35:41 EDT In a message dated 09/09/1999 00:00:55 US Mountain Standard Time, JFleming@amug.org writes: << A few more weekends of work, and it's back to Roosevelt Lake for the opening of the Arizona sailing season, starting in a month or so. >> John Sounds like you had a great time..........Hope to see you on the water at Roosevelt this fall...........I'm planning on at least one outing with Sea Horse up there...........hehe. Lenny M-23#003 Sea Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 09 Sep 1999 20:29:24 -0400 Fran, The sailing on Moosehead Lake was wonderful. The lake is about three miles wide where we were sailing, with several islands and bays to explore. There wasn't a Cigarette or a PWC to be seen. Just the locals trolling for lake trout or salmon, at slow speeds and hardly any noise. We went out two evenings looking for moose, guided by local knowledge, but - no moose! Of course, the negative side of this is that all you have up there are very small villages, grocery stores 30 miles down the road, and just moose to amuse you on a rainy day. But the silence, and the beauty of the lake will be a very saleable product in years to come, as the world gets noisier and more crowded. We've also sailed up on Lake Champlain: a lot more of civilization, and also a great place to sail. We stayed in Essex, NY, which is about 30 miles south of Burlington, VT, on the West side of the lake, so if you had a rainy day, or the wind was too strong, you could go across the lake with the ferry and then explore Burlington, or just head north on the "Northway" - the Interstate, and go to Plattsburg, NY. Burlington has a nice pedestrian town middle, with fountains, and of course, a Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream store. The difference in driving between Lake Champlain and Moosehead Lake is about 100 miles, with Champlain being the closer. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 09 Sep 1999 21:46:19 PDT "Of course, the negative side of this is that all you have up there are very small villages, grocery stores 30 miles down the road...." Connie, in my book, that's a plus! I looked at the road atlas to see where Moosehead Lake was. It IS out in the sticks. I was to Mt Katadin a few years back and had to drive miles and miles down a dirt/gravel road to get there. I rented a canoe for 4 hours in a lake for something like three bucks. I'm sure once I get my boat I'll be trailering over that way. Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sandyal55@aol.com Subject: M_Boats: Lake Powell Date: 10 Sep 1999 00:13:00 EDT A couple of weeks ago, I was invited to spend a weekend on Lake Powell with some friends. Stu and Mary Ann live in Flagstaff with Oscar (75lb golden retriever), and keep a Compac 23 in dry storage at the lake. I got off work early in Phx and arrived in Flag at 2:15. By 3:30 we picked up Mary Ann at high school (teacher) and were on the road to Powell. By 7:00 we were motoring across the lake to a cove and dropped the anchor in 30 Knots of wind in the dark. They knew the lake well but I was a newcomer to Powell. The anchor bit and we went down below as the rain was on the way. All this while lightening struck frequently in the West over the Grand Canyon. In the morning, Oscar and I went ashore (inflatable dink) for a walk and swim. Oscar swims more than any dog on earth. He is truly the best boatdog I've ever seen. After breakfast we tried to sail with very little wind. The motor carried us around Castle rock to another cove, arriving in the early afternoon. We all swam and hiked around with only one houseboat in sight. All day we saw no one onboard so we were in effect alone. The evening was similar to Friday night. I've lived in Arizona for almost 28 years and thought I'd seen lightening, but Saturday night I saw a lightening show over the Canyon which lasted for two hours. It had every type of lightening that exists. Ground strikes, cloud to cloud streaks and glowing clouds. This show eventually got to us, and we went below and played cards during the rain. Sunday morning, Oscar needed to go ashore at 6:00 so I took him while my hosts made breakfast. Again, not much wind during the day and the trip home was uneventful. We sailed very little due to light winds but as long as I'm on the water, sailing is only icing. My worst day on a boat is better than my best day at work. Powell is a place I'll return to before I retire and head out for saltwater territory. Thanks for taking the time to read this; Sandy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: M_Boats: test message Date: 11 Sep 1999 13:32:45 -0600 Keith Diehl - Salt Lake City, UT www.xmission.com/~kdiehl ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Moosehead Lake Date: 11 Sep 1999 20:40:19 -0400 Todd, Moosehead Lake is great sailing country, no doubt, but I was just contrasting it with "more civilized" places, such as the Maine coastal towns: but then you are fighting congestion; high prices; 12 foot tides (don't forget to bring a dinghy - there is no dock space available - only moorinhgs), but you have restaurants, places to go, things to see. In Moosehead Lake, the sailing is it, and if you have a rainy day, or it is blowing too much, then you just have to sit in your cabin and watch TV. Of course, you can drive 120 miles each way and visit Quebec, which we did; or drive down to Greenville and get a flight on a float plane and fly around the whole area. We loved it. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Peter Rose Subject: M_Boats: (no subject) Date: 12 Sep 1999 22:07:10 -0700 unsubscribe montgomery_boats prose@crl.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "The Nesbitts" Subject: M_Boats: Thanks Date: 16 Sep 1999 21:45:15 -0500 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF008C.C2F94240 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello All, We just want to thank everybody online for their helpful suggestions = during our first Montgomery sailing season. We hope to get a few more = sailing days in but it gets cold early here in Minnesota. Plans are = underway for pulling Pretty Tacky II out of the lake. We'll live = vicariously through your warm weather sailing tales until next May. Penny and Bob Nesbitt Pretty Tacky II M-17 #266 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF008C.C2F94240 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello All,
 
We just want to thank everybody = online for their=20 helpful suggestions during our first Montgomery sailing season.  We = hope to=20 get a few more sailing days in but it gets cold early here in = Minnesota. =20 Plans are underway for pulling Pretty Tacky II out of the lake.  = We'll live=20 vicariously through your warm weather sailing tales until next = May.
 
Penny and Bob Nesbitt
Pretty Tacky II
M-17 #266
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF008C.C2F94240-- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZYacht@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: list sign on info. Date: 16 Sep 1999 23:04:29 EDT Can some one instruct me as to how to sign back on the list? I seem to have dropped off. Thanks gilasailr@aol.com M-17 # 319 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: list sign on info. Date: 15 Sep 1999 11:21:33 -0500 Here you go: All administrative list functions, such as subscribe and unsubscribe, are directed to majordomo@xmission.com, not the list. [Last updated on: Fri Mar 12 13:51:40 1999] Welcome to the Montgomery Sailboat Owner's Mailing List! Please consider saving this message for future reference. Why not post a short note telling us about yourself and your boat and where you sail? We all hope you enjoy the group. Feel free to ask questions, offer advise, or just chat with other members. Our list is small, but friendly. To post to the list, mail to: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com To subscribe or unsubscribe, send mail to: majordomo@lists.xmission.com with either subscribe montgomery_boats or unsubscribe montgomery_boats in the body of the message. The list is archived monthly. The archives are named montgomery_boats.YYMM, where YY is the year (look out - 2K disaster waiting to happen!) and MM is the month. Update - Newer archives are named montgomery_boats.YYYY.MM. Y2K disaster averted! There are five ways to view the archives: 1. Use the search engine! http://www.listquest.com/goto/montgomeryboats 2. Go to my home page (http://www.xmission.com/~kdiehl) and click on the "VIEW THE ARCHIVES" link. You can also look at some Montgomery pictures and learn about the Montgomery Owner's Newsletter while you're there. 3. Point your browser at http://www.xmission.com/pub/lists/montgomery_boats/archive 4. FTP to ftp.xmission.com and navigate to the pub/lists/montgomery_boats/archive directory. Then ftp the files you want. 5. Send the message index montgomery_boats to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. You will receive a list of archive file names via e-mail. Decide which one you want and send the message get montgomery_boats archive/FILENAME to majordomo@lists.xmission.com, replacing FILENAME with the name of the file you want. It will be e-mailed to you. Remember, this is a UNIX system so things are case sensitive and that's a forward slash! To learn more about the majordomo list server, visit http://www-gsb.uchicago.edu/comp_svcs/majordu.htm END -----Original Message----- >can someone tell me how to unsubcribe please > > thanks > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Roberta C. Dvorscak" Subject: M_Boats: looking to buy Date: 16 Sep 1999 20:46:30 -0700 Hello, My name is Mark Dvorscak. I am new to this list. I am diligently = searching for an M17. I came close to acquiring one recently but it was = so far away that someone else snatched it out from under me during = negotiations. I live in the Pacific Northwest but I will travel a long = way for a good boat. If anyone can help to point me in the right = direction I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks, Mark Dvorscak ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: KMurphyAL@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: looking to buy Date: 17 Sep 1999 00:46:01 EDT Mark, I've got an M17 for sale. I bought it just a few months ago but have lost my job and need to sell. I paid $2500 for it and $1000 to ship it out to Mobile, Alabama from Texas. I need $2250 for it. It is a fixer upper: It is structurally sound, but needs a bottom job, reinstallation of 12 volt system, and really should have new lines. If you aren't afraid o a boat which needs about $2000 in work/parts, let me know. Kris Murphy 334-343-2414 phone 334-345-1798 fax KMurphyAL@aol.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: CMPEDERSON@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: looking to buy Date: 17 Sep 1999 02:09:46 EDT Mark, I am a lurker on this list because I enjoy sailing. I have a M17 and we have recently put it up for sale. We live in Huntington Beach, CA. What is your driving range and price range? Cliff cmpederson@aol.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 08:08:58 CST Was wondering what the height of the M17 is on the trailer. I'm planning a carport and want to make sure one will fit. Regards, Randy W M15# 194 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: KMurphyAL@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 13:18:53 EDT Less than 7 feet KM ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 13:40:57 EDT In a message dated 09/17/1999 06:10:59 US Mountain Standard Time, Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu writes: << Was wondering what the height of the M17 is on the trailer. I'm planning a carport and want to make sure one will fit. >> Randy With the pulpit, push pit and mast resting on the two.......combination shoal draft keel........I think you are going to need about 9' to clear everything........I know my old 17 wouldnt fit in my standard garage opening at 7'........and it was the older swing keel model which sets lower on the trailer. Good luck..... Lenny M-23#003 Sea Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 13:47:34 CST thanks I appreciate your effort & help. Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet In a message dated 09/17/1999 06:10:59 US Mountain Standard Time, Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu writes: << Was wondering what the height of the M17 is on the trailer. I'm planning a carport and want to make sure one will fit. >> Randy With the pulpit, push pit and mast resting on the two.......combination shoal draft keel........I think you are going to need about 9' to clear everything........I know my old 17 wouldnt fit in my standard garage opening at 7'........and it was the older swing keel model which sets lower on the trailer. Good luck..... Lenny M-23#003 Sea Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 13:48:07 CST thanks Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Less than 7 feet KM ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary M. Hyde" Subject: M_Boats: Porta-Potti 135 fits M15 Date: 17 Sep 1999 12:11:12 -0700 I tried it and the 135 model wedges into the recess for it in my 1983 M15. More on Vanilla later. Going sailing on Lake Coeur d' Alene, ID. tomorrow. --Gary, M15 #235 "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary M. Hyde" Subject: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 17 Sep 1999 12:18:55 -0700 I put a Honda 2hp on Vanilla but have trouble reaching hull speed (~5 knots). Does anyone have a quick and dirty way of measuring engine rpm to check if it is in the 5000 to 6000 rpm full throttle range? Does anyone know if a smaller pitch prop can be had? The standard prop is 3-blade plastic with 7-1/4" dia. and 4-3/4" pitch (that's 184 X 121 mm). Thanks. --Gary, M15 #235 "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cosens, Eric D" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 17 Sep 1999 14:34:07 -0500 Sorry I can't comment on the RPM test. I'll try to remember to figure out my prop pitch over the next few days. I can say however, that my M-15 reaches hull speed using a 2.2 hp motor (2 stroke Mercury) with no problems (and that at 1/2 to 3/4 throttle). Regards, Eric Indiana M-15 #412 "Lucy Maud" -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, September 17, 1999 2:19 PM I put a Honda 2hp on Vanilla but have trouble reaching hull speed (~5 knots). Does anyone have a quick and dirty way of measuring engine rpm to check if it is in the 5000 to 6000 rpm full throttle range? Does anyone know if a smaller pitch prop can be had? The standard prop is 3-blade plastic with 7-1/4" dia. and 4-3/4" pitch (that's 184 X 121 mm). Thanks. --Gary, M15 #235 "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZSKYBUM@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 15:56:19 EDT My M-17 is 100" or 8'4" when you level the trailer out so the front and back are equal height. On my boat the mast is tied to the bow pulpit when it is lowered, some people have trailers with a mast support. Remember these are Arizona inches so Texas inches my be smaller!!! Curtis Clark Out standing..in my yard. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 15:12:37 CST look out Arizona don't insult Texas or you may have a maelstrom on your hands. thanks for the info Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet My M-17 is 100" or 8'4" when you level the trailer out so the front and back are equal height. On my boat the mast is tied to the bow pulpit when it is lowered, some people have trailers with a mast support. Remember these are Arizona inches so Texas inches my be smaller!!! Curtis Clark Out standing..in my yard. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Fraser, Mark" Subject: RE: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 15:48:02 -0700 Well what is it; 9 ft or 7 ft.? Now I'm curious. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, September 17, 1999 12:48 PM thanks Randy W ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Less than 7 feet KM ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 20:43:44 EDT In a message dated 09/17/1999 15:49:38 US Mountain Standard Time, FraserM@sybrondental.com writes: << Well what is it; 9 ft or 7 ft.? Now I'm curious. >> I guess it depends on which version of keel you have, pulpit and stern rails, and whether you use a mast crutch or not..........if you want to be absolutely sure, find one and measure it........ Lenny ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 20:52:49 PDT Now I'm *really* confused. Do you mean to say that there is a difference in the geometry of the keels? I guess I just assumed (ooch!) that the different arrangements were in material only (ferrous in old/fiberglass in new). Tod "Easily Confused" Mills ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: Re: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 17 Sep 1999 19:10:31 -0600 Measure your garage. The boat will be six inches higher. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, September 17, 1999 4:48 PM > Well what is it; 9 ft or 7 ft.? > > Now I'm curious. > > -----Original ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 18 Sep 1999 00:31:14 EDT In a message dated 09/17/1999 6:11:11 PM US Mountain Standard Time, kdiehl@xmission.com writes: << Measure your garage. The boat will be six inches higher. >> LOL.....Leave it to Keith............. Lenny ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 18 Sep 1999 08:42:30 -0400 Gary, At last June's Chesapeake Rondevous (on the Potomac), Abby Gura had a Honda 2hp/4cycle. I don't know about hull speed, but his boat would really scoot with very little commotion from the motor. And said he never had it anywhere near full throttle. I'm getting one. I can't imagine there would be different props available on the factory motor, but anything is possible. Higher hp engines, like my 5hp even, have a prop geared for high rpm pushing a light inflatible or aluminum skiff. On my M15, it doesn't push that hard even though it makes lots of noise. I can easily get to get hull speed, however. I believe hull speed for an M15 is < 5kts, in the range of 4.7. I am having trouble connecting to the internet right now, but we can check the archives. Thanks for the potti test results. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Robert Becker Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 18 Sep 1999 09:42:49 -0700 (PDT) >I put a Honda 2hp on Vanilla but have trouble reaching hull speed (~5 knots). >Does anyone have a quick and dirty way of measuring engine rpm to check if >it is >in the 5000 to 6000 rpm full throttle range? >Does anyone know if a smaller pitch prop can be had? The standard prop is >3-blade plastic with 7-1/4" dia. and 4-3/4" pitch (that's 184 X 121 mm). >Thanks. >--Gary, M15 #235 > "Vanilla" > Pullman, WA > gmhyde@wsu.edu Gary, I have a Honda 2hp regular shaft on my M15 #208 and have found that the pitch of the motor on the mounting bracket makes a big difference. I move mine to the last outboard slot in the mount so the motor is driving the stern down into the water and get hull speed at about half throttle. The local Honda dealer told me they make just the one prop for this motor, but he would be happy to custom fabricate one for a hundred bucks or so. Bob ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Peter Jacobs Subject: Re: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 18 Sep 1999 10:34:59 -0700 Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu wrote: > > Was wondering what the height of the M17 is on the trailer. > I'm planning a carport and want to make sure one will fit. > > Regards, > > Randy W > M15# 194 Hi Randy, Just measured my 1989 M17 on trailer (TrailRite) with mast attached to bow pulpit and to stern "crutch" (fits in with rudder pin) 100 inches, or 8 ft 4 inches. Hope this helps. -Peter- -- Peter Jacobs, M17 #416 Victoria BC Canada http://www.islandnet.com/~pjacobs/homepage.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sandyal55@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 18 Sep 1999 15:52:17 EDT The best way to measure RPM is with an old dwell tach. A pickup wire is clamped on the spark plug wire, and then go out on the water and do a run test. It is a 4 stroke motor which gives a direct reading, like a car. Sandy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Harvey Wilson Subject: RE: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 18 Sep 1999 23:46:53 -0400 My Evinrude shop manual states different props are available bor differen= t purposes. My 8hp Yachtwin, has a different size and pitch from the standard motor, intended for power boats. I'd contact yjour Honda dealer, or get on the web and find Honda and ask them directly..supplying as much info as needed. I don't trust the GPS to give true sailing speeds, but the 3hp Seagull th= at I now use drives my M-17 at 4-4.5 mph. Harvey/ Ga M-17 Stargazer #294 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Craig Lund" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 18 Sep 1999 23:57:21 -0400 I have a new M15 and a new Honda. I just measured speed with a = commercial knot stick. The motor easily moves the boat at just under 5 = knots, requiring very little throttle. Wide open I can push the boat = above 5 knots. This behavior seems to match the sails. The fastest that I've gotten the = boat to sail is 5.5 knots, but that is in 20 knots of wind. Craig -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Bill = Riker Sent: Saturday, September 18, 1999 8:43 AM Gary, At last June's Chesapeake Rondevous (on the Potomac), Abby Gura had a = Honda 2hp/4cycle. I don't know about hull speed, but his boat would really = scoot with very little commotion from the motor. And said he never had it anywhere near full throttle. I'm getting one. I can't imagine there would be different props available on the factory motor, but anything is possible. Higher hp engines, like my 5hp even, = have a prop geared for high rpm pushing a light inflatible or aluminum skiff. = On my M15, it doesn't push that hard even though it makes lots of noise. = I can easily get to get hull speed, however. I believe hull speed for an = M15 is < 5kts, in the range of 4.7. I am having trouble connecting to the internet right now, but we can check the archives. Thanks for the potti test results. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Sandyal55@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 19 Sep 1999 02:52:25 EDT The Yachtwin/Sailmaster line of OMC motors are very different from standard motors. They are geared down 2.5:1 . The prop spins at 40% of the crankshaft speed. The props have 3 bladed "Dumbo eared" props. The pitch is actually higher than a standard prop cause the prop speed is so much slower. Do not try to exchange these props for the standard motor prop. Sandy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: M_Boats: Fw: Small Craft Advisory Date: 19 Sep 1999 10:23:15 -0600 FYI to the list ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Saturday, September 18, 1999 9:51 PM > Keith, > > Hello. Some friends and I have started a new publication called Small Craft Advisory. It is nicer than most newsletters but something less than a magazine. We have gathered some fantastic material and look forward to covering the Montgomery boats in future issues. Let me know if you would like to submit any articles on small boat sailing, or if you know of anyone who might be interested. We can only afford to pay for submissions with issues, but would love to have some Montgomery owners involved from the start. We look forward to reviewing the boats for an upcoming issue. Next month it's the Com-Pac 19. > > Thanks for your time. > Best Regards, > > Josh Colvin > Small Craft Advisory > > Anchor907@aol.com > > -- > This e-mail was generated from your home page; the e-mail address > "Josh Colvin " > may be incorrect. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 19 Sep 1999 18:10:24 -0400 Gary, I have a 2 HP Honda on my M-15, and though I've never checked the speed, I'm sure I can reach hull speed at about 1/2 to 2/3 throttle with the standard propeller. At what altitude are you operating? Higher altitude will decrease the engine output. If you are at sea level then my previous comment applies. Connie M-15 #400 LEPPO Glastonbury, CT ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 19 Sep 1999 18:15:41 -0400 Bill, I happen to have obtained a Portapotti 135 at our Industrial Supply Agency - otherwise known as the Transfer Station (Town dump). If you still are looking for one, it's yours for the shipping costs - none of this nonsense about the cost of a new M-17! Yell if you still need it. Connie chbenneck@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 19 Sep 1999 21:41:36 PDT Aww, Gee, Connie Here I had it all worked out PURR-FECT! Here's how it was supposed to work: I'm (soon to be) in need of an M17. Rachel is thinking a 15 is the boat for her. Bill needed a porta-pot REAL BAD. So! I give Bill the porta-pot. Rachel gives me the M17. Bill gives Rachel the M15. Pretty good, eh? Actually, Bill does now have my 135 at a bargain basement price as of today. We went sailing together and it fit snugly in it's spot just as it was supposed to. Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: height of a M17 Date: 20 Sep 1999 08:15:01 CST thanks, appreciate it ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu wrote: > > Was wondering what the height of the M17 is on the trailer. > I'm planning a carport and want to make sure one will fit. > > Regards, > > Randy W > M15# 194 Hi Randy, Just measured my 1989 M17 on trailer (TrailRite) with mast attached to bow pulpit and to stern "crutch" (fits in with rudder pin) 100 inches, or 8 ft 4 inches. Hope this helps. -Peter- -- Peter Jacobs, M17 #416 Victoria BC Canada http://www.islandnet.com/~pjacobs/homepage.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: M_Boats: Re: M17 for sale. Date: 20 Sep 1999 08:32:00 CST FYI, ( I don't have first hand knowledge about this boat so anyone interested will need to check directly with the owner ) Regards, Randy W ______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________ Author: Bfedw@aol.com at #Internet Hello -- Wondering if you got message regarding my decision to sell M17 #217. Can supply details if you or acquaintance are interested. Thanks. Ben Edwards, 17927 Briarcrest, Flint TX, 75762 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cosens, Eric D" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 20 Sep 1999 08:37:02 -0500 Good instinct Harvey. I've seen the "I checked my speed with the GPS" comment a lot on sailing newsgroups/mailing lists. Truth is, due to selective availability (i.e. SA - the error built-in to civilian GPS by the gov't) speed numbers from your typical consumer GPS unit are woefully inaccurate at slower walking/jogging/small sailboat speeds. At higher speeds, like cruising down the highway it's a different story because the SA error is a smaller component at that point. Regards, Eric Indiana M-15 #412 "Lucy Maud" -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, September 18, 1999 10:47 PM I don't trust the GPS to give true sailing speeds, but the 3hp Seagull that I now use drives my M-17 at 4-4.5 mph. Harvey/ Ga M-17 Stargazer #294 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 20 Sep 1999 20:09:24 -0400 Hey, Tod, you wrote: "Here's how it was supposed to work: I'm (soon to be) in need of an M17. Rachel is thinking a 15 is the boat for her. Bill needed a porta-pot REAL BAD. So! I give Bill the porta-pot. Rachel gives me the M17. Bill gives Rachel the M15. Pretty good, eh?" Needless to day, I don't think much of your deal. Rachel gets a boat. You get a boat. And all I get is a pot to . . . . " Last time I'll take you sailing! Seriously, I really enjoyed the sail, and it was a gorgeous day. If the potti is still bumping on the v-berth cover, I will just take Jerry's advice and fill it with hot water, and sit on it long enought to drink a couple of Sierra Nevada Pale Ales. The case of which (you can only buy beer by the case in Pennsylvania - Ben Franklin is still spinning in his grave) would cost more than I am paying you for the potti! At least it's my favorite beer! Connie, thanks for the offer, but even thought the price is high, Tod's ex-potti is already installed so there's no shipping. Speaking of prices, Friday morning heading to work, I decided not to wait until next spring, I would see if a Honda 2/4 was available now. I checked Honda's web site and got info on the PA and OH dealers. Only four were in reasonable proximity to Pittsburgh and Cleveland, but none has a motor in stock. I guess I will wait until spring. All quoted $775 for the model with the clutch. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Fraser, Mark" Subject: M_Boats: Paint, gelcoat, wax, don't wax, sit, stand... I have a headache. Date: 20 Sep 1999 17:18:11 -0700 Hi all, Can Anybody talk to me about a painted deck on an M15. I don't know a think about fiberglass or it's maintenance and I'm looking at an M15 that is apparently in good shape but the deck was painted by a previous owner... don't know why. What are we talking about here. The guy who has it says it's no big deal and I could get it redone for a couple hundred bucks and I believe him, I just don't know what I'm talking about. If I were going to be real anal would I want to have the thing repainted or gelcoated... and what the hell's the difference. Or should I just not worry about it as I am being way to picky about something that is just a mild aesthetic irritation. Thanks in advance. Mark -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, September 20, 1999 5:09 PM Hey, Tod, you wrote: "Here's how it was supposed to work: I'm (soon to be) in need of an M17. Rachel is thinking a 15 is the boat for her. Bill needed a porta-pot REAL BAD. So! I give Bill the porta-pot. Rachel gives me the M17. Bill gives Rachel the M15. Pretty good, eh?" Needless to day, I don't think much of your deal. Rachel gets a boat. You get a boat. And all I get is a pot to . . . . " Last time I'll take you sailing! Seriously, I really enjoyed the sail, and it was a gorgeous day. If the potti is still bumping on the v-berth cover, I will just take Jerry's advice and fill it with hot water, and sit on it long enought to drink a couple of Sierra Nevada Pale Ales. The case of which (you can only buy beer by the case in Pennsylvania - Ben Franklin is still spinning in his grave) would cost more than I am paying you for the potti! At least it's my favorite beer! Connie, thanks for the offer, but even thought the price is high, Tod's ex-potti is already installed so there's no shipping. Speaking of prices, Friday morning heading to work, I decided not to wait until next spring, I would see if a Honda 2/4 was available now. I checked Honda's web site and got info on the PA and OH dealers. Only four were in reasonable proximity to Pittsburgh and Cleveland, but none has a motor in stock. I guess I will wait until spring. All quoted $775 for the model with the clutch. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Paint, gelcoat, wax, don't wax, sit, stand... I have a Date: 20 Sep 1999 21:27:06 EDT In a message dated 09/20/1999 17:20:06 US Mountain Standard Time, FraserM@sybrondental.com writes: << If I were going to be real anal would I want to have the thing repainted or gelcoated... and what the hell's the difference. Or should I just not worry about it as I am being way to picky about something that is just a mild aesthetic irritation. Thanks in advance. Mark >> Mark Repainting a deck is no big thing if it's been done correctly.........just make sure it's not peeling or blistering from water penetration.......Applying new gelcoat is a "big" thing and isn't somethng to be taken lightly............more than likely the boat showed wear on the deck and was painted for appearence sake.......Is the seller the one who painted it? A good epoxy paint job makes things look new again. Lenny M-23#003 SEa Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Howard A Subject: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 20 Sep 1999 20:40:09 -0500 I just bought a M17, and am trying to get as much information on it as possible. Serial Number MMP172780287 I was told it was a '77 model, but can that be confirmed from the serial number, and how do you know what the hull # is? Who would have the records on where it was manufactured, and what the original equipment list was, and if it was sold as finished boat or kit. I figure you can't know too much about a partner. Howard Audsley Columbia, MO ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Joe Kidd" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 20 Sep 1999 20:19:25 -0700 > I guess I will wait until spring. All quoted $775 for the model >with the clutch. Bill, Waiting for your new Honda w/centrifugal clutch will be worth the wait. Like so many others who have responded, I really like mine. BTW, the discussion about M-15's and hull speed with a Honda 2 hp has been entertaining. On smooth water, my Honda moves my M-15 with more than adequate speed at about two-thirds throttle. Ditto on GPS reliability; the numbers dance all over the screen and require a lot of interpretation and intuition. Joe Kidd M-15 #207 "Poco A Poco" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Roberta & Mark Dvorscak Subject: M_Boats: How Many? Date: 20 Sep 1999 19:23:37 -0700 Does anybody know how many M17s have been built? Is there a location on = the web where someone could find out more of the history of the M17? = Thanks in advance. Still Looking, Mark Dvorscak ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Paint, gelcoat, wax, don't wax, sit, stand... I Date: 20 Sep 1999 21:23:59 -0400 Mark, Painting fiberglass is no big deal. Get an International Paint brochure and they'll tell you how it is done. The other paint companies also have products and brochures to lend assistance. I have painted several fiberglass boats, and if you follow instructions, and keep things clean, the results are excellent. A new gelcoat job, which has to be done by experienced boatyard painters, is very expensive compared to a quart of paint, and some elbow grease. >From 20 feet away, who can tell the difference? On my M-15 the cockpit sole needs refinishing, so in spring, I'll paint and shake a bit of model railroad HO guage fine ballast sand in the wet paint for anti-skid properties. Did the same when I refinished a ComPac 16. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 20 Sep 1999 21:12:53 -0400 Todd, Let me see if I have this figured out correctly. You give Bill a Portapotti. Rachel gives you an M-17. Bill gives Rachel his M-15. As far as I can visualize this, Bill is left sailing on a Portapotti. What kind of a rig does the Portapotti have? Sloop, schooner, brig, barkentine, full ship? Bermuda or gaff rigged? ...or sprit sails? Is the Portapotti a fixed keel or a keel/centerboard version? Does the inside waterballast really help the sailing qualities? What are the sailing qualities of a Portapotti? What is the tacking angle? With, or without reading material? If the length to beam ratio is close to 1:1, how is it in a seaway? Is this the single seater racing version or is it more the family cruising model? Questions, questions! Looking forward to all the technical detalis, as well as drawings of the vessel. Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Harvey Wilson Subject: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 20 Sep 1999 23:10:15 -0400 Hi Howard... >>>Serial Number MMP172780287<<< The serial number is 278 and date of manufacture is 02/78 (not 02/77 or 02/87)...looks like you did a typo on the last digits (0287). I don't think there were kit boats made...but only Jerry can say. I have= the M-17 brochure, and can fax it to you when I return from vacation next= week. Stargazer is hull # 294, made in 02/79. Harvey/ Ga M-17 Stargazer #294 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 20 Sep 1999 23:40:30 EDT In a message dated 09/20/1999 6:36:37 PM US Mountain Standard Time, haudsley@tranquility.net writes: << Serial Number MMP172780287 I was told it was a '77 model, but can that be confirmed from the serial number, and how do you know what the hull # is? Who would have the records on where it was manufactured, and what the original equipment list was, and if it was sold as finished boat or kit. I figure you can't know too much about a partner. >> Looks to me like you have an M-17 manufactured in 2/78..hull # 287......Just hang out on the list and you'll find out everything you need to know....... Lenny M-23#003 Sea Horse ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 20 Sep 1999 23:42:08 EDT In a message dated 09/20/1999 8:11:34 PM US Mountain Standard Time, HarveyWilson@compuserve.com writes: << >>>Serial Number MMP172780287<<< The serial number is 278 and date of manufacture is 02/78 (not 02/77 or 02/87)...looks like you did a typo on the last digits (0287). >> Harvey,,,,,,,,did I read that backwards too ???????? LOL Lenny ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 18 Sep 1999 17:14:45 -0500 Dear Howard, Welcome to the list! Did you buy "Osprey"? Here's how the numbers work: MMP172780278 (assuming this is the hull ID#) MMP = Mongomery Marine Products (not sure about whether the 'P' means products or not) 17 = seventeen feet long (there's also a 15 and a 23, plus a few smaller-sized dinghies) 278 = this is the hull # 0278 = built in February, 1978 What a coincidence that it's 278 built in 02 of 78 :-) Where do you plan on sailing with your new M ? I think everyone on the list would be interested in hearing about sailing locales and experiences. I had inquired about what southern Missouri sailing would be like in late November, hoping for a nearby (closer than Florida or Arizona anyway) place to extend the season on a hypothetical Thanksgiving trip, but got answers along the lines of "Brrrr - go to Florida" I had thought that Table Rock Lake looked neat on the map. A few people suggested Stockton Lake (but not in late Nov.) Again, welcome to the group --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: Info on a M17 Date: 18 Sep 1999 17:21:37 -0500 Howard - By the way, although all pre-1998 boats were made by Montgomery Marine, they are now being manufactured by Bob Eeg/Nor'Sea Yachts in California. They were out of production for a few years, but luckily Bob is now building these great boats again. You might want to visit the Nor'Sea web site, as it has photos and specs on the M-17. A few details have been changed between the 70s and now, but the boat is essentially the same. The url is Also, the M-list is archived (a treasure trove) and can be found on Kieth Diehl's home page. Keith's the one who runs this list (Thank-you, Keith). His url is Happy Sailing --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: How Many? Date: 18 Sep 1999 17:30:49 -0500 Dear Mark, Assuming no gaps in serial numbering (which is probably assuming way too much :-)), there would have been about 500 made. My guess is that there were some gaps in the numbering below #200, but I'm not sure of that. A few early models had a retractable keel that went up into the cabin. There were also a few flush-deck and fixed keel models, but those were all in the early years, and now they're all keel/cb designs. There's a history of M-17 design in the archives, which can be found on Kieth Diehl's home page. I think the history is at the top of the index. Kieth's url is I'm probably going to be selling my M-17, and plan to officially post it here, but I've been too busy to do so. I will do it soon though, or you could e-mail me off-list if you'd like to talk about it before that. Happy shopping --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 18 Sep 1999 17:36:19 -0500 Connie, I was already thinking that Bill was not going to be happy with this deal... I wonder if Tod's in sales :-) Anyway, your post on the PP1 sailing vessel was very amusing. My brother and I took one of those hard plastic, round pools out on the lake once (rowed in circles, naturally), but never thought to try the P.P. --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Howard A Subject: M_Boats: Infor on a M17 Date: 21 Sep 1999 06:07:19 -0500   
Dear Howard,

        Welcome to the list!  Did you buy "Osprey"?   Here's how the numbers
work:

MMP172780278  (assuming this is the hull ID#)
Well, she is not currently named OSPREY, but it is hull #278, so I think it must be. I will be talking with Thomas soon to find out. Lucky for me we are only a few hours apart.

As for sailing in MO in November..........How tough are you? It can be nice with temps in the 70's (what with global warming and all), or we can have snow on the ground. Water temps in the 40's and 50's. The major sailing lakes are: Stockton (once described to me as a "Major mistake by the Corps of Engineers"...built with a 20+ mile straight, deep water channel in a wind belt); Mark Twain....close to IA, IL, and St. Louis; Truman...some open channels and close to KC. The rest are narrow, winding Corps type lakes with wooded areas adjacent, which fouls up the wind.

I work near Mark Twain lake, so that is where most of my sailing will be done. Also, I work with a group of Venture Scouts, so I plan to get them involved as well.

By the way, I'm glad I found this mail list. It is a great resource.

Howard
  ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: Re: M_Boats: How Many? Date: 21 Sep 1999 08:46:26 -0600 Check the archives for a history of the Montgomery that appeared in the first issue of the MON. See my web page for a link. Keith Diehl - Salt Lake City, UT www.xmission.com/~kdiehl ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, September 20, 1999 8:23 PM Does anybody know how many M17s have been built? Is there a location on the web where someone could find out more of the history of the M17? Thanks in advance. Still Looking, Mark Dvorscak ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZSKYBUM@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Paint, gelcoat, wax, don't wax, sit, stand... I have Date: 21 Sep 1999 11:27:49 EDT On the back of the Lattitude 38 Magazine there is an ad for Nelson Marine, allegedlay the largest boatyard on the west coast. They specialize in refinishing boats and use the Sterling Linear Polyurethane coatings. They claim it's stronger and more durable than gelcoat. Call them up to get an accurate price (510) 814-1858. The Farrier trimarans use LP (Liniear Poly) because it's lighter, more durable and more UV resistant than gelcoat, plus it is more EPA friendly to spray. I just made an appointment to get my M-15 completly refinished on the main hull and decks, I have to remove the trim and hatch combings. The total cost estimate was $425- plus tax. These folks refinished my fiberglass sailplane and it looks beautiful after two years. Curtis Clark "Estoy Perdido" M-17 "E-Boat" M-15 Scottsdale, Arizona ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZSKYBUM@aol.com Subject: M_Boats: Boarding Ramp advise Date: 21 Sep 1999 11:36:34 EDT It has rained so much here in Arizona that I am thinking of building a ramp to take my animal friends with me after the flood. Do I need cleats to keep the animals from stipping off the ramp? In Arizona we have alot of small native wildlife rabbitts, snakes, sewer roaches, scorpians, etc so my Montgomery 15 will probably hold them. Did Noah have a web site? I originally titled this "4 inches in 3 hours" but I didn't want you folks to warp that into comments on my masculinity!!! Curtis ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Fraser, Mark" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Paint, gelcoat, wax, don't wax, sit, stand... I have Date: 21 Sep 1999 09:12:46 -0700 Hey guy, Haven't received the photo's yet, looking forward to it although I don't think it'll tell me much more than I already suspect. It's a very nice little boat and "I SHOULD BE DAMN THANKFUL FOR THE OPPORTUNITY"... ok mom... From what I've heard so far I'm just being way too picky/naive about the paint vs Gelcoat thing, and you've been very helpful... thanks Curtis, really. My learning curve here is huge and I have to be careful, I get obsessive on pet projects. I also have to consider the fact that there'll be a lot of other little costs associated with this endeavor so it's pretty silly to be worried about a cosmetic issue. Last time I was out sailing it wasn't a real immaculate process anyway and I have a feeling there might be travelers and things to install in the near future to keep the rigging neat and close at hand. I want the 15. I think it would be perfect for my son and I. I already told him that daddy was going to get him a boat... probably a mistake. It's amazing to me how well a 3.5 year old's mind remembers exactly what you say when it involves things they are interested in. He asks about it daily. Let me know your thoughts on the details. Mark -----Original Message----- Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 1999 8:28 AM have aheadache. On the back of the Lattitude 38 Magazine there is an ad for Nelson Marine, allegedlay the largest boatyard on the west coast. They specialize in refinishing boats and use the Sterling Linear Polyurethane coatings. They claim it's stronger and more durable than gelcoat. Call them up to get an accurate price (510) 814-1858. The Farrier trimarans use LP (Liniear Poly) because it's lighter, more durable and more UV resistant than gelcoat, plus it is more EPA friendly to spray. I just made an appointment to get my M-15 completly refinished on the main hull and decks, I have to remove the trim and hatch combings. The total cost estimate was $425- plus tax. These folks refinished my fiberglass sailplane and it looks beautiful after two years. Curtis Clark "Estoy Perdido" M-17 "E-Boat" M-15 Scottsdale, Arizona ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AirEvacLen@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 21 Sep 1999 14:56:48 EDT In a message dated 09/20/1999 19:35:26 US Mountain Standard Time, chbenneck@juno.com writes: << As far as I can visualize this, Bill is left sailing on a Portapotti. What kind of a rig does the Portapotti have? Sloop, schooner, brig, barkentine, full ship? Bermuda or gaff rigged? ...or sprit sails? Is the Portapotti a fixed keel or a keel/centerboard version? Does the inside waterballast really help the sailing qualities? >> Connei Nearest I can figure, the Port-a-potti is a "flush deck", junk rigged, water ballast, shoal draft , single sailor bucket.............heheh Lenny ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary M. Hyde" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 21 Sep 1999 12:00:19 -0700 Connie: I'm operating on Lake Coeur d'Alene at 2128 feet above sea level. I can occasionally get M15 hull speed (4.9 knots) with the Honda 2hp. I checked rpm this weekend and got 5000 rpm at full throttle doing 5 knots. The engine is rated at 2hp at 5500 rpm, so it isn't a bad match. Propeller slip was about 38%. If I backed off to about 4300 rpm, I still made 4.8 knots, with a slip of 30%. Conclusion: The standard prop (184 dia. x 120 mm pitch) is a pretty good match, but a slightly smaller pitch would let the engine get up to 5500 rpm and produce slightly more power. "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ---------- >From: Conbert H Benneck >To: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check >Date: Sun, Sep 19, 1999, 3:10 PM > > Gary, > I have a 2 HP Honda on my M-15, and though I've never checked the speed, > I'm sure I can reach hull speed at about 1/2 to 2/3 throttle with the > standard propeller. > At what altitude are you operating? Higher altitude will decrease the > engine output. > If you are at sea level then my previous comment applies. > > Connie > M-15 #400 LEPPO > Glastonbury, CT > > ___________________________________________________________________ > Get the Internet just the way you want it. > Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! > Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barefoot Subject: M_Boats: Calif. Lurker 17 Date: 21 Sep 1999 12:34:28 -0700 (PDT) Wanted Calif. Lurker with 17 Mont., please contact barebirken@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary M. Hyde" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 21 Sep 1999 14:22:38 -0700 Thanks, Sandy --Gary, M15 #235 "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ---------- >From: Sandyal55@aol.com >To: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check >Date: Sat, Sep 18, 1999, 12:52 PM > > The best way to measure RPM is with an old dwell tach. A pickup wire is > clamped on the spark plug wire, and then go out on the water and do a run > test. It is a 4 stroke motor which gives a direct reading, like a car. Sandy > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: M_Boats: M17: for sale Date: 22 Sep 1999 09:00:54 CST hello M boaters. I ran across this ad. I think this is close to Houston. I don't have first hand knowledge about this boat or know the owner so you will need to contact the owner direct. Regards, Randy W M15# 194 1977 Montgomery Daysailer, 17 feet, 4 hp Evinrude outboard low hours. Trailer included, new lights and wiring. Four sails also included. All offers considered., $4,500.00, (409) 243-2529 Location: Hamshire, TX ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary M. Hyde" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti Date: 22 Sep 1999 09:10:25 -0700 I bought my Honda 2 hp at Tobler Marina in Hayden Lake, ID in August for $697. They had the best price I could find in the Spokane-Coeur d'Alene area. --Gary, M15 #235 "Vanilla" Pullman, WA gmhyde@wsu.edu ---------- >From: "Joe Kidd" >To: >Subject: Re: M_Boats: Bill's Porta-Potti >Date: Mon, Sep 20, 1999, 8:19 PM > > >> I guess I will wait until spring. All quoted $775 for the model >>with the clutch. > > Bill, > > Waiting for your new Honda w/centrifugal clutch will be worth the wait. > Like so many others who have responded, I really like mine. BTW, the > discussion about M-15's and hull speed with a Honda 2 hp has been > entertaining. On smooth water, my Honda moves my M-15 with more than > adequate speed at about two-thirds throttle. Ditto on GPS reliability; the > numbers dance all over the screen and require a lot of interpretation and > intuition. > > Joe Kidd M-15 #207 "Poco A Poco" > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 22 Sep 1999 19:52:56 -0400 Gary, If you can get 5000 RPM at 2100 feet altitude from your Honda that sounds good to me. If you can get 5 knots at 5000 RPM, and 4.8 Knots at 4300 RPM at that altitude, I'd say, run at 4300 RPM and be happy with the 4.8 knots. It'll be less noise, and lower fuel consumption for "only" 0.2" knots less speed. That's the way I'd operate. As you try and drive the displacement hull faster than hull speed, the power requirement goes up very fast. For another knot you may need 4 HP and to get to 6 knots you probably will need 8 HP. T'ain't worth it! An M15 isn't a PWC, or a Cigarette. It's a sailboat! Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZYacht@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 24 Sep 1999 01:48:06 EDT Sandy, I am looking at the service manuals for OMC 1.2 hp thru 8 hp and the gear ratios are the same for "std" and "sail" aka Yachtwin and Sailmaster motors. The gear ratios are as follows: 1.2 hp 12:25 (0.48) ((2.64 cu. in.)) 1 cyl 3.0 hp 12:25 (0.48) ((5.28 cu. in.)) 2 cyl 4.0 hp 12:25 (0.48) ((5.28 cu. in.)) 2 cyl 4.0 'Deluxe' 13:29 (0.45) ((5.28 cu. in.)) 2 cyl 5.0 hp thru 8.0 hp 13:29 (0.45) ((10 cu. in.)) 2 cyl The 1.2 thru 4.0 used the common to the group 'small' gearcase/lowerunit; the 4.0 Deluxe used I believe the same gearcase/lowerunit/pan as the 5.0-8.0 series; although the 4 Deluxe uses a different gearlube than ALL the others of recent vintage! I have changed MANY 'regular' props to 'Sail' props with dramatic improvements. Note. Quoted from OMC. " If the propeller blades have too much pitch, the engine is operating below its normal range at full throttle,power is being lost, and powerhead damage could occur. If the propeller blades have too little pitch, the engine is operating above its normal range at full throttle and damage from overspeeding could occur." This statement is made to generically cover all of their motors from 1.2 hp to 300 hp! If you use an OMC prop on the above named motors you should be just fine. P.S. I believe the 'Sail' props are actually lower in pitch and larger in diameter. ( I could be mistaken, I will check) So..........hows that for a tirade of nearly useless stuff?? Me thinks one should go sailing and not worry about how fast, Hp, Rpm, etc. forget that thing back there...it might not work anyway! Don't rely on your automobile brakes or your boats motor. (MY Evinrude 4 Yachtwin is as reliable as the sunrise and strong as a John Deere, it is a polluter but I use it very sparingly) JUST GO SAILING M-17 #319 Gary O. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZYacht@aol.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 24 Sep 1999 01:49:55 EDT Sandy. Those OMC props dont have DUMBO ears.I DO! Gary O. M-17 #319 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Fraser, Mark" Subject: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 24 Sep 1999 14:47:09 -0700 Question to M15 owners. What anchor (size and style) would you recommend for an M15 to be used predominantly in Southern California bays (Newport back and Mission). I saw a CQR 5lbs Shovel style, they were laughing about it calling it a toy anchor. In the picture it looks like its about 10" in total. Could something like that be just right for the M15? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jerry montgomery Subject: Re: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 24 Sep 1999 20:16:03 +0000 Hi Mark I use a 10 lb CQR for either a 15 or 17 and like it. I have brought a Danforth up wrapped several times- enough so that I don't trust them at all. The Danforths claim more theoretical holding power and it might be true but it doesn't do you any good if it wraps. Several people in Arizona that I have sailed with in the Gulf have used the 5 lb CQRs on 15s and have been very happy. Also, people whose opinions I trust have had good success with Bruce anchors. Jerry ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sparsons@canby.com (Steve Parsons) Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard motor rpm Check Date: 25 Sep 1999 10:21:03 PDT Weren't these the props that came out Texas? I think some company by the name of EDP (Perot Systems?) made them. :-) skp >Sandy. >Those OMC props dont have DUMBO ears.I DO! >Gary O. >M-17 #319 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barefoot Subject: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 Date: 25 Sep 1999 10:50:46 -0700 (PDT) Wanted to buy M-17 1987 or newer. Does anyone know of someone who will be putting their boat on the market this winter? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dennis W. Farrell" Subject: Re: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 Date: 25 Sep 1999 12:36:16 -0700 Did you ever hear from the "lurker" that seemed to wanted to sell an M-17? Any idea what's happening with him or the boat? Thanks -- dwf -----Original Message----- >Wanted to buy M-17 1987 or newer. Does anyone know of >someone who will be putting their boat on the market >this winter? > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 25 Sep 1999 21:08:56 -0400 Mark, An anchor is a tool for attaching yourself to the bottom. Different types of bottoms require different tools (anchors). There is no "one and only" anchor, unless, you are always sailing in the same area, and have optimized your anchor for the conditions you find in that area. A Danforth is great in sand and mud, but it is hard to set if you have a lot of weed on the bottom, and is no good in rocks. A CQR will go through weeds and find bottom. It works well in a softer bottom too, but you have a handling problem. That's why people using CQRs have them mounted on roller on their bows. I've heard good things about the Bruce anchor, but have no experience myself with the Bruce. So, What kind of a bottom are you anchoring in? If you can answer that question, then you are in a good position to select an optimum anchor for that condition. I have only done a modest amount of anchoring in the M15, but I carry the small FORTRESS with about 150 feet of rode, as my serious anchor; and my lunch hook is an aluminum Danforth type with about 75 feet of rode. I am trying to get a 4 lb. Bruce, because, up in Lake Champlain there is a lot of weed on the bottom in coves where we want to stop for lunch, and I've had problems trying to set the Danforth. Too much weed that bunches between the flukes so that the anchor never really will set itself. Anchors and long rodes are safety. Two should be a minimum. (What do you do if the outboard jockey cuts your only anchor rode? .....or the large powerboat wraps your rode around his propeller, and you have to cast off till he can get it untangled?) I sleep best when I have two anchors set, and a third is in reserve: ....just in case! M15 #400 LEPPO Connie ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: M_Boats: M-boats are more fun than R-boats Date: 26 Sep 1999 19:58:10 PDT That's right, folks....M-boats ARE more fun than R-boats. Yesterday I got to crew on a 1920's vintage R-boat. It's about 38' LOA, long overhangs, 7' beam, full keel. It's a very pretty boat, but sailing at a normal 30 deg heel in 13 kts of wind with regular dowsings from sheets of spray flying back and trying to avoid getting a finger ripped off while tending the sheets is a lot less fun than sailing a Montgomery. Earlier I was crewing in five races for a guy on a Thistle and saw Bill Riker on his M15. Nine hours of hard racing has left me feeling rather sore today. I shoulda sailed with Bill. Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Roberta & Mark Dvorscak" Subject: Re: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 Date: 26 Sep 1999 17:38:28 -0700 Hello Dennis, That "lurker" had one of the boats that I was checking into, but he sold it before I had an opportunity to look at it. Good luck with your search. Mark (still searching diligently) Dvorscak ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Saturday, September 25, 1999 12:36 PM > Did you ever hear from the "lurker" that seemed to wanted to sell an M-17? > Any idea what's happening with him or the boat? > > Thanks -- dwf > > -----Original Message----- > From: Barefoot > To: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com > > Date: Saturday, September 25, 1999 10:50 > Subject: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 > > > >Wanted to buy M-17 1987 or newer. Does anyone know of > >someone who will be putting their boat on the market > >this winter? > > > >__________________________________________________ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Dennis W. Farrell" Subject: Re: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 Date: 26 Sep 1999 17:48:12 -0700 Mark: thanks for the information. I think I'm going to hibernate on this quest for a while !! -- dwf -----Original Message----- >Hello Dennis, > That "lurker" had one of the boats that I was checking into, but he sold >it before I had an opportunity to look at it. Good luck with your search. > Mark (still searching diligently) >Dvorscak >----- Original Message ----- >From: Dennis W. Farrell >To: >Sent: Saturday, September 25, 1999 12:36 PM >Subject: Re: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 > > >> Did you ever hear from the "lurker" that seemed to wanted to sell an M-17? >> Any idea what's happening with him or the boat? >> >> Thanks -- dwf >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Barefoot >> To: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com >> >> Date: Saturday, September 25, 1999 10:50 >> Subject: M_Boats: WTB: M-17 >> >> >> >Wanted to buy M-17 1987 or newer. Does anyone know of >> >someone who will be putting their boat on the market >> >this winter? >> > >> >__________________________________________________ >> >Do You Yahoo!? >> >Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com >> > >> >> >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Cosens, Eric D" Subject: M_Boats: Running, Anchor, Steaming Lights Date: 26 Sep 1999 21:32:15 -0500 I'm planning to add lights to my M-15 next spring and am in the process of thinking the whole project through. I have a couple questions for you veterans. Location: The location of the stern and anchor lights is pretty self-evident. My question involves the location of the bow lights. In reviewing the archives the 2 locations mentioned are the bow pulpit and the mast. The idea of mounting them on the mast is appealing because that will mean 1 less hole I have to make in the deck. Any reason(s) why I wouldn't want to mount the red/green combination light on the mast with a steaming light above it? Through Hull: How is the hole through which the wires are passed through the deck finished? Is there a fitting for this? My chief concern is controlling water ingress. Regards, Eric 1988 #412, "Lucy Maud" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Howard A Subject: M_Boats: M-17 Questions Date: 26 Sep 1999 23:11:29 -0500 First the M-17 I purchased was Osprey #285. I was glad to learn of the history from Thomas. Next, I have other questions about some structural details. On this M-17, there are two through-hull drains. One for the galley, and one for the cockpit scupper. These appear to be bronze or copper, and are glassed into the hull. Is there any history of these through-hulls failing, and what can be done about putting seacocks on these to prevent a sinking, if the hose were to fail? And, I notice the mast is stepped to the keel. Are there any schematics or drawings of the structural detail under this step (as in longitudinal stringers to spread the load) and how is the lead keel attached? Is it poured into the fiberglass keel, or bolted on? I see no evidence of bolts. And for those of you who have one, where, exactly is your bilge pump installed, and what size is it? Thanks, Howard #285 (not re-named yet) By the way, isn't there some sort of ceremony required when you change the name of a boat? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Roberta & Mark Dvorscak" Subject: M_Boats: Boatdename.html Date: 26 Sep 1999 21:33:23 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0866.C2B08D20 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01BF0866.C2B08D20" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01BF0866.C2B08D20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Howard, The attached file will give you the lowdown on boat denaming and = renaming. Mark (still searching diligently) = Dvorscak Boatdename.html ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01BF0866.C2B08D20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Howard,
The attached file will give you the = lowdown on boat=20 denaming and renaming.
     =    =20             =    =20         Mark (still searching diligently)=20 Dvorscak
 

 Boatdename.html
------=_NextPart_001_0006_01BF0866.C2B08D20-- ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0866.C2B08D20 Content-Type: text/html; name="Boatdename.html" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Boatdename.html" 48° Vigor's Interdenominational Boat Denaming = Ceremony
Vigor's Interdenominational =
Boat Denaming Ceremony
by John Vigor 		3D""

Due to an overwhelming number of requests for copies of John Vigor's = Interdenominational Boat Denaming Ceremony, we are rerunning it again. = Now, take care to save this one!

I = once knew a man in Florida who told me he'd owned 24 different=20 yachts and renamed every single one of them.
"Did = it bring you bad luck?" I asked.
"Not = that I'm aware of," he said. "You don't believe in those old=20 superstitions, do you?"
Well, = yes. Matter of fact, I do. And I'm not alone. Actually, it's not so=20 much being superstitious as being v-e-r-y=20 careful. It's an essential part of good seamanship.
Some = years ago, when I wanted to change the=20 name of my newly purchased 31-foot sloop from Our Way to Freelance, I = searched for a formal "denaming ceremony" to wipe=20 the slate clean in preparation for the renaming. I read all the books, = but I couldn't find one. What I did learn,=20 though, was that such a ceremony should consist of five parts: an = invocation, an expression of gratitude, a supplication, a re-dedication=20 and a libation. So I wrote my own short ceremony. Vigor's = inter-denominational denaming ceremony. It worked perfectly.=20 Freelance carried me and my family many thousands of deep-sea miles both = north and south of the equator, and we enjoyed good luck=20 all the way. I used the same ceremony recently to change the name of my = newly acquired Santana 22 from Zephyr to Tagati, a=20 Zulu word that means "magic," or "bewitched." We're hoping she'll sail = like a witch when I finally get her in the water this summer=20 after an extensive refit.
I'll = give you the exact wording of Vigor's denaming ceremony,=20 but first you must remove all physical traces of the boat's old name. = Take the old log book ashore, along with any other papers that bear=20 the old name. Check for offending books and charts with the name = inscribed. Be ruthless. Sand away the old name from the lifebuoys,=20 transom, top-side, dinghy, and oars. Yes, sand it away. Painting over is = not good enough. You're dealing with gods here, you=20 understand, not mere dumb mortals. If the old name is carved or etched, = try to remove it or, at the very minimum, fill it with putty and then=20 paint over. And don't place the new name anywhere on the boat before the = denaming ceremony is carried out. That's just tempting fate.
How = you conduct the ceremony depends entirely on you.=20 If you're the theatrical type, and enjoy appearing in public in your = yacht club blazer and skipper's cap, you can read it with flair on the=20 foredeck before a gathering of distinguished guests. But if you find = this whole business faintly silly and embarrassing, and only go along=20 with it because you're scared to death of what might happen if you = don't, you can skulk down below and mumble it on your own.=20 That's perfectly okay. The main thing is that you carry it out. The = words must be spoken.
I = compromised by sitting in Tagati's cockpit with the written-out=20 ceremony folded into a newspaper, so that any passerby would think I was = just reading the news to my wife, sitting opposite.=20 Enough people think I'm nuts already. Even my wife has doubts. The last = part of the ceremony, the libation, must be performed at the=20 bow, just as it is in a naming ceremony. There are two things to watch = out for here. Don't use cheap-cheap champagne,=20 and don't try to keep any for yourself. Buy a second bottle if you want = some. Use a brew that's reasonably expensive, based on your=20 ability to pay, and pour the whole lot on the boat. One of the things = the gods of the sea despise most is meanness, so don't try to do=20 this bit on the cheap.
What = sort of time period should elapse between this=20 denaming ceremony and a new naming ceremony? There's no fixed time. You = can do the renaming right after the denaming, if you want,=20 but I personally would prefer to wait at least 24 hours to give any = lingering demons a chance to clear out. (Scroll down for the wording of=20 the ceremony.)=20

Afterwards

Now you can pop the cork, shake the bottle and spray the whole of the = contents on the bow. When that's done, you can quietly go=20 below and enjoy the other bottle yourself. Incidentally, I had word from = a friend last month that the Florida yachtsman I mentioned=20 earlier had lost his latest boat, a 22-foot trailer-sailer. Sailed her = into an overhead power line. Fried her. She burned to the waterline.=20 Bad luck? Not exactly. He and his crew escaped unhurt. He was just very = careless. He renamed her, as usual, without bothering to=20 perform Vigor's famous interdenominational denaming ceremony. And this = time, at long last, he got what he deserved.

Vigor's = Denaming Ceremony
"In the name of all who have sailed aboard this ship in the past, and in = the name of all who may sail aboard her in the future,=20 we invoke the ancient gods of the wind and the sea to favor us with = their blessing today.
"Mighty Neptune, king of all that moves in or on the waves; and mighty = Aeolus (pronounced EE-oh-lus), guardian of the winds=20 and all that blows before them:
"We offer you our thanks for the protection you have afforded this = vessel in the past. We voice our gratitude that she has=20 always found shelter from tempest and storm and enjoyed safe passage to = port.
"Now, wherefore, we submit this supplication, that the name whereby this = vessel has hitherto been known (_____), be struck=20 and removed from your records.
"Further, we ask that when she is again presented for blessing with = another name, she shall be recognized and shall be=20 accorded once again the selfsame privileges she previously enjoyed.
"In return for which, we rededicate this vessel to your domain in full = knowledge that she shall be subject as always to=20 the immutable laws of the gods of the wind and the sea.
"In consequence whereof, and in good faith, we seal this pact with a = libation offered according to the hallowed ritual of the sea."=20
CLICK HERE for Printable = Page of Vigor's Denaming Ceremony=20
Christening Ceremony
After a boat is denamed, you simply need to rename it using the = traditional christening ceremony, preferably with Queen=20 Elizabeth breaking a bottle of champagne on the bow, and saying the = words:

"I name this ship ___________ and may she bring fair winds and good = fortune to all who sail on her."

John Vigor, an Oak Harbor = resident, is a boating writer and editor. He is the author of the = following books:

  • Danger, Dolphins & Ginger Beer (Simon & Schuster) a sailing=20 adventure novel for 8 to 12 year-olds.
  • The Practical mariner's Book of Knowledge (International Marine)
  • The Sailor's Assistant (International marine) For publication in 1999:
  • The Seaworthy Offshore Sailboat (International Marine)
  • 20 Small Sailboats to Take You Anywhere (Paradise Cay)

    • ...return to 48° North title = page.

    ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0866.C2B08D20-- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: bownez@juno.com Subject: M_Boats: Duluth visit Date: 27 Sep 1999 18:27:02 -0500 Hi Rachel, Did you get my E-mail about meeting in Duluth this Thursday? Can you make it after your dentist appointment? It would be nice to see you. Later, Bones ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: Re: M_Boats: Duluth visit Date: 27 Sep 1999 20:58:21 -0500 Dear Bones, Monday night Hi, sorry I didn't get back to you earlier, but my computer is wigging out and I haven't been able to use it; I'm amazed that it's working now. Yes, I'd love to meet on Thursday - I'll probably get out of the dentist's office sometime between 10:30 and 11:00, shall we still meet at Duluth Grill at 1:00? That would be fine with me - I may take a little snooze in the car between 11:00 and 1:00 since I'll have to leave my house at 6:30 a.m. (yuck). If you are going to e-mail back, could you "cc" a copy to ? I may have to use the computer at work, and that way I'll be able to get the mail. How was your sail on Theo's boat? And yes, I'd love to wander over to Barker's Island. I bet a lot of the boats are on the hard by now... Looking forward to our rendez-vous --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: rland@win.bright.net Subject: M_Boats: whoops (maybe) Date: 27 Sep 1999 21:00:22 -0500 whoops, didn't mean to send that to the whole list, if I did, I guess Bones' "re" is set up to go there. Sorry for the extra mail --- Rachel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: M_Boats: Small Craft Advisory Date: 27 Sep 1999 22:58:40 -0400 FYI- A few days ago, Keith posted a message from Josh Colvin, who is starting a small boat newsletter called "Small Craft Advisory." I thought it sounded interesting, so I emailed Josh and received the following. I am going to give it a try. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel -----Original Message----- Sent: September 23, 1999 11:21 AM Bill, Thanks for your reply. Actually I'd love to post the information about Small Craft Advisory on the M site, but I don't want to offend anyone with something that seems commercial. At any rate I'll give you the details. If you think the group would like to have me post the information, maybe you can post it or let me know how I can. Regarding the publication: It's a small format black and white publication in magazine style, though not nearly as slick as the glossy store bought variety (something like a "newszine"). It is our contention that there is a void in the "small boat specific" market (because we can never find anything to read!). While we are admittedly doing it for the love of the subject, we intend to keep actual production costs at a minimum in order to successfully fill each issue with good content and continue to grow. Below is a slightly more formal pitch. Thanks again. Sincerely, Josh Colvin Small Craft Advisory SMALL CRAFT ADVISORY Introducing SMALL CRAFT ADVISORY Boat Reviews: We take you inside! From in-depth technical information to owner feedback, we tell you about the real capabilities and features of some the best small craft in the world. Are Montgomery 17's really that fast? What kind of rigging configuration is best on the Venture 21? You'll get the scoop from the people who know! Interviews: From fearless adventurers to boat designers, we go one-on-one with the most important and legendary names in small boat cruising! What's it like to take a 14 ft. West Wight Potter head-on into a gale off the Alaskan Coast? Where to Sail: Do you really care about the crew that sailed their 50 foot yacht to Bermuda? We tell you about the places that interest the small boat cruiser. Places right in your back yard! From Lake Tahoe to The Florida Keys, and every bay, river or pond in between. Much more... Small Craft Advisory keeps you up-to-date with a calendar of events relating to trailerable and other small boats. We'll give you the latest info on products that make small boat cruising more safe, or more enjoyable. How-To articles and Classifieds (1 FREE per issue for subscribers) for all things related to small craft. Subscribe now and you'll get the premier issue featuring an in-depth interview with the legendary David Omick, the man who sailed his 14ft West Wight Potter from Seattle to Alaska. Also, we review the ComPac 19 sailboat. Is it the best boat made, under 20 feet? Plus much, much more! Subscribe: To receive a one-year subscription (6 issues), please send your check or money order for $19.95 to : Small Craft Advisory 907 Anchor Morro Bay CA 93442 email: Anchor907@aol.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bill Riker" Subject: RE: M_Boats: M-boats are more fun than R-boats Date: 27 Sep 1999 20:59:22 -0400 Yeah, Tod, while you were getting your fingers nearly ripped off, I was sitting on the lee side, cooler between my legs, making sandwiches. I sailed about 5 miles with hardly a touch of the tiller. Just to prove something to my self, I even went below and read the newspaper. I'm not sure what I proved, but I proved it in 13 knts of wind. Well, maybe it was 8-10 then - it came up later. Once, while below, the wind increased a bit, and Storm Petrel decided to go about. I actually had to go on deck and see sheet the jib on the other tack. I had a fast sail back with the Asynch spinnaker up, but I wouldn't want to fly it with any more wind that that. As nice looking as the M-boats are, the R-boats really are prettier. Bill Riker M-15 #184 Storm Petrel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: M_Boats: Flush Deck M17 For Sale Date: 27 Sep 1999 23:30:01 -0600 My wife says I have to sell my flush deck 17 before I can talk to Bob about a new boat, so... If someone is looking for a day-sailor with all of the superior attributes of the M17 plus even more speed 'cause it's a tall rig -- have I got a deal for them! The boat has some problems, the foredeck is delaminating and there's some cosmetic damage but the price will make up for everything. It's got a main, a kevlar 180 (yeah it's fast), a 130, a heavy weather jib, a spinnaker, and a trailer. If you're interested, call or email me and we can talk specifics and price...I am __motivated__ by the thought of a new boat. Keith Diehl - Salt Lake City, UT www.xmission.com/~kdiehl ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Keith Diehl" Subject: Fw: M_Boats: Flush Deck M17 For Sale Date: 27 Sep 1999 23:34:18 -0600 I probably should mention that my phone number is (801) 403-8209. You've got the email address. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Monday, September 27, 1999 11:30 PM > If you're interested, call or email me and we can talk specifics and > price...I am __motivated__ by the thought of a new boat. > > > Keith Diehl - Salt Lake City, UT > www.xmission.com/~kdiehl ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: bownez@juno.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Small Craft Advisory Date: 28 Sep 1999 07:22:49 -0500 The magazine sounds like something we can relate to. I ordered my subscription. Later, Michael "Bones" Bowden M17 #92 ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Marvin Wyckoff Subject: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 10:41:08 PDT I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased one from the factory. Marvin Wyckoff marvinw@ncd.com Newberg, OR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Robert Eeg Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 11:56:24 +0000 Hi Marvin Your in luck. We finished another factory new Montgomery 15 and its being delivered to the new owners in the Seattle area by Jerry Montgomery himself. Jerry was at the boatshop last saturday to pick up the new 15, named "Spitfire". (ivory and blue) He is transporting it to Seattle in the next few days. (Jerry loves to deliver boats. He enjoys being on the road) The boat is beautiful and I would be happy to give you the owners name and number. Just email me. We also have 2 new 17s ready to ship and they will be leaving the shop with-in 10 days. You welcome to visit the boatshop and we are always open on saturdays if you care to fly down to the Ontario Airport. (we can pick you up) The next group of 17s are going to: Signal Mountain, Tennessee, Leawood Kansas, Charlotte North Carolina, Plainfield NJ, Etc. A factory new M_15 went to Craig Lund and family from Durham, New Hampshire and his work number is (603) 868-2300. Nice guy. Thats his boat on the website. More photos of the 15 will be posted on the site soon. including photos of the mast carrier. More 17 photos will be posted including the M_17 we built with Bronze ports and bronze hardware. (and more) Also some new Nor'Sea 27 photos. Just received the Montgomery decals from the sign guy and will be sending them out to the 9 people that wanted them. (took him a while but hey, its free;-) Take care Bob www.NorseaYachts.com Marvin Wyckoff wrote: > I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, > Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased > one from the factory. > > Marvin Wyckoff > marvinw@ncd.com > Newberg, OR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Randy_Watkins@odp.tamu.edu Subject: Re[2]: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 14:28:23 CST Bob, please quit tempting us ( me anyway ) like this. my M15#194 would love to have a new sister M17 ( bronze ports sound great ) meanwhile, content with my 1981 M15. Regards Randy W College Station, Tx ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Author: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com at #Internet Hi Marvin Your in luck. We finished another factory new Montgomery 15 and its being delivered to the new owners in the Seattle area by Jerry Montgomery himself. Jerry was at the boatshop last saturday to pick up the new 15, named "Spitfire". (ivory and blue) He is transporting it to Seattle in the next few days. (Jerry loves to deliver boats. He enjoys being on the road) The boat is beautiful and I would be happy to give you the owners name and number. Just email me. We also have 2 new 17s ready to ship and they will be leaving the shop with-in 10 days. You welcome to visit the boatshop and we are always open on saturdays if you care to fly down to the Ontario Airport. (we can pick you up) The next group of 17s are going to: Signal Mountain, Tennessee, Leawood Kansas, Charlotte North Carolina, Plainfield NJ, Etc. A factory new M_15 went to Craig Lund and family from Durham, New Hampshire and his work number is (603) 868-2300. Nice guy. Thats his boat on the website. More photos of the 15 will be posted on the site soon. including photos of the mast carrier. More 17 photos will be posted including the M_17 we built with Bronze ports and bronze hardware. (and more) Also some new Nor'Sea 27 photos. Just received the Montgomery decals from the sign guy and will be sending them out to the 9 people that wanted them. (took him a while but hey, its free;-) Take care Bob www.NorseaYachts.com Marvin Wyckoff wrote: > I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, > Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased > one from the factory. > > Marvin Wyckoff > marvinw@ncd.com > Newberg, OR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Mclain, Mac" Subject: RE: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 14:51:46 -0700 Hi Marvin. My names Mac. I have a M15 #380 and I live in Beaverton, Oregon and you are welcome to look at it I'll pull it out of the garage. Contact me at macmclain@nike.com or 6149313. -----Original Message----- From: Marvin Wyckoff [mailto:marvinw@bv.ncd.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 10:41 AM To: montgomery_boats@lists.xmission.com Cc: marvinw@bv.ncd.com Subject: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased one from the factory. Marvin Wyckoff marvinw@ncd.com Newberg, OR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 18:09:06 PDT Bob: Bronze ports & hardware? Is this the 17 you were telling me about with the bowsprit? Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-boats are more fun than R-boats Date: 28 Sep 1999 22:12:08 PDT >Yeah, Tod, while you were getting your fingers nearly ripped off, I was >sitting on the lee side, cooler between my legs, making sandwiches. I >sailed about 5 miles with hardly a touch of the tiller. Just to prove >something to myself, I even went below and read the newspaper.... Rub it in, why don't yah? I think that Thistler is learning all on his own with no help (?) from = me...*S* Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Robert Eeg Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 19:10:05 +0000 Tod Yes, thats the one. It looks great. We are getting ready to ship it. We are waiting for the cushion maker to finish the interior cushions. I will be sending you some photos as soon as we take them. (after shes totally finished) The bowsprit is just used as an anchor platform and should come in handy while cruising. Take care Tod talk to you soon Bob "htmills@bright.net" wrote: > Bob: > > Bronze ports & hardware? Is this the 17 you were > telling me about with the bowsprit? > > Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "htmills@bright.net" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 22:29:18 PDT Bob, I can hardly wait! If I may, a suggestion for the pictures on the web page. Some of them show the boat (s) from more or less the same angle (near duplicates). As long as you are taking pictures, one from the sidedeck looking aft int= o the cockpit would be nice as would a better view of the interior (like = your new M15 pics). I have a few pictures of M15's on a trailer and sailing = that you might be interested in....(as long as the boat owners don't object: = Abbey G., Bill R., and Doug K.). The few that I got of 17's at the Chesapeake = didn't really turn out that well. The updated site with the new pictures is looking better with every updat= e. Tod ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sparsons@canby.com (Steve Parsons) Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 19:44:42 PDT Marvin, I have a M15, and am in Canby. There are a couple more M boats in this area. Give me a call, and we might be able to mesh schedules. Steve M15 159 Sojornen 266-9726 >I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, >Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased >one from the factory. > >Marvin Wyckoff >marvinw@ncd.com >Newberg, OR > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen gray Subject: Re: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 29 Sep 1999 03:23:26 +0000 At 02:47 PM 09/24/1999 -0700, you wrote: >Question to M15 owners. > >What anchor (size and style) would you recommend for an M15 to be used >predominantly in Southern California bays (Newport back and Mission). > >I saw a CQR 5lbs Shovel style, they were laughing about it calling it a toy >anchor. > >In the picture it looks like its about 10" in total. > >Could something like that be just right for the M15? > > I have a 4 lb. Bruce anchor that I bought from West Marine. Best anchor I've ever owned. Perfect size for the M-15. I have used it as a lunch hook for larger boats because its so small and easy to handle...even in deep water it holds great (it's hard to get 7:1 rode on Lake Mead where small coves can be 50' deep). Can't say enough good about Bruce anchors. Steve Las Vegas, Nevada ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "John Fell" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 18 Jan 1999 21:14:07 -0800 Hi Bob, I saw the Montgomery 15 graphics, Yes I would like them on my boat. I think they look great, and hopefully they will get you some more orders. I'll call you soon about it. Thanks John Fell -----Original Message----- >Tod >Yes, thats the one. > >It looks great. We are getting ready to ship it. > >We are waiting for the cushion maker to finish the >interior cushions. > >I will be sending you some photos as soon as we >take them. (after shes totally finished) > >The bowsprit is just used as an anchor platform and >should come in handy while cruising. > >Take care Tod > >talk to you soon >Bob > >"htmills@bright.net" wrote: > >> Bob: >> >> Bronze ports & hardware? Is this the 17 you were >> telling me about with the bowsprit? >> >> Tod > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Roberta & Mark Dvorscak" Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 28 Sep 1999 21:48:05 -0700 If all goes as planned I will be trucking down I-5 through the Portland area with an M17 in tow on Sunday afternoon (10-2) . Mark Dvorscak ----- Original Message ----- Cc: Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 10:41 AM > I would like to see both the Montgomery 15 & 17. Are there any in the Portland, > Oregon area? Also I would like to talk to someone who has recently purchased > one from the factory. > > Marvin Wyckoff > marvinw@ncd.com > Newberg, OR > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AZSKYBUM@aol.com Subject: M_Boats: Running, Anchor, Steaming Lights Date: 29 Sep 1999 11:14:24 EDT This months Sail magazine has a good article on placement and angle of lights. My M-17 has a tricolor at the very top of the mast, it works great but is the first thing you hit going under a too low bridge or the first thing you hit when you back up too far and hit the mast. Oh yea and when you drop the mast it gets broken off also, I knew I had bought three of them! They come in different sizes the small one works the best and is about $35- from West Marine. Curtis Clark Scottsdale, Arizona ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 30 Sep 1999 19:56:40 -0400 Steve, Thanks for the good words about the 4 lb. Bruce. I have been trying to find one for my M15, but haven't had any luck. Did you special order it from WEST, since the only model they list in their catalog is the 11 lb. Bruce? Connie M15 #400 ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Conbert H Benneck Subject: Re: M_Boats: Want to see a Montgomery 15 & 17 Date: 30 Sep 1999 19:19:26 -0400 Bob, Just got the latest Mongomery News Letter and saw the photos of your new M-15. Congratulations! It looks great. I just wish that the printed photo was a bit clearer so that I could pick out all your modifications, and install them on my boat! Connie M15 #400 ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Francene Lebowitz Subject: M_Boats: capsize Date: 30 Sep 1999 20:56:54 +0100 M15 owners- I looked in the archives for info on capsizing a 15. Not much there. Anyone know of this ever happening to one, or is the 275lb. ballast more than adequate to prevent this under all but the most adverse conditions? Just curious, and seeking peace of mind as well! Fran M15#236 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen gray Subject: Re: M_Boats: Anchors for M15 Date: 01 Oct 1999 04:29:02 +0000 At 07:56 PM 09/30/1999 -0400, you wrote: >Steve, >Thanks for the good words about the 4 lb. Bruce. I have been trying to >find one for my M15, but haven't had any luck. Did you special order it >from WEST, since the only model they list in their catalog is the 11 lb. >Bruce? > >Connie >M15 #400 I bought mine a few years back at the Newport Beach store. I have not seen them in the catalog for a while. We have a new West Marine that just opened last month, if I get a chance I'll stop in and check to see if they are still available. Steve M-15, M-7'11"