From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #390 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Thursday, June 11 1998 Volume 02 : Number 390 In this issue: - Re: Unjustified Karl Berger opinions Re: Unjustified Karl Berger opinions Re: New Ribot Disc Re[2]: Another Downtown Question Fishing with John Lurie + Henry Kaiser comments on Parachute Year s box African Music (was Kronos, again/Africa) ny spots and things to do Source for Locus Solus Records While we're on the subject of Int'l music... Re: Source for Locus Solus Records Re: Another Downtown Question Horvitz, Zorn, E#, (drummer) quartet ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 08:49:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Wiry and Wired Subject: Re: Unjustified Karl Berger opinions To the Berger-curious: I absolutely agree with JS's opinions below & would like to add that my favorite Berger is a quartet disc on Black Saint called Around. It is surprisingly pretty & rewards a close listen (you know, staring at the speakers) as well as making outstanding dinner music. A promising-looking trio disc with the word Crystal in the title came out soon afterward & left me absolutely cold. Regards WW - ---Jeff Schwartz wrote: > > I believe Berger is on Don Cherry's Blue Note albums, > which I think rule (and have been reissued in those > annoying limited editions). All Kinds of Time is > wonderful, Conversations OK. > -- > Jeff Schwartz > jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu > http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html > > - > > == Love? What is it? Most natural painkiller what there is. LOVE. --the last words of William Burroughs _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:08:53 -0400 From: Sean Terwilliger Subject: Re: Unjustified Karl Berger opinions Just visited the FAX page and there am informed that Berger and Namlook have put out a duo... Might be intresting (as will the Opera mentioned on the Axiom page...) - -Sean Wiry and Wired wrote: > To the Berger-curious: > > I absolutely agree with JS's opinions below & would like to add that > my favorite Berger is a quartet disc on Black Saint called Around. It > is surprisingly pretty & rewards a close listen (you know, staring at > the speakers) as well as making outstanding dinner music. A > promising-looking trio disc with the word Crystal in the title came > out soon afterward & left me absolutely cold. > > Regards > WW > > ---Jeff Schwartz wrote: > > > > I believe Berger is on Don Cherry's Blue Note albums, > > which I think rule (and have been reissued in those > > annoying limited editions). All Kinds of Time is > > wonderful, Conversations OK. > > -- > > Jeff Schwartz > > jeffs@bgnet.bgsu.edu > > http://www.bgsu.edu/~jeffs/main.html > > > > - > > > > > > == > Love? What is it? Most natural painkiller what there is. LOVE. --the last words of William Burroughs > > _________________________________________________________ > DO YOU YAHOO!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > - - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 08:50:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Wiry and Wired Subject: Re: New Ribot Disc - ---Jamie F Graves wrote: > the disc is a pretty straight and accurate > representation of their style > Nothing really that new here though, just a bunch of > musicians having a good time. If the disc is like the single performance I heard, most of the tunes are by a little known & absolutely fantastic composer, Arsenio Rodriguez who will be new to most listeners. I raced out & got a representative disc by AR immediately & love it. It's called COmmo Se Goza en el Barrio & comes from Tumbao Cuban Classics (TCD-022). Let's dance! WW == Love? What is it? Most natural painkiller what there is. LOVE. --the last words of William Burroughs _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 98 11:38:08 -0500 From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Re[2]: Another Downtown Question Patrice wrote: >This kind of puzzles me. Zillion of records are released every year with many >of them rehashing cliches and tricks defined/introduced by others long time >ago, and keep on getting the stamp of "cutting edge". My musical knowledge is >far from being what I would like it to be, but as far as I know, Horvitz' >style is pretty unique. Are you bothered that he still keeps on writing >melodies? Should he do 100% free improv like zillions of others to not look >"dated" (because rehashing TOPOGRAPHY OF THE LUNGS 30 years after does not >seem dated by most of the "on the edge" audience)? Ouch! That's certainly a nail deserving to be hit on the head, though parsing out which performances are rehashes and which are not gets a bit sticky. While I enjoy the President releases (and think they're an interesting precursor to Previte's recent fusion investigations), I think I hear at least part of what William was complaining about. Horvitz' electric piano-y sound does tend to impart a slickening quality (though, yes he writes lovely melodies) and I recall thinking at the time that I was glad for Sharp's participation in the band as he manages to inject a bit of grit into the proceedings. A number of other records from the downtown folk at the time (off-hand, I'm thinking of Moss', Tacuma's, Arto's, etc) utilized a drum machine sound that I'm sure was the cat's meow then, but quickly (in fact, instantly) sounded horribly thin and shallow. I think my favorite of Horvitz' from that period was his solo, 'Dinner at Eight' on Dossier. BTW, any Robin Holcomb fans out there? I find some of her song-format works to be very beautiful, her lyrics refreshingly honest and, for that matter, I loved her 'classical' release, 'Little Three'. Anyone know what, if anything, she has planned for the near future? Brian Olewnick - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 09:31:29 -0700 From: "Allen Gittelson" Subject: Fishing with John Lurie + Henry Kaiser comments on Parachute Year s box Greetings, Two items of interest to this group. 1) Regarding the Fishing with John: I just stumbled across these notes which can be found at http://www.sfweekly.com which is from a weekly here in San Francisco. John Lurie, became a trace ruffled in the mid-'80s when his screen performances in Jim Jarmusch's Stranger Than Paradise and Down by Law brought him much-deserved publicity. Acting was just a diversion for Lurie. His true darling was, and still is, the somewhat infamous, wholly irreverent, oftentimes ingenious Lounge Lizards -- a mutable nine-piece that has been creating skewed jazz since 1979. Despite his grumbling, though, the connection between the Lizards and movies seems permanent: Lurie gladly received screen time in The Last Temptation of Christ, Wild at Heart, and Blue in the Face, and of the band's 18 recordings, half are film scores. To make matters worse, whenever the Lounge Lizards have had time to release a new studio album (as opposed to their numerous live recordings) a soundtrack has been nipping at their heels. In 1987, it was No Pain for Cakes followed by Down by Law; in 1989, it was Voice of Chunk followed by Mystery Train. Now, in 1998, we have what is possibly the Lizards' most notable -- and perhaps spiritual -- work. Queen of Ears finds Lurie tempering his cartoon antics with touches of African juju rhythm, Gnawan harmony, Burundi drumming, and klezmer noodling. Sadly, few people will be able to regard this work without also considering Fishing With John, the newly released soundtrack that accompanies Lurie's brilliantly absurd fishing show -- hosted, written, and directed by himself -- which is scheduled to debut on the Independent Film Channel on Monday, June 15, at 8:30 p.m., and on Bravo on Friday, June 19, at 11:30 p.m. The first six episodes find Lurie shark fishing with Jim Jarmusch in Montauk, snapper fishing with Tom Waits in Jamaica, snook fishing with Matt Dillon in Costa Rica, ice fishing with Willem Dafoe in Maine, and giant-squid hunting with Dennis Hopper in Thailand (a two-parter). After seeing Fishing With John, it's impossible to separate Lurie's signature sax line from the droll voice of narrator Robb Webb: "These are real men, doing real things." You will be forever haunted by images of Waits getting seasick, Dillon flapping his arms during the sacred fishing dance, Dafoe offering his armpit as an answer to hypothermia, and Hopper all hopped up on pingpong. For the sake of upright music appreciation, check out John Lurie & the Lounge Lizards before the show airs, at the Fillmore on Saturday, June 13, at 9 p.m. Tickets are $25; call 775-7722. I'd be very interested in seeing this, but alas I have no way to do so. I do not have nor desire cable television (except for viewing this). 2) I saw this on the Henry Kaiser web pages which can be found at: http://php.indiana.edu/~mpiper/HKMain.html *THE PARACHUTE YEARS 1977-1980 (TWINS/LA CROSSE CD), John Zorn, Tzadik TZ 7316-1. HK needs to relate an anecdote about this product: Eugene Chadbourne told me that he had written great historical notes for this documentry CD of the group TWINS recorded back in 1977. He told me that I would really enjoy them. Then when I got my copy I was surprised that the notes were not printed in the CD. I wondered why and asked Chadbourne. He said that Zorn thought I would be offended by the notes and and so he didn't include them. I was telling this to ROVA's Larry Ochs and he said: no, that was wrong. Zorn didn't print the notes because Chadbourne took too much credit for "Zorn's ideas." ...Oh well .....some things never do change......... I emailed Eugene and asked to see the censored notes. But he had lost them. Very interesting. Ciao, Allen - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 13:00:48 -0400 From: Perfect Sound Forever Subject: African Music (was Kronos, again/Africa) A lot of my favorite music from Africa comes from Nigeria. Sunny Ade (who's playing later this month in NYC at Tramps), Fela Kuti (RIP), Babatunde Olatunji (who's still touring), I. K. Dairo and Ebenezer Obey are just a few (of many performers) who are worth checking out. Glad to see there haven't been any 'ripping out the culture' arguments here about Western musicians-that's a real crock. Jason - -- Perfect Sound Forever online music magazine perfect-sound@furious.com http://www.furious.com/perfect - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:39:51 +0000 From: Yin Pin Subject: ny spots and things to do hi, this has probably be asked before on the list. but was wondering if anyone could recommend places, record stores (besides cadence, downtown music gallery and northcountry) and things to do in new york between 21st-23rd of june. thanks. - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:05:38 -0400 From: David Keffer Subject: Source for Locus Solus Records Hello Folks on the Zorn-List, I am looking to pick up some records on the new label, "Locus Solus". It is the Japanese arm of Recommended=20 Records. Anybody know of a mail order site for these records? The two releases on Locus Solus so far are: Charles Hayward=20 "Double Agent(s): Live in Japan Volume 2"=20 Locus Solus Records - LSR 002 - released May, 1998=20 compact disc=20 featuring C. Hayward with Keiji Haino, Tatsuya Yoshida,=20 Yoshihide Otomo, and Peter Br=F6tzmann.=20 =20 Charles Hayward=20 "Escape from Europe: Live in Japan Volume 1" Locus Solus Records - LSR 001 - released 1996=20 compact disc=20 Thanks. David K. - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 11:02:38 PDT From: "Silent Watcher" Subject: While we're on the subject of Int'l music... Hoping some knowledgeable list-member might be able to help me out with this : I just obtained a ney (Egyptian flute) and a rhaita (Moroccan double reed instrument) and need some help. Basically, with the Ney at least, I can't figure out how to play it. It has six finger holes, but nowehere to blow into like a western flute does. It's open on both ends, but neither end appears to be for the purpose of blowing into. Is it possible there's some sort of mouthpiece that I don't have? As far as the rhaita...it's been compared to an oboe, and I was lead to believe that you could use oboe reeds with it. There is no mouthpiece, but there is an opening about 7/16" in diameter at the top. Being unfamiliar with the physical characteristics of an oboe, is this in any way similar, or is there a mouthpiece involved here too, like the woodwind instruments that I'm familiar with. Any help at all would be extremely appreciated. Peace, SW For Sale/Want list and Bill Laswell Discography at : http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Underground/7093 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:18:37 -0400 From: cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupree) Subject: Re: Source for Locus Solus Records >>>>> "David" == David Keffer writes: David> I am looking to pick up some records on the new label, David> "Locus Solus". It is the Japanese arm of Recommended David> Records. Anybody know of a mail order site for these David> records? The two releases on Locus Solus so far are: David> Charles Hayward "Double Agent(s): Live in Japan Volume David> 2" Locus Solus Records - LSR 002 - released May, 1998 David> compact disc featuring C. Hayward with Keiji Haino, David> Tatsuya Yoshida, Yoshihide Otomo, and Peter David> Brotzmann. Charles Hayward "Escape from Europe: David> Live in Japan Volume 1" Locus Solus Records - LSR 001 - David> released 1996 compact disc Wayside has Escape from Europe, crediting it as a UK release though. They are the US distributor for ReR, so I'd keep checking back with them at http://members.aol.com/Cuneiform2/cuneiform.html. - --- Caleb T. Deupree ;; Opinions... funny thing about opinions, they can change. Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. (Pablo Picasso) - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:22:08 -0700 From: dtapia@unoco.edu (Douglas Tapia) Subject: Re: Another Downtown Question >I sort of asked this one last week, but I'll try again, especially after >finding The President "Bring Yr Camera" today for $2.99. On first listen >this sounds really dated, to me some of the sounds are a little hard >to get through, but what I'm wanting to ask is: how do people feel that >this music has held up (that of Sharp, Horvitz, Previte, Frisell, Zorn). I'm aware that another very enlightning conversation is even now underway on this subject between Brent Burton and Patrice Roussel, but when I tried to tie in their conversation with my opinions on this subject I found myself quite bewildered, besides they have said really all their is to be said about the merits of uniqueness and the DX-7 .-} So on to my opinion of all this. I think the problem with a lot of the music from the '80s is that musicians were given, for the first time, new tools that enabled them to work in a cloistered fashion. This is especially evident, to me, in the music of Horvitz and Frisell from this period. Yes, the sounds are difficult to get through, but the problem is this: Much of the music is defined by the sounds. (Remember, this was the time when "New Age" began to boom.) People with rudementary keyboard skills were sitting down at synths and letting the timbres suggest the pieces that were being written. Wayne was busy plaing with drum machines and samplers. And, as I've always asserted, just because I, as a keyboardist, can now play a saxophone or drum sample with relativly good tone and intonation, does not mean that I really ought to. I think that it's fair to say that in a few cases some of these musicians traded in their normally good taste for an opprutunity to showcase these new instruments in a way that was atypical of their composition/improvisition styles. This era if fascinating for this reason: Taking Horwitz as an example, I think that the first President albums were fairly weak, as their focus was really more on the cool new sounds and slick production than on real musical substance, though this in itself was an esential part of these musicians' development, and therefore important. (Remember, this was the age of pink spandex and big hair) In the Frisell and Horvitz albums of this era, I think that the technical learning curve can be seen quite plainly. Remember, when this stuff was brand new nothing really sounded real and there was nobody who could make drum machines and sequencers groove. Now at the close of the millennium, not only are there people who can sequence tracks that are nearly indistinguishable from "real" players. (Now we have drumers who intentionally immitate drum machines. . .but that's a different post) Horwitz now creates music with much more substance and melodic content than the earily days of the President. He's gotten used to the instruments and has incorporated them into his sound/concept. _Miracle Mile_ is a great example of technology and musicality coming together in a good way. As for Frisell. . . Well, you'll note that Bill hasn't been using a lot of drum machine lately. In fact, Bill's had one semi-acoustic project after another lately. Horvitz and Previte have jam bands or bar bands, if you will. (Bobby's term, you'll note) Zorn's output seems rather acoustic instrument centered as well, though as you've pointed out, his stuff ages pretty well. I suspect this has to do with Zorn's constant avoidence of anything that smells like mainstream. I think we're all in agreement that every era has a signiture sound. We're all influenced by changing socital values. We either take some part of that and use it, or we react against it. This forms the "sound of an era" Certainly, we are seeing a shift from lush, electronic synth textures to a newfound facination with acoustic based music. Take the fairly recent renewed interest in country music, folk music, ethnic/world music, etc. Also look at the trend in jazz away from fusion to earthy, funky sounds ala MMW, Zony Mash, Henery Thredgill, etc. Will we look back and say, "wow! that sounds really late '90s!"? Almost surely. - --peace Doug - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 13:36:59 -0500 From: Dan Hewins Subject: Horvitz, Zorn, E#, (drummer) quartet Anybody know what label this disc will be released on and when? And who is the drummer, Previte or Wollesen? Thanks, Dan - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V2 #390 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? 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