From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #163 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Monday, November 13 2000 Volume 03 : Number 163 In this issue: - A Fine Line Bill Dixon Re: Zorn List Digest V3 #159 Re: Zorn List Digest V3 #162 ostertag and cage Charms in Vienna/Fennesz vs. Krakauer question Re: question Re: question RE: question Re: Otomo Yoshihide/Ground-Zero Fennesz vs. Krakauer Boredoms, not a burden Re: Boredoms, not a burden Re: Otomo Yoshihide/Ground-Zero ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:42:21 EST From: Velaires@aol.com Subject: A Fine Line Just bought Don Byron's new disc of the same title. Wodering what other people's thoughts were on it. Personally, I think it's one of his weaker ones -- so far. With a musician like Don, there might be something you don't get the first time around. Then again, I said that about NU BLAXPLOITATION, and it hasn't really come up in my estimation. skip h - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 02:21:12 EST From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Bill Dixon I'm really, really enjoying the new Bill Dixon on FMP, Berlin Abbozzi. it's a quartet from 11/99, Dixon, Klaus Koch and Matthias Bauer both on double basses, and Tony Oxley on drums. it's a shame that Dixon's work over the past decade hasn't received more recognition. I think there's an interesting parallel to be drawn between this stretch of his work and the Giuffre/Bley/Swallow discs from the early sixties. in this parallel, Dixon's two Vade Mecum records would be the rough equivalent of Fusion and Thesis, beautiful free chamber jazz with an edge, and the new FMP would be Free Fall, an attempt to stretch the formula farther out, more raucous and exploring. anyway, I'm a big fan of all six of these CDs. I'd go so far as to call all of them pretty darned essential. I think Dixon's duo CDs with Oxley from earlier this year, Papyrus, volumes 1 and 2, are less successful and I'm not exactly sure why. Volume 2 especially does very little for me, it feels like somehow all the magic has been drained away. anyone else feel the same or differently? Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 15:12:51 GMT+0100 From: "Jeroen de Boer" Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V3 #159 Yes, and Brain is the new G'n'R drummer.. > .is there any truth to the rumor that buckethead is the new guitar player for > guns n roses ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? > > - > - ---------------------------------------- Jeroen de Boer music director Open Electronic Festival/Cyberslag Foundation Munnekeholm 10, 9711JA Groningen The Netherlands tel/fax: +31 (0)503634676/(0)503632209 gsm: +31 (0)624814506 usva-th2@bureau.rug.nl http://www.cyberslag.com - ---------------------------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 00:26:50 -0600 From: Rob Alley Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V3 #162 Does anyone out there know where I can get some videos of Masada and/or Dave Douglas? Thanks, Rob Alley ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:47:21 -0500 From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: ostertag and cage oops -- deleted the msg about the ostertag reissue -- the one built on samples of a boy crying as shovels dig the grave for his father in el salvador (slightly different than the original description). i had it, listened to it once, thought it brilliantly executed and utterly wrenching, and sold it hoping to never hear it again. it's not especially 'musical,' and it's emotionally pretty tough going (was for me, anyway). so, think twice, i guess. and if you don't have any ostertag, don't start there. (don't start with 'fear no love,' either.) the 'say no more' series is the most enjoyable of what i've heard. nice comments re cage. i really like him, and think his contributions as a philosopher of aesthetics by far outpace any of his other work. kg np: archie shepp - attica blues note to new yorkers: 12th street books, a relatively new bookstore west of university place, has a fair bit of old vinyl generally priced between 2 and 4 $s. nothing too outside when i was there yesterday, but some carla bley, andrew hill, lots of older stuff (basie, roach). a miles davis 10-inch on prestige for $10, too. and, more to their point i'd guess, it's quite a nice bookstore. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:59:32 +0100 From: "Diego Gruber" Subject: Charms in Vienna/Fennesz vs. Krakauer Zornlisters, Being with my hands full the last days, it's been some time already since I saw Dave Douglas and Charms of the Night Sky here in Vienna, but I didn't want to miss the opportunity to write about my first live experience on the music discussed on this list. the concert took place on a wonderful venue, the Wiener Konzerthaus, and i had a very good seat, having gotten there early. I was pretty curious to see the rhythmic section going on without a drummer. there was some kind of special symbiosis going on on that stage, especially between guy and dave. he looked so inspired from his own music and delighted to hear the other musicians performing it. i need not say how great they are since you've seen them yourselves. the playlist had everything, from long, sentimental pieces, to crazy east european stuff, to noises coming out of disassembled instruments, coughs, and hitting the chairs against the floor. more than once did they provoked a good intended laugh. they came out twice for an encore, which was pretty neat, the crowd applauded for quite a long time every time they left the stage, and i think the vienna crowds must be demanding. i think most of the tunes they played wil be featured on a new record coming soon, that will be called 'a thousand evenings', so I'm really looking forward to that. One of the pieces was said to be performed regularly for a dance ensemble, and other one was dedicated to a Russian composer who emigrated to America and was one of the pioneers of Klezmer (according to Douglas this man hated to be called a klezmer musician, as it had a demeritorial meaning back then, so we should just call hima wonderful musician). His name was David Tarre or something like that, couldn't pick it up really. Does anyone know something about this composer? Coming weekend there are two interesting performances from artists i've only heard mentioned here. Fennesz and David Krakauer. I know they are way different and perhaps not comparable performances, but I'd like to know what to expect from them cause maybe I'll have to pick between just one of them. The Fennesz performance (together with Radian) will apparently include visuals and is called "Music for 17 Loudspeakers", which sounds intriguing. But I'm definitely more familiar with klezmer thanks to Masada. Cheers, D. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:12:25 +0100 From: "Diego Gruber" Subject: question Does a piece for prepared piano, in its written form, explain how the piano must be "prepared"? Or does the artist prepare the piano his own way and therefore the piece will sound different depending on what the artist put in there? D. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:13:05 -0800 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Subject: Re: question On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 18:12:25 +0100 "Diego Gruber" wrote: > > Does a piece for prepared piano, in its written form, explain how the piano > must be "prepared"? Or does the artist prepare the piano his own way and > therefore the piece will sound different depending on what the artist put in > there? Check out Michael Nyman's book on experimental music for a photograph of Cage's details on how to prepare a piano. Patrice. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 11:32:23 -0500 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: question On Mon, Nov 13, 2000 at 06:12:25PM +0100, Diego Gruber wrote: > Does a piece for prepared piano, in its written form, explain how the piano > must be "prepared"? Or does the artist prepare the piano his own way and > therefore the piece will sound different depending on what the artist put in > there? Cage's scores explain the preparations in fine detail. There's still some range of difference due to the physical aspects of the various pianos and materials, but it's pretty clear what's meant. - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:29:20 -0700 From: "Matthew W Wirzbicki (S) " Subject: RE: question >Does a piece for prepared piano, in its written form, explain how the >piano >must be "prepared"? The only prepared piano material I've ever learned to the point of relative performance is Cage's "perilous night." I had quite a bit of dificulty deciding exactly what he wanted. He specified only "bolt and nut" or "rubber" with no indication of size or type. He does specify between which strings of each unison, however, the lenghts from the dampers are subject to complete error as the distances are different on every piano (in other words it's very difficult to tell which partials he wants). There is a great text called "the well prepared piano" (by Bunger I belive) which is unfortunately OOP as far as I know. I found a copy in our library but without that I would've had very great difficulty preparing the piano in a semi acceptable manner. In other words if Cage wanted specific sounds to be the same performance after performance then he surely didn't give explicit enough directions IMO. Matt Wirzbicki - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:40:24 GMT From: "Arthur Gadney" Subject: Re: Otomo Yoshihide/Ground-Zero Hello, >1) Ground Zero. (snip) but you can't really go wrong, >except for the Cassiber remix disc. I don't really know about that. Like Jon said, the Ground Zero CDs are extremely different. From the "Last Concert" CD which is probably *the* most intense unlistnable noise CD I have ever heard, to "Null & Void" which has some really beautiful quiet parts, or the minimalist "Consume Red" to the ultra eclectic genre marathon "Plays Standarts" My personal favorite is "Plays Standarts". I guess this is concidered extremely old fashioned by now by most of you, but I really love those tunes. It features only covers of many, many different types of music. All brilliantly arranged and SUPERBLY played. I don't think there has been an album so (succesfully) varried since the first Naked City CD. Also, this is my recommendation as a good place to begin, since it has alot of different styles, including some which are in main focus on some of the other Ground Zero CDs. >2) his pre-1998 plunderphonic style turntable work. (snip) he doesn't > >perform in this style anymore, Not at all? What about when improvising? I heard that he would play with the great great drummer Han Bennink later this year. I can't imagine Han playing along sinewave tones!! But then again, you can never know with Han... Related question: Does Otomo still performe with Yamataka Eye? >reportedly not thrilled about Asphodel's recent release of a duo record >with >Christian Marclay which they'd been holding onto for a few years. Strange. The stuff I heard from it is among his best. >3) his current fascination with wave-based minimal electronics. Will this never end? I actually thought this scene was more or less dead by now. How much more to be said with only sinewaves? Seems everyone and his mother is doing this stuff with their powerbooks, these days... >his best work yet in this >vein may be on the brand new Otomo Yoshihide/Voice Crack-Bits, Bots and >Signs, Still, I have to admit, this does sound very interesting! ARTHUR_G _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 16:31:56 -0500 From: "Jesse Kudler" Subject: Fennesz vs. Krakauer > Coming weekend there are two interesting performances from artists i've only > heard mentioned here. Fennesz and David Krakauer. I know they are way > different and perhaps not comparable performances, but I'd like to know what > to expect from them cause maybe I'll have to pick between just one of them. > The Fennesz performance (together with Radian) will apparently include > visuals and is called "Music for 17 Loudspeakers", which sounds intriguing. Go, go, go! Fennesz is one of the very best of the recent young computer musicians, and everything I've heard by him is great. He's been particularly adept at melding noise with melodic or at least harmonic material (chords), so don't be scared off if you're expecting an inhospitable wall of noise. He also has a couple of recent live CD's out (neither of which I've yet heard unfortunately) that have been getting very good reviews, so I think he'll be a good bet. Radian is also quite great. They're a bass/drum/synth trio who play a kind of mixture of scaled-back Mego-style sine-tones and noise atop an almost robotic syncopated back-beat. That may sound boring, but it's surprisingly effective. They're really masterful at switching textures and building tension just by having the bass and drums drop out and return or by slowly shifting the synth tones. Their fist EP is live too, so you can definitely expect them to be rewarding outside the studio. So, yeah, go to the show. - -Jesse - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 13:34:17 -0800 From: "Fag music" Subject: Boredoms, not a burden Thanks, guys.The recommendations for John Cage will help me getting into this stuff.Right then,I wanna know:besides lead singing for Boredoms,does Yamatsuka/Yamatanka/Yamataka(kill me,for I dunno which one of these guys actually exist)Eye have another stuff out?I know he hangs around a lot with Zorn,and I just listened to their their album called Nani nani,it is great.But I wanna know:does anyone have a commented discography of him,or something????Is there actually a solo Eye album,like Adult themes for voice,for example???I'd like to hear some comments on it.So,anyone???? Screams, I know what you did last summer - ------------------------------------------------------------ How do you spell EMAIL? You @ 37.com - The world's easiest free Email address Get your free email at: http://email.37.com/ - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2000 13:46:56 -0800 From: Chris Westphal Subject: Re: Boredoms, not a burden eYe has a side project called Audiosports that is Japanese hip hop. Highly recommended if you like hip hop. This is a more subdued eYe from a vocal standpoint but creatively still as exciting. He also has quite a few other side projects (as do the other Boredoms) but I haven't checked any of them out. (c) At 01:34 PM 11/13/2000 -0800, Fag music wrote: >Thanks, > guys.The recommendations for John Cage will help me getting into > this stuff.Right then,I wanna know:besides lead singing for Boredoms,does > Yamatsuka/Yamatanka/Yamataka(kill me,for I dunno which one of these guys > actually exist)Eye have another stuff out?I know he hangs around a lot > with Zorn,and I just listened to their their album called Nani nani,it is > great.But I wanna know:does anyone have a commented discography of him,or > something????Is there actually a solo Eye album,like Adult themes for > voice,for example???I'd like to hear some comments on it.So,anyone???? >Screams, >I know what you did last summer > > > >------------------------------------------------------------ >How do you spell EMAIL? You @ 37.com - The world's easiest free Email address >Get your free email at: http://email.37.com/ > > > >- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 17:07:46 EST From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Otomo Yoshihide/Ground-Zero not sure why you crossposted your response to the zorn-list exactly, but here goes... <> it's funny that you call Last Concert unlistenable noise and Consume Red minimalist, since the bulk of Last Concert is a live performance of Consume Red. <> yeah, this concert is on November 30 in Tokyo. Otomo is playing guitar and electronics, which I'm guessing will be the sinewave tones you don't seem too thrilled by. he has been playing more guitar also lately, including in Taku Sugimoto's guitar quartet, which is composed music and is supposedly flat out gorgeous, although I haven't heard it. as a side note, whoever on the zorn-list was drooling over the thought of Otomo's solo guitar CD-R, edition of 50, I got a copy and you're not missing too much. however, no, I'm not selling it. <> not for a while, no. <<>reportedly not thrilled about Asphodel's recent release of a duo record >with >Christian Marclay which they'd been holding onto for a few years. Strange. The stuff I heard from it is among his best.>> personally, I didn't like most of it. but whether you or I like it is pretty irrelevant, the point being that he evidently feels that it's not representative of his current work and interests. <> but how many of them are doing it well? wait until you hear the Toshimaru Nakamura/Sachiko M. CD I'll be releasing early next year. brilliant collaborative sine wave improv, with a 36 minute track centerpiece. it will melt your mind, in a good way, of course. the real question, if you ask me, is "how much more to be said with saxophones?" Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V3 #163 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? Email the list owner at zorn-list-owner@lists.xmission.com