Re: Tristano & the studio

From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #588 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Monday, October 8 2001 Volume 03 : Number 588 In this issue: - Tristano & the studio boston tips? RE: Tristano & the studio Re: Tristano & the studio Re: cd vs. cdr PSF label Re: PSF label Frisell w/ Holland and Jones... Re: Witness RE: Atk & Fris Bith-Aneth Meanings Re: Frisell w/ Holland and Jones... Re: Witness No Depression/Tortoise live Re: No Depression/Tortoise live ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2001 18:38:16 EDT From: CuneiWay@aol.com Subject: Tristano & the studio >These two examples spring to mind easily, are there more examples of >straight jazz spiced with studio techniques? Lennie Tristano rather famously sped up his playing on some solo tracks (& possibly also trio tracks? my memory is failing me) on his first (?) Atlantic album. I think "Turkish Mambo" may be the best known example. He got reamed in the press by the critics of the day for doing so. So much so that several albums after that felt compelled to mention something along the lines that "there is not studio manipulation or trickery involved" It's sorta odd that he did that in the first place, as he was such a great technician that he probably could've played the sped up stuff naturally! Maybe he just liked the un-natural timbres that the speeding up produced. Steve - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2001 23:30:09 +0000 From: "Kurt Gottschalk" Subject: boston tips? hi -- i may be making a trip to boston, not far from new york, but i've never been. any tips on checking for gigs? upcoming things i should know about? where thurston's store is? thanks. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 0:8:2 -0400 From: "Matthew Mitchell" Subject: RE: Tristano & the studio - ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Indeed he did. The 'famous' trio one on which he sped up his piano is called 'Line Up,' I believe. Its a really weird solo, basically a solo played over the changes to A flat. All sorts of really advanced stuff for the time in that one. - -matt mitchell - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com Sent: 10/7/01 2:38:16 PM Subject: Tristano the studio These two examples spring to mind easily, are there more examples of straight jazz spiced with studio techniques? Lennie Tristano rather famously sped up his playing on some solo tracks ( possibly also trio tracks? my memory is failing me) on his first (?) Atlantic album. I think "Turkish Mambo" may be the best known example. He got reamed in the press by the critics of the day for doing so. So much so that several albums after that felt compelled to mention something along the lines that "there is not studio manipulation or trickery involved" It's sorta odd that he did that in the first place, as he was such a great technician that he probably could've played the sped up stuff naturally! Maybe he just liked the un-natural timbres that the speeding up produced. Steve - - - --- Matthew Mitchell - --- matmi@earthlink.net - --- EarthLink: It's your Internet. - ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII

Indeed he did. The 'famous' trio one on which he sped up his piano is called 'Line Up,' I believe. Its a really weird solo, basically a solo played over the changes to A flat. All sorts of really advanced stuff for the time in that one.

-matt mitchell

----- Original Message -----

From:

To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com

Sent: 10/7/01 2:38:16 PM

Subject: Tristano & the studio

>These two examples spring to mind easily, are there more examples of

>straight jazz spiced with studio techniques?

Lennie Tristano rather famously sped up his playing on some solo tracks (&

possibly also trio tracks? my memory is failing me) on his first (?) Atlantic

album. I think "Turkish Mambo" may be the best known example.

He got reamed in the press by the critics of the day for doing so. So much so

that several albums after that felt compelled to mention something along the

lines that "there is not studio manipulation or trickery involved"

It's sorta odd that he did that in the first place, as he was such a great

technician that he probably could've played the sped up stuff naturally!

Maybe he just liked the un-natural timbres that the speeding up produced.

Steve

-

--- Matthew Mitchell

--- matmi@earthlink.net

--- EarthLink: It's your Internet.

- ------=_NextPart_84815C5ABAF209EF376268C8-- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 21:41:06 -0700 From: Skip Heller Subject: Re: Tristano & the studio > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. - --MS_Mac_OE_3085422066_4993636_MIME_Part Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Let us not forget Bill Evans' CONVERSATIONS records (there were three), where he overdubbed himself on three (sometimes two) pianos. The firsy, CONVERSATIONS WITH MYSELF, is a classic. skip h - --MS_Mac_OE_3085422066_4993636_MIME_Part Content-type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Re: Tristano & the studio

Let us not forget Bill Evans' CONVERSATIONS records (there were= three), where he overdubbed himself on three (sometimes two) pianos. = The firsy, CONVERSATIONS WITH MYSELF, is a classic.

skip h

- --MS_Mac_OE_3085422066_4993636_MIME_Part-- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 01:02:31 EDT From: Dgasque@aol.com Subject: Re: cd vs. cdr In a message dated 10/7/01 1:10:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cdeupree@erinet.com writes: (snip) << Recordable CDs start off life much the same way except that instead of any pits being pressed into the disc they are left smooth with an additional coating of a material which can be "phase changed." When a CDR is recorded, a laser is used to heat up the phase changeable material to create a "virtual" pit. This is one area where a CDR can run into problems. For the best performance, it is critical that the pit-to-land transition is very clean, or steep, so to speak. The more vague the change, the greater the room for error creation. >> (/snip) This falls in line with a posting I read some time ago on one of the tech-oriented newsgroups concerning CD-R burning. MOL, the poster stated that slower burn speeds resulted in a more accurate burns, because at higher speeds, the pit slopes tend to be more "rounded". It sounded pretty logical to me and I've followed this practice ever since, never burning at more than 4x. I've used Imation Silver CDs as long as I can remember and have yet to burn a data or music CD that's been unreadable. My one experience outside of this has been with Memorex blue-dye CDs, which yeilded music discs that alternated the usual "sawtooth" pattern-type noise with muffled-sounding music. - -- np: Seldom Scene- Live at the Cellar Door =dg= - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 00:26:52 -0700 From: "serge dautricourt" Subject: PSF label Hey guys, I've been reading some descriptions of releases from the japanese label PSF on Forcedexposure. They all sound really awesome. I wish i could hear them all! Is there anybody who could suggest some of the highlights on this label? So far I'm looking at Vajra 'Sravaka' and maybe something by Fushitsusha, but they all look good. . . Serge p.s. what's the 'np:' that everybody puts at the end of their messages. I assume it precludes an album they dig. np: Ikue Mori "One Hundred Aspects of the Moon" _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 05:18:33 -0400 From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: PSF label At 12:26 AM 10/8/01 -0700, serge dautricourt wrote: > >I've been reading some descriptions of releases from the japanese label PSF >on Forcedexposure. They all sound really awesome. I wish i could hear >them all! Is there anybody who could suggest some of the highlights on this >label? So far I'm looking at Vajra 'Sravaka' and maybe something by >Fushitsusha, but they all look good. . . Don't know the Vajra, but the two live Fushitsusha albums (psf 3/4 and psf 15/16) are considered classics. There's a Haino site that has a lot of reviews at http://www.planetc.com/users/keffer/haino/index.html. If you're interested in japanese psych generally (and not just Haino), the three Tokyo Flashback samplers are pretty good too. >Serge > >p.s. what's the 'np:' that everybody puts at the end of their messages. I >assume it precludes an album they dig. np = 'now playing' - -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 04:52:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Theo Klaase Subject: Frisell w/ Holland and Jones... - --0-103913914-1002541974=:77874 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Some tunes on this album really shine through... Although at times it seems Elvin Jones doesn't know the changes that well... The highlights, for me, are Twenty Years, Moon River, Strange Meeting, Smilin' Jones, and Convict 13... The song "Again" I was a bit disappointed in probably because it sounded so "right" on the "Where in the World" album, not to mention Pigpen's version almost equally as good on the album "V as in Victim..." Overall the album sounds a lot stronger than Blues Dream and Ghost Town combined... - --------------------------------- Do You Yahoo!? NEW from Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. Yahoo! by Phone. - --0-103913914-1002541974=:77874 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Some tunes on this album really shine through... Although at times it seems Elvin Jones doesn't know the changes that well... The highlights, for me, are Twenty Years, Moon River, Strange Meeting, Smilin' Jones, and Convict 13...

The song "Again" I was a bit disappointed in probably because it sounded so "right" on the "Where in the World" album, not to mention Pigpen's version almost equally as good on the album "V as in Victim..."

Overall the album sounds a lot stronger than Blues Dream and Ghost Town combined...

Do You Yahoo!?
NEW from Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. Yahoo! by Phone. - --0-103913914-1002541974=:77874-- - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 08:59:25 -0400 From: Bob Sweet Subject: Re: Witness Dan Frank Kuehn wrote: > Craig (he looks like some kind of redheaded mulatto) was astounding, Really? What do you look like? This is really an offensive, crass, and tasteless comment. Bob Sweet - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 09:07:12 -0400 From: "Sean Westergaard" Subject: RE: Atk & Fris i just saw Kermit playing with Greg Bendian's interzone with the Cline brothers last friday night. The first few tunes were a bit snoozy for me; the melodies weren't really memorable, they caught me as more of a compositional exercise than a good tune, but they really picked up momentum as the set went on, and the last couple peices were great. Kermit played upright for about half the set, then proved he's really a better electric player. sean - -----Original Message----- From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Marcin Gokieli Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2001 6:35 AM To: Skip Heller; David Egan; zorn-list@lists.xmission.com Subject: Odp: Atk & Fris > he'd do that (much as I loved Joey and Kermit), because he's such a > versatile player. wait a minute... What is drisoll doingh those days? - - - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 09:22:49 -0400 From: "patbor" Subject: Bith-Aneth Hi, I'm looking for a live recorded version of Masada's "Bith-Aneth" that comes close to the Jerusalem one as for intesity, solo creativity and interplay. I listened to the studio version but wasn't satisfied. I'm trying to find out if JerusalemBith-Aneth has been a unique performance or if repeated so intensely somewhere else. thanks, Patb - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 09:42:24 -0400 From: "patbor" Subject: Meanings Hi, It's good to listen with intesity and high involvement and try to deduce what a composition has been written for, but sometimes you need to know the meaning of song titles. Does anyone know the meaning of Masada's song titles? (At least: Bith-Aneth, Tekufah, Idalah-Abal, Mahshav, Peliyot, Kanah, Ziphim). thanks, patB - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 09:48:49 -0400 From: "David Beardsley" Subject: Re: Frisell w/ Holland and Jones... - ----- Original Message ----- From: Theo Klaase > Some tunes on this album really shine through... >Although at times it seems Elvin Jones doesn't know the changes that well... ??? Did he play a wrong note on the drums? * David Beardsley * http://biink.com * http://mp3.com/davidbeardsley - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 08:13:17 -0600 From: Dan Frank Kuehn Subject: Re: Witness Very sorry for any offense. None was intended. I speak without thinking. I'd never seen such curly red hair, and the word mulatto came to mind. I didn't know it was a bad word. I'm an aryan idiot, occasionally offensive, crass, and tasteless. Dan Bob Sweet wrote: > > Dan Frank Kuehn wrote: > > > Craig (he looks like some kind of redheaded mulatto) was astounding, > > Really? What do you look like? > > This is really an offensive, crass, and tasteless comment. > > Bob Sweet - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 15:25:17 GMT From: Parry Gettelman Subject: No Depression/Tortoise live Only saw Tortoise live once -- was dismayed to arrive and find they had started on time, unheard of for that particular club, so I had missed most of the show. But then 20 minutes of them turned out to be plenty. It was so dull, it kind of caused me to lose interest in their records, too. I think the whole "No Depression" "phenomenon" probably grew out of a bunch of rock journalists pitching roots-rock trend stories to editors in order to get a SXSW trip every March. Or maybe I'm just projecting my own guilt.... What can I say, the universe owes me vegetarian chorizo breakfast tacos once a year. Like most genres, alt-country/roots-rock/ND has a few great artists, a few good ones and a lot of dreck. And a lot of the best artists, per usual, never get the exposure they deserve. Charlie Chesterman, for instance, can write rings around Whiskeytown's much-heralded Ryan Adams. Charlie's '80s group Scruffy the Cat was a much better band than Wilco (even tho I did like the first Wilco record - and incidentally, they no longer have a major label affiliation, they got dumped). To me, the definitive statement on the sudden trendiness of twangy rock is Robbie Fulks' "Roots-rock Weirdos," a hilarious send-up of music as fashion statement that is also a heck of a catchy roots-rock tune. His new "Couples in Trouble" is a pretty amazing pop record. Which, incidentally, has a guest spot from Tim Mulvenna of the Vandermark Five. The Vandermark Five was just here in New Orleans, show was fairly engrossing but not transcendental. The ensemble work was the best part, although the solos were nicely crafted. Parry - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 08:40:34 -0700 From: Skip Heller Subject: Re: No Depression/Tortoise live > > I think the whole "No Depression" "phenomenon" probably grew out of a > bunch of rock journalists pitching roots-rock trend stories to editors > in > order to get a SXSW trip every March. Largely, yes. Or maybe I'm just projecting my > own > guilt.... What can I say, the universe owes me vegetarian chorizo breakfast > tacos once a year. > > Like most genres, alt-country/roots-rock/ND has a few great artists, a few > good ones and a lot of dreck. And a lot of the best artists, per usual, > never get the exposure they deserve. Charlie Chesterman, for instance, can > write rings around Whiskeytown's much-heralded Ryan Adams. Charlie's '80s > group Scruffy the Cat was a much better band than Wilco (even tho I did like > the first Wilco record - and incidentally, they no longer have a major label > affiliation, they got dumped). Come to Hollywood, where guys who were playing pizza-metal not so long ago are now warbling like Neil Young and/or Gram Parsons, except with none of the character. > > To me, the definitive statement on the sudden trendiness of twangy rock > is Robbie Fulks' "Roots-rock Weirdos," a hilarious send-up of music as > fashion statement that is also a heck of a catchy roots-rock tune. His new > "Couples in Trouble" is a pretty amazing pop record. You heard the Dallas Wayne record he produced? Pretty good. > skip h - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V3 #588 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? Email the list owner at zorn-list-owner@lists.xmission.com