From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #876 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Monday, April 8 2002 Volume 03 : Number 876 In this issue: - Odp: What Does DMG Know? Re: Yoshihide - Dreams RE: What Does DMG Know? Re: What Does DMG Know? Rethenecks Re: What Does DMG Know? No Moe Re: No Moe comments on Yuka Honda: Memories Are My Only Witness Douglas' orchestral work Re: help with Ron Miles' WOMEN'S DAY Gentle Giant Records going out of business sale marc ribot/cubanos at Vassar Re: What Does DMG Know? Fwd: comments on Yuka Honda: Memories Are My Only Witness RE: What Does DMG Know? Re: What Does DMG Know? Help for a translation Wuorinen & Adams ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 10:29:20 +0200 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: What Does DMG Know? Did you read his other books, especially *A Scanner Darkly*? - ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Smith > Well, since that's precisely the point at which I've just arrived (what were > the odds on THAT?), I can't really offer much more of an opinion. But yeah, > I was particularly impressed with those passages. - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 12:56:28 +0000 From: "Bill Ashline" Subject: Re: Yoshihide - Dreams >From: "Bruno Bissonnette" >Subject: Yoshihide - Dreams > >Hey, has anybody heard the new Otomo Yoshihide Jazz Ensemble 'Dreams' cd on >Tzadik? Impressions? I haven't given it a lot of listens yet, but from what I've heard so far, I like it a lot. Better than "Flutter." Of course, with Phew and Togawa Jun on vocals, it's all over the place--elements of treacly Japanese pop to free jazz and Sachiko M's sampler work this time fits a lot better with the music as a whole than it did with "Flutter." On the jazz improv parts, "Eureka" and "Hahen Fukei," there's plenty of inspired work from Kikuchi Naruyoshi, who for me is a far more interesting tenor player than most of what I hear coming out of New York these days. I like Phew a lot as well. Particularly on her work with Anton Fier--the fabulous but stupidly out of print "Dreamspeed" on Avant and on Blind Light's "Absence of Time." So, I'd give it a couple of thumbs up so far. I've yet to hear a release by Otomo I haven't liked. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 11:46:45 -0400 From: "Steve Smith" Subject: RE: What Does DMG Know? Nope, only 'The Man in the High Castle' so far. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com - -----Original Message----- From: Marcin Gokieli [mailto:marcingokieli@go2.pl] Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 4:29 AM Did you read his other books, especially *A Scanner Darkly*? - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 10:29:29 -0700 From: "s~Z" Subject: Re: What Does DMG Know? >>>Nope, only 'The Man in the High Castle' so far.<<< You have much better works awaiting you. The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch Galactic Pot-Healer Valis Ubik ...and more, but those are my 4 favorites. - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:25:46 +0000 From: "Kurt Gottschalk" Subject: Rethenecks i don't have hanging gardens, but i have 4 of their other cds (sex, aquifer, black and white and live). from what i can gather from those, they've just become more interesting over the years. 'sex', the first, is quite jazzy, mellow miles like, but of course without horn. they've become more abstract and more repetitive, both of which i like. 'black and white' is really nice, as is live. live they were great. deep suspense, not at all boring. not the kind of thing i woulda useta liked live. my ears changed several years ago, when i was on the edge of my seat during a solo piano morton feldman concert. notes floating around in the air, waiting to be plucked, resolution so slow. they're playing victo too! kg np: urfaust & gary lucas "prazska strasidla" (this is some faust relative, i'm guessing. is it representative at all? i picked it up for gary's guitar. it's interesting, but i'm not sure i'm being pulled faustway. Hello. Just listenied to "Hanging Gardens" by The Necks, and what a pleasent surpsrise! I thought this band would be plink plonk super minimal impro, but in fact it's very groovy. Quite similiar to Ponga, but with more than a slight Steve Reich touch. So I'm curious. what are their other CDs like?? Do they compare?? Which one would be the next one to get??? Have anybody seen them live?? I guess it might be incredibly boring, or...? Generally I prefer this type of music in my living room. (The Zorn connection of course being that the excellent drummer Tony Buck ones met a guy who claimed to have heard "The Big Gundown" in the mid 80s) Cheers, _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:26:17 -0500 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: What Does DMG Know? On Sun, Apr 07, 2002 at 11:46:45AM -0400, Steve Smith wrote: > Nope, only 'The Man in the High Castle' so far. I'd strongly recommend the trilogy "The Divine Invasion", "Valis", and "The Transmigration of Timothy Archer", then listening to Tod Machover's opera of "Valis". > -----Original Message----- > From: Marcin Gokieli [mailto:marcingokieli@go2.pl] > Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 4:29 AM > > Did you read his other books, especially *A Scanner Darkly*? > > - > - -- | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | New book: Surprise Me with Beauty: the Music of Human Systems | | http://www.metatronpress.com/nj/smwb.html | | Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:00:49 -0600 From: Dan Frank Kuehn Subject: No Moe A slow-burning backburner question: The tune "No Moe" by Sonny Rollins has been recorded twice by Bill Frisell, on Have a Little Faith and his live trio album, but I can't find it anywhere played by Sonny himself. Has anyone heard or heard of a Sonny Rollins performance of "No Moe"? Thanx, Dan in Taos - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 17:06:54 -0700 From: skip Heller Subject: Re: No Moe on 4/7/02 5:00 PM, Dan Frank Kuehn at smokey@laplaza.org wrote: > A slow-burning backburner question: > > The tune "No Moe" by Sonny Rollins has been recorded twice by Bill > Frisell, on Have a Little Faith and his live trio album, but I can't > find it anywhere played by Sonny himself. > > Has anyone heard or heard of a Sonny Rollins performance of "No Moe"? > > Thanx, > > Dan in Taos > > - > It's on SONNY ROLLINS WITH THE MODERN JAZZ QUARTET orig on Prestige, reissued on OJC. skip h - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 11:36:58 +0100 (WET DST) From: Ricardo Reis Subject: comments on Yuka Honda: Memories Are My Only Witness anyone care to comment on this one? greets, Ricardo Reis "Non Serviam" - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 07:09:35 -0400 From: "patbor" Subject: Douglas' orchestral work Hello, does anybody know if there will be a live broadcast of the world premiere of Douglas' orchestral work scheduled 27 April? Thank You Patb - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 17:33:59 +0200 From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: help with Ron Miles' WOMEN'S DAY it was recorded between october and november 1996 in Boulder and probably released in 1997. Andreas np: Johnny Dyani - Mbizo (Steeple Chase) >From: "Patrice L. Roussel" > > Does anybody know when that record came out? (The catalog number would >help also.) > > Thanks, > > Patrice. _________________________________________________________________ Testen Sie MSN Messenger für Ihren Online-Chat mit Freunden: http://messenger.msn.de - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 12:03:26 -0400 From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Gentle Giant Records going out of business sale I know there are a lot of Otomo fans on this list who might be interested in tracking down some of his work while it's still somewhat available. >>>> From: "TV Pow" Subject: Gentle Giant Records going out of business sale For delayed release:: Gentle Giant Records has ceased operations on January 1, 2002. We have lowered prices on all remaining stock which is available for purchase from www.tvpow.net The following items are still available: ::: Otomo Yoshihide - Sound Factory 1997 - CD/LP A Box Full of Ghosts - Box Set featuring split 7"s from tvpow/liminal, kazumoto endo/incapacitants, christian marclay/otomo yoshihide; plus a CD-ROM of videos from tvpow, otomo yoshihide, liminal, flexible products, melt banana, and xome. Cult Junk Cafe - CD - recorded in Tokyo 1996 by Tsunodo Tsuguto, Yasuhiro Otani, Yoshigami Kyota, Sakamoto Kazutaka, Michael Hartman, and special guest Otomo Yoshihide. The Miracle of Levitation - Compilation CD w/Ground Zero, Jim O'Rourke, Ruins, Melt-Banana, U.S. Maple, James Plotkin, Otomo Yoshihide, Akiyama-Sugimoto, liminal, Xome, Cult Junk Cafe, Uchihashi Kazuhisa, Tsunoda Tsuguto, Pencilneck, 7000 Dying Rats, The Flying Luttenbachers, TV Pow, Lumbar Trio, Altered States, and Yasuhiro Otani. Kazumoto Endo / Incapacitants - split 7" Television Power Electric- CD Extra - Expanded version of TV Pow featuring Jim Baker, Aeron Bergman, Todd Carter, Brent Gutzeit, Michael Hartman, Ernst Long, Otomo Yoshihide, R. Wilkus. TV Pow / liminal - split 7" ::: many thanks to all who supported us. <<<< - -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 16:17:52 GMT From: "nors5379" Subject: marc ribot/cubanos at Vassar i was curious if anybody knew anymore about marc's gig at vassar this weekend? all i have found out so far is its a free gig at 4pm during the VICE jazz fest on the campus. supposedly the whole festival starts at 1pm, but i cant find a listing of who else is playing during the day. i checked all over vassar's site but theres only a mention of the fest starting at 1pm. any information would be appreciated. - -darryl. - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 09:27:52 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Subject: Re: What Does DMG Know? On Sun, 7 Apr 2002 10:29:29 -0700 "s~Z" wrote: > > >>>Nope, only 'The Man in the High Castle' so far.<<< > > You have much better works awaiting you. > > The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch Totally agree. This one is a true nightmare where Dick keeps of fooling the reader to believe that things have finally settled, and then again, another layer of the nightmare unravels. Frighteningly awesome. Patrice. NP: IN C: Acid Mothers Temple - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:29:19 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= Subject: Fwd: comments on Yuka Honda: Memories Are My Only Witness Hi, No great insights but I listened to “Memories Are...” three or four times and I didn’t find it too impressing, so to speak. Just and ordinary electronics record, not as stylish as it’s presented on the Tzadik website, IMHO. There are some good funky rythms and the sound is very good but in general I’d say it’s too dancefloor-oriented in some moments. Certainly not an innovative album, mainly based on the use of samplers and drum machines, and it doesn’t help cure my dissappointment with the Oracle Series so far. I had great expectations but can’t recommend it at all. Best, Efrén del Valle > > > anyone care to comment on this one? > > greets, > > Ricardo Reis > > "Non Serviam" > > > - > _______________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger Comunicación instantánea gratis con tu gente. http://messenger.yahoo.es - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:29:31 -0400 From: "Steve Smith" Subject: RE: What Does DMG Know? Thanks for the input on PK Dick. Now, would anyone mind telling me where to begin with Acid Mothers Temple? Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Otomo/Rowe/Sugimoto, "The Street," 'Ajar' (Alcohol) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Patrice L. Roussel NP: IN C: Acid Mothers Temple - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 10:39:27 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Subject: Re: What Does DMG Know? On Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:29:31 -0400 "Steve Smith" wrote: > > Thanks for the input on PK Dick. Now, would anyone mind telling me where to > begin with Acid Mothers Temple? I can't say a lot since IN C is the first record by the group that I buy. I really enjoy a lot this record, but mainly for nostalgic reasons. IN C is 35 years old and their version is quite pleasurable. The other pieces remind me a lot of Rhys Chatham's compositions for guitars (30 years old), but with a psychedelic angle, and since I am a big fan of Chatham, I like these pieces also. I have the feeling that this is a record that I will play a lot, although there is nothing groundbreaking in it. Is this disc representative? Patrice. - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2002 17:31:09 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= Subject: Help for a translation HI, I'm currently translating a Tim Berne interview from Perfect Sound Forever and there's something I don't quite understand. Berne states that Gary Lucas was working as "ad copy" for Columbia (if I'm not wrong). If any English speakers could give me a description of what "ad copy" is, I'll probably be able to find a correspondance in Spanish. A million thanks in advance. BTW, check the interview! It's really good. Best, Efrin del Valle _______________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger Comunicacisn instantanea gratis con tu gente. http://messenger.yahoo.es - - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 08:19:02 -0500 From: Herb Levy Subject: Wuorinen & Adams Steve Smith wrote: >As far as his actual music goes, Wuorinen's hit-to-miss ratio is actually >rather good. He's written a few indispensible things (Time's Encomium, >Percussion Symphony), a fair amount of pretty damn good things (Third Piano >Concerto, The Golden Dance, the disc of trios on Koch International >Classics) and a lot of arid, formulaic and seemingly emotionless music as >well. My reaction to his work is similar, though I think our lists of hits differ somewhat. But your follow-up really mis-states Wuorinen's arguments over the years. >The reason that I think Wuorinen provokes such a heated response is for the >bluntness with which he states his personal aesthetic convictions, well >documented in numerous interviews and many of them rather unpopular. For >him, music skips from Machaut, Dufay and Josquin by way of Bach to Mozart, >Haydn and Beethoven, then to Stravinsky and Schoenberg, and finally Wolpe, >Babbitt and Carter, with between those disparate poles. > >Hey, I understand the desire to be provocative -- the above "top 12" was >concocted in a public interview -- but I have real problems with his >omissions, personally. You can't completely understand Schoenberg without >knowing Brahms, and the same holds true to some extent for Stravinsky vis a >vis Tchaikovsky and Rimsky-Korsakov. If Wuorinen doesn't like Romantic music >fine, but to gloss over its highlights -- especially Brahms, but also >Berlioz (for the art of orchestration), Chopin (for the piano music), >Schubert (for the chamber music and lieder) and Liszt (for virtually >everything) -- is a misrepresentation of history. What you say here is certainly true, but if Wuorinen was responding to a question something like "name the dozen composers who are most interesting/important/etc to you," which I'm pretty sure is the context for this list, he's under no obligation to accurately represent the history of Western classical music. This kind of idiosyncratic response is absolutely more interesting than if he'd come up with the kind of list that's used for a 12 week music appreciation class. & for what it's worth, similar lists by Steve Reich have some of the same lapses though, of course, the most recent composers Reich picks as important to him are quite different. >And as for contemporary music, well, if it ain't serialist, it ain't shit, >apparently. For at least a decade he's been the epitome of the "academic" >composer, denying neo-Romantics, minimalist and other assorted eclectics >alike access to performance opportunities, or at least that's the >perception. Here's a pretty good illustration, in the man's own words (no >omissions or elisions, even) from an editorial he wrote for the March 17th >issue of the New York Times on why the loss of classical music programming >on WNYC-FM doesn't really make any difference: > >"The sad fact is that WNYC's new music fare has lately been pretty >one-sided, concentrating on the pop avant-garde that really is just >commercially unsuccessful rock and roll garnished with a dollop of John >Cage. Absent is the tough stuff you can sink your teeth into. New York may >be the cultural capital of the world, but it's also the world hype capital, >and a lot of what happens here culturally is distorted. Puffery trumps >reality." > >If you've lived in New York for any period of time whatsoever (and I know >you have, David), you know how completely this statement blows, and how a >few people at that station have provided tremendous service in supporting >the careers of Zorn, Glass, Reich, Meredith Monk, Laurie Anderson, the Bang >on a Can crowd and countless others. What Wuorinen's saying, in effect, is, >"The station doesn't play MY music." Plain and simple. Kinda makes you >wonder what he thought of sharing a bill with Zorn a few weeks back, doesn't >it? What you say about his frequent vociferous & public position as apologist for serialist music in the face of "neo-Romantics, minimalist and other assorted eclectics" is again true (though your sense of history is somewhat skewed, he's had this attitude since the mid-1970s), but it's inaccurate to reduce his argument to "The station doesn't play MY music." I don't live in NYC, but WNYC never played much, if any, music by Scoenberg, Wolpe, Babbitt, Carter, either, to name only those mentioned in Wuorinen's top 12 list. He's clearly trying to make a case for a lack of attention to a much wider swath of music history than just his own music. If, say, Dave Douglas were to make a similar argument about the lack of downtown scene-sters on any of the countless jazz stations across the US that basically follow the Wynton line of music history, I doubt that you'd reduce his argument to "The station doesn't play MY music." Your own list of composers recently championed by WNYC, with the exception of Zorn, can pretty much be reduced to various flavors of minimalist and ignores any "neo-Romantics and other assorted eclectics." I know the station's been supportive of "neo-Romantics" but based on my limited sense of things from my increasingly scarce visits to NY, the "other assorted eclectics" who were part of the station's overall programming mix, and not simply heard on John Schaeffer's program, were few and far between. And finally, given the release of Wuorinen's disc on Tzadik, do you really question whether he'd want his music to be heard in same context as Zorn's? Isn't that exactly the situation of having a disc released on Zorn's label? The CD can't be a surprise to Wuorinen, so I'd be amazed if he were to have a problem with the recent concert. Jim Flannery wrote: >Personally, I hate him for single-handedly destroying the SF Symphony's >"New and Unusual Music" series, which under the leadership of John Adams >had presented (to progressively larger audiences) performances including >Paul Dresher's _Liquid and Stellar Music_, ROVA, and Reich's _Music for >Large Ensemble_ (those last three on one program, IIRC), Glenn Branca's >_Symphony #5_, a 2-hour solo piano performance by Charlemagne Palestine >(AFAIK his only SF appearance in the last 25 years), Ingram Marshall's >_Fog Tropes_ ... I could go on ... and after Wuorinen took over >sputtered through a couple years of indifferent performances of >compositions by now-forgotten young serialist nebbishes (presumably his >grad students) being played to steadily emptier rooms, until the whole >thing was abandoned for lack of interest. <> While I too was far more interested in the programming Adams did in this series than Wuorinen did during his stint, I'd place the blame on the music director who chose Wuorinen to follow Adams. Wuorinen did what he was asked to do, he selected contemporary music that was interesting to him. Whoever hired him to do this very clearly had either no idea what that would mean or didn't care. (& 25 years is probably a slight exaggeration on the Palestine performance. I'd be surprised if he hadn't played at Langton (back when they were called (& were at) 80 Langton Street) in the late 1970s/early '80s. He was on the West Coast several times in that period.) UFOrbK8@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 04.06.02 22.51.14, newgrange@sfo.com writes: > > >Personally, I hate him for single-handedly destroying the SF Symphony's > >"New and Unusual Music" series, which under the leadership of John Adams > >had presented (to progressively larger audiences) performances including > >Paul Dresher's _Liquid and Stellar Music_, ROVA, and Reich's _Music for > >Large Ensemble_ (those last three on one program, IIRC), Glenn Branca's > >_Symph... > >john adams' relative pertinence in new music is questionable to me, too This is a mis-reading of the post you're responding to. Jim Flannery was comparing the range of music Adams curated into a SFO's concert series while he was the orchestra's composer-in-residence with the range of work presented by Wuorinen when he served the same function. >... i >love his early period ('77-ca.1987) and a few later works, and adore his >orchestrations of the *smaller* pieces, etc. but he's very much a packaged >performer/composer/bureaucrat in a way that i really disapprove of... > >case in point is a personal antecdote - i was at a Q&A with him at the >cleveland orchestra and i'd met him before (but obviously didn't know him >really - still don't) and i raised my hand and asked him what the worst >review he ever got was. the little Q&A director laughed nervously and said >"oh, gee, you must be a composer..." and john giggled nervously and said "i >don't know what the worst review i ever got was, but the best i ever got said >'john adams has done for minimalism what mcdonalds has done for the >hamburger...' I don't love all of Adams' work, any more than I do Wuorinen's, but Adams isn't simply a bureaucrat. He seems to be writing the music he wants to write (I think they both are). Adams is lucky to have written some pieces that get played by a lot of orchestras, especially in the US, and may well be the most performed living American composer of works for orchestra since the death of Aaron Copland. While he may not be my choice for new music posterboy, he's probably one of the few living composers that symphony subscribers would recognize by name and might even be able to remember hearing a piece by. >- he has a funny way of spitting out the exact same sentences >to people and being so ickily insincere... he doesn't do much for the face >of new music for me either... Many people who are frequently interviewed by press people who have no idea about their work, or the wider context for it (which means almost any artist who is not working in extremely successful (commercially) pop music or movies, and even many of them), have set responses to the commonly asked questions. This is as true for scientists as it is for artists - if you read a lot of interviews in the popular press with people like John Cage or Richard Feynman, you see an awful lot of answers on automatic pilot. It comes with the territory: it's more of a way to keep comparatively sane than anything else. - -- Herb Levy Mappings: new music in RealAudio P O Box 9369 Forth Wort, TX 76147 USA http://antennaradio.com/mappings/show.htm mappings@antennaradio.com - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V3 #876 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? 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